Is it possible to be a feminist and pro life at the same time? A friend of mine labeled me as a feminist one day, but I feel like I'm really disqualified since I don't believe in abortion
Please no flames. I don't judge people who are pro choice--I just don't personally feel like abortion is a good idea, with few exceptions.
I have always considered myself a feminist and I am pro-life.
Women with children are a true power.
Only women can have children. This is one of the most powerful statements a human being can make in her lifetime, to bring into this world another human being to carry on with half of our genetic material and live past our own lifetime.
Raising this child up properly is one of the most important things any one can do.
This is truly the only way the average person can change the world.
You give up that chance if you abort a healthy child.
Originally posted by Journey This is harsh, I will get flamed, but I believe that if abortion was made illegal (except in the instance of rape and health concerns), and the woman went out and received an illegal abortion, she deserves whatever comes to her.
A person goes and murders another human being because they're ruining their life or whatever. They deserve any consequences they receive, be it jail, being shunned by society, or being fatally injured.
I have no word to reply to such a hateful belief. How sad.
Originally posted by applejuice ...Raising this child up properly is one of the most important things any one can do.
This is truly the only way the average person can change the world.
You give up that chance if you abort a healthy child...
Of course raising up a child is one of the most important things anyone can do. But it's not the only imporant thing, not by far.
There are lots of women out there changing the world who have never given birth...some of them are doing it by raising their children (including unhealthy children) and some are doing it in countless other ways that have nothing to do with raising their own children.
I know a woman who had 2 abortions. I love her regardless of the poor choices she made. I don't think it is fair to kill a baby just because the father sinned. I consider life as starting at conception.
I am a fetal rights activist, but I would not stand and pickit and yell obscene things to women whe are considering an abortion.
I told dh that I would under no circumstances abort a healthy pregnancy just because I was raped. He knows that I would not kill MY child. It is still a part of me.
I won't use an IUD just because their is no absolute way to prove if it is abortive or not. I sure hope that I didn't have any prospective pregnancies that ended in abortion by taking birth control when I was younger.
Now that I am old enough to think through my choices, we are not using chemical birth control.
Dh uses condoms. If I did get pregnant, I would love our child as a gift from G*D.
And a word on what feminism is to me:
That women should receive equal rights, that do not cause death to others.
And it would be true feminism to disagree, and at the end of the day put our arms around eachother and give eachother support.
Originally posted by Bladestar5 ...And it would be true feminism to disagree, and at the end of the day put our arms around eachother and give eachother support.
Except, of course, the ones who have "gotten what they deserve" when they die from an illegal abortion. I mean, that's what you said in your last post.
Bladestar5, You can't have it both ways. You cannot be so hateful towards women who make a choice you disagree with and then expect us all to join you in a chorus of "kumbayah". So go hug someone else who thinks women "deserve what they get" when they do things you don't agree with, I want no part of it.
I know a man who had his child aborted against his will. He was all ready to stand up to the plate and raise the baby. He is still hurt 20+years later.
I am amazed that it took until Page Three of this thread to talk about men - the rest of the posts never mention the other half of the equation at all!!
Flame me for saying that a woman barely has a choice if the father doesn't take responsibility. Abortions are all about spineless "fathering" and I get so furious at blaming women like it was *only* their idea to make a baby and then destroy it.
Most of the abortions that I personally know of occurred because the "sperm donor" did not want to take responsibility.
The "mother" then made arrangements, through her own actions or under cohersion by the "sperm donor", to do away with the fetus because she did not want to raise the baby in such a bad situation.
You cannot be so hateful towards women who make a choice you disagree with and then expect us all to join you in a chorus of "kumbayah". So go hug someone else who thinks women "deserve what they get" when they do things you don't agree with, I want no part of it.
Well, see, there is a difference also. It is MURDER. Feminism and murder don't mix. What about the baby? Is it feminist to kill your children because they are an inconvenience? No, I don't think it is right.
It is feminist to do what you want to YOUR body...not your baby's.
I don't understand why "feminists" want to use a health issue as a political tool. It's not ok. You're talking about a womens health issue and that the majority of women getting them done do NOT know whats TRULY going on with them. Informed consent is out the window. The same "feminists" would be up in arms, and ARE up in arms, at the alarmingly high rate of c sections in this country...and yet shuttling off 15 year olds without their parents consent AND without them being fully aware is ok??
