Gender...who's finding out? - Page 2 - Mothering Forums

Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
Old 02-16-2011, 02:06 AM
 
sunanthem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Asheville, baby!
Posts: 2,567
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I didn't find out with my first 2, but I have never had an ultrasound either, I'm with the whole, there is no medical reason I need to see inside there, so why do it? For fun?

We already have a boy and a girl, so whatever is cool for us. (wishing for a girl though). But yeah, just baby, and we'll have a few names of each gender picked out, and some neutral newborn stuff.

I also don't have a problem with waiting after the birth a few days or so to determine the right name, either.


Saamy Student mama to  superhero.gifand hearts.gifand babyf.gif

sunanthem is offline  
Sponsored Links
Advertisement
 
Old 02-16-2011, 02:27 AM
 
capretta's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2010
Posts: 517
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
We'll find out. Neither of us find any appeal in being surprised by sex. I'm sure birth will be exciting enough already. That said, we wouldn't shell out $35 on an intelligender test just for fun either and we won't be painting any rooms pink or blue.
capretta is offline  
Old 02-16-2011, 05:33 AM
 
tutucrazy's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 800
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Not finding out is part of healing for me.  I had a truamatic hospital birth experience with my son and I want this one to be a no muss, no fuss gentle homebirth.  I don't want any unnecessary intervention and not knowing the gender is part of me trying to make it all a very natural, normal experience.  

 

We are not finding out the sex and we are not doing any ultrasounds this time around.  Aside from the recent debates about ultrasound safety, I just don't want my babe to undergo 20-30 minutes of noise that sounds like a freight train passing by their side.  We don't have any real reason to need an u/s since they aren't recommended by the FDA unless there are complications and they don't really improve  birth outcomes.  


Momma to DS (2/08) and #2 due 10/11.
 
tutucrazy is offline  
Old 02-16-2011, 05:57 AM
 
StephandOwen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 8,613
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
For those who are saying that studies show there is no improving the outcome with the use of ultrasound, does that not take into consideration the babies who are discovered to have some sort of defect on ultrasound that can either be operated on in utero or immedately after birth? What about the babies who have something that needs immediate attention after birth? If it's discovered before birth you 8am be prepared in the right setting with the right doctors. I just don't understand how it can be said ultrasounds have no affect on the outcome of any pregnancy. Am I misunderstanding?

Steph, DH Jason (1-1-11), DS Owen (10-3-03) and DS Kai (10-13-11)

StephandOwen is offline  
Old 02-16-2011, 06:23 AM
 
livacreature's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Pittsburgh, PA
Posts: 544
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

I think we'll find out, but I don't think we will tell other folks. 


Social working mommy to babygirl.gif 10/10/11, three cats, and a dog.

livacreature is offline  
Old 02-16-2011, 07:04 AM
 
AlexisT's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: Central PA
Posts: 2,208
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)

IIRC, the Cochrane reviews on u/s that conclude no benefit exclude the 20wk anatomy scan. They're for routine u/s after 20 weeks.

 

I want to find out this time. Last time, the hospital wasn't allowed to tell us. It will save 50% of arguing on names :)


DD 01/2007, DS 09/2011

AlexisT is offline  
Old 02-16-2011, 07:23 AM
 
Join Date: Dec 2003
Location: Healing my heart
Posts: 6,041
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Nope, we won't find out until birth either. It's so much more fun that way, something to look forward to! I did find out with my first 3 (all boys!) but not the last 3 (all girls!).

Mama~Love is offline  
Old 02-16-2011, 08:24 AM
~pi
 
~pi's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 3,670
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)


Quote:
Originally Posted by StephandOwen View Post

For those who are saying that studies show there is no improving the outcome with the use of ultrasound, does that not take into consideration the babies who are discovered to have some sort of defect on ultrasound that can either be operated on in utero or immedately after birth? What about the babies who have something that needs immediate attention after birth? If it's discovered before birth you 8am be prepared in the right setting with the right doctors. I just don't understand how it can be said ultrasounds have no affect on the outcome of any pregnancy. Am I misunderstanding?


