Circumcision argument with husband! - Page 2 - Mothering Forums

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#31 of 56 Old 05-05-2011, 05:59 PM
 
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I don't see anything rude here.  Just because people don't agree and are speaking up doesn't mean it's being rude.

 

As for the DH who had a bad later in life circ, that argument may color ones thoughts but it isn't very scientific IN THAT it can happen with an infant circ too.  So you can cut a boy at 3 days and have major issues or hold off and let nature be.  IF (and that's a BIG IF) there is a problem later, one can address it at that point.  Would you (a general you) preemptively do cardiac surgery because there *might* be an issue or would you hold off till there/if there was one?

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#32 of 56 Old 05-05-2011, 06:55 PM
 
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I don't see anything rude here.  Just because people don't agree and are speaking up doesn't mean it's being rude.


Posters have edited. winky.gif And I think the points are coming across better now. thumb.gif

 


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#33 of 56 Old 05-05-2011, 07:16 PM
 
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Posters have edited. winky.gif And I think the points are coming across better now. thumb.gif

 

Carry on :)  lol
 

 

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#34 of 56 Old 05-05-2011, 08:40 PM
 
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I know this is a super hot button issue. My son is circumcised and I am unsure if I regret it or not. The truth is I left it up to my husband, for some to think that I don't belong at MDC or that I am a bad mother because of this I think that is a little uncalled for. We are not all going to agree on everything crunchy and parenting, nor should we, and I know Mothering's stance but that does not mean I cannot be a member of the community with a voice.

 

We are now expecting our second, don't know the sex and truth be told, if left soley up to me I am not sure I would do it again BUT my husband is not ashamed of his circumcision and does not consider himself mutilated. He takes much offense to that term and will not listen to the "intactivists" simply because of their harsh and offensive language. The truth is that our children are OUR children and his opinion is just as important as mine. It is important to respect your husband as well as your kids. I dont feel like the OP's husband is respecting her simply because he is refusing to talk about it with her but some men are even more passionate for circumsision then the female intactivists are against it. It may not matter to some but one of the reasons he is for it is because a friend of his had it done as a teenager because of problems and it was a horrific experience for the kid. 

 

By the way, "mother nature" gave me wisdom teeth, and a brain tumor, I didn't keep those. There are other points you can make but that part of it is not a solid argument.

 

 

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#35 of 56 Old 05-05-2011, 08:50 PM
 
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My dh and I had that argument and I let him chose in the end. I seriously regret it! It was just so wrong! I am very unhappy about this. 

 

Stand your ground. Tell him this is going to be like congress..there has to be a 2/3 vote to change something....and he is not 2/3 of this group. If you both agree to chopping his penis, then you will do it. Otherwise, until you are both in agreement, it will not be done.

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#36 of 56 Old 05-05-2011, 09:06 PM
 
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By the way, "mother nature" gave me wisdom teeth, and a brain tumor, I didn't keep those. There are other points you can make but that part of it is not a solid argument.

 

 



But not everyone gets those removed and never at birth.

I still have my tonsils, appendix and a tailbone.

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#37 of 56 Old 05-05-2011, 09:13 PM
 
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I didn't take time to read all of the posts, because I don't want to get involved... I just wanted to tell you my story and how I went about it.

 

I'm also anti-circ. My husband is for it. Like, way for it. Anytime it got brought up, he just changed the subject and ignored me.

 

I'm also anti-vax, pro co-sleeping and pro-cloth diapering.

 

I compromised. ;-) I weighed what was more important to me...

 

I told him he could name the baby, vaccinate it, put it in it's own bed and diaper it how he pleases if we left the baby's foreskin alone UNTIL the baby was old enough to decide for himself if he wanted it done or not.

 

Granted, I'm only 13 weeks so I'm still praying for a girl so we don't have to deal with this. LOL That's just how we resolved our issue.

 

I just reminded him that just because we aren't doing it at birth doesn't mean we can't get it done later if/when our unborn son decides that HE wants it.

 

Lots of luck to you. I know it's a bitter battle and I hope it gets resolved peacefully.


