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#121 of 610 Old 08-05-2006, 11:23 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Moochie Mamma
Subbing- I'm not Pagan but am very interested and would love to learn more about it. I don't have time right now to read all the posts but I'm wondering if anyone can recommend a good book to learn some basic info?

Thanks
Hi there Honestly, I hate the name, but The Idiot's Guide to Paganism is really informative.

Emily SAHM to four unschoolers Olivia (9), Brian (7), Jack (6), and Liam (5)
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#122 of 610 Old 08-05-2006, 11:25 PM
 
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hugs mamaofthree...just keep thinking about how happy your dd is right now and how much she is learning about letting people find and follow their own paths. You've done and are doing an amazing job of "showing" as well as "telling". I'm sorry your IRL friends are giving you a hard time...maybe they don't realize the sort of responsibility and freedom you are modeling to your dd, or they are worried they wouldn't be able to do the same thing in your shoes?

Whatever their reasons...I'm sorry they're acting this way. Hang on to the happy...

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#123 of 610 Old 08-05-2006, 11:43 PM
 
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Mamaofthree~I hope things work themselves out for you...I know they will. I am facing having to get a job soon so we can pay down this overwhelming debt we have going on....
I think with all the people giving their opinions you just have to know when to smile and wave and not listen to a darn thing they are saying.

Moochie~Stick around, you'll like it here. I happened to get the Idiots guide to Paganism and I also got Circle Round but this explains more about the celebrations and things to do with kids....I still like it anyway. I'm reading bits and pieces of Spiral Dance and it's pretty interesting....

Mama to 14yo, 9yo, 7yo, and babe born 9/2012
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#124 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 12:36 AM
 
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mamaofthree~ to me, it really sounds like you are doing the right thing! How good of you to listen to your daughter and not "guilt" her into anything! (Did they honestly say that?!?) Changes are hard- transitions always make me loopy :. How wonderful that you are a nurse and can get a good paying part time job! One 12 hour shift sounds hard, but perfect. You will still be a sahm a majority of the time! And, as you said, if she is not happy, things can change.

Really, good for you!!

Hi, Moochie Mama!

Ugh. I'm tired tonight. I- cough,cough- worked out at the gym this afternoon. Geez. Never thought I would be saying that. Now, zone out with a chick flick since dh isn't home!

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#125 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 05:50 AM
 
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mamaofthree--First off ((hugs)) to you and I think it is great that you are honoring your daughter's desire to go to school. I also know exactly how difficult it is to let her. This last school year was the first year that my kids went to regular school, and although I really loved homeschooling them (we were much closer to unschoolers than school-at-homers), I also felt it was important to give them the opportunity to make that choice and try it out. We had just moved and they wanted to try the schools here since we'd heard they were great. It is definitely one of the hardest things I've done but I will tell you that I don't regret it for a minute. We ended up at a school that is amazing, with fantastic, caring teachers and staff and families and I am really really pleased with how last school year went and am now looking forward to the coming school year. (Okay, I'm also slightly terrified since my oldest will be in Jr. High this year, but that's another post.) Anyway, yes I still miss homeschooling and there are days that in my heart I really wish that is what we were doing, but I've seen a lot of positive come out of this experience as well, not the least of which is that my children made a thoughtful decision for themselves, it was honored and proved a good choice for them. So, I just wanted you to know that I can imagine how you must be feeling even without the added difficulty of having friends and others second-guessing you.
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#126 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 05:56 AM
 
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Welcome Moochie Mamma!!


Salvia, what movie did you watch and was there popcorn involved?

So in other news, I went to my MILs to do birthday things today and MIL gave me a digital camera for my birthday! I am so excited that I *finally* have one and can get my pics online easily now and all. So I apologize in advance if I post too many pictures in the days to come whilst I play with my new toy. Speaking of pics, Salvia those last ones you posted are stunning! Wow! I hope you don't mind, but I changed my background on my computer to the thistledown!:
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#127 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 11:12 AM
 
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Can't wait Moony, great present!!
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#128 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 11:42 AM
 
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Originally Posted by 13moons

So in other news, I went to my MILs to do birthday things today and MIL gave me a digital camera for my birthday! I am so excited that I *finally* have one and can get my pics online easily now and all. So I apologize in advance if I post too many pictures in the days to come whilst I play with my new toy. Speaking of pics, Salvia those last ones you posted are stunning! Wow! I hope you don't mind, but I changed my background on my computer to the thistledown!:
You are sweet! No, I don't mind- I'm very flattered!

