so, back to CPS resistance strategies - Page 7 - Mothering Forums
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Talk Amongst Ourselves > so, back to CPS resistance strategies
Periwinkle's Avatar Periwinkle 07:44 PM 04-19-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Romana9+2 View Post
I thought she was sleeping in the bed with her dad, not her foster parent, and not all the time, either. Did I mix it up?
No sorry I just misunderstood... I thought we were talking about foster parents and whether it is ok for CPS to require that foster children not cosleep. My bad.

Quote:
Originally Posted by BeliganSheepDog
My dad used "AP" practices as a cover for child abuse. Anything can be twisted and misused.
I am so sorry.

Momalea's Avatar Momalea 10:59 PM 04-19-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by i'mmykid'$mom View Post
I would go to my ILs house and call for a lawyer referral and also call the lawyers available to us through dh's company (check the links on the first page; the Parent's Guide also has lawyer referrals). I'd ask MIL to go pick-up the house. Once that was done I would return home (make sure the video camera and digital camera batteries are working) because they may not have enough evidence to get a warrant and may not come back.
Thanks for your input!
mamamillet's Avatar mamamillet 11:03 PM 04-19-2007
Quote:
I thought we were talking about foster parents and whether it is ok for CPS to require that foster children not cosleep.
In TN co-sleeping is frowned upon. ANd children over 2yo are not to sleep with adults unless they are sick--(that night).
ThreeBeans's Avatar ThreeBeans 11:13 PM 04-19-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by mamamillet View Post
In TN co-sleeping is frowned upon. ANd children over 2yo are not to sleep with adults unless they are sick--(that night).
ANY children over 2yo? Or are we still talking about foster kids?


Shhh...don't tell my 2.5 year old.
mamamillet's Avatar mamamillet 11:30 PM 04-19-2007
Foster kids...my almost 7 yo just moved out this year!
Anglyn's Avatar Anglyn 09:04 PM 04-20-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Periwinkle View Post
Argh. I don't know. I worry A LOT about abuse in the foster care system and think this law is designed to keep kids out of the beds of strangers. (They're strangers at first, aren't they?) I know there are exceptions - like if you become foster parents to a 1 month old or something, but not sure taking your new 4 year-old foster dd into bed with you is a great idea. Just not sure.... seems like a sticky situation and the least offensive things I've read about these rules yet.
You may be right on that point. In the specific case I saw though, cosleeping was a godsend for the child.
Anglyn's Avatar Anglyn 09:10 PM 04-20-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by rmzbm View Post
WHO said that?????
It was her FATHER. And there's NOTHING wrong with it. Nothing. My G'parents raised me & I slept with my flippin' GRANDPA at that age!
I think that poster is mixing up two difrent incidents being discussed. A PP has stated that a girl was removed from her parents for cosleeping with her father.

In an entirely diffrent post, I had stated that a one year old girl that I worked with professionally and followed from foster home to foster home improved quite significantly when the fostermom coslept with her (no fosterdad, the woman was a widow).

And my ds coslept with me even at that age. Not always, not even mostly, but let him watch a scary movie or us being under a tornado watch during a thunder storm and I wake up with him there.
Anglyn's Avatar Anglyn 09:15 PM 04-20-2007
My oldest DS is 15, nearly 16 and while he does not cosleep per se, maybe once every two weeks or so he will wander into my room after dh has gone to work and just go back to sleep in my bed. When I get up, I leave him in there sleeping with his siblings (ages four and two). I have never molested him and its always HIS idea to come in there. I dont even know why he does it, except maybe he just wants to be with eveyone else? Its no biggie to me. I usually dont even know he's there until I wake up and look over.

