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#1 of 13 Old 04-27-2003, 08:34 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I have been meaning to post this for a week.

Last weekend, on the saturday (i think) of easter weekend...Larry King had all these spiritual leaders on his show and it was pretty interesting.

But I must say that Reverand MacArthur from california was exceptionally hostile, i guess that is the right word...he might say differently..I think he would probably say he was sincere and passionate but in my opinion he certainly talked down to the rest of the panel and I felt that the priest kind of had to keep him in line a bit.....anyway they got into quite a discussion and that I thought was most curious was about the language the bible...I think new testament was written in.....

He said Greek and Depak Chopra said pre-Aramic.

I guess my question is...how can they not even be on the same page about what language the new testament was written in?

And how can there be any peace when that can't even be agreed upon?


here is a snippet from the transcripts...





Before we go to phone calls, Father Manning wanted to respond to Reverend MacArthur.

MANNING: One of the things that I believe is Jesus is God and Jesus is the source of all salvation. The difficulty that I have with condemning people for not accepting Jesus is that oftentimes the Jesus they don't accept is the Jesus you and I present to them.

It is very unattractive, and if -- if the time of judgment comes of saying I'm sorry, you go to hell, it really frightens me that perhaps I'm the one that's going to be responsible for that because I haven't presented the real love and the power of Christ in the way that I think it should be presented.

MACARTHUR: Well, I don't want to take the responsibility to have to design and define Jesus and somehow draft up an acceptable Jesus. The Jesus of the New Testament is the only Jesus there is, and the...

MANNING: The... MACARTHUR: ... apostles -- well, the apostle -- the apostle Paul said if anybody preaches any other Jesus, let him be anathema. So we can't invent Jesus. We go to the New Testament. There he is.

KING: But would you agree the New Testament has been interpreted many times, and it wasn't originally written in English?

HATHOUT: But there is...

KING: Well, Larry, it was originally written, of course, in Greek, but the...

CHOPRA: No. I'm sorry. It wasn't written in Greek. You should know your Bible. It wasn't written in Aramaic, which is a pre- Babylonian language. It doesn't even...

MACARTHUR: Pardon me, but it was written in Greek.

CHOPRA: No, sir.

MACARTHUR: So we'll -- we'll leave it at that point.

MANNING: But -- but the...

MACARTHUR: Suffice...

KING: Let me -- let me get a call.


Here's the link....
http://www.cnn.com/TRANSCRIPTS/0304/20/lkl.00.html

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#2 of 13 Old 04-28-2003, 02:04 AM
 
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Deepak Chopra may have been confusing the language in which the NT was written with the language Jesus spoke. Jesus spoke Aramaic but Paul's letters were written in Greek. In the Gosples, there are occasional words/phrases written in Aramaic so as to quote Jesus more accurately, but the books themselves are written in Greek.
I hope some Biblical scholars will back me up on this.

Edited to add that it sounds like the priest was doing a good job of being a peacemaker and that his introspective approach was valuable. Wish I had seen the show.
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#3 of 13 Old 04-28-2003, 02:34 AM
 
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That was very interesting! Thanks for posting. I always like to see the way people of different faiths see issues.
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#4 of 13 Old 05-01-2003, 12:13 AM
 
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If Reverend MacArthur is the Reverend MacArthur I am thinking of (Master's College? Grace Community Church?), then yes, he is very arrogant.

But very successful as a pastor. There was a scandal he was exonerated of twenty-three years ago regarding the type of counseling he does, but he survived.


He has a history. But he is very sure of himself.

"The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie, deliberate, contrived and dishonest, but the myth, persistent, persuasive and unrealistic."
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#5 of 13 Old 05-01-2003, 01:47 PM
 
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I saw that show! It reminded me of our discussions here at Mothering, before the rules of no debate were reiterated.

The Protestant pastor was very cranky and judgemental. Chopra and the Catholic priest seemed to have more love in their little fingers than he had in his whole Bible!

I must have missed that Greek/Aramaic discussion tho. I did not remember that. Of course the NT was written in Greek. The Jewish scriptures were written in Hebrew, with a little bit here and there in Aramaic. We don't really know what language Jesus (Yeshua) spoke. Acc to my reading, the area was becoming so thoroughly Hellenized, many Jews no longer spoke their native tongue and took to Greek (esp in the large Jewish diaspora population of Alexandria, Egypt, and we know Jesus is said to have spent time in Egypt [cosmopolitan hotbed of liberalism and tolerance]). Paul himself was using the Septaguint (the Gk translation of the 5 books of torah) in his writings. With the mistranslation of "young woman" to "virgin" (shall give birth to Emmanuel), to name one problem.
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#6 of 13 Old 05-01-2003, 02:01 PM - Thread Starter
 
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yes, I believe the reverand is the same as the one from Grace church.... by the way talk about fraudulent advertising.... 'GRACE" is hardly what he bestows... maybe the church should be called, "MY WAY IS THE RIGHT WAY" Church.