Now, when was your birthday? How could you not tell us? Don't take away our good excuse to shower you with love!

How exciting about the digital camera! They are fun- I take so many more pics than I would with a film camera. So, bring 'em on!

Quote:
Originally Posted by 13moons

Salvia, what movie did you watch and was there popcorn involved?
: Of course, popcorn was involved. I'm the Queen of Popcorn! I make it on the stove top with lots of olive oil, brewer's yeast, and garlic salt.

Well, I watched Cruel Intentions because I've been sort of wanting to watch it for years but too embarrassed to watch it with anyone. I'm -was- a big Buffy fan, so I wanted to see how Sarah Michelle Gellar was (not so great. She was so supported by great writing on Buffy). Who knew that Ryan Phillippi was so hot?!?! Oh, he is so pretty and nasty in this movie. And, Reese Witherspoon- she does not do much for me. Have you seen the movie? There is a kissing scene between SMG and a young Selma Blair- wow.

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#129 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 11:47 AM
 
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Salvia, I hate popcorn but when I do make it I make it like that... I love brewer's yeast. I also make grits the same way... yum. Feelin' the Buffy love! I saw that movie a long time ago.

Dh and I watched Cast Away last night, and not at all what I expected ... We were going to watch Ghostbusters, but found we didn't have it. Livin' the smart life over here!
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#130 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 01:03 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Salvia
Now, when was your birthday? How could you not tell us? Don't take away our good excuse to shower you with love!
It's today actually! I'm taking off in an hour or so for a girls day/night out with my SIL, my sister and my mom. That sounds cheesy since we're related but they're super fun people that make me remember why Kegels are so important.

I have not seen that movie, Salvia, but good kissing scene? Maybe I should... I like popocorn too even though I hate how it sticks in my teeth, but I have the coolest electric popcorn making skillet thing...er, one of these. I love it!
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#131 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 01:18 PM
 
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Thanks for all the good thoughts. I needed that. Feeling much better today. And yes someone wanted me to guilt her into staying home, they suggested that I tell her how much I love and would miss her, and that maybe she would then stay home, so I would be happy. :

Anywho, onto more happy matters... I have used Salvia's pictures as wallpaper before too. Such lovely pictures! :

13moons: I love that popcorn maker! That is so cool. I have been wanting an airpopper. We use to have on when I was a kid, loved that thing!

H

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#132 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 01:20 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Happy Birthday Mooney!!! and you thought you could get away without telling us

Salvia~I like that movie quite a bit. We own it. It is actually based on Dangerous Liasons. Yes, I love Ryan. The kissing scene did not do it for me, but I loved the seduction scenes between SMG and Ryan. Oh, and my dream car is the Jaguar Roadster in the opening scene. LOVE that car, though not very practical with four kids, .

Emily SAHM to four unschoolers Olivia (9), Brian (7), Jack (6), and Liam (5)
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#133 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 01:26 PM
 
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Originally Posted by mamaofthree
13moons: I love that popcorn maker! That is so cool. I have been wanting an airpopper. We use to have on when I was a kid, loved that thing!

H
It is great. I don't like the taste of air popped popcorn but this one tastes like it came off the stove with only about as much trouble as an airpopper. You just put the oil or butter in there, put the popcorn in, let it pop and then unplug and flip it once it's popped. Plus it makes a ginormous bowl so there's enough for all of us. Oh, but I guess if you were looking to get rid of the oil/butter part then an air popper is the way to go.



Thanks for the birthday wishes Emily! I wasn't really trying to get away with anything, it just slips my mind with all the other birthday stuff we get going on over here this time of year.
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#134 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 02:03 PM
 
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: Happy Birthday, 13moons! We love you!:

:

moony------> ?

