Children with ADHD- has anyone tried Vayarin or Phosphatidylserine /DHA/EPA supplements ? - Page 2 - Mothering Forums

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#31 of 63 Old 05-26-2013, 11:16 AM
 
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Can anyone who's been using this long-term comments on the long term effectiveness?  I'm just curious -- I've never heard of this product before and it seems like it would be worth trying. 


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#32 of 63 Old 09-23-2013, 10:45 AM
 
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Hi all! I wanted to share our experience so far with Vayarin. We started it back in May (2 tablets, once daily) and saw a great improvement with our son's reading and writing over the summer. He is 6 1/2. Kindergarten was a huge struggle and he has a very hard time working independently, staying on task and working with a partner. His handwriting is pretty bad, which is a hallmark of ADHD. But over the summer and into 1st grade, it improved dramatically. So- hopes held high, we entered first grade. He began having a lot of the same problems. I met with his teacher and decided (against my instincts) to give a traditional stimulant med a try. His ped prescribed 18mg Concerta. We stopped our Vayarin that Sunday and started the Concerta Monday. I had him off of it after three days. It was like he was high on cocaine. Pinching his cheeks, rolling his eyes, obsessing about things, more fidgety, emotional, not eating, trouble sleeping...you name it. So, I had been doing research on the phophatidylersine that is in Vayarin. At the two tablet dose, you get 150mg. The big double blind study that was done recently used 200mg. The children that took the 200mg PS showed marked improvement in their ADHD symptoms. So I called his ped to let her know that the Concerta was not right and inquired if we could have him take the Vayarin again, only at a higher dosage. Well- as luck would have it, the rep from Vaya had been in that week and informed the peds at this practice that they could write it for 2 tablets, 2ce daily. This gives a total dose of 300mg PS. We started this last Friday. I had lunch with my son at school today and he is back to his sweet, happy self. I had lunch with him last Monday as a way to see how he was doing on the Concerta and he was having a hard time- obsessing, rolling his eyes-just not our boy. I am hopeful as we continue with the higher dosage of Vayarin that some of his classroom difficulties will subside or at least get better. I'll keep you posted!

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#33 of 63 Old 09-23-2013, 10:49 AM
 
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http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/23495677

 

Here's a link to the abstract...this trial was done earlier this year. Very encouraging!

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#34 of 63 Old 10-03-2013, 02:55 PM
 
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My 13-year old son was just prescribed Vayarin today.  He received a concussion playing football and the neurologist said a complication from the concussion could be a worsening of his ADD.  (He currently is not medicated for his ADD, and is doing fine on school.)  He recommended the Vayarin as a precaution.  I am interested, especially if it will help keep him off stimulant meds in the future.  

 

Our older son is a high school junior this year and we started him on Concerta last year to help him focus in school and on homework.  The Concerta made a huge positive difference for him, but wonder if Vayarin might have helped him if we had known about it?  

 

I think study on Vayarin was just with younger children, 6-13.  Does anyone know anything about it being used for older kids, or kids on Concerta?  I think we will try it for 13 year old for sure.

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#35 of 63 Old 10-03-2013, 03:13 PM
 
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Raleigh Mom, are you in Raleigh, NC? If so, what pharmacies carry Vayarin?
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#36 of 63 Old 10-03-2013, 04:31 PM
 
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Not sure.  Dr sent prescription to Rite Aid on Wade Ave.  Hope they have it.  

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#37 of 63 Old 10-03-2013, 04:39 PM
 
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Please post when you know. Btw, I'm in Chapel Hill and my DD goes to school in Durham.

I hope you have good results with the Vayarin.
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#38 of 63 Old 10-12-2013, 09:35 AM
 
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My 8 year old son (PDD-NOS, SPD, ADHD) is going on his third month taking Vayarin.  I have seen very good results.  He is also delayed in reading and math and has a receptive speech delay.  I can tell that his processing of information and giving a respond is faster.  He takes Focalin XR 10mg for the ADHD and impulse control.  We are now going without the Focalin on the weekends whereas before we never did because he would be non stop impulsive and bouncing off the walls.  I don't know if we will do aways with Focalin all together because he helps him focus better on his work, but I'm happy that we can take breaks on weekends and other non-school days.

