Anyone's LO have Versed before a surgery? Update#29 - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 03:37 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I don't think I've posted here before, so first off -

DS was born with a cleft lip and palate, had lip repaired at 4 months, palate at 7 months. He recently developed what we think is a thyroglossal cyst and its coming out on Thursday. This surgery will be outpatient, and he will only be under for about 20 minutes. In that way, it will be much easier than his other surgeries, but I'm concerned about anxiety because he is older now. He is extremely verbal and is expresses that he is scared of all kinds of things. In fact, when I said to him, "In two days you are going to go see Dr. S and he is going to fix the bump on your neck," he replied, "hurt my skin, Eli scared." I told him he wouldn't feel any hurting and that he'll be able to watch Barney and have popsicles afterward and he seemed ok with it. :

What I would like is to be able to go back with him while until he gets the initial gas to make him feel better. My mom works at the office and called the surgery center to ask if that was ok and they said no - but they do give Versed and have "great results." Versed essentially causes amnesia. So, DS will seem normal and with it, but will have no recollection of anything once the medicine takes effect. This isn't sitting right with me. I do not want to traumatize him period, but especially because this is not his last surgery.

I don't want my baby to have surgery again!

Anyone have experience with this drug? What would you do in this situation?
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#2 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 04:20 PM
 
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First, best of luck and speedy recovery to your lo.
I have a limited amount of experience with this drug. My ds2 has a seizure history and he has had it for that. In our experience ds was very loopy and certainly seemed "drugged". Unfortunately, it is hard for me to say if that reaction was from the medication, or his normal posdictol state from having a seizure Wish I could be more help....
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#3 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 04:20 PM
 
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We didn't have Versed, but my boy had a root taken out (a front tooth broke due to being hit on the lever of the heating vent accidentally). He was in my arms the whole time, they gassed him into twilight sleep. He came out of it and said "bah!" while wiping his mouth (means my tooth hurts) and ten minutes later he realized that no, it DIDN'T hurt.
I feel guilty because I thought he was only dealing with teething pain! (He was teething like mad!) After that it took a good 2 months before he even CARED about teething pain!
I don't know - is there any way you can demand to go with him? I wouldn't want to leave his side!
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#4 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 04:36 PM
 
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Dd has had Versed before several surgeries, and I've actually had it myself prior to surgery. In dd (and myself, but I'll speak to her experience), it made her loopy and a bit giddy. She had a fairly small dose, but still seemed drugged to me. It helped her with some of the anxiety, especially when she was younger/less verbal. The last couple of minor surgeries (ear tubes) we haven't used it and she's done fine.

Our hospital does let us go right into the OR and sit holding the child's hand until they've gotten the mask. I personally hate watching dd like that, but I know it's a support to her, so I do it anyway. Is it a children's hospital? Is there someone else (surgeon, child life) that you could talk to? Oh, and dd really finds it comforting being able to bring her baby doll into the OR with her (they give it to me as soon as she's under) and then she has it as soon as she wakes up.
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#5 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 04:42 PM
 
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My 8 yo had versed while getting some tooth work done (broken tooth) years ago and he just seemed loopy or drunkish. He was fine very soon after. I would opt for that again if (heaven forbid) we had to have anesthesia.

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#6 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 04:54 PM
 
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two of my children have had it for surgerys (i think that is what they had - i remember hearing that name - it has been quite a few years ago though)
dd was 5 and was trying to grab invisible things out of the air when it kicked in.
i think she had it later when they had to check to make sure the surgery for renal reflux had worked.
ds was almost 3 and had extensive dental work done in a children's hospital.
both of them cried when it wore off and could not control the crying.
but, they did not remember that, nor did they remember the surgeries at all.
i do think we were with both of them when it was first given until it had kicked in well.
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#7 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 05:14 PM
 
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My daughter lived on versed for the first 6mos of her life and has had it multiple times since then and I too have had versed. if they said it will only cause amnesia like effects but that the kid will act normal than they must not be using the versed that I'm familiar with. It makes you very loopy, sleepy and relaxed.