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#38 of 56 Old 05-06-2011, 05:40 AM
 
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Originally Posted by LACandy View Post

, for some to think that I don't belong at MDC or that I am a bad mother because of this I think that is a little uncalled for. 

 

 

By the way, "mother nature" gave me wisdom teeth, and a brain tumor, I didn't keep those. There are other points you can make but that part of it is not a solid argument.

 

 


No, you don't have to agree but just as I wouldn't come here asking for advice on spanking a kid, I wouldn't expect to come here for pro circ info.


Pointing out not doing surgeries on babies because there is no point to it is just as solid as I someone who says "I know someone who had a botched one."  Neither one is scientific.  THe science is that if you DON'T circ, you won't have a botched one and chances of needing one later in life because of an issue is minimal.

 

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#39 of 56 Old 05-06-2011, 07:46 AM
 
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I kept my wisdom teeth. And people get brain tumors removed due to the fact that it can cause death. Foreskins do not kill.
 

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Quote:
Originally Posted by LACandy View Post

By the way, "mother nature" gave me wisdom teeth, and a brain tumor, I didn't keep those. There are other points you can make but that part of it is not a solid argument.

 

 





But not everyone gets those removed and never at birth.

I still have my tonsils, appendix and a tailbone.
 


 

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#40 of 56 Old 05-06-2011, 10:15 AM
 
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Maybe he needs some reassurance that you like his penis?

 

(You'd think that getting pregnant would be reassurance enough...;)

 

Seriously, though, I think that a lot of men feel self-conscious or like you're criticizing their penis because it's circumcised. They get defensive and shut out your thoughts.

 

I know after discussing it with my partner he felt sad that he was circumcised and felt a little awkward about it for a while (although he always thought that it was my decision to make, not his).

 

Now he's very adamantly against routine infant circumcision (it's not just females who are intactivists!),

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#41 of 56 Old 05-06-2011, 11:41 AM
 
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It must be really hard to be struggling with your partner over this. 

 

I was 13 when my brother was born, and was in the hospital when they did the circumcision.  He felt it.  The truth is that babies feel everything the rest of us feel; they just can't protest it.

 

I remember my mom using the same arguments you mentioned - "boys should look like their dads," "he'll be teased in the locker room," "it's just what you do," "it's more hygienic" (which it was, in Biblical times when they first started doing it).  None of those arguments really seemed to make sense to me, and still don't.

 

Now I'm having a baby boy, and for any procedure that is not medically necessary, it comes down to this: his body, his decision.  If he wants to get circumcised as an adult for any reason, I will support him.  Until then, I'm not letting anyone remove a part of his body that God put there.

 

I think some adult men are a little defensive about this, because they themselves were circumcised and for that reason, they prefer to think of it as a "necessary" thing with no potential disadvantages.  But many have educated themselves about the historical and other reasons for the procedure and made a different decision for their new babies, and maybe your husband will be open to doing so as well.

 

Just my two cents.  Good luck!

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#42 of 56 Old 05-06-2011, 12:35 PM
 
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Originally Posted by librarymommy View Post

Okay, I didn't expect all that!

There is some valuable info to think about however. My dh is known for being very stubborn, but I'm wondering if showing him a video may help. Where may I find one? Also, I'm going to contact our insurance to see if it is a covered surgery. Financial pressure may do the trick where emotional/rational will not.

Of course, if it is a girl, there are no worries! Wish me luck...

Many (most?) health care providers in my region require parents to watch a video before the procedure can be performed. Here is a link to the resources in The Case Against Circumcision sub-forum.
 

 


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#43 of 56 Old 05-07-2011, 01:20 PM
 
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I don't know if this has been said before or not, but unless both mom's and dad's signatures are signed you can hold your ground and your baby will not be cut.  You both have to consent.


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#44 of 56 Old 05-07-2011, 01:28 PM
 
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I don't know if this has been said before or not, but unless both mom's and dad's signatures are signed you can hold your ground and your baby will not be cut. You both have to consent.


I thought that varied on location?