If its getting late and for some reason ds2 is still wide awake but dd has fallen asleep, dh takes her into the bedroom and they go to sleep and ds2 and I come later (alternatley, if its the other way he takes ds2 while dd and I are up. Cuz Im the night owl. Just saying that cosleeping with a parent of the opposite gender does not equal sexual abuse.)
NatureMama3's Avatar NatureMama3 09:38 PM 04-20-2007
I agree Angela, in many other cultures whole-family cosleeping is the norm.
lena1984's Avatar lena1984 12:28 PM 04-26-2007
bumping to help out another mama :
Manena's Avatar Manena 07:34 PM 04-26-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by lena1984 View Post
bumping to help out another mama :
I have never seen so much paranoia over CPS until I joined this board. Why is that?
BelgianSheepDog's Avatar BelgianSheepDog 07:55 PM 04-26-2007
Unity in adversity? It's not countercultural unless The Man wants to stop it? Culture of fear? Maybe some of all of the above. I find it quite Jungian.
alegna's Avatar alegna 08:47 PM 04-26-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by Manena View Post
I have never seen so much paranoia over CPS until I joined this board. Why is that?
Because a large number of us have either been targeted by CPS or personally know someone who has.

-Angela
CaraNicole's Avatar CaraNicole 09:35 PM 06-23-2007
i'm curious can you make your own contract for them to sign(before you let them in the door)? you know saying the will pose for pictures in each room of your house, let you tape everything,etc maybe even throw in you will not lie (could charge them later if they twist things) i was thinking about this the other night and i wonder is it possible?
alegna's Avatar alegna 01:47 AM 06-24-2007
Quote:
Originally Posted by CaraNicole View Post
i'm curious can you make your own contract for them to sign(before you let them in the door)? you know saying the will pose for pictures in each room of your house, let you tape everything,etc maybe even throw in you will not lie (could charge them later if they twist things) i was thinking about this the other night and i wonder is it possible?
No.

-Angela
mmmummy's Avatar mmmummy 07:41 AM 06-24-2007
im reading this thread with great intrest as im dealing with cps as we speak..
at the moment i personally am being polite yet passionate and working 'with'
them. they had better not make an issue out of us not vaxing,however..whole
other ballgame at that point because i will not let them 'bully' me into doing it.
(im not saying i will go totally mad on them,i dont mean it *quite* like that..)

ETA: my case happens to be due to a hot water heater flooding our house.
we have got the new one in but they still insist on new flooring. so,for those
who dont know-it seems they can take your children over floor stains,if you
dont either get the stains out (even if its clean!!) or new flooring in 'on time'.

which i believe is stupid..and im hoping and praying it will NOT come to that.
ive been told it wont,reassured it wont..but it is still a scary place to be in.
wombat's Avatar wombat 12:18 PM 06-24-2007
How I'd deal with CPS?

I'm not sure having a blanket strategy is so useful. I think it'd help to have several strategies depending on the situation.

A blanket 'don't let them in' could backfire if the allegations are serious enough. If they're pretty frivolous, and there's not much evidence it may work in ending their involvement sooner. But if the allegations are serious and there is supporting evidence, it could just prolong and aggravate the process.

I personally don't like the blanket 'stick to your rights' scenario because the consequences of it can mean more work for CPS, who are already underfunded, undertrained, struggling with workloads etc etc. When I did CPS work, the hostile people (who could be abusers or not), just added to my workload preventing me from spending time with other families. I had to keep coming back to visit them until I could finalise the case one way or the other. The CPS worker has little choice in this - reports have to be investigated. And some abusers use this hostile approach to scare off investigation so it does tend to raise a red flag. So depending on the situation I'd try to be cooperative and helpful and hope to resolve it quickly.

So I'd agree with know your rights THOROUGHLY, listen to the allegations and then use your own judgement to deal with the situation. A lot of CPS clients are uneducated in general, poor and lacking in resources. So in those cases, if they're not confident in dealing with CPS in their house, it'd be helpful for them to have an advocate present. Find a person/friend in advance that you can call if the situation arises. Have them with you to advocate for you if you talk to CPS.

