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#301 of 1560 Old 02-28-2008, 03:05 PM
 
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Originally Posted by UmmIbrahim View Post
wa salaam

also, need i mention that i've reached a point where I don't care if my opinions offend those who dont get Islam and dont wanna get Islam. Im respectful towards other faiths, I expect the same back.

Guess what, I belive circ is right...its a religious sunnah...if others wanna be haters...go ahead. In the end we all answer to God!

Umm Ibi
: : This really made me laugh!! but it is oh so true. I also believe it is a religious sunnah and don't really feel bad about it. Allahu Alam!

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Originally Posted by Shiloh View Post
salaam

thanks for saying this, I often feel like I have to hide the fact my son's are circ'd especially here....or be appologetic about it....I guess I got to come out of my islam-o-closet
: Don't feel be apologetic about it. You know in your heart why your sons were circ'd. Besides, why are some women so worried about other women's children's genitals??

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Originally Posted by umsami View Post


Wa'alaikum Assalam:

In my four or so years on MDC, I've gotten in a bit of trouble for my pro-religious circ stance. I've posted on ways to make it more comfortable for the baby, but hey... eventually the thread gets closed, but at least Mamas who do circ may see it. They've gotten a bit better in not allowing people to say bad things about religious circ... a few years ago, things could get really really nasty.
I believe in some ways we need to be educators. However, with this topic, I steer clear. Some women only want to debate about it. They will never hear any one elses view point. and they will never ever respect another person's views. I mean, I respect that some women choose not to circ, why can't they respect that I choose to??? (even though I don't have a son, I would circ if I did)
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#302 of 1560 Old 02-28-2008, 04:48 PM
 
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my four or so years on MDC, I've gotten in a bit of trouble for my pro-religious circ stance. I've posted on ways to make it more comfortable for the baby, but hey...
I hate the misinformation on there, my ds did not cry for their circs, they were not in pain, they were given painkillers, it did not interfere with their feedings, my husband held them in his arms they were not strapped to any board...

I posted something on aposthia on the board (I know being tricky) as Mohammed -pbuh - was said to be born without foreskin...wow the responses I got....

Quote:
Besides, why are some women so worried about other women's children's genitals??
I was on the circ board and one woman made the comment that no one has the right to comment on anyone elses genitals...but of course she meant no one has the right to comment on her son being intact....but she has the right to damn me to hell

8 might be enough
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#303 of 1560 Old 02-28-2008, 04:59 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Shiloh View Post
I hate the misinformation on there, my ds did not cry for their circs, they were not in pain, they were given painkillers, it did not interfere with their feedings, my husband held them in his arms they were not strapped to any board...
I do understand the secular anti-circ position, but really ... if I were someone waffling on the subject and looking for info probably 90% of what I've seen around here would send me running from anti-circ activists as fast as I could. I know it's well-intentioned, but yeesh.

(My son slept through it ... though I know some would say he went into a state of dissociative shock or something. )
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#304 of 1560 Old 02-28-2008, 05:02 PM
 
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my son cried when the doctor took off his socks...
but not when they circ. him.

If there was no religious component to my conviction I may not have circ'd.
But I agree if I was looking for fair and balanced...there's a pretty onesided argument _HOWEVER I did see a poll once and a fair % of mamas here have circ'd I think it was 15-30%...pregnancy brain fails me now...

8 might be enough
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#305 of 1560 Old 02-28-2008, 09:25 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Shiloh View Post
salaam

thanks for saying this, I often feel like I have to hide the fact my son's are circ'd especially here....or be appologetic about it....I guess I got to come out of my islam-o-closet
yeah girl...let it alll hang out! You dont see Jewish mamas or Xtian mamas or Wiccan mamas worried about what they say, why should we?

Im about to start a thread asking why people think its OK to hate on religious people and esp Muslims.

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#306 of 1560 Old 02-28-2008, 09:33 PM
 
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alright you post it
there's a TAO post about are you afraid of black people...I assume they mean the cultural group haven't read the thread...

how about do you want to sit next to me and my qu'ran on a plane?

8 might be enough
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#307 of 1560 Old 02-28-2008, 10:09 PM
 
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Originally Posted by UmmIbrahim View Post
Im about to start a thread asking why people think its OK to hate on religious people and esp Muslims.