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#45 of 56 Old 05-08-2011, 12:26 PM
 
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Yes I have heard that it only takes one parental signature unfortunately :(
 

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I don't know if this has been said before or not, but unless both mom's and dad's signatures are signed you can hold your ground and your baby will not be cut.  You both have to consent.



 

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#46 of 56 Old 05-09-2011, 06:34 AM
 
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Yes I have heard that it only takes one parental signature unfortunately :(
 



 

Ugh.  Maybe that's just a CA thing.  My friend refused and her dh couldn't do anything about it there.  That's a bummer.  I'm thinking video maybe the only way to go to try to sway him.  I'm sorry mama.  It should be up to the child when he's old enough to figure out what he wants done to his body.  I hope he sees the light before the end of your pregnancy.


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#47 of 56 Old 05-12-2011, 05:30 PM - Thread Starter
 
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OP here. Thanks for all your support. Our ultrasound is tomorrow, so I'll know for sure if I need to get into this. I'll let you know.

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#48 of 56 Old 05-12-2011, 08:43 PM
 
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It only takes 1 signature here.

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#49 of 56 Old 05-16-2011, 04:36 PM
 
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I posted a few days ago about having had this particular argument with my husband in the past and possibly having to face it again. And yep, I will. We had our ultrasound today and the baby is a boy. I'm sad to say that the thought of the circumcision discussion is suppressing any joy I may have otherwise felt. greensad.gif

Did you have your ultrasound? Was everything alright?


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#50 of 56 Old 05-17-2011, 01:58 PM
 
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I hope that everyone comes to an agreement. It can be tough. When our oldest son was born I freaked out at the thought of them hacking at my baby's penis. So, I told my husband he had to decide and he didn't make a decision so that was the decision. Both of our boys are intact and I am thankful that we didn't have to fight over it. 

 

I have a friend who let her husband decide also even though she did not support circ and their oldest boys is circ'd and their youngest isn't. The younger one was born at home so the momma told her husband he had to make the appts needed to get it done if he wanted to and he waited too long. So now, they have one of each. I don't know what their long term plan will be with that. 

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#51 of 56 Old 05-17-2011, 02:25 PM
 
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I don't know if this has been mentioned or not, but what about talking to your pediatrician?  The pediatrician I chose for my children refused to do cosmetic procedures on children, so he would not perform routine infant circumcision.  At least this is what someone told me when I was looking for a pediatrician in my area.  I never actually talked to him about it as I had a girl, but he was also willing to work with parents who choose not to vaccinate, and who had homebirths.  So maybe finding a doctor who shares your opinions might help. 

 

Even if you do have a girl, I think this issue is worth working out.  I'm not sure I ever worked it out with my partner, honestly.  When we were having our first, I said I was opposed to circumcision, he said he was in favor of it.  He said if I really felt strongly about it, he'd go with my opinion.  I said if he really felt strongly about it, I'd go with his opinion.  We had a girl.  Four years later, I was pregnant again, and much stronger in my anti-circumcision feeling.  Early on in my pregnancy, my husband said something to the effect of, "I guess we're going to have to have the circumcision debate again" and I said, "No debate, we're not doing it."  Of course that got his hackles up and he started pushing the "we need to discuss all the issues".  I told him that our daughter's pediatrician didn't even perform them and a few other things.  My feeling was we decided it the last time, and this time it really IS important to me.  He didn't really push it after that, but maybe it got swept under the lets-hope-it-goes-away rug.  Ultimately, though, he is reasonable and I think he would have realized that he was in part reacting based on emotion, the emotion of knowing that it had been done to him but that doesn't mean it should be done to other people.

 

And if it was truly important to him, he could educate himself on the matter, but he was the type to say, "Oh, just read it and let me know, whatever you think is best" type.  At the same time, he also wants me to do the research in the way he wants it, double blind studies with lots of data that support my idea, and nothing whatsoever what he thinks is fringe.  That was his complaint about the immunization issue.  No, if he wants that data, than he needs to seek it out.  And he needs to understand the politics behind it all and understand just why what he wants might not exist. 