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#39 of 63 Old 11-14-2013, 01:52 PM
 
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I'm another Raleigh mom. Doctor just gave me a scrip for Vayarin for DS, 15. I just called Costco and Wal-Mart Supercenter on Glenwood. Wal-Mart was over ten dollars less expensive than Costco, $53.46. It's definitely worth a try.

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#40 of 63 Old 11-14-2013, 02:37 PM
 
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Just bumping this thread for more info on vayarin or supplements for ADHD, DS has mixed type - Inattentiveness and Impulsivity.  He eats very well, and his diet is healthy.  We have been successful using other startegies so far, but he is having difficulty completing classwork this year.  Thankfully, he is also GT, so he gets the concepts quickly.  We do not want to medicate if we can avoid it, but are open to looking at some supplement options.

 

I do not want to sound like a snob, but a lot of the posts on this thread are from new mothering members.  As such, I do not know you yet, and you have limited credibility since I do not know if you work for vayarin and are just promoting your product, or you are a legit crunchy mama who has just found us.  I am really looking for the post of some experienced mamas out there.


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#41 of 63 Old 11-14-2013, 11:28 PM
 
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Originally Posted by anj_rn View Post
 

Just bumping this thread for more info on vayarin or supplements for ADHD, DS has mixed type - Inattentiveness and Impulsivity.  He eats very well, and his diet is healthy.  We have been successful using other startegies so far, but he is having difficulty completing classwork this year.  Thankfully, he is also GT, so he gets the concepts quickly.  We do not want to medicate if we can avoid it, but are open to looking at some supplement options.

 

I do not want to sound like a snob, but a lot of the posts on this thread are from new mothering members.  As such, I do not know you yet, and you have limited credibility since I do not know if you work for vayarin and are just promoting your product, or you are a legit crunchy mama who has just found us.  I am really looking for the post of some experienced mamas out there.


I thought that was a little strange, too. I know MDC results can be ranked high in some google results... but this was a bit weird.

I've uped my kids fish oil (Nordic naturals) and am giving him natural vitality liquid: http://www.amazon.com/Natural-Vitality-Kids-Calm-Multi/dp/B00BOU176G

 

kids' calm....

 

but that is it. We are still in the process of diagnosing... and I didn't want a nutritional issue to be the reason for the behavior...


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#42 of 63 Old 11-16-2013, 08:40 AM
 
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My son just started a social skills group; one of the boys is taking Vayarin after having been on medication (Concerta, I think) that didn't work well for him. She seems happy enough with the results.

 

When I did a search for Vayarin this thread was one of the top five results :shy.


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#43 of 63 Old 12-07-2013, 04:42 PM
 
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Does anyone know if the manufacturer of vayarin (vaya) and Attend (vaxa) are a company one in the same?  I am very skeptical that these may be the same company trying to market for different obtainable pricing?  This medication was recommended to us the other day for our child and I have some mental red flags flying.  I am also doubtful this will work as my genetics seem to hold that I cannot take any omega 3 supplements from fish products due to cumulative side effects.  Are these products vegan?  Anybody know more about how the products are generated?

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#44 of 63 Old 12-13-2013, 07:18 PM
 
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Originally Posted by anj_rn View Post

He eats very well, and his diet is healthy. 

 

Honestly, this is a pretty vague statement.  What is seemingly healthy for most could cause problems in your child.  We are an organic, grassfed, whole foods family (pretty much nothing is in a package--and I mean that literally) but you know what?  My kid can't eat tomatoes, apples or oranges (among other things).  Doesn't matter that they're organic or non-GMO.

 

So to say that the diet is "healthy" doesn't really say much.  You cannot possibly know how many people I see in a year that say this only to find that their diet is the problem.  Not because they eat crap and fast food, but because they are reacting to an otherwise seemingly healthy, fresh food.

 

If you haven't explored that avenue, it's worth it.


