I really hate PETA... Another low for this group. - Page 3 - Mothering Forums

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#61 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 03:33 PM
 
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There's no time to waste being sweet and gentle.
Exactly.
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#62 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 03:46 PM
 
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Originally posted by Arduinna
I hope your speaking for yourself and those that agree with you only. Because I am not part of your collective "we".
I'm referring to the comments that several people have made to the effect of, "look, the sign got us talking, obviously -- so it worked." But this thread has not been discussing animal abuse ... or... what was the point the sign was trying to make? Something about milk? (You see what I mean?) This thread has been discussing, instead, PETA's controversial approach, and whether or not kids who believe in Santa can read, and so forth. The issue that PETA intends to promote discussion about has not been the focal point of the discussion.

-Alice, SAHM to dd (2001) and ds (2004) each of whom was a homebirth.jpg, who each self-weaned at 4.5 years bfolderchild.gif, who both fambedsingle2.gif'd, who were bothcd.gif, and both: novaxnocirc.gif.   Also, gd.gif, and goorganic.jpg!

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#63 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 03:51 PM
 
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I totally agree - couldn't have said it better!

aw, shucks. i cant help myself. i love peta. guess i never will get rid of that soft spot i have for extremist, underdogs, and people who are unaffraid to be totally offensive for a good cause. the fact that so many hate them just makes em seem more cuddly to me.

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#64 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 03:58 PM
 
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Considering that this thread was started to discuss PETAs advertising decisions (not it's activism for animal rights) it's hardly surprising that the focus has been the ads. I generally like to stay on topic in threads.

In fact the OP is a perfect example for my previous post.

I'm sure that many many people have been curious as to the controvery over PETA ads and gone to their website to find out what they really do stand for. Who are they? They are the people that have limited info on PETA as an organization, and that haven't already decided to write the group off as "extremists".
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#65 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 04:06 PM
 
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Originally posted by Erin Pavlina
PETA definitely gets in your face using humorous truth
There's no time to waste being sweet and gentle.
I'm not saying they have to be sweet and gentle. There's nothing wrong with getting in people's faces and using humorous truth. I just think it's possible to do so while keeping the focus on the issue and without offending women and holocaust survivors and upsetting small children. I'll bet those of us in this thread could get together and come up with a truthful, in-your face message that attacks the factory farming industry without offending those we don't want to offend, and create a more effective sign than PETA's.

-Alice, SAHM to dd (2001) and ds (2004) each of whom was a homebirth.jpg, who each self-weaned at 4.5 years bfolderchild.gif, who both fambedsingle2.gif'd, who were bothcd.gif, and both: novaxnocirc.gif.   Also, gd.gif, and goorganic.jpg!

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#66 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 04:14 PM
 
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Hey, I consider myself to be an animal rights activist, but this doesn't mean I have to like PETA. As I have said in previous posts, I applaud their ideals and support their intent.

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They don't have time to mess around. Millions of animals are slaughtered every day. There's no time to waste being sweet and gentle.
I am in agreement but it's one thing to have this philosophy but quite another to plaster it up on a billboard for everyone to see. Why not have 'em in late night commercials, in magazine ads, saturate every talk show and news broadcast! Call me crazy, but I'd like to choose the time I feel is most appropriate when it comes to educating my son about the evils of commercial meat processing and the fur industry. I can turn off the TV, I can not buy certian magazines, but it's kinda hard to keep my kid from seeing a HUGE bilboard! They have every right to spread their message but not when it threatens the innocence of my son and his peers! THERE IS A BETTER WAY!

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#67 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 04:20 PM
 
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Originally posted by Arduinna
Considering that this thread was started to discuss PETAs advertising decisions (not it's activism for animal rights) it's hardly surprising that the focus has been the ads. I generally like to stay on topic in threads.
But don't you see? Someone read the ad, and then came here and, instead of posting "hey! I just saw a great ad that taught me something I didn't know about milk!" they posted "ugh! how inappropriate!" and then a bunch of us joined in saying that our reaction to the ad is the same. This thread represents a reaction to the ad which is not exactly the reaction that such an ad should be trying to produce.