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#135 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 02:15 PM
 
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Thanks, Salvia!
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#136 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 02:38 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Emmama

Salvia~I like that movie quite a bit. We own it. It is actually based on Dangerous Liaisons. Yes, I love Ryan. The kissing scene did not do it for me, but I loved the seduction scenes between SMG and Ryan. Oh, and my dream car is the Jaguar Roadster in the opening scene. LOVE that car, though not very practical with four kids, .
The car is very nice. My dh came home and was oooing and ahhing over it. Have you read the book- Les Liaisons dangereusus? I'm curious to see how close the movie is. I have not watched the original movie for some time. I like John Malkovitch- not pretty, but yummy and very,very naughty. You know, oddly enough, I thought SMG and Ryan had better on screen chemistry than Ryan and Reece.

O.k., sorry for the off topic movie talk.

Wow- your dh comes home tomorrow! Are you just feeling : today?

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#137 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 02:42 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Salvia
I like John Malkovitch- not pretty, but yummy and very,very naughty.
Oooh, too right! That is spot on!
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#138 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 02:51 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Salvia
Wow- your dh comes home tomorrow! Are you just feeling : today?
Yeah he does! I pick him up 5 pm-ish, or whenever the Welcome Ceremony ends. Oui, it is so hard to believe that this is the end and that he will not have to go back! I am soooo excited, but there is a lot to do before he gets here, I have been deep cleaning the house.

Emily SAHM to four unschoolers Olivia (9), Brian (7), Jack (6), and Liam (5)
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#139 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 04:40 PM
 
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Emmama~I am so excited for you, I would go : if dh left for a year! I'm so glad he'll be home very soon!

13moons~ Happy Birthday!!!!!:
Hope you have a magical one!

Mama to 14yo, 9yo, 7yo, and babe born 9/2012
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#140 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 06:25 PM
 
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Hi, I am new here as I finally have enough posts! Not much to say now, but I am subbing and will pop back later

Nicole - )0( unschooling mama to Lilahblahblah.gif (12/21/05) and Cianwild.gif (9/21/07) as well as 3 dog2.gif 2 cat.gif,  4 rats, chicken3.gif and ducks
 
 

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#141 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 06:27 PM
 
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13moons: is the popper hard to store? I have really limited space. And HAPPY BIRTHDAY! : :

Emmama: Did your DH get to come home for a couple weeks at all while he was gone? And how did he do if he did. My neice (actually dh's) dh is in Iraq and comes home in December. He was home last month for two weeks. The poor guy, he was so "shell shocked" just being in a normal (so to speak) environment. Neice and her dh fought alot. She thought he was full of it. It was very sad. I am not sure their marriage will survive this. Not saying this is you, just wondering how your dh is doing? (It could be that neice is a very harsh and non forgiving person... the whole thing is sad) Anyway... I am so happy for you! Just over 24 hours to go! YIPPEE!

H

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#142 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 06:43 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by mamaofthree
Emmama: Did your DH get to come home for a couple weeks at all while he was gone? And how did he do if he did. My neice (actually dh's) dh is in Iraq and comes home in December. He was home last month for two weeks. The poor guy, he was so "shell shocked" just being in a normal (so to speak) environment. Neice and her dh fought alot. She thought he was full of it. It was very sad. I am not sure their marriage will survive this. Not saying this is you, just wondering how your dh is doing? (It could be that neice is a very harsh and non forgiving person... the whole thing is sad) Anyway... I am so happy for you! Just over 24 hours to go! YIPPEE!

H
That is sad! I know of a couple of people that are filing for divorce when the guys get back....

Yeah, dh did get two weeks in June. We had a real good time, the only thing he was shocked about was how fast people drive here (they only drive 30 mph where they were, anywhere they went!). Despite the separation, it brought dh and I closer I think. We were determined to not grow apart due to the separation. Looking back though, the year went by soooo fast!: Wow.