You are awfully fiesty today!! I would love to read the thread that got you goin'.

Go ahead and start it. I will be right there supporting you!
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#308 of 1560 Old 02-28-2008, 10:11 PM
 
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alright you post it
how about do you want to sit next to me and my qu'ran on a plane?
Now that would be funny!! oh the conversations that would take place would be great!
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#309 of 1560 Old 02-28-2008, 10:19 PM
 
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Asalam Alaikum!

I think the thread would end up locked. But who knows? Somebody post it! I am getting really tired of the veiled Islamophobic comments that I have seen lately. I would love to hear people's real opinions, not that people would likely give them.
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#310 of 1560 Old 02-28-2008, 10:31 PM
 
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I would do the poll but I don't know how..someone can talk me through it I'll post it
okay questions..
1. are you afraid of muslims?
2. just muslim men in traditional dress?
3. would you be freaked out if I prayed on a plane...
4. muslim women in traditional dress and

sorry I am getting silly..
are you afraid of muslims on a train?
are you afraid of muslims on a plane?
I do not like them in a box.
I do not like them with a fox.
I do not like them in a house.
I do not like them with a mouse.
I do not like them here or there.
I do not like them anywhere.

8 might be enough
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#311 of 1560 Old 02-29-2008, 10:28 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Shiloh View Post
Isorry I am getting silly..
are you afraid of muslims on a train?
are you afraid of muslims on a plane?
I do not like them in a box.
I do not like them with a fox.
I do not like them in a house.
I do not like them with a mouse.
I do not like them here or there.
I do not like them anywhere.
:

sad but true!
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#312 of 1560 Old 02-29-2008, 10:57 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Shiloh View Post
I would do the poll but I don't know how..someone can talk me through it I'll post it
okay questions..
1. are you afraid of muslims?
2. just muslim men in traditional dress?
3. would you be freaked out if I prayed on a plane...
4. muslim women in traditional dress and

sorry I am getting silly..
are you afraid of muslims on a train?
are you afraid of muslims on a plane?
I do not like them in a box.
I do not like them with a fox.
I do not like them in a house.
I do not like them with a mouse.
I do not like them here or there.
I do not like them anywhere.


To post a poll... pretend you're posting a normal thread... then, near the bottom, there should be a check box about including a poll and the number of options you want. Check that. Always preview it first... and you should be fine.

Mom to DS(8), DS(6), DD(4), and DS(1).  "Kids do as well as they can."

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#313 of 1560 Old 02-29-2008, 10:58 AM - Thread Starter
 
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LOL
Hey, keep me in your dua'at...here I go!!!!

I'll post the URL arter i'm done.
Hey i'm already banned from several threads on this forum for being fiesty...why not more.
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#314 of 1560 Old 02-29-2008, 10:59 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Summertime Mommy View Post
Asalam Alaikum!

I think the thread would end up locked. But who knows? Somebody post it! I am getting really tired of the veiled Islamophobic comments that I have seen lately. I would love to hear people's real opinions, not that people would likely give them.
Wa'alaikum Assalam:

People can't give their real opinions, otherwise they're violating the UA. BUT, if you hang out on N&CE (News & Current Events) you can get an idea of people's real opinions whenever a thread relating to Islam comes up. Or just go back and read through some of the older threads in the board.

Mom to DS(8), DS(6), DD(4), and DS(1).  "Kids do as well as they can."

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#315 of 1560 Old 02-29-2008, 11:02 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Oh God...um, I've chickened out!

where should it be posted?
How should I word it?
hahahahhaa, yes i'm a chicken! *does the chicken dance*

p.s. I have my husbands words in my ears...asking me why I always gotta be crazy, stirring up the waters and making a hornets nest of troubles...hahahaha!
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#316 of 1560 Old 02-29-2008, 11:06 AM
 
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Hmmm... you could try placing it in TAO...

You could try wording it so it seems like you're looking for positive feedback, maybe....

So, say... I'm a Muslim woman who covers (if you do) and I realize that makes a lot of people nervous. What things could I and other Muslims do to make you feel more comfortable if you flew with us?