At our hospital you aren't allowed to go back with the kid. They let you walk to the door and then you hand the kid over, typically while they're still fully awake and aware, having been given no meds prior to this point. Personally I think giving versed prior to leaving mom and going back to the OR would be a good thing but my little one is still too young to realize what's going on so it hasn't been an issue.
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#8 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 06:19 PM
 
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Originally Posted by tarajean56 View Post
So, DS will seem normal and with it,
That is so funny. My DD (age 2.5 at the time) was absolutely terrified everytime someone came close until we gave her versed (I gave it to her) then she giggled and happily went into the nurse's arms when they carried her back, meowing like a kitten and happily waving beybye while yelling, "I kittycat! I kittycat!" The versed worked fine I was an absolute wreck.

Waking up from the anesthesia was far more traumatic for her, but she doesn't seem to remember it at all - maybe it was the versed or maybe just the nature of the anesthesia.
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#9 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 06:21 PM
 
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My son had Versed prior to a dental procedure. As the Versed started to wear off he absolutely flipped out. He'd just scream at the top of his lungs, etc. The dentist said that some kids do have this but he'd never seen anyone with my son's level of intensity. While driving home my son kicked me in the head from the back seat. He talked about dying, he talked about killing me, etc. It was horrible because he remembered every...single...thing. He felt horrible later that day for saying all of those mean things to me. (ETA - I wasn't upset, I felt so bad for him as he had no control over it)

The dentist has agreed that Versed is not in his future. Again, this isn't necessarily a typical response due to the intensity.

When it started kicking in though he just giggled and got real loopy then we carried him back to the room. He was totally fine throughout the procedure, etc - it wasn't until the Versed started to wear off.

Good luck!
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#10 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 06:34 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Wow, thanks for all your responses!

As far as him not being loopy...I'll talk to my mom about this more today. Maybe I misunderstood her, or she misunderstood the surgery center person - because I know that she said Versed.

This surgery is not at a children's hospital, its just an outpatient surgery center, but they do have many ped patients. I don't know if I can insist to go back there - I think I may really push the issue because I think that it would be very good for DS. I don't understand why so many hospitals allow this and others don't. Does anyone know the reasoning behind that?

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That is so funny. My DD (age 2.5 at the time) was absolutely terrified everytime someone came close until we gave her versed (I gave it to her) then she giggled and happily went into the nurse's arms when they carried her back, meowing like a kitten and happily waving beybye while yelling, "I kittycat! I kittycat!" The versed worked fine I was an absolute wreck.
Oh gosh, that's funny. So he'll pretty much be high, huh? I'm most worried about handing him over and him being all alone going back into the room scared. To hear that your daughter went happily does ease some fears of mine. When he was younger - I was so freaking depressed that I was just functioning and did whatever they told me. He really did have excellent care. Now that I am myself again, I'm a worried mess.
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#11 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 06:38 PM - Thread Starter
 
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My son had Versed prior to a dental procedure. As the Versed started to wear off he absolutely flipped out. He'd just scream at the top of his lungs, etc. The dentist said that some kids do have this but he'd never seen anyone with my son's level of intensity. While driving home my son kicked me in the head from the back seat. He talked about dying, he talked about killing me, etc. It was horrible because he remembered every...single...thing. He felt horrible later that day for saying all of those mean things to me. (ETA - I wasn't upset, I felt so bad for him as he had no control over it)
Oh wow, I'm sorry! That sounds really upsetting for both of you. Thanks for sharing your experience. Its always scary for me to give DS anything for the first time because you just never know how they will respond. If I do choose to have him have the Versed, at least I can be prepared for this possibility. Thank you.
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#12 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 06:59 PM
 
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DD had it becuase even at some Children's hospitals, they don't let you go back. DD had endoscopy at 10 months for which she wasn't letting go of me. They brought her some versed and she was fine to go with them then. Definitely a little loopy looking. At our kdis hospital, they have versed lollipops...Who knew?! DD was a little too young and horribly allergic to foods, so we didn't try one just the oral meds.
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#13 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 07:09 PM
 
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I've had one child in surgery where he was given Versed and two other instances where my kiddo wasn't.

The versed was much better. Yes, he was loopy and silly--but he wasn't scared. No screaming or crying--he waved and laughed as they took him back. He was 19 months.

The first surgery without I was allowed in the OR (though at a distance). My son was terrified and struggled against the mask. He was 22 months.