He was so arrogant. And if you didn't see the show...let me tell you the body postures were very, very tellling.

It was interesting.

Like Darylll I walked away with more interest in hearing depak and the priest speak again, then ever, ever hearing the rev. I can only guess what kind of counseling he does.......

thank you all for the information about the language...I thought this was most curious that they weren't in agreement but I guess it is about semantics..no pun intended.

yeah, it did seem a bit like mothering dot com discussions... but worse... they had no x chromosomes on Larry King.

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#7 of 13 Old 05-02-2003, 01:25 AM
 
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My DH and I attend a nearby synagogue - near Grace Community Church. He has a HUGE following. Lots of homeschoolers there. At Thanksgiving time when we have ecumenical meetings with the local Presbyterians and Catholics, he (MacArthur) does not ever participate.

That is very sad because we can all live to learn from each other. NO one has the market cornered on the TRUTH.

Also, when I returned to school to finish my credential, I did consider going to The Master's College in Newhall which he also runs. It does have a good reputation and is respected as far as schools of education go, but is very expensive. I ended up going to CSUN which I did not think was a good school of education, but I have a credential don't I?

BTW, the congregation does have a very supportive, long-established homeschooling group.

"The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie, deliberate, contrived and dishonest, but the myth, persistent, persuasive and unrealistic."
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#8 of 13 Old 05-04-2003, 07:39 PM
 
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Just be glad no one asked MacArthur his views on women.

Anyone who even considers going to counseling by him should run away, fast, especially if you are female.
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#9 of 13 Old 05-04-2003, 11:08 PM
 
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I found this statement to be so moving:

>>>>
KUSHNER: I believe that my religion is the best in the same way that I believe my wife is the most wonderful woman in the world, not as a statement of fact but as a statement of love and loyalty. That is it's a way of saying this is what I am committed to.

It's not a way of making a factual statement that I'm correct and everybody else is wrong because when you say that, you're -- as Deepak suggested, you're going to end up arguing with each other ad infinitum.
<<<<<

Wow, what a great way of looking at religion!

Kay

 

 

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#10 of 13 Old 05-04-2003, 11:11 PM
 
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I liked this from Manning (priest):

>>>>
KING: You killed people because they didn't believe the way you believed.

MANNING: And we've learned from that. That doesn't work. It doesn't work. We've got to be able to understand the presence of God in Muslims. We've got to understand the presence of God in all people, and they -- and reverence that presence and hold it -- God is moving in you, God is moving in the Muslims in a great way, and I need to say, hey, God, thank you for that, help me to learn from that, help me to learn that I might be able to draw closer to God.
<<<<<

And I don't know about Macarthur's other views, but listen to this (this is quite a statement for someone to make):

>>>
MACARTHUR: Yes. Every time the Christian faith has stepped into any kind of war, it has stepped beyond the lines of Biblical Christianity. It is wrong. We've learned that from history.

Every war ever conducted, every inquisition, every crusade, whether or not it was the Protestants going across to kill the Catholics in Ireland, it was wrong. It was not Christian.

MANNING: It doesn't work. It doesn't work.

MACARTHUR: That's not the New Testament. That's not Christianity.
<<<<<

Kay

 

 

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#11 of 13 Old 05-04-2003, 11:16 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I too liked what kushner said about religion and his wife...


I can only guess what macarthur's thoughts about women are.... I am sure they are scary. I would probably react the same way I did when I heard the reverand of Rusty And Andrea Yates talk about motherhood duties or something like that... I don't know I sort of shut down it was so horrible.

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#12 of 13 Old 05-05-2003, 02:48 AM
 
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MacArthur's views on just about every subject make me do the following:

: :Puke
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#13 of 13 Old 05-18-2003, 09:56 PM
 
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The Reverend MacArthur was involved in 1978 in counseling a young man who was severely depressed. He was contemplating suicide. The young man eventually did commit suicide. The very reverend Macarthur allegedly said words to the effect that ~Sometimes this is the way G-d calls his little lambs home~

The parents sued unsuccessfully, and he got off. But there was quite a bit of controversy for about three-four years.

"The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie, deliberate, contrived and dishonest, but the myth, persistent, persuasive and unrealistic."
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