Or... ask... Which of these statements (allow multiple choices) do you agree with regarding Muslims? (you could specify those that wear hijab or not)... then list some positive things and negative things... cause y'know, we're all terrorists if we wear hijab. (Side note, this always baffles me because the 9/11 hijackers looked WESTERN. Do they really think Al Qaeda is so stupid that they'd put the bomb underneath some chic in hijab or niqab's clothes??? : )

Mom to DS(8), DS(6), DD(4), and DS(1).  "Kids do as well as they can."

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#317 of 1560 Old 02-29-2008, 11:48 AM
 
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Originally Posted by umsami View Post
Hmmm... you could try placing it in TAO...

You could try wording it so it seems like you're looking for positive feedback, maybe....

So, say... I'm a Muslim woman who covers (if you do) and I realize that makes a lot of people nervous. What things could I and other Muslims do to make you feel more comfortable if you flew with us?

Or... ask... Which of these statements (allow multiple choices) do you agree with regarding Muslims? (you could specify those that wear hijab or not)... then list some positive things and negative things... cause y'know, we're all terrorists if we wear hijab. (Side note, this always baffles me because the 9/11 hijackers looked WESTERN. Do they really think Al Qaeda is so stupid that they'd put the bomb underneath some chic in hijab or niqab's clothes??? : )
That would be a nice thread and it doesn't sound argumentative in any way.

On a side note, I had a friend who was on a bus from Toronto to Michigan when the bus was surrounded by police and she was removed from the bus and searched. Apparently one of the people on the bus claimed that she was a man dressed as a women with a bomb under her clothes.
How sad is that where we live in a world where a muslim woman can't even ride in peace.
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#318 of 1560 Old 02-29-2008, 12:18 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Oh man, actually...I must admit, during our last flight back from Iran to the USA we had a stopover in France. :
and like so many of the people booked on the flight from France to the USAwere our fellow passengers coming from Iran...well, okay, im sure being w/ a bunch of Iranians was scary enough...but then, I-yes I, actually got pretty worried when a whole bunch of people flying from Syria came to check in for their flight...yes, i'm serious...I coming from Iran and flying from hijab...got nervous (as did many of the other Irani passengers, we were all standing around talking about this)...becos the Syrians looked like religious school students, w/ long beards, thobes, Niqabs and then the 1 guy dropped his bag and out came a bunch of heavy religious books. I felt like utter crude for being so worried...but, I really really was.
So, I can ONLY imagine what the average, ignorant, Non-Muslim passenger felt...being surrounded by all these Iranians and Syrians.



p.s. I'll post in TAO-whats TAO btw? later, when I get back from the post office. Thou just know, i probably wont be checking the thread that much, so ya'll better pony up and reply to people. ok?

M'a salaama
Umm Ibi
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#319 of 1560 Old 02-29-2008, 01:04 PM
 
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The problem with that kind of thread, no matter how it's worded, is like umsami said ... people mostly know they can't just come out and say "I think Islam is backwards; I'm scared of Muslim people; etc" -- even anonymously, even to themselves. I foresee just a lot of "I have nothing against Muslims, Islam has been hijacked by extremeists, the religion is comparatively young and is in a period like the Christian reformation, all faiths have good and bad in them" and so on and so forth.

Now, post a news thread about some Muslim person doing some bad thing somewhere in the world, even if it's not true and can easily be shown as such, and a lot of people get a lot more unintentionally sincere.
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#320 of 1560 Old 02-29-2008, 01:21 PM
 
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Originally Posted by UmmIbrahim View Post
p.s. I'll post in TAO-whats TAO btw? later, when I get back from the post office. Thou just know, i probably wont be checking the thread that much, so ya'll better pony up and reply to people. ok?
Assalamu Alaikum:

TAO is Talk Amongst Ourselves.

Peace.

Mom to DS(8), DS(6), DD(4), and DS(1).  "Kids do as well as they can."

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#321 of 1560 Old 02-29-2008, 01:25 PM
 
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... article on the BBC about how a bunch of Turkish scholars are re-examining the ahadith.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/7264903.stm
Came across this today:

http://www.todayszaman.com/tz-web/de...ay&link=135202

Quote:
On Thursday the Directorate of Religious Affairs issued a press release that expressed frustration with the coverage of the project by the BBC and other Western and domestic media outlets, rejecting the descriptions of "reform," "revision" and "revolution." "We believe that this academic and scientific hadith project, being conducted independent of domestic and foreign politics, will be an important step taken to convey the universal message of the Prophet Mohammed to the 21st century," the statement read. Also on Thursday directorate head Ali Bardakoğlu spoke to the press at İstanbul Atatürk Airport while on his way to Saudi Arabia and commented that some foreign press organs had covered the project without doing sufficient research to back their claims.