Emily SAHM to four unschoolers Olivia (9), Brian (7), Jack (6), and Liam (5)
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#143 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 10:12 PM
 
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Hi there,

Just want to jump in on the discussion earlier in the thread about the threefold goddess. Hope this doesn't negate the very important stuff that others are discussing, I hope all is well with everyone and their families, I just want to comment on a particular issue

I haven't looked at the stuff about the fourfold goddess and intend to but I just wanted to say how I see the threefold goddess working. I don't think that it is as simple as having phases in our lives that we move through and that we exist only in one phase at a time. Nor do I think that this change is a recent manifestation. Each situation or moment is a representation of a different aspect of her and of ourselves. When I was a young woman I was a 'maiden' but left behind my 'maidenhead' some time past I manifested many of my mothering aspects without having a child and have walked darker paths that could be seen as crone like.

Like the goddess we are not one definable creature but many overlapping and interlinking ones. Just as we have flashes of spring in winter or a cold day in summer so we manifest Her in different ways and at different times. I truly believe that we should each embrace the opportunity that we are given to delve into a new or forgotten aspect of ourselves. We don't stop being mothers just because we don't bleed, nor do we leave behind the essential combatative energy of the maiden when we are mothers or older. I think to embrace the overlapping and interwoven aspect of the goddess is what is truly wonderful about being a pagan. Like the world around us She is complex. We should never allow ourselves to be defined in too simple a way and I think we need to honour each aspect of the goddess which exists within us at the same time.

This probably only makes sense to me but I felt it was important to say it. Hope all of you are well, hale and hearty. Bright blessings and joyous mysteries to you all xxx
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#144 of 610 Old 08-06-2006, 11:14 PM
 
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I am a UU who lurks here-- looking for earthy-spiritual readings about giving birth. Or, if any of you have links to your birth stories that make reference to your beliefs, I would love to read them.

I'm just telling this little bundle, "I am ready when you are!"

Thank you!!
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#145 of 610 Old 08-07-2006, 01:21 AM
 
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Welcome, Katiemare! Blessings on the arrival of your wee one!

Emmalina~ a really interesting and well thought out post! Thank you! To me, it was like a light bulb going on when I read it! I think you are exactly right when you write about embracing all of the stages within us at any given day. This is the essence of our folly and wisdom.

I did a bit of reading and it seems to me that Donna Henes is the main person behind the idea of the Four Fold Goddess. She says that in her studies, four is reflected more often in nature: 4 seasons, 4 phases of the Moon, 4 elements and 4 directions. She goes on to say:

"For millennia, the three faces of the Triple Goddess have, in fact, accurately reflected the stages of women's lives -- the developing youth, the nurturing mother and the wise old woman. She still corresponds with the real life expectancy and experience of most women in the world even today who live pretty much as they always have. The reality of their existence dictates that they grow quickly through girlhood into early and prolonged maternity then, if they are lucky enough to survive multiple childbirths and general poverty, they pass through menopause directly into old age. "

and

"While certainly there is still much to learn from these models, the old triple-header construct is no longer all-inclusive. It doesn't include a description of my life or the lives of other contemporary women in their middle years living in modern developed countries. It does not address our issues and needs, nor does it embrace our unique and unprecedented position in society. It does not even recognize our existence. The old stereotypes simply do not apply to us."

(Here is the entire article)

She goes on to say name the "new' phase 'Queen'- so Maiden, Mother, Queen, and Crone. The name Queen reflects the time of power that is available to modern women.

What she has to say is interesting, but I think you make a very valid point, Emmalina, that we should not get bogged down in the literal and linear characteristics of the aspects of the Goddess.

Good night!