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#45 of 63 Old 12-14-2013, 05:40 AM
 
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Honestly, this is a pretty vague statement.  What is seemingly healthy for most could cause problems in your child.  We are an organic, grassfed, whole foods family (pretty much nothing is in a package--and I mean that literally) but you know what?  My kid can't eat tomatoes, apples or oranges (among other things).  Doesn't matter that they're organic or non-GMO.

 

So to say that the diet is "healthy" doesn't really say much.  You cannot possibly know how many people I see in a year that say this only to find that their diet is the problem.  Not because they eat crap and fast food, but because they are reacting to an otherwise seemingly healthy, fresh food.

 

If you haven't explored that avenue, it's worth it.

:yeah We've always eaten "healthy" too, but it turns out my kids can't do gluten and one of them can't do gluten or dairy.  Because the problems it caused with their absorption of nutrients, their B vitamins were very very low!  


 
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#46 of 63 Old 01-19-2014, 07:18 AM
 
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My daughter takes focalin as well. Did you keep on the Dickson when school started?
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#47 of 63 Old 05-01-2014, 12:29 PM
 
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Originally posted by vw4runner: Does anyone know if the manufacturer of vayarin (vaya) and Attend (vaxa) are a company one in the same?  I am very skeptical that these may be the same company trying to market for different obtainable pricing?

 

These are two different companies. Vaxa is a US-based company that makes homeopathic products. Vaya Pharma (Enzymotec)  is an Israeli company with offices in the US and internationally. It specializes in lipids for cognitive health of children, adults, seniors and people with dementia.

 

Our 14-year-old son has been taking Vayarin exclusively for almost 7 months, after quitting all conventional Rx for ADHD last fall when the benefits no longer outweighed the harmful side effects. While his attention, organization and general energy and pleasant demeanor are nowhere as good as they were on the various Rx's, his emotional volatility has leveled out and his occasional -- but increasingly frequent -- black-out rage episodes have vanished.

 

Also, once he stopped taking Rx, which he had been on for about 18 months, his appetite returned and his growth began to catch up to where it wanted to be because he was finally eating again.

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#48 of 63 Old 05-01-2014, 01:47 PM
 
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I cant answer your above question, but my 8yo has been on vaxa attend for almost 2 mths and i have seen no  impact whatsoever. Its $37 a bottle and only lasts a month.

I will take him to the psych tomorrow and request the lowest dose possible of, probably ritalin, just so i  can say that he tried it. I have no intention of keeping on this long term and will avoid escalating the dosage. As for the growth issue, i read that if the child has a good breakfast before the med,   and then later in the day after the med,  that total intake should be the same.

 

I hope my son will only have to take a dose in the AM.  Did you find this possible in your sons case? As it is,  my ds barely eats any lunch at school because there are so many dietary retrictions (no meat, no gluten) so he's basically snacking at school anyway, and i have a good meal ready when he and his brother get home.

 

Did you try to give your child a dose at times that didnt impact his appetite? Or did that prove difficult?

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#49 of 63 Old 05-02-2014, 09:06 PM
 
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Contactmaya - not sure who in particular you were asking.  My daughter started an extended-release Ritalin that allows her to take one in the morning.  The name isn't "Ritalin" but it's the same drug, methylphenidate, just in some sort of slow-release capsule.  She's 7 and has never eaten lunch well at school.  Before the Ritalin she was too distracted.  Now I'm not sure if it's the medication or something else.  Her noontime eating was bad, didn't get worse, didn't get better.  She does eat well at other times and in the little while she's been on it she has not lost any weight at all.

 

We're also using PS and fish oil.  In truth, I think the RItalin has made the most difference.  She's doing really well and catching up in school.  I hate the idea of a medication at so young an age, but I also hated watching her start to fail in relationships and academically.  She's a sweet, smart kid and I don't want her self-definition to be that she's the one who can't pay attention and is always lagging behind because she gets distracted by a million different things.  The lagging is physical, too.  She was getting grief from kids for walking slowly which she has always done because she just has to notice everything.  I call her a "watcher."  