The directorate's Görmez said the project is a scientific one aimed at better understanding the content of the hadith. "It would neither be scientific nor correct to expurgate certain hadith. Sometimes insufficient information could be used to reach to precise information. Thus, we will not expunge certain hadith; we will make a new compilation of the hadith and re-interpret them if necessary," he noted.

The directorate vehemently denies that it is attempting to create a new form of Islam for secular Turkey or for political motives, as the BBC report suggests. Instead, it contends that it is taking a long-overdue look at the classical sources of Islam, contextually re-evaluating them for the 21st century to ensure that the texts can continue to be a guiding, relevant spiritual source for Turkey's millions of Muslims. In essence, a return to an original form of Islam that has been diluted over the centuries by various developments.

Görmez underlined that the project is being conducted by the directorate with the assistance of 35 hadith scholars from several Turkish universities and expressed disappointment over seeing distorted news articles in Western media related to their project.

"I had an interview with BBC reporter Robert Pigott around two months ago about the project. I underscored during our interview that it cannot be termed a revolutionary reinterpretation of Islam. But, his article read 'the very theology of Islam is being reinterpreted in order to effect a radical renewal of the religion.' This does not reflect the truth. We are going to take the appropriate legal measures for redress," he added.

The directorate's project will produce a six-volume text that includes Quran exegesis (tafsir) and hadith evaluation. Some 400 topics will be interpreted in the light of the Quran and the hadith. The project is expected to be completed by the end of this year.
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#322 of 1560 Old 02-29-2008, 01:28 PM
 
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oooh... thanks for posting this Liquesce.

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#323 of 1560 Old 02-29-2008, 05:37 PM - Thread Starter
 
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The problem with that kind of thread, no matter how it's worded, is like umsami said ... people mostly know they can't just come out and say "I think Islam is backwards; I'm scared of Muslim people; etc" -- even anonymously, even to themselves. I foresee just a lot of "I have nothing against Muslims, Islam has been hijacked by extremeists, the religion is comparatively young and is in a period like the Christian reformation, all faiths have good and bad in them" and so on and so forth.

Now, post a news thread about some Muslim person doing some bad thing somewhere in the world, even if it's not true and can easily be shown as such, and a lot of people get a lot more unintentionally sincere.
salaam,
I agree...so, I'm not going to make such a thread...but someone else is free to do so.
It would be like that, much like the are you afraid of black people thread...I love the poll option of "no ofcourse not, thats racist"...or whatever it was, because frankly, we all know that most of those people who checked that option are wary of black people got its so un-PC to state that you are so they hide behind "no, ofcourse not...thats just racist!"...
I can forsee for Muslims it would be the same..."no, ofcourse a Niqabi in black don't scare me...thats just racist!"

meanwhile, we know many misguided people are afraid of Muslims, black peopl, punks, goths and anyone else who doesnt fit the ivory tower image.

I have noticed the amount of ignorant, angry and agressive members, looking to force their opinions and engage you in a combative mannter on this forum, who have NO desire to educate themselves and instead rely on history books or TV...c'mon, we know both tend to be biased. I say, some of them must have to much free time on their hands!

NE way, hope everyone has a blessed jummeh! I hope I havent offended anyone here.

m'a salaama
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#324 of 1560 Old 02-29-2008, 06:40 PM
 
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Aww..I was looking forward to seeing that post. I would post it myself, but I am a big chicken. I think people might actually be more honest than we think, not completely honest of course, but I think that a lot of people don't even realize that they are thinking/saying things that are horribly biased. I can barely read the threads in N&CE half the time, because they make me so angry, but I seriously don't think people understand what they say is wrong.

Muslims are the people it is "okay" to be afraid of these days.
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#325 of 1560 Old 03-01-2008, 05:45 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Spkg of which...we have our tickets for Iran reservced and we are-subhanallah! Flying via Air Qatar. Sure the flight from DC to Qatar will be like 16hrs...hehehhee, but id would much prefer to be on a flight w/ other Muslims and middle easterners and not get the 3rd degree during our stopover!!!!