-Alice, SAHM to dd (2001) and ds (2004) each of whom was a homebirth.jpg, who each self-weaned at 4.5 years bfolderchild.gif, who both fambedsingle2.gif'd, who were bothcd.gif, and both: novaxnocirc.gif.   Also, gd.gif, and goorganic.jpg!

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#68 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 04:26 PM
 
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HUH??? A peaceful demonstration is hardly an act of war! Marches and sit-ins at lunch counters are hardly acts of violence! So what is your problem with Gandhi and Martin Luther King being called pacifists?? They were pacifists!!
Then what is the problem with the billboard? They are not advocating war - and most kids probably won't understand the double entendre of the billboard.

They got you to think about animals at a time when animals are traditionally not thought of at all - except for the meal or as a gift.

A pacifist may oppose violence and war but they do not oppose confrontation and IMO that is what this is about.

Gandhiji also said that you can judge a nation by how well its animals are treated.

Further I have never seen PETA advocate violence on this issue.
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#69 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 04:29 PM
 
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Originally posted by Devrock
I'll bet those of us in this thread could get together and come up with a truthful, in-your face message that attacks the factory farming industry without offending those we don't want to offend, and create a more effective sign than PETA's.

I am sure that PETA could also do the same, if they wanted too, some groups want press whether it actually works to further their cause or to educate or not.:

I am sure they could come up with ads that made a very clear, very stong point (as I said before- show the pics of animals, and leave out the Holocaust victims), but they obviously are looking for something other than education, IMO

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#70 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 04:33 PM
 
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no, actually someone read an op ed piece about PETAs ads and came and posted a copy of it. And it's clear from their choice of title for this thread that they already have a bias against PETA (again supporting my contention). Not the same thing. And considering the focus of Mothering and many MDC members on natural living, vegetarianism ect and the fact that not one person posted about not understanding the Santa ad, it's clear that we understood the link between milk and impotence so what is there to discuss??

There were posts btw about animal rights, but they were from people who already had made a decision. We that same old same old stuff of "well what about the poor vegetables" in essence saying that any activism is usless and hypocritical. Hardly stuff for an open minded discussion. And again off topic for this thread about ADS.
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#71 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 04:36 PM
 
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Originally posted by 3boys4us
Then what is the problem with the billboard? They are not advocating war - and most kids probably won't understand the double entendre of the billboard.
No one has claimed that the billboard is advocating war or that children will understand the sexual reference. The expressed concern is that children will be upset by the suggestion that Santa Claus will not be visiting their house this year.

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Originally posted by 3boys4us
They got you to think about animals at a time when animals are traditionally not thought of at all - except for the meal or as a gift.
No, they didn't get me thinking about animals. They got me thinking about a bunch of little kids who are going to be uspet by the suggestion that Santa Claus will not be visiting their house this year.

Luckily, I don't need PETA to make me think about animals. I think about animals regardless of PETA. Good thing.

Quote:
Originally posted by 3boys4us
I have never seen PETA advocate violence on this issue.
I don't think anyone has been claiming that PETA advocates violence on this issue.

-Alice, SAHM to dd (2001) and ds (2004) each of whom was a homebirth.jpg, who each self-weaned at 4.5 years bfolderchild.gif, who both fambedsingle2.gif'd, who were bothcd.gif, and both: novaxnocirc.gif.   Also, gd.gif, and goorganic.jpg!

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#72 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 04:42 PM
 
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Originally posted by Arduinna
no, actually someone read an op ed piece about PETAs ads and came and posted a copy of it.
I believe that was the original poster's way of saying "ugh, how inappropriate."

Quote:
Originally posted by Arduinna
And it's clear from their choice of title for this thread that they already have a bias against PETA
I don't think you need to be biased to notice a certain pattern in this particular group's advertising.

-Alice, SAHM to dd (2001) and ds (2004) each of whom was a homebirth.jpg, who each self-weaned at 4.5 years bfolderchild.gif, who both fambedsingle2.gif'd, who were bothcd.gif, and both: novaxnocirc.gif.   Also, gd.gif, and goorganic.jpg!