Like I said.....I never labled myself a feminist and seeing the incredibly black and white/judgemental attitudes held by people in this thread is one reason why. I actually have a concept that *gasp* the world and this issue are not as black and white as my political party would have them seem. However, the true womens issue here, to me, is part of a greater issue of womens health, educating women, and making them active participants in their health care rather than bystanders. And abortion on demand as it is today, in the real world, in 2004.....is NOT doing women and girls ANY favors being given the way it is. I don't know that it needs to be made illegal, but it sure as hell needs to be restricted and changes need to be made to the way womens health as a whole is approached.
Originally posted by anothermama The same "feminists" would be up in arms, and ARE up in arms, at the alarmingly high rate of c sections in this country...
Where are these feminists that are up in arms over c-sections?
Lest we forget, it was the feminsts of the time that pushed for anesthesia during childbirth. Some still equate lack of sensation during birth with feminism.
Anyway, it's hard to find popular feminism that truly supports mothers. I am hoping the tide is changing.
Originally posted by Journey if abortion was made illegal (except in the instance of rape and health concerns), and the woman went out and received an illegal abortion, she deserves whatever comes to her.
what about the male, when exactly does he get the bill for his role in the unfortunate situation?
what happened to forgiveness? with all due respect, i cannot for the life of me think which of the many faiths represented on MDC is compatible with that kind of thinking...
To be truly pro-life is to support life from it's conception to it's natural end.
Quote by dado:
what happened to forgiveness? with all due respect, i cannot for the life of me think which of the many faiths represented on MDC is compatible with that kind of thinking...
Is this not the message of the Bible? Most faiths (Christian, Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Buddists) have forgiveness, not revenge, as a conerstone of their beliefs.
I hope the "informed consent" issue cuts both ways, for those who are anti-choice. Do you also think that a woman with an unwanted pregnancy should be counselled about every possible problem that could happen in the event the pg was carried to term, plus the problems that might arise later?
Ok, so maybe Journey could've worded it a little less harshly, but I think she was trying to get across acountability.
I don't think that abortion is necessary in MOST cases. I don't consider certain medical reasons as "abortion". I do forgive my friends who have had abortions....I am just saying that if a woman is going to PURPOSELY go out and get an abortion if it were illegal, and KNOWING she is going to an unsafe place to do it, then she ought to have known better.
I don't believe in abortion as birth control, that is for darned sure. It definitely needs to be regulated.
I would die of sorrow if my teenage daughter thought she couldn't come to me and tell me if she accidentally got pregnant. I know that some girls are afraid of their parents, and something needs to be done about that. But, there is no need in today's society for so many teens to be getting pregnant, and getting abortions. I know there are exceptions, but MOST teens know what they are doing when they have sex.
As far as a rape victim goes, well, I stated that I don't think it is fair to punish the child for the father's sins, but I am not sure how I feel about other women getting abortions after rape. I think there are some gray areas there. How do we know if a woman was definitely raped? Can't we at LEAST put a limit on the number of abortions a woman has had?
Has anybody ever read about that woman(I forget her name) who was a late-term abortion victim who survived?
And what Dado said...what ABOUT the man's feelings? I know some women use abortion as a means to hurt a man.
I also know of a teen who had an abortion and was pregnant within a couple months, and carried that baby to full term. I forgave her, but it hurt that she could think the first as disposable, and the second as a keeper.
I used to be pro-choice, but many things turned me the other way. I just think somebody needs to care about these babies.
I guess it is the fact that they see abortion differently. I used to be pro-choice...I am pro-choice with what a woman does with HER body, just not her baby's. I don't see it as healthcare but they do.
This is one of those threads that makes my stomach ache when I see that there is another response.
It is another one that I wish I never responded to. I know how I feel, I just don't know how to word it to say how I feel.
Originally posted by Bladestar5 I guess it is the fact that they see abortion differently. I used to be pro-choice...I am pro-choice with what a woman does with HER body, just not her baby's.
I find it ironic that the women on the board that are pro-choice don't believe the women that are pro-life should have the "choice" to be a feminist.
Obviously, you have the choice to call yourself whatever you want. I just don't believe it, that's all. As has been made abundantly clear, the lives of women who would be butchered if abortion were not safe and legal mean less than nothing to the "pro-life" people. That to me speaks volumes about whether or not you are feminists, as does Bladestar's "How do we know they were raped" attitude.
That was taken completely out of context. I mean that every woman who wanted an abortion would claim to have been raped. Sorry if you thought it was meant another way. I am not very good at wording.
Originally posted by dado what about the male, when exactly does he get the bill for his role in the unfortunate situation?
Thats an excellent idea...maybe that should be a turning point issue...start sending the guys bills for the abortions rather than having them be fed or state funded. I'd be all for that. And I would bet it would be a tool to see a decrease in abortion.
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