I *hate* stopovers in Europe, esp France they are SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO horrible AND the people on the flights, esp the Europeans are SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO rude if they see your a Muslim!
Id rather NOT have to deal w/ people and their stupid attitudes when i'll have a young toddler slingin' on my hip, puhlease...like I got time for that!

so, subhanallah to that! Oh and apparently Air Qatar is really nice-esp if you have wee ones.
anyone flown via that airline?

Maybe sometime i'll post that thread...like in the summer, when i'll have more time on my hands and less stress.
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#326 of 1560 Old 03-01-2008, 06:29 PM
 
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assalamu alaikum just noticed your post, dead head muslim i am somewhat of a dead head muslim. the brother that introduced me to islam first introduced himself to me by complimenting my doors t shirt ha ha anyway nice meeting you sis.
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#327 of 1560 Old 03-01-2008, 06:45 PM
 
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hi, i just saw your post, i'm so happy that you're open minded and curious, and willing to ask questions and learn.
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#328 of 1560 Old 03-01-2008, 07:05 PM
 
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Originally Posted by msiddiqi View Post
mumster, I just ordered a book by Martin Lings, called Muhammed. I'm currently listening to a lecture based on it. He was a British scholar who converted to Islam. I have read that it is one of the best biographies out there - especially for non-Muslims looking to understand Islam better (since the author sort of presented a lot of the information so non-Muslims could grasp it better).
I don't know if you have the time, but maybe you could pick a copy of it up. Otherwise, there are some really knowledgable (I consider myself still in the process of learning) moms on this board like Mama Aaminah mentioned so hopefully they'll be able to help you out.
I love that book! Also Ash Shifa of Qadi Iyad
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#329 of 1560 Old 03-02-2008, 08:31 AM
 
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Spkg of which...we have our tickets for Iran reservced and we are-subhanallah! Flying via Air Qatar. Sure the flight from DC to Qatar will be like 16hrs...hehehhee, but id would much prefer to be on a flight w/ other Muslims and middle easterners and not get the 3rd degree during our stopover!!!!

I *hate* stopovers in Europe, esp France they are SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO horrible AND the people on the flights, esp the Europeans are SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO rude if they see your a Muslim!
Id rather NOT have to deal w/ people and their stupid attitudes when i'll have a young toddler slingin' on my hip, puhlease...like I got time for that!

so, subhanallah to that! Oh and apparently Air Qatar is really nice-esp if you have wee ones.
anyone flown via that airline?

Maybe sometime i'll post that thread...like in the summer, when i'll have more time on my hands and less stress.
[/lurk mode]Good for you with Qatar Airways! I have an acquaintance whose husband is a pilot for them--she says it's the most awesome airline to fly, and she's flown just about everything. Very posh! I can't wait to hear your review.

We always fly Turkish Airlines now. We tried Air France two summers ago and regretted it heavily. CDG airport was horrific and I'm sure hijabi me didn't help matters any. Of course it helps that we're all flying on US passports, nowhere near the amount of interrogation that our Turkish travelers had. The food was horrible and there was so little of it that I thought I'd starve.

back to [lurk mode]
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#330 of 1560 Old 03-02-2008, 10:51 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Turkish Kate View Post
[/lurk mode]Good for you with Qatar Airways! I have an acquaintance whose husband is a pilot for them--she says it's the most awesome airline to fly, and she's flown just about everything. Very posh! I can't wait to hear your review.

We always fly Turkish Airlines now. We tried Air France two summers ago and regretted it heavily. CDG airport was horrific and I'm sure hijabi me didn't help matters any. Of course it helps that we're all flying on US passports, nowhere near the amount of interrogation that our Turkish travelers had. The food was horrible and there was so little of it that I thought I'd starve.

back to [lurk mode]
ohh cool.
hey is Doha Intl. airport cool? Actually...im curious...are their hijab/abayah stores there? Id love a real khaleeji abayah from Qatar-and not buy one via the states. blah!

Im actually very excited about flying Qatar air...i dislike CDG too...they are SO rude, which makes me rude in response. :
They think all hijabis deserve less than par treatment...and the French people on the Air France flights are rude too!
yuck!
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