 

These decisions are so damn hard.  I would have never in a million years thought I would have a child taking Ritalin.

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#50 of 63 Old 05-04-2014, 07:23 AM
 
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Thanks Letitia, thats very helpful. I directed my  question at the poster above mine, who mentioned her child had growth issues. My child already has borderline  short growth stature.

 

Im not sure about putting him on extended release because that means the drug will be affecting him after school, and  this is school adhd only.  The school environment, whatever it is about it, brings on adhd like symptoms.  So the drug is for school only,  and i dont want it anywhere near our homelife.

 

 

I saw the psych  on Friday, and he mentioned extended release, which i am opposed to unless it proves necessary. He also mentioned that  seizures can be  a hidden reason for speech delays/language related adhd  behaviors (my son resort to fidgeting and lack of attention when in a highly verbal environment). I have never heard of this link before, but also never had reason to suspect seizures in my son.

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#51 of 63 Old 05-06-2014, 03:05 PM
 
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I'm not an ADHD expert, but that seems really weird to me that a kid could have true ADHD in only one setting.  My daughter definitely has done better in some things than others, mainly depending on how much she likes whatever the activity is, but she got herself kicked out of group swim lessons even though she is a true fish and LOVES the water.  She would go swimming off when it wasn't her turn.  We started noticing she couldn't follow group instructions around the age they first start doing activities with kids separate from their parents, like gymnastics class.  Her toddler-ish impulsiveness just didn't abate as she got older.  It is IMPOSSIBLE for her to stay in her seat at dinner and she's 7.  She's a smart, sweet kid, and if something is really interesting to her, like a craft project or an imaginary game she's playing with little animals, she'll do it really for a long time, but that's typical of ADHD.  It's how she can't maintain a normal concentration on the everyday ho-hum stuff that stood out to us.  "Can you go put your shoes on?"  Well, our shoes are on the front porch, and half the time she'd end up out in the yard, barefoot, looking at something that caught her eye from the porch, completely having forgotten about putting on her shoes.  So the problems in school seemed a natural extension of the problems we were having at home.  

 

Do you believe he has ADHD?  Here I am, mom of a kid taking Ritalin, and I would have been very, very against trying it if I hadn't known without a doubt she really fit the description for ADHD.  If your kid  only has problems in school, do you or the school wonder if there is a problem other?  (Sorry, I haven't been on the boards a lot so if you've posted about this before I apologize).  There are so many other kinds of issues that can give kids problems in school but not noticeably in other settings.  You have to be able to focus your eyes at something close to you for extended periods of time in a way you don't have to for anything else - you can look away while doing a puzzle, drawing a picture, but you can't really look away and back much while you sound out a word.  You have to be able to focus on one voice (the teacher's) above all the whisperings and rustlings.  You have to be able to tolerate those whisperings and rustlings.  You have to be physically comfortable enough to do all that.  You have to feel safe.

 

I don't know what it's like in other states, but in my dirt-poor state it really sucks.  Evaluations done through the schools are not very good and you wait a long, long time for them.  If we hadn't had the money to get private neuropsych testing, as well as further evaluations by a pediatric Occupational Therapist and Developmental Optometrist ($$$$ total), we'd still be floundering.  Our daughter would be falling further behind in school, and the school wouldn't think it's a problem because in school her shyness and fear of calling bad attention to herself is enough to keep her in her seat, so nobody noticed her mind and attention were wandering every which-way until we asked them to watch for it.

 

I really feel for you.  Also, you say son and that he's small - my daughter is average height by the growth charts but in the taller half for our part of the country, so I haven't worried too much about that, but I know adult height is one of those things a person can't control is one of those things that can play an invisible role in some types of adult success.  Grrr, it is all so complicated.  We try so hard to do what's right.  

 

I think about that height issue, and I remember my physical therapist, a very short guy, who lost some relatives who got a prion disease from early Human Growth Hormone they were given as kids.  You just never know about so much of this stuff.  At least Ritalin's been around longer than I've been alive so there's some track record.  But damn, I would not give my kids anything if I could help it.  