I've also been threatened with CPS and the hospital social work dept at my hospital where I birthed my dd. I think it helps if you make it clear to the person threatening you that you understand the legal definitions of child abuse, understand what risk assessment is, don't take kindly to people wasting CPS resources/taxpayers dollars and that you will report frivolous and malicious complaints to their supervisors. Quiz them on precisely what 'abuse' they are concerned about and how it fits into the legal definition of child abuse. You can sometimes sort out the 'I don't agree with your way of parenting' issues versus actual concerns of abuse this way. Sometimes the medical staff aren't being malicious but are just clueless about this themselves and it actually helps reframe it for them.
Wugmama's Avatar Wugmama 05:30 PM 07-24-2007
Holy crap, did you see the latest thread:

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...72#post8712172

:

After I sent him this link, dh wants us to locate a lawyer so we know who to call in this situation.

He is reading up on www.fightcps.com. He already wants to move to NZ, this kind of stuff doesn't help.
KaraBoo's Avatar KaraBoo 06:35 AM 07-25-2007
I don't blame your husband, Wugmama. Everytime the thought crosses my mind to someday move back to the United States, I think of things like this and I quickly change my mind. No Way will I live like that.
~D~'s Avatar ~D~ 09:56 PM 11-10-2013
I realize this thread is several years old, but wanted to share a quick run-down on my current situation with cps. DD15 has bipolar disorder, and is under the care of a psychiatrist. I recently had an operation on my shoulder, and on the day of my surgery she gained access to my rx pain pills. My mom had left them out on the counter inadvertently, I think because I was still under anesthesia & she didn't know my lock box code. Anyway, it took a few days to discover what happened. I confronted DD and she confessed to not only taking them but crushing & snorting them with a friend. Because of her history of BP, cutting & other recent struggles, I was terrified that she might commit suicide - either purposely or accidental. So I scheduled an emergency session with her psychiatrist, who recommended an evaluation at the inpatient mental health facility about 30 miles away. They decide to admit her, and DD comes unglued. Says that I'll be sorry I admitted her, I need to be punched in the face, etc. Knowing this is likely the BP talking, I let it roll off. So during her stay, they adjust her meds (pls no flaming, I really did try every possible alternative first) & she gets a visit from a DHS employee who interviews her EXTENSIVELY took photos of her arm. DD didn't tell me this when I visited her, she waited until she came home. Fast forward three weeks & I get a call from CPS stating there has been a complaint filed & she needs to come talk to me. I agreed to the home visit, scraped up everything I could & retained a law firm that specializes in fighting CPS. I instructed DS12 that when she arrived at his school to interrogate him that he was to request the 'interview' take place at home.
The home visit was promptly cancelled by the SW on the morning the home visit was to take place. :-) this past Friday. Being that tomorow is a holiday, & Tuesday is her day off , I suspect she is trying to drag it to the 30 day deadline - 11/15. So she can claim 'extenuating circumstances' & get an extension, maybe she's bringing a supervisor.... Who knows. Either way, my attorney contacted the supervisor and stated we are available & prepared for the home visit to take place THIS WEEK. Bring it on! I am so glad I had the resources to retain a law firm. This CW pulledDD out of class Thursday & told her that the woman who interviewed her in the hospital said I'M THE ONE snorting pills & I'M SMOKING WEED WITH DD!! DD did mention I used to have a medical marijuana card, but it's expired & I haven't smoked in a VERY long time. I even went & submitted myself for a 5 panel drug test which is negative, so Ms. Lawyer can squash that right away.
I don't know exactly what the allegatios are, at this point. But I would bet that its related to the
rx pills & my past mmj card. But I refuse to allow a govt worker into my home without a lawyer to protect my family's rights.
So my basic strategy is this:
1. Get a lawyer. A warrant will allow them in yourg
home, but will do nothing much to protect your family's rights.
2. Instruct your children if possible, to request that they be interviewed at home. A school interview is NOT required.
3. Record everything, & make your answers as brief as possible. You don't have to explain everything.
4. Politely decline any question you don't feel comfortable with. They don't need to know if you've ever had an abortion, or anything you don't wish to share.
5. They have the burden of proof. Not you.