The second surgery without was horrible. They took him back screaming and crying for me. I knew he'd be scared until he was out. Granted he was older (3.5) but we had a lot more acting out the fear and experience in play that went on for quite a while with him. I still see it sometimes a year later. That kiddo can't have Versed I imagine because of metabolic stuff. But I much prefer the Versed route.

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#14 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 07:34 PM
 
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I had Versed for a birth- repair surgery at 2 months PP.
I it.
I remember being really sleepy then going into the surgery room and that is it. I don't remember waking up, etc.

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#15 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 08:22 PM
 
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Michaela's had versed twice. The first time, she was only about 1 1/2, and after she drank it (I think it tasted really, really bad, but it was a tiny dose), she went from being clingy and scared to acting like a happy drunk, smiling and waving at everyone. It made the time before her MRI pass much more painlessly.

The second time, she was 10, and it didn't work as well. It still tasted nasty, but she didn't relax nearly as much as she did that first time.

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#16 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 08:25 PM
 
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Well I didn't want them to give my daughter Versed during this last MRI, but they did. I didn't express my wishes on it. Well she was "drunk" all day! I wasn't happy with the side effects of this stuff. Even when my husband put her to be that night she was like this. Not fun.

I know when she had surgery back in Feb at Primary Children's they talked about Versed. My husband and I decided against it. They told us alot of kids have a hard time coming out of it.

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Ds had it for some dental work last summer. It made him loopy, drunkish, and very, very compliant (which is completely the opposite of his personality). He didn't have amnesia, though - he remembered everything they did and told me about it in detail afterwards. He just wasn't scared or anxious about it. We would have had to do GA without it, so I'm glad it worked well for him. He was a little out of it for the rest of the day, but it's hard to tell how much of it was the med and how much was the stress and pain of having teeth pulled.
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#18 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 08:38 PM
 
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DD has had Versed twice. She was silly and loopy and compliant from it before she was put under, but woke up EXTREMELY disoriented, combative and angry both times. I've been told this is fairly common. At this point I would not give it to her again, but she is 4.5 and not afraid of strangers.

DS was put under without Versed at 5 months, and I was amazed by how easily he woke up and how he seemed to have no "hangover" at all.

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DD has had Versed twice and woke up EXTREMELY disoriented, combative and angry both times. I've been told this is fairly common. At this point I would not give it to her again, but she is 4.5 and not afraid of strangers.

DS was put under without Versed at 5 months, and I was amazed by how easily he woke up and how he seemed to have no "hangover" at all.
Exactly. This was the first time my daughter has had it and never again. She has had numerous procedures/surgies without any problems. But apparently this time she wouldn't lay down on the table and go to sleep. So they gave her Versed.

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#20 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 09:17 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thank you for sharing your experiences. It is all really helpful. I'm leaning towards giving it, hoping and praying he comes out of it smoothly. I think at this point I'd prefer crying after the surgery while still loopy opposed to intense fear before.

Isn't there an 3rd option of everything in life going perfectly and not needing surgery at all??
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#21 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 11:13 PM
 
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You've had lots of replies, but just to add another voice.

My daughter has had Versed at least twice that I can remember. The first time was funny because it didn't seem to really have much affect on her. About 40 minutes after she took it the anesthesia nurse came to check on her and looked at the chart to double check she had gotten the right dosage because she still seemed so alert. She settled down pretty quickly after that though.

The second time she got loopy within about 10 minutes.

She's never had a problem coming out of it and has never expressed any anxiety about going to the hospital. She has anxiety about everything else so I figure the Versed must be helping. Our hospital let's us stay with her while the Versed takes effect, but we are not allowed to go back then while they finish knocking her out.

Yes, a much better option would be to avoid the surgery altogether. I like that option.
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#22 of 31 Old 08-12-2008, 11:57 PM
 
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are you absolutely, certainly, totally, 100% positive they won't let you go back until he is out? If you gown up, I can't imagine why they wouldn't let you in there for the 15 seconds it takes to put him under.

my daughter had dental work under GA and I went in (gowned) and held her hands until the mask took effect.

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#23 of 31 Old 08-13-2008, 01:24 AM
 
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DD has had Versed twice. She was silly and loopy and compliant from it before she was put under, but woke up EXTREMELY disoriented, combative and angry both times. I've been told this is fairly common. At this point I would not give it to her again, but she is 4.5 and not afraid of strangers.