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#73 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 05:08 PM
 
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I may not agree with all of PETA's tactics, which is why I stopped financially supporting them years ago (not to mention that i'm broke : ) , but I am VERY glad they exist nevertheless.

The mass droves of people do not stop and think what is wrong with milk... what is wrong with snapping chicken's beaks off.... what is wrong with mass pumping of antibiotics, ect.

This ad makes us uncomfortable, and IT SHOULD!!!! The amount of resouces this contry consumes in the name of eating animals/animal products is sickening. The health threat, the environmental threat, the lack of ethical consideration.... PETA shocks and introduces eye opening discussion.

Once upon a time something called the ERA was considered extreme. Guess what, it still is by many. But I will support the ERA until it one day passes. Likewise, I will support veganism until we embrace compassion for those who can't speak for themselves.

Great thread.

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#74 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 05:13 PM
 
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Devrock... PETA's ads aren't offensive to everyone, so saying they can make ads that don't offend people really isn't under their control. People will either choose to be offended or not offended by what they see. What some see as offensive to women or holocaust survivors, other people will see as a perfect example.

Here is something I wanted to point out...

If you were a slave in 1859 in the south and you were suffering terribly (as they all were), would you want some nice people from the north to have some tea parties with a few people who paid to be in attendance listening to their thoughts and views on why the slaves should be freed? Or would you want those people marching in the south, putting up signs showing whipped backs, abused bodies, and cowering people and bringing to light the true atrocities that were committed against these slaves? If you were a slave in 1859 would you care if some southern slave owners were offended by those signs?

If you were a slave in 1859 would you be wishing with all your being that someone, somewhere would save you, no matter the cost, no matter the threat to the economy of the south, no matter who had to be shaken awake so they would finally see that it is not right to treat any living being so cruelly?

No animal should suffer such cruel treatment to be a delicacy on someone's plate. It's murder, it's wrong, and in my humble opinion, there is simply no justification for it. So I applaud and support PETA for their efforts and their tactics. More power to them.
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#75 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 06:08 PM
 
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The above poster reminds me why I would never give $$$ to PETA.

Do I think animals should be fed well, not tortured...? Yes. Do I think all people should be vegitarians? No. Do I think that people should be able to wear leather? Yes.

For me, I totally support PETAs attempts to have animals treated in a *humane* manner. I cannot support, though, assertions that it is reasonable to care for an ANT as much as your own child, or if you were driving and there was a person in front of the car you WOULDN'T swerve if you had to hit an animal to do so. That's just off the deep end for me.

Totally OT--- When DD was just becomming a good reader, we passed an adult superstore called "Peeps"--- she thought that it was the factory where *all* the Easter candy peeps were made and kept asking if we could go there. She knew we couldn't go *right then* because the windows were dark--- obviously they were closed, lol.

 

 

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#76 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 06:15 PM
 
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Originally posted by TiredX2
The above poster reminds me why I would never give $$$ to PETA.
I have to laugh, because Erin Pavlina's post is making me think that maybe i WILL start to give PETA some money again (if I can find some).
:LOL

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#77 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 06:27 PM
 
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Well, it was definatley eloquent!

Quote:
It's murder, it's wrong, and in my humble opinion, there is simply no justification for it.
See, I do think there is *justification* that is quite adequate for animal death. Drug research, disease research, etc... And when you get right down to it, I feel the animals should be treated well but that it is "okay" to eat them or wear them for that matter.

For me, the fact that Blacks should have the same rights as Whites is just as obvious that animals should NOT have the same rights as people.

And one thing I don't understand, and I'm not being sarcastic here. If we are going to no longer eat meat or use any animal products--- what do we do with the animals? Let them go free? Would it be someones responsibility to feed them? I'm serious here, whats the solution?

Kay

 

 

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#78 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 06:34 PM
 
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Originally posted by Erin Pavlina
Devrock... PETA's ads aren't offensive to everyone, so saying they can make ads that don't offend people really isn't under their control.
I think it is. I think their basic attitude on it has been that they know their ads are offensive and they don't apologize and they intend to keep doing it.