Sorry, this didn't end up being a quick run-down. It's never quick or simple with CPS.

ETA: Home visit went great, cps worker told us before she left that she was probably going to deny the case, as she saw the allegations were SO unsubstantiated. Rec'd a call 1 1/2 hrs after she left to confirm that, after speaking to her supervisor, cps was indeed denying to open a case. Woohoo! Score one for the goodguys!
contactmaya's Avatar contactmaya 02:07 PM 11-16-2013
Quote:
Originally Posted by Unoppressed MAMA Q View Post

NOT here to talk about whether CPS is good or bad.

here to talk about PROTECTING your own family in case of unwarranted CPS invasion.
 

Even though you posted this over 6years ago, i want to thank you for posting it.


MommyBear's Avatar MommyBear 06:35 AM 01-17-2014

My boys were just returned two weeks ago after spending two months in foster care. They were taken because my (then) 10 year old had body odor. He had showered the night before and was wearing clothes fresh from the dryer but the nurse at his school decided to call the police. They were taken straight from school, nobody told me what had happened. The social worker saw a stain on our carpet and reported our house as "filthy." She tried to tell us that the DA said we had to re-floor our house (untrue). She outright lied to the court and because of that, our boys were taken from us. I was allowed one, one hour visit per week for the first month. We were assigned a new case worker from another agency who came and did a walk through of our home and supervised our visits. He said that he and his coworker could find no reason for the boys to have been taken in the first place. Not only were they gone but they were not placed together and two of them were made to bathe in rubbing alcohol. DH's military service was twisted and used against us (they said he "killed 33 people in Afghanistan" when both the number and location were wrong and it was his JOB), trying to make him look like he had anger issues. They took my child support (still haven't given it back) and have demanded that we both take several classes, have psych evals, physicals and DH has to take an anger management class. When we went back to court, we had a new judge and he actually read the reports of the new case worker. The DA stood there telling the judge that we didn't deserve to have our boys back, luckily the judge saw past all of that and we got the boys back. Now, we're locked into a year of "services" that will do nothing but have people snooping through our house. I know there are good social workers out there, I know several. But, I also know that there are some that will outright lie to get children taken away from their families, not to mention school employees who try to cause trouble where there is none. Since getting the boys back, I have enrolled the younger two in eSchool through our school district. Their old school called DCF saying that my boys aren't enrolled anywhere, which they knew to be untrue (they had to approve the transfer to eSchool).


homemademomma 08:47 AM 01-17-2014
Quote:
Originally Posted by NatureMama3 View Post

I'm one of those who doesn't do well-child checks.

my lovely 6 month experience with CPS was DUE TO WELL CHILD CHECKS.

If I hadn't gone, the ped wouldn't have become paranoid about what she percieved as an unsupportive spouse (um, he worked 8-5 and so did she. given we had newborn twins, he couldn't just give up a job, eh?) not ever attending said WCCs.

WCCs don't guarantee you will be free from CPS problems. We err on the side of caution against them.

there are currently no MDs who know my children exist, they don't know they're not vaxxed, they don't know they eat vegan, they don't know the 4 year old nurses. what they don't know, they don't report!

I just need to say that this is an impossibility. It is much more likely that the doc called CPS because of concerns about the septic hip- maybe the ped thought that the parents neglected to bring her in for treatment in a timely manner? Or felt that the mother didn't understand the seriousness of what was going on and the child was at risk of not getting needed follow up?  I don't know. 

 

I'm not saying that CPS can't be a trainwreck, because it can. But it is an impossibility that CPS was called because the dad didn't go to well baby visits. 