 

I feel like I'm sort of venting, which I'm not sure is appropriate or helpful to you, but how you describe your situation makes me so frustrated with how we deal with children as unique individuals in most of the schools in this country.  I really, really hope you find a good path.

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#52 of 63 Old 05-07-2014, 12:19 PM
 
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There is enough impairment in the school setting to warrant trying medication, since everything else has been tried and is  not effective. There is no impairment at home.

 

Adhd is a syndrome, and looks different  in different people. As far as i am concerned, i am at the point where i want him to have help, and if medication will help, i am willing to try it. Any person would have their focus sharpened by amphetamines, whether they have adhd or not. At this point, i dont care anymore. He has adhd at school, and thats all that matters.

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#53 of 63 Old 05-07-2014, 01:17 PM
 
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I'm not an ADHD expert, but that seems really weird to me that a kid could have true ADHD in only one setting. 

This is a very common misconception regarding ADHD. 

 

 

 

"“He focuses on his video games for hours. He can’t have ADHD.” 

For the most part ADHD poses problems with tasks that require focused attention over long periods, not so much for activities that are highly engaging or stimulating. School can be especially challenging for a person with ADHD because the typical classroom lecture, compared with a video game, can be relatively unstimulating in terms of visuals, sound, and physical activityve ADHD. For the most part ADHD poses problems with tasks that require focused attention over long periods, not so much for activities that are highly engaging or stimulating. School can be especially challenging for a person with ADHD because the typical classroom lecture, compared with a video game, can be relatively unstimulating in terms of visuals, sound, and physical activity "


 
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#54 of 63 Old 05-07-2014, 02:16 PM
 
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This is a very common misconception regarding ADHD. 

 

 

 

"“He focuses on his video games for hours. He can’t have ADHD.” 

For the most part ADHD poses problems with tasks that require focused attention over long periods, not so much for activities that are highly engaging or stimulating. School can be especially challenging for a person with ADHD because the typical classroom lecture, compared with a video game, can be relatively unstimulating in terms of visuals, sound, and physical activityve ADHD. For the most part ADHD poses problems with tasks that require focused attention over long periods, not so much for activities that are highly engaging or stimulating. School can be especially challenging for a person with ADHD because the typical classroom lecture, compared with a video game, can be relatively unstimulating in terms of visuals, sound, and physical activity "

Just so as you know, my son is not how you describe above. His ability to focus on many intellectually challenging things outside the school environment is impeccable. The problem is that school is a highly verbal environment, and this is challenging for my ds.  If medication helps him to  process sound better then so  be it.  It remains to be seen. But as i said, you dont have to have adhd to have your focus improved by amphetamines, or whatever other drug they have out there.

 

That is why i  say, he has school ADHD, and so he has. Either he functions in the school environment or he doesnt.  Whether adhd, apd or spd is the cause, it really doesnt matter to the professionals.

Adhd is probably misdiagnosed in many cases, because they dont take these other  conditions into consideration, or call them 'co morbid', when in fact they may causative of the symptoms. The exact relation between executive  function weaknesses and  co morbid conditions is also something that is  not well understood.

My son did a neuropsych and it didnt even consider that he has also been diagnosed with language impairments, and failed to explain  its relation to attentional deficit. It also failed to distinguish lack of motivation, boredom tolerance, and executive function. It was woeful in my opinion. This is what they consider the litmus test for ADHD.  They are in the dark ages.

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#55 of 63 Old 05-07-2014, 04:03 PM
 
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Just so as you know, my son is not how you describe above. His ability to focus on many intellectually challenging things outside the school environment is impeccable. The problem is that school is a highly verbal environment, and this is challenging for my ds.  If medication helps him to  process sound better then so  be it.  It remains to be seen. But as i said, you dont have to have adhd to have your focus improved by amphetamines, or whatever other drug they have out there.

 

That is why i  say, he has school ADHD, and so he has. Either he functions in the school environment or he doesnt.  Whether adhd, apd or spd is the cause, it really doesnt matter to the professionals.