Quote:
Originally posted by Erin Pavlina
If you were a slave in 1859 would you care if some southern slave owners were offended by those signs?
The people that PETA is offending are not analogous to the slave owners. If PETA were simply offending people who are cruel to animals, then I would say what you are saying: More power to them!

-Alice, SAHM to dd (2001) and ds (2004) each of whom was a homebirth.jpg, who each self-weaned at 4.5 years bfolderchild.gif, who both fambedsingle2.gif'd, who were bothcd.gif, and both: novaxnocirc.gif.   Also, gd.gif, and goorganic.jpg!

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#79 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 06:43 PM
 
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I went strait to PETA's website after reading this thread, and picked up info on many more issues and their agenda.

You talking about it does work. Regardless of what aspect you are talking about. You're increasing exposure.

Sparked my curiosity, I'm sure I'm not the only one
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#80 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 06:43 PM
 
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I went strait to PETA's website after reading this thread, and picked up info on many more issues and their agenda.

You talking about it does work. Regardless of what aspect you are talking about. You're increasing exposure.

Sparked my curiosity, I'm sure I'm not the only one
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#81 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 06:51 PM
 
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Why shouldn't animals all have the same rights people? The right to live as nature intended, the right not to become someones dinner or someones belt. I'm pretty sure if cows could talk they would NOT want to be killed for your pleasure. Really, I fail to see the difference between people and animals. We are all alive. We all breathe the same air. They have their own agenda in life as do we. Really TiredX2 what makes your life so much more important then that of another living, breathing creature on this earth?
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#82 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 06:53 PM
 
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gaffa: even if you don't change one thing or you disagree with all the PETA stands for being informed is always a good thing

Dev, I'm confused how you can say that the ads are offensive to EVERYONE, especially when so many people (me included) have said they are not offended. If your offended fine, you have a right to your opinion. But you don't have the right to speak for EVERYONE.
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#83 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 06:55 PM
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I just wanna say I love you Erin Pavlina!


The brainwashed masses continue to eat meat, support factory farming, support medical testing on animals, support the torture of animals to get skin in their cars and on their feet - because they are brainwashed. It's too uncomfrotable to look at the truth, to face the reality of what they are doing to animamls with their financial support fo the institutions who torture them.

How hypocritical is it to take our kids to the zoo in admiration of the animals, or to take them to the petting zoo in the same kind of mood, then serve them up the dead remains of an animal on their plates for dinner? An animal who has been enslaved and tortured its entire life?

It has been medically proven that testing drugs on animals is not effective medicine for humans.

It has been medically proven that meat causes disease in humans.

It has been scientifically proven that meat farming destroys the environment.

It has been scientifically proven that animals have feelings, are bonded in a family structure and love their young. Read "When Elephants Weep" to see the social destruction of the elephant heard when one of its family members is killed. Wake up and smell the roses.

See the truth about the torture of animals at www.peta-online.org


And Kay - your concern for how the animals would all eat if we stopped killing them is touching. you needn't worry though - that's no reason for you to continue eating them and feeding them to your family. They would be taken care of - I guarantee you. And all the feed used to pump them up for slaughter could be redirected to feed people who are going hungry in this world.

Meat is murder, eating it is unconscionable if you know what factory farming is, and Peta, Last Chance for Animals and whoever else is willing to devote their lives to this cause are heroes.
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#84 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 07:05 PM
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One last thing:

Are you REALLY open minded?

Then go to this link and watch a FREE VIDEO

http://www.meetyourmeat.com/

It's free, doesn't cost you a dime, so why not?

then, after you have watched it, I challenge you to go anywhere in the world and find a film about how lovely, sweet and kind factory farming and the slaughter of animals is.

Folks this is an issue that has one reality, and one reality only
the farming and slaughter of animals is barbaric

Secondly, I repeatedly see outraged people who are mad because they think us activists feel animals have the same rights as humans. the right to life is a lot different than the constitution of the United States including all animals. We don't think animals have the right to bear arms, we don't think they have the right to free speech, since - ahem, they can't talk.

