Weird...I'll try yet again...Judaism 101 - Page 2 - Mothering Forums
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#31 of 36 Old 06-12-2003, 04:06 PM
 
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Originally posted by marcy74
If I were to go to our local Synagogue, I wonder if the Rabbi there may have an entirely different view on it than a Rabbi in a more liberal area. Or am I misunderstanding how Judaism works?
Okay, so there are two things going on when you approach a rabbi about any issue. One is, his or her membership in a movement. For example, your rabbi may be a Reform rabbi and a member of the CCAR, or he may be a Chabad rabbi and follow the tenets of Lubavitch Hasidism. That's one factor in how your local rabbi will answer a question. And the kind of question you ask your rabbi is strongly shaped by that as well. You probably wouldn't ask your Reform rabbi, "Is my chicken kosher, I found a stone in its gullet" and you might not necessarily ask your Chabad rabbi for pastoral counseling (though you never know, he might have a degree in that!)

Then there is the personality of that individual and his or her circumstances in the community. Even though we have movements and schools of thought, there's no pope in Judaism, no bishop to reprimand the individual clergy person. The rabbi is responsible to his or her congregation or other employer. But he really has the freedom to make his own interpretations of Jewish law, according to his own teachers and influences and his own sense of things.

With Jewish families, it's the same. One set of Jewish parents is willing to disown their children for intermarrying, or same-sex marriage, or becoming less observant. Another set won't let go no matter what.

Monotheistic but not monolithic, that's us.

Divorced mom of one awesome boy born 2-3-2003.
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#32 of 36 Old 06-12-2003, 04:33 PM
 
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Originally posted by marcy74
Yes, it was helpful. I'm sorry, I didn't mean to offend. I guess I was under that impression because of that documentary. One Rabbi told a gay man that he needed to go to therapy and overcome this. Which I guess isn't really saying he didn't have compassion, he just thought this man could change, and the gay man felt very hurt and abandoned by this Rabbi.
Another man told his parents he was gay and they sent him to Israel to "straighten him out." That just doesn't seem very compassionate to me. You don't do what we think you should be doing, so we don't want to see you until you do! His father was a Rabbi, I think.
Marcy, so you are saying that individuals who are religious, torah observant can also be uncompassionate and judgemental? Yeah, sad but true.
In your previous post, that I was responding to, you made it sound like torah observant religious leaders previously felt that certain peple did not deserve G-d's love and mercy. THAT is simply not true. The individual torah observant person has personality
trait faults that cause him to occasionaly act wrongly toward others, or not handle situations properly. Or some people simply do not have the capacity to deal with ppl so outside of their view of "normal". Sad, but true. Those are individual's faults and circumstances. They may say something about the individual and his behavior. That does not mean it reflects on G-d's "thoughts" or "feelings" about another individual or their standing with G-d.


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If I were to go to our local Synagogue, I wonder if the Rabbi there may have an entirely different view on it than a Rabbi in a more liberal area. Or am I misunderstanding how Judaism works?
I'm not sure what "view" you are starting with. Normative torah thought sees male/ male anal sex as a prohibition from the torah. Just as a jewish man having sex with a niddah (menstuating) jewish woman is prohibited. Noone asks at the door of the shul if you have done in the past, presently do, or are planning on doing, either of these forbidden things. It is noone's business. Why does anyone, rabbi or otherwise, need to have a "view" on other people's private behavior??

A jewish man has a mitzva to get married and have children. The biggest part of practicing judaism is in the home and personal life of an individual. It is hard to do that and actually impossible to fulfill some very important mitzvos without a jewish home and family.
Every person has their personal challenge, and not every person can fulfill every mitzva that pertains to them.
Again, that has no affect on you (general), so it should not matter.


Here are some normative torah thoughts on the subject (both links available from the trembling web site):
http://www.aish.com/societyWork/arts...Before_G-d.asp

http://www.tremblingbeforeg-d.com/agudath.html

-BelovedBird

Mom of 5 boys- 13, 10, 8, 2 : and newbie Aug. 24th, '09 . babywearing advocate . Cook, baker, homemaker, wife to a man with another woman's kidney (live altruistic, unknown donor).
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#33 of 36 Old 06-12-2003, 04:34 PM
 
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T
All this talk has reminded me of a fundraiser I pitched in on years ago. An ad hoc group raising money for AIDS research did a musical called "West Hollywood Side Story", the classic re-written with comedic gay understones. It worked so well the next year they did "Fiddler on the West Hollywood Roof" which I worked on briefly. It was a riot... same basic storyline with two sons and a daughter needing to be married off... and all three of them come out during the story. Of course after a bit of comedic angst everyone embraced for the finale.

We now return you to your regularly scheduled Spirituality discussion.
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#34 of 36 Old 06-12-2003, 05:02 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Beloved Bird, I sense from your posts that you are angry with me for the questions I am asking. I hope I've not offended you or anyone here, I'm just trying to understand it all. I'm extremely sensitive, so I could have mis-read your posts. It's so hard to "read" tone of voice on message boards.
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#35 of 36 Old 06-12-2003, 05:55 PM
 
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Marcy, where do you get the impression that I am angry about your questions? To the contrary, I am answering them to the best of my ability. One statement you made bothered me. I think I have explained why....:

-BelovedBird

Mom of 5 boys- 13, 10, 8, 2 : and newbie Aug. 24th, '09 . babywearing advocate . Cook, baker, homemaker, wife to a man with another woman's kidney (live altruistic, unknown donor).
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#36 of 36 Old 06-12-2003, 06:09 PM - Thread Starter
 
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BelovedBird, you're always so kind and caring in your posts, so I figured I mis-read or was being too sensitive. Thank you for clearing that up! Sometimes, passion for a subject can be confused for anger, KWIM? I think it was the double ?? which seemed hostile to me, but like I said, it's really hard to "hear" tone of voice here.

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