Adhd is probably misdiagnosed in many cases, because they dont take these other  conditions into consideration, or call them 'co morbid', when in fact they may causative of the symptoms. The exact relation between executive  function weaknesses and  co morbid conditions is also something that is  not well understood.

My son did a neuropsych and it didnt even consider that he has also been diagnosed with language impairments, and failed to explain  its relation to attentional deficit. It also failed to distinguish lack of motivation, boredom tolerance, and executive function. It was woeful in my opinion. This is what they consider the litmus test for ADHD.  They are in the dark ages.

I was only referring to the comment that if a child can focus on one thing and not others it means they don't have ADHD.  The quote was taken from the page that I linked to regarding commonly held misconceptions about ADHD, not my own words.  

 

My son blew the teachers away on his evaluation during the one on one part of the test, and admit to wondering what I and his teacher were seeing that they weren't.  He was highly focused to the point of being hyper focused on many of the parts and his scores put him in the genius range.  Then they saw him in the classroom and went, "Oooooh, now we see it!"  LOL! 

 

With him though, it's not just sound.  It's movement, sound, even smells that can distract him.  And yes, it is rare that a child has only ADHD.  Often there are sensory issues, learning disabilities, anxiety, etc that can affect behavior and learning.  And you're right, often throwing the ADHD label at things, means that they miss the rest of the picture.  Thankfully, they didn't do that at our school.  It was just one more piece of the puzzle regarding where he was at.


 
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#56 of 63 Old 05-07-2014, 04:57 PM
 
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Queen of the Meadow, you got it exactly backwards.  Please read it again:  I didn't say if a child can focus on one thing they don't have ADHD, what I asked was how a child could have ADHD and only be unable to focus in one setting.

 

Yes, of course, kids with ADHD can be focused, even hyperfocused, on things they like. 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Letitia View Post
 

Queen of the Meadow, you got it exactly backwards.  Please read it again:  I didn't say if a child can focus on one thing they don't have ADHD, what I asked was how a child could have ADHD and only be unable to focus in one setting.

 

Yes, of course, kids with ADHD can be focused, even hyperfocused, on things they like. 

Ahhh, yes!  I see it now.  Guess I shouldn't be reading things on my phone.  LOL!


 
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#58 of 63 Old 05-07-2014, 05:08 PM
 
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ContactMaya, sounds like you are already aware of other issues that can cause a kid to look like he/she has ADHD in the classroom and have them on your radar.

 

Evaluations are so hit or miss.  Evaluators are so hit or miss.  I feel like I am constantly trolling for connections - parents of older kids who have used professionals in the community and can give us recommendations.  

 

And if you're at the point, you're at the point.  I don't like giving my kids meds at all, but if my daughter's going to take something every day I'm glad it's a drug as old as the hills.  

 

I wish you a good path.

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#59 of 63 Old 05-08-2014, 08:04 AM
 
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Yes, im at the point where i want to try something for him (teachers are certainly pressuring me), but  i dont see this as a long term thing. I will pull him out and homeschool if  i see that he can only function on drugs in the school environment.

 

Agreed about the evaluators,  the doctors, the professionals....there are alot out there who simply get it all wrong.... 

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#60 of 63 Old 07-07-2014, 07:29 AM
 
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Vayarin

I just received the prescription for Vayarin and eager to get the script filled. I"m calling around to find the least expensive cost, but they are pretty close in price. I had also emailed the company after researching and trying to figure out if taking PS and omegas would not provide the same benefit. The company has been helpful and responsive to my questions. I am hoping this will help with the inattentive. I finally was able to find a doctor in our area that prescribed this. Our pediatrician would NOT prescribe it. I am currently looking for a primary doc that is open to more nature approaches and supplements. The doctor who prescribed Varyarin was the one who actually brought it up first. This appointment was address ADHD dx that we recently received and his area of specialty. He was amazing and explained that Vayarin provides the combination needed to get the Omegas to the brain. If taking over the counter omegas then my child would need to take a good 1,000 mg a day.
I thought I would just chime in. Good luck!
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