So I thought I would copy Peta's mission statement here to clarify what rights we think animals do have - for the record.


PETA believes that animals deserve the most basic rights—consideration of their own best interests regardless of whether they are useful to humans. Like you, they are capable of suffering and have interests in leading their own lives; therefore, they are not ours to use—for food, clothing, entertainment, or experimentation, or for any other reason.
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#85 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 07:06 PM
 
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I thought is was funny but I do realize that their ads are sometimes tasteless, some are good and some are bad. I just brace myself and Take it with a grain of salt.
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#86 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 07:13 PM
 
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Awesome post oatmeal...I am really enjoying the passion of this thread...I found no offense but I do not offend easily...I love the fact that it offends so many people and makes them uncomfortable...I think PETA is doing a marvelous job and I hope they keep up the good work.
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#87 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 07:14 PM
 
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I just want to say that Martin Luther King Jr. was considered an "extremist" - violence isn't the only gesture that can earn one that tag. Granted, it's a perjorative term and not one I would apply to him because of that.

King was even considered an "extremist" by people who were sympathtic to the cause because of the tactics he chose - direct, nonviolent resistance. (Read his "Letter from the ********** Jail" - written to confront the criticism thrown at him by otehr clergy - black and white.) He broke laws - repeatedly. He went to jail. He said things about racism, poverty and war that made many people uncomfortable. He confronted the power structure at great personal risk in order to create the tension to inspire true change. Ghandhi called this "soul force" - or satyagraha. He spoke truth to power.

Okay - off soap box. Back to the regularly scheduled programmming.

It does seem to me that PETA chooses tactics to create that kind of tension. They choose to exercise the rights granted to people in this country to express their views -- at, no doubt, risk to themselves.

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#88 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 07:19 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by gaffa
I went strait to PETA's website after reading this thread, and picked up info on many more issues and their agenda.

You talking about it does work. Regardless of what aspect you are talking about. You're increasing exposure.

Sparked my curiosity, I'm sure I'm not the only one
I think the ad causes more people to turn away from PETA than turn toward PETA.

Quote:
Originally posted by AmandasMom
Why shouldn't animals all have the same rights people?
Vegetables are living and breathing, too. Where do you draw the line? We have to eat something. It isn't black and white: Animals vs. vegetables. It's a sliding scale, all gray, with the lowest animal forms being only marginally higher on the list than the highest vegetable forms. (Did you know there are certain plants capable of a low form of communication?) I have an ethical problem with killing other primates, and I'm starting to add certain other mammals to my list. I'm not too careful about stepping on ants, though. We all draw our line in a slightly different place, depending on our own personal ethics.

Quote:
Originally posted by Arduinna
Dev, I'm confused how you can say that the ads are offensive to EVERYONE
I'm sorry, when did I say that? Can you quote me, please?

Quote:
Originally posted by oatmeal
eating it is unconscionable if you know what factory farming is
I don't eat meat from factory farms. I buy only free-range meat.

-Alice, SAHM to dd (2001) and ds (2004) each of whom was a homebirth.jpg, who each self-weaned at 4.5 years bfolderchild.gif, who both fambedsingle2.gif'd, who were bothcd.gif, and both: novaxnocirc.gif.   Also, gd.gif, and goorganic.jpg!

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#89 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 07:22 PM
 
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Continuing to eat meat just because you're not sure what would happen to all those animals if we stopped is like saying we should keep smoking because what would we do with all that tobacco.

Animals are forced to bear children to meet the demands of our society. If the demand were decreased, the farmers (and I use that term loosely) would stop breeding so many. Natural selection would again prevail.
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#90 of 202 Old 12-10-2003, 08:07 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by Jennifer Z
You have got to hear the song "Carrot Juice is Murder" by the Arrogant Worms. Here are the http://www.letssingit.com/arrogant-worms-carrot-juice-is-murder-sdnfw88.html]lyrics[/URL] . It is sung like a passionate folk song, very tongue in cheek.
The link is not working...
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