The issue is that these problems are so rare that they don't show up as stat sig even in a large trial. And u/s is not going to pick everything up. I believe they catch about half, but that's just my rough recollection. I could be wrong. That's what I meant when I said that to a certain extent, the 'routine u/s don't help' finding is a function of the statistics and sample size. Of course if you are one of the rare cases, then it could help. But because those cases are rare, the benefits of u/s don't show up as significant in aggregate.

 

It's like saying that distributing free lottery tickets is not a great way to address poverty. You might disagree if you happen to get a winning ticket, but it is true as a general rule.

 

It's also worth pointing out that a lot of the science on this area is pretty muddy. And at this point, the vast majority of women in developed countries are offered a mid-pregnancy u/s, and I suspect it's unusual to decline, so it's tough to get good comparative data anymore, even observational.


professor & maman de DS1 (6) & DS2 (1)

~pi is offline  
Old 02-16-2011, 08:43 AM
 
StephandOwen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 8,613
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by ~pi View Post




The issue is that these problems are so rare that they don't show up as stat sig even in a large trial. And u/s is not going to pick everything up. I believe they catch about half, but that's just my rough recollection. I could be wrong. That's what I meant when I said that to a certain extent, the 'routine u/s don't help' finding is a function of the statistics and sample size. Of course if you are one of the rare cases, then it could help. But because those cases are rare, the benefits of u/s don't show up as significant in aggregate.

 

It's like saying that distributing free lottery tickets is not a great way to address poverty. You might disagree if you happen to get a winning ticket, but it is true as a general rule.

 

It's also worth pointing out that a lot of the science on this area is pretty muddy. And at this point, the vast majority of women in developed countries are offered a mid-pregnancy u/s, and I suspect it's unusual to decline, so it's tough to get good comparative data anymore, even observational.



Thanks! That makes sense. It all really just depends on your perspective. To one person they might see it as their odds of having a special needs child (with a special need that can be diagnosed via ultrasound) is so low that the risks aren't worth it. Then there are other mamas who feel different. Personally, I've been in the "special needs world" long enough that I don't think the odds of having a special needs child are "that" low. But my perspective is jaded because it's what I'm surrounded by, so of course it seems like there are more children with special needs then there really are. But for a mama who is never around any children with special needs they might feel sorta like "that can't/won't happen to my child" and be more comfortable waiting to see at birth thumb.gif

 

And.... ahem.... for a big enough winning lotto ticket I'll say whatever you want me to say lol.gif


Steph, DH Jason (1-1-11), DS Owen (10-3-03) and DS Kai (10-13-11)

StephandOwen is offline  
Old 02-16-2011, 09:21 AM
 
Amy May's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 482
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Hi Steph- per your question,

 

From the research I've done, there are a few reasons that ultrasounds have been found to be provide no benfits has a few causes.  In the case of babies with serious defects, the studies showed that ultrasounds sometimes didn't pick up the anamolies in the first place, or sometimes indicated there was an anomally when where wasn't.  The use of ultrasound wasn't found to improve the outcome of the babies- the same number of babies died etc.  However, they did find that babies who were found to have an anomally through ultrasound tended to be induced earlier, have shorter gestations, and be subject to more intervention.  For a special needs child, the extra time in the womb can be crucial.  Clearly though, statistics are just statistics, and it doesn't really matter if overall, ultrasounds aren't shown to improve the outcome of the pregnancy if that is your baby! 

 

Also, in the vast majority of cases, there is nothing that can be done with the information from an ultrasound.  One of the most common justifications given for routine u/s is to detect IUGR  (intrauterine growth retardation).  However, there is no treatment for IUGR, so routine u/s screen for conditions where nothing can be done (except to produce a lot of anxiety and further interventions). 

 

Again, stats are useful for looking at overall trends, but they mean nothing on an individual level.  Ultrasounds absolutely have medical uses and for some individual families, they can make a huge difference to know ahead of time.   I'm truly not trying to suggest that ANYONE should or should not be getting ultrasounds- I just feel strongly that the woman and family make an informed decision, and actively choose the kind of care they want in their pregnancy.  All momma's should be empowered in their decisions! 

 

Ultrasounds do have huge benefits and can be an amazing tool when used for specific indication.  The general warning is against using routine ultrasounds as basically a window with a webcam into your womb!