 

Absolutely with circumcision, first do no harm.  If he is not willing to read anything you've written, and he won't discuss his reasoning with you or provide you with anything to make his own case, but absolutely insists on his way, that is disrespectful to you and your children, and indicates potential problems in other areas.  So just trying to work this out might be beneficial to your marriage and how you interact with each other.  JMO.

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#52 of 56 Old 05-17-2011, 04:59 PM - Thread Starter
 
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That sounds like my husband. Anyway, the night before the ultrasound I broke down crying and we ended up talking. He said that I was arguing rationally and logically, but it was an emotional topic so therefore not getting through to him. (big gender role switch!) He admitted he wants the baby to look the same as him. At least we talked and we get where each other is coming from. He said that he would look at what I give him, but he wasn't changing his mind. But, better than where we were...

 

And yes, the baby is a boy! I just had a feeling which was why I was getting worked up over this. My dh said I took the news very well. DD's reaction was funny, as soon as we told her she was having a brother, she didn't want to have anything else to do with it.

 

I called the pediatrician but he hasn't called me back. Apparently only the OB's do the procedure where we live, and our doesn't. I'm not planning on making any appointments, so if DH wants it, he has to do the legwork (not that I'll allow it if he does!). Still have to find out about two signatures and the procedure for setting it up, I'm seeing my midwife tomorrow so I'll ask and MAKE SURE THAT I NEED TO APPROVE.

 

I'm feeling better about things, and I am getting excited about this baby boy. I have one friend who is very supportive, she just lives far away. Everyone else down here (friends, coworkers etc.) all think I'm crazy for even thinking about non circ. But I can't in good conscience allow it, so therefore I won't. I'll keep you all posted. It may be an interesting 4 1/2 months!

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#53 of 56 Old 05-17-2011, 05:09 PM
 
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Congratulations! Baby boys are wonderful! :) I wanted to let you know that I was in your shoes. When I was pregnant with my DS my husband was adamant that DS be circumcised so that he would look the same as him. We had a lot of conversations. In the end he also decided that he did not want to circumcise. I did not pressure him, but I did make sure we both did our research together. We even watched a circumcision together. That was tough to watch. I think it's important you both get where each other is coming from. I think if he feels heard, he is more likely to be open to the reasons why not to circumcise. Give him time, he may surprise you! Mine sure did. 

 

BTW, I did the same thing as you. I told him if he wanted to do the circ, he would need to do the legwork to make sure it got done. winky.gif

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#54 of 56 Old 05-17-2011, 07:50 PM
 
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I wanted to share this resource with the group: http://www.doctorsopposingcircumcision.org/.

 

 

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#55 of 56 Old 05-17-2011, 09:19 PM
 
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Yes, I think it has to be the emotional impact of it, being asked to look at something that you've taken as given and that into something that was done to you by loving parents, and then reframing it as mutilating and painful--I think that can have an impact on these discussions.  My husband was somewhat emotional about homebirth too.  I showed him reports of studies, and he finally got a point where he said, "I don't care if you say it is safer, it doesn't FEEL safer."  And from then on, he was able to examine what was really worrying him about the whole thing.

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That sounds like my husband. Anyway, the night before the ultrasound I broke down crying and we ended up talking. He said that I was arguing rationally and logically, but it was an emotional topic so therefore not getting through to him. (big gender role switch!) He admitted he wants the baby to look the same as him. At least we talked and we get where each other is coming from. He said that he would look at what I give him, but he wasn't changing his mind. But, better than where we were...

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#56 of 56 Old 05-18-2011, 01:49 PM
 
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I just don't get the "look the same as me" thing.  Have you asked your DH how many times he remembers seeing his Dad's penis?  DH was never pro-circ so we never had the discussion really but we have had it since about other people arguing that point.  He has said he NEVER saw his Dad's penis.  Doesn't know if he is circed or not.  Nor does he care if our DS and he "look" the same.  We aren't going to dye DS's hair to match DH's and that is a LOT more noticeable than if they are bot the same in the penis department! I get different men will have different self image issues with it but seriously, do men really look at other mens penises all that much?

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