DS was put under without Versed at 5 months, and I was amazed by how easily he woke up and how he seemed to have no "hangover" at all.

I wish we could all avoid the surgeries!

I just wanted to say that the angry/combative thing...I was told this happens to some kids (and even adults) from the anesthesia. My versed kid did have this. He was ok after he went back to sleep and woke. But my non-versed kid came out of one surgery happy and the other so combative and angry and disoriented they gave him a med to calm him (had I been there that wouldn't have happened). He had not had versed. So I'm not sure that reaction is versed vs. anesthesia. Either way I personally would still have picked Versed again.

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#24 of 31 Old 08-13-2008, 01:28 AM
 
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I just wanted to say that the angry/combative thing...I was told this happens to some kids (and even adults) from the anesthesia.
This happens to my dd2 every time she has anesthesia with or without Versed.
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Thank you for sharing your experiences. It is all really helpful. I'm leaning towards giving it, hoping and praying he comes out of it smoothly. I think at this point I'd prefer crying after the surgery while still loopy opposed to intense fear before.

Isn't there an 3rd option of everything in life going perfectly and not needing surgery at all??

Is he going to be conscious during the surgery, or is the versed a prelim to general anesthesia? I just noticed that your son is the same age as my youngest son - when he had dental work done a couple of months ago, they didn't even attempt conscious sedation. What happened with him is that they gave him a sedative shot (which was admittedly freaky to witness) while I held him. Within two minutes or so, he was out, but his eyes were open and glazed over. Then they took him back to run IVs and put the mask on him. I wasn't able to be there when they did that, but I was able to be with him when he woke up. I can't imagine having tried to do it while he was conscious. He just wasn't capable of being co-operative.
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#26 of 31 Old 08-13-2008, 06:33 AM
 
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my son had a definite reaction to this. he said the walls were melting. thought he could stand up but could not. hallucinated and everything.
he was miserable waking up from the surgery as well

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DS had versed before we tried an MRI. Getting him to drink the versed sucked big time. He did get a little loopy though, which was the plan (make him loopy and relaxed). We also ended up giving him 2 other drugs, which were supposed to knock him out. They did not have any effect on him though, as he never went under and we didn't get the MRI done that day.

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#28 of 31 Old 08-13-2008, 04:57 PM
 
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Brandon just had versed Monday before getting his tonsils out. They gave it to him because Brandon has aggressive tendencies when in a new place and I wanted him to be relaxed instead of scared and screaming (now, when he came out of general anesthesia, *that* is when we had our big problem--he was screaming and swearing and kicking the nurses... ) And actually, he remembers everything he did while under the influence of versed (so for an hour--from the time he was admitted until the time he got the mask for the general anesthesia).

And he was just funny as heck--he was like "I can still RUN!" and he was moving his legs as fast as he could in the bed trying to run. And then he said "help me help me! Eyeballs are staring at me!"--it was a doorstop, but he was seeing double and so he saw two doorstops. Then he was laughing because he saw 2 of everything "look mama...2 tv's. 2 mamas. 2 doors!"

And today, 3 days later, he still remembers all of that!

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#29 of 31 Old 08-14-2008, 01:18 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Well, we are home recovering. DS did have the Versed, and I was really glad he did. He responded well it seems. He was funny once it kicked in and almost asleep by the time we said goodbye at the OR doors. He was a little upset coming out, but nothing like the poor little guy next to us. DS was most upset about the wires attached to him.

The bad news is that it wasn't a cyst, it was what the ENT thinks is probably an abscess of some sort. It was much deeper than he thought and connected to lots of different areas in the submental region. He cleaned it out and removed the lining, and sent all that to pathology. We'll know Monday some more about it. He told us this may work and we won't have to worry about it again, or it could come back - which would require a more invasive surgery and leave a good long scar on his neck.

Thanks for all your help!
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#30 of 31 Old 08-14-2008, 02:28 PM
 
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.

The bad news is that it wasn't a cyst, it was what the ENT thinks is probably an abscess of some sort. It was much deeper than he thought and connected to lots of different areas in the submental region. He cleaned it out and removed the lining, and sent all that to pathology. We'll know Monday some more about it. He told us this may work and we won't have to worry about it again, or it could come back - which would require a more invasive surgery and leave a good long scar on his neck.

Thanks for all your help!
Did they give you a probability you won't have a recurrance?

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