 

I tried to paste the link to another article, but if it doesn't work you can search Midwiferytoday.com for Ultrasound, and go to the article by Marsden Wagner, and another by Beverly Lawrence Beech.

 

http://www.midwiferytoday.com/articles/ultrasoundwagner.asp


Amy, feathering our nest with sweet husband O and baby girl, P (October 2011). 
Amy May is offline  
Old 02-16-2011, 09:35 AM
 
wendybird's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: OK
Posts: 372
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

We will definitely find out. The day is a surprise, the weight is a surprise, how they look is a surprise. Their gender is a preparation and bonding stat we can use. :) We talk to baby by name from the moment we find out!


Wendy,loving wife to Brian, happy mama of Trinity(15), Christian(15), Gavin(13), Logan(11), Griffon(9),Jubilee(7), Epiphany (4), and Lucian Danger( born 18 April 12) <3
wendybird is offline  
Old 02-16-2011, 09:39 AM
 
ldsmom06's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Metro Atlanta
Posts: 837
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

We will most likely find out.  I don't like any surprises except the pregnancy itself.  I can't stand not knowing when I am going to give birth either but I just have to deal with that.  I have 1 boy and 2 girls. 


Jennifer, SAHM to my little man 5 1/2 and my VBAC sweetie pie girls 4 1/2, 2 1/2 and 6mos. 

ldsmom06 is offline  
Old 02-16-2011, 11:11 AM
 
AKislandgirl's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: Alaska
Posts: 2,055
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

We will probably find out here. I want to know what color of longies to start knitting! We found out with DD and I had fun preparing.


Sue, Mama to Fiona Aileen (2/1/09) and  Maeve Penelope (10/7/11) familybed2.gif cd.gif
 

AKislandgirl is offline  
Old 02-16-2011, 03:56 PM
 
Hannahkatiebell's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Louisville, Ky
Posts: 441
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 1 Post(s)


Quote:
Originally Posted by StephandOwen View Post

For those who are saying that studies show there is no improving the outcome with the use of ultrasound, does that not take into consideration the babies who are discovered to have some sort of defect on ultrasound that can either be operated on in utero or immedately after birth? What about the babies who have something that needs immediate attention after birth? If it's discovered before birth you 8am be prepared in the right setting with the right doctors. I just don't understand how it can be said ultrasounds have no affect on the outcome of any pregnancy. Am I misunderstanding?



Thank God for the ultrasound that caught my son's cleft lip and palate at 20 weeks. It would have been quite the shocker had we not found out ahead of time!


Hannah, Wife to R , Mama to Alexander, born 2-15-08,
and Gabriel, born 10-17-11. Ask me about cleft lip and palate!
signcirc1.gif

Hannahkatiebell is offline  
Old 02-16-2011, 07:05 PM - Thread Starter
 
corrabelle's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Ontario, Canada
Posts: 420
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Good to hear the flip side of this, Hannah. I can imagine that a cleft palate would be something you'd need to prepare for medically, and emotionally.

 

I just want to say that I'm so glad that this group can discuss things so casually and calmly. I just want to be as informed as possible, and everyone has put in their view respectfully without any judgment on others. HUGS!


 Mama to Reuben (8) and Zeke (7)fencing.gif and baby girl, Lötte babyf.gif
Illustrator/designer of children's media and rubber stamps.  blogging.jpg

corrabelle is offline  
Old 02-16-2011, 09:20 PM
 
purplerose's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2010
Posts: 899
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

So going by your stats, if you don't find out you will have another girl :) I had all girls and didn't find out with them. My 14 year old is going crazy wanting to know with this one, she's sure it's a boy. She had the idea to find out from the u/s tech but not tell anyone...I didn't go for that!

 

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mama~Love View Post

Nope, we won't find out until birth either. It's so much more fun that way, something to look forward to! I did find out with my first 3 (all boys!) but not the last 3 (all girls!).



drowning in hormones with 4 daughters and an understanding, loving hubby. also some dogs. my life is crazy and we are always learning.

purplerose is offline  
Old 02-17-2011, 07:47 AM
 
sunanthem's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2004
Location: Asheville, baby!
Posts: 2,567
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

For me, pregnancy and birth are a very spirtual, personal process. From my experiences in life, I tend to side with faith in God, the Universe, Nature, whatever that my body and child can and will have a positive experience, and I feel I cannot get that positive experience when I bring the process into the more medical spectrum because I prefer less technology and interference in my pregnancy and birth. I feel like the history of birth and midwives, supportive communities, less medical interventions, is an excellent place to draw support from. If I have an ultrasound, that is one more step towards welcoming medical interventions, for me. And I prefer not to take that step.