 

I've been on both sides of the CPS issue. CPS came to my house when there was an issue with an older boy on the school bus being sexually inappropriate on the bus. They were a lifesaver for us, as I was sick with worry about the whole thing. A case was opened on our family because of concerns that my son had been exposed to inappropriate sexual behavior. We were lucky to have an amazing caseworker. I was SO worried because the caseworker had apparently tried to visit us when we weren't home, then sent us a letter which I didn't get for a full MONTH because our mailbox was snowed over and I hardly ever made it to the P.O. to pick up our mail. When I finally got the letter, I freaked out and tried to call the worker over and over again, only to find out she was on vacation. Anyway we finally connected, she made a home visit. She talked to my kids alone (which makes SENSE. It's ridiculous to expect to be in the room with your child when there is suspicion that you might be abusing/neglecting said child!!!!), but explicitly told me I could listen through the door. She made another follow up visit a few weeks later, and that was that. 

 

My experience with CPS was wonderful. But I recognize that I won the caseworker lottery. I also have Privilege, because I am white, not poor, married, and both of my kids no longer nursed or coslept. 

 

 

On the other side, I am an RN and used to coordinate prenatal services for moms on methadone treatment, who were homeless, had mental health issues, and/or other social risk factors. I've had to call CPS a few times, and I've been sick with worry each time, knowing that I am opening a potential can of worms for the family in question. My facility had a blanket policy of making a referral for any mom who had a positive drug screen, for any drug. THIS IS NOT A REPORTABLE OFFENSE and I refused to comply. I was able to get my facility to change it's policy, and I also got us to stop drug testing all women as a matter of course. Criminalizing women who use drugs during pregnancy only causes these women to avoid getting the care they need. It kills me. 

 

 

ALSO- this is relevant. I have two special needs children. One has ataxia telangiectasia and requires lots of specialized medical care. My son has mental health problems, and as such we are connected with DMH and see therapists, social workers, psychs, and case workers. I have also had to call the police on my son numerous times, too many to count. :(  I delayed vaxing my son (my dd does not make antibodies to vaccines, so she is completely unvaxxed). I was also always quite upfront about cosleeping, and all our docs knew that I breastfed both of them for more than two years. My kids were also vegetarian and I frequently used herbal/natural remedies on them instead of using mainstream medicine.

 

I never, once, not ever, had a practitioner side eye me for any of my "alternative" parenting practices. 


crazyms's Avatar crazyms 08:58 AM 01-17-2014

Mommybear I'm so sorry for what your family was put through and all the other mamas here.

 

Note from attorney: If you are FORCED to sign or feel no other way out during a run in with them sign "under duress, XX XXXX" This means "yes I did sign but I was forced against my will to do so" basically. Your attorney can undo whatever you signed in this manner. That's what mine said anyways.


NatureMama3's Avatar NatureMama3 10:05 AM 01-17-2014
Quote:
I just need to say that this is an impossibility. It is much more likely that the doc called CPS because of concerns about the septic hip- maybe the ped thought that the parents neglected to bring her in for treatment in a timely manner? Or felt that the mother didn't understand the seriousness of what was going on and the child was at risk of not getting needed follow up? I don't know.
You guarantee a court case which my lawyer and I reviewed all doctor notes stating exactly that did not happen? Special. You do not know just because you are an RN. I worked in that medical office as a Medical Assistant and personally knew the doctor as well. It is exactly what happened. Think it didn't all you want, but don't come in here claiming my experience is false, misconstrued or made up. You were not there. You did not work with that doctor or read the medical records. I did.
pokeyac's Avatar pokeyac 12:31 PM 01-17-2014
I would like to remind you all that this is a public forum. Any information you share could be used in any active CPS cases if your true identity is able to be linked to your online identity. We generally discourage discussion about active cases/investigations for this reason. You may edit posts by clicking on the pencil icon at the bottom. Also, please remember that personal attacks are against the User Agreement. Let's keep the discussion civil. This thread is almost 7 years old. If you have a new topic to discuss, please start a new thread.
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