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#146 of 610 Old 08-07-2006, 08:09 AM
 
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I, too, incorporate the triple goddess into everyday living. I have aspects of maiden, mother AND crone in myself (even though I haven't reached cronehood). I like to honor my complete Self. There are times when I want to focus on a specific aspect, of course, but I never exclude the others.

to all those who are going through hard times.
Happy Belated Birthday to 13moons.
Sorry I haven't been able to catch up.
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#147 of 610 Old 08-07-2006, 08:17 AM
 
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Salvia and Emmalina, excellent posts!
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#148 of 610 Old 08-07-2006, 09:51 AM
 
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happy birthday 13moons!

congrats emmama! I bet you are enjoying your dh right now and totally not checking this board
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#149 of 610 Old 08-07-2006, 10:08 AM
 
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Salvia,

Thanks for the link that was an interesting article. While I wouldn't contradict the writers thinking as I think what she had to say was relevant, it didn't really resonate with me. Perhaps I'm just old fashioned! I think that she was right in some respects about acknowledging women in a powerful phase of their lives when they are no longer directly 'mothering' but I always felt that this was encompassed by the crone as well as the original maiden figure. I don't think we could see Brigid or Diana as purely youthful virginal figures, in fact I think it is at this post motherhood period that those energies return fully and powerfully allowing a woman to draw on her fertility for her own ends rather than for life creation.

I think this article is written from the perspective of someone who is still feeling a need to validate their own power and importance as a woman, something I don't really relate to. I know that I am valuable in all stages of my life and all manifestations so don't need to justify my 'Queeniness', this is something I already have a good grasp of!: Maybe I'll feel differently in 20 years but I am happy to embrace my inner crone/maiden/mother at whatever phase I am in.

I also have to say that some of the comments I found to be historically invalid. Not ALL women were poor, that is just patently untrue and not have women always been oppressed creatures throughout history. Just because our stories are not always fully known does not mean we have to accept a limited view of our own history. Indeed some archeology is now bringing to light the view that pre-roman cultures saw the fertile aspect of womanhood as a very powerful and spiritual force. Young women who had not yet shed their virginity were seen as incredibly raw beings who were both to be revered but their power was also dangerous. This energy is one that I see as mellowed by motherhood/life experience and harnessed more effectively by the individual.

I'm not really comfortable with a lot of 'mainstream' pagan thinking which seems to vere more towards redefining the self but in a limited way. I have no problem with folk being whatever or whoever they want to be but the high levels of Ravens or Morgans populating the pagan world and the fetish for velvet seems more about creating a romantic self view than it is to do with connecting with nature and the goddess. I have always found a woolen poncho and sturdy boots to be of more value than a 'costume' which seems designed to distance me from my normal self and allow me to create a fiction that, to my mind, is more conventional as it is to do with being attractive not connected or powerful. I am not trying to take away from anyone's practice just giving my view. I think the more time you spend gardening, or walking the dog, cooking, creating and just being the more you connect with the goddess. I don't need to dress up or make myself 'special' (though that is always a fun thing to do!) she knows who I am and it is as my most normal that I need her guidance the most.

I suppose what I am trying to say is that for me, the goddess isn't so much about me being a goddess myself or a form of feminism (though it helped me so much to realise divine could also be female). I turn to her for guidance, I see her as within but also outside of myself. Not just a manifestation of the human condition but more than that, something I can barely contemplate. She is with me all the time and I try to see her as woven into everything. I am not at the centre of everything and the goddess does not exist only for me, that is something I think we pagans need to remember as it is at the core of what makes us different from other religions. The gods are about ALL being sacred and allowing our own egos to take a back seat in the pure joy of living and doing.

Sorry if this is really unconnected but I've been interupted a lot! And sorry it isso long but this is stuff I've been thinking about for a while. I would be very interested to hear everyone elses thoughts and hope nothing I've said has dismayed anyone. If it has ignore it! bright blessings to you allxxx
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#150 of 610 Old 08-07-2006, 10:14 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Jenniebug
congrats emmama! I bet you are enjoying your dh right now and totally not checking this board
Thanks, but he is not here yet. I pick him up this evening. I will not be on here tonight or tomorrow: !

I am sorry to switch conversations, but I have a question. Has a Goddess ever called you? If so how did you know? What do you do if you get called? Hmm, maybe called is not the right word. "Claimed" might be more appropriate.

Emily SAHM to four unschoolers Olivia (9), Brian (7), Jack (6), and Liam (5)
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