Saamy Student mama to  superhero.gifand hearts.gifand babyf.gif

sunanthem is offline  
Old 02-17-2011, 01:09 PM
 
Mamma H's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: San Francisco
Posts: 1
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

First pregnancy and I don't want to know, but husband does.  Should I let him find out and then try and keep it from me?

Mamma H is offline  
Old 02-18-2011, 07:16 AM
 
Kindermama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2004
Location: she's only happy in the Son
Posts: 2,604
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

We'll find out like we have in the past. Either way, it's always a surprise for us whether we find out via ultrasound or at the birth. I'll be super shocked if I'm not having a boy this time! I'm 3 for 3 so far!


Consciously mothering 3 girls and 2 boys
Kindermama is offline  
Old 02-18-2011, 11:15 AM
~pi
 
~pi's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Posts: 3,670
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexisT View Post

IIRC, the Cochrane reviews on u/s that conclude no benefit exclude the 20wk anatomy scan. They're for routine u/s after 20 weeks.

 


AlexisT, you are right, but wasn't there a large RCT or perhaps a meta-analysis on the 20 wk scan that showed no aggregate benefit in normal pregnancies? I admit I'm a little hazy on this -- it is not my area, though it's related. I could be completely misremembering. [ETA: I was not completely misremembering -- there was a US trial in the late 80s/early 90s between routine u/s vs. u/s with clinical indications only, which is what I was thinking of. However, it was a very small sample for the research question (n=15,000, which I would suspect is underpowered for some outcomes.) My institution's archives don't go back that far, so I can't see full methods and tables, unfortunately. The fact that this research is very old at this point makes it less relevant, too.]

 

In any case, as far as I am concerned, it is a moot point. Given my risk status, I will definitely be having a level II midway through, as well as a few others, including possibly amnio. And I plan to take advantage of the opportunity to find out gender this time.


 

Quote:
Originally Posted by AlexisT View Post


I want to find out this time. Last time, the hospital wasn't allowed to tell us. It will save 50% of arguing on names :)


lol.gif


professor & maman de DS1 (6) & DS2 (1)

~pi is offline  
Old 02-18-2011, 11:21 AM
 
StephandOwen's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2004
Location: Kentucky
Posts: 8,613
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)


Quote:
Originally Posted by Mamma H View Post

First pregnancy and I don't want to know, but husband does.  Should I let him find out and then try and keep it from me?



It depends on his personality and how much it would upset you if you did find out. I briefly considered letting dh find out and it just being his secret but it would never work in our family. DH does not have the kind of personality to keep a secret so he would be telling everyone else in the world. My MIL would love the opportunity to spoil a surprise if she knew I really wanted it so she would have no problem telling me the gender after dh tells her.

 

In other words, it has the potential to upset me a whole lot more if dh knows and I don't than to just find out together.

 

If ds cannot come to the ultrasound then I think we're going to have the u/s tech write down the gender and seal it in an envelope. Then later when dh, ds and I are all together we'll have ds open the envelope and read it to all of us.


Steph, DH Jason (1-1-11), DS Owen (10-3-03) and DS Kai (10-13-11)

StephandOwen is offline  
Old 02-18-2011, 01:46 PM
 
Amy May's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2011
Location: Boulder, CO
Posts: 482
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)


Quote:
Originally Posted by Mamma H View Post

First pregnancy and I don't want to know, but husband does.  Should I let him find out and then try and keep it from me?



Wow, that sounds like torture to me!  In my opinion, I think it is either you both know or neither of you know.  I think if only DH knew, I would somehow find a way to pry it out of him. My DH would prefer to know, but we'll see- I'm not planning on getting any u/s, so it is not like he can find out without me... LOL


Amy, feathering our nest with sweet husband O and baby girl, P (October 2011). 
Amy May is offline  
 
User Tag List

Thread Tools


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off