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#1 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 05:40 AM - Thread Starter
 
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(This thread is not directed towards anyone on this board.  It is not a statement against homebirths or the like.  I'm not wanting to debate the pros and cons of hospital verses home, I am wanting validation that my "friend" is a big old bully!)

 

 

I will be having a hospital birth.  Maybe a c-section, maybe not, it is a wait and see how things go.  I am okay with this, as long as my individual medical concerns are being addressed and there isn't a big ol' stamp across my forehead or chart that subjects me to unnecessary surgury or interventions.  That being said, with my medical issues, I am very content with things being in the hospital. 

 

 

A woman I went to high school with has had all three of her babies at home.  I mentioned to her that I was pregnant.  One of the first friends I have told, actually.  When she inquired about the plan for birth, I told her that I was seeing an OB whose practice I was comfortable with and would be delivering at a hospital less than a mile from my home.  Her response?  "Oh, I'm so sad for you!  That sounds just awful!"

 

 

Okay.  Back up.

 

 

I know some women have had bad hospital experiences.  I am not discounting that.  But to say that the birth of my child will be AWFUL merely due to the location is so freaking offensive.

 

 

So, I tried to explain to her that homebirth isn't really an option for everyone.  Due to being a t1 diabetic, I called midwives just out of curiosity and was pretty much told that I was risked out.  Period.  Curiosity satisfied.  I told her I was really really okay with that.  Not to mention, even if I was perfectly healthy, last time I checked, the hospital was still a valid option for bringing healthy, well adjusted children into the world.

 

 

She goes on to tell me that I am "being manipulated by a system that thinks pregnancy is an illness" and that it is "so sad for her to see baby's born into a place of sterile negativity".  She goes on to say that EVERY woman she has known to give birth in a hospital has had CRIPPLING PPD, even psychosis due to their experience.  Really?  Crippling PPD?  Every single one?  Because I know that PPD is very common, but something tells me that if every woman who gave birth in a hospital became psychotic (rare), we'd know.   

 

 

The real kicker that brought me to hanging up the phone after telling her to stay away and not contact me was "delivery is the first tangible way you let you child know you love it, to take that away seems so damaging."

 

 

REALLY?

 

 

I am thrilled she had positive homebirthing experiences.  I have had friends who have had very positive hospital experiences as well.  I just don't get where it is "okay" for her to act like this.  I'm so mad that she took something I was excited to share with her and completely trashed it.

 

And I'm sorry.  Not eating sushi for nine months seems like a pretty darned tangible act of love!

 


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#2 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 06:21 AM
 
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You had me until this comment.  Really??

 

Quote:

And I'm sorry.  Not eating sushi for nine months seems like a pretty darned tangible act of love!

 

I am sorry your friend was so rude.


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#3 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 06:29 AM
 
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I'm with you on all counts, with a special "hell yeah," on the sushi.

 

I have had two babies in hospital.  I had PPD the second time, but I don't think the hospital birth was the causal factor.  I think having a crappy year overall, a complicated pregnancy, an obstetrical emergency, a baby in the NICU, and surgical recovery on top of it all may have somehow played into it.  Thousands and thousands of women have babies in hospitals every year, and very few are subsequently "crippled" by PPD.  Unless what your friend means by "crippled" is "had even the slightest merest whiff of a blue mood within two years of giving birth."  (PPD is quite serious stuff.  I'm not taking it lightly.  But crippling levels of any mental disorder are uncommon.)

 

If delivery were the first way I let my children know I love them, I would think that I would get some points for the five hours of pushing.  I would think that some credit would be available for getting my butt to the hospital by the fastest means possible for that emergent c/s, to make sure my daughter was safe.  But as it happens, I don't think that delivery is even on the list of ways I let my children know I love them.

 

You were totally right to hang up on that lady.  Those are some crazy ideas, and you do not need them in your life.

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#4 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 08:26 AM
 
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I had PPD after my HOMEBIRTH, even though it went well. I didn't bond with my DD for months afterwards. I've only had 1 HB, and won't be having one this time due to having twins. I can't risk it.

I totally hear you on everything you said. She had no right to say that to you. I hope she listens to you, and stays away.

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#5 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 08:39 AM
 
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Speaking as a mama who embraces many, but not all, aspects of AP-ing and natural "crunchy" parenting and who gave birth the first time at a midwife-staffed freestanding birth center and plans to do the same again...

 

Your "friend" reminds me of that character in "Away We Go"...the one that was the old friend of Bert's and became a university professor...."I love my babies!  Why would I want to push them away from me??" (in re. to strollers). 

 

Sounds like she's a source of negativity and needs to be kept out of your pregnancy.

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#6 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 08:49 AM
 
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I had a very positive all natural hospital birth with my first child.  I went on to have a very positive homebirth with my 2nd.  And while I did have a homebirth, it is possible to have a healthy positive hospital birth as well, and I would never speak to anyone the way that lady did about your birth.  I'm sorry you had to go through that.  Not all us "homebirthers" are like that.


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#7 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 08:51 AM
 
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I had two glorious, natural hospital births with my CNM. The baby slipped outta me and was put on my chest. The baby checks all done while baby was in my arms.. we were nursing in minutes. The baby never left my side. We were home 12-14 hours later both times. No post partum depression. My experiences were empowering and thoughtful and not the least bit sad.

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#8 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 09:26 AM
 
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Oh my!!  I really wish women would realize that judgmental statements like this do NOTHING at all to "further the cause" of homebirths or unmedicated births.  UUUGH.

 

No one has the same circumstances that you do and while I am not a big fan of OBs (after professionally defending them in med mal lawsuits for many years), they have a place in US maternity care.  And guess what... that gets to be your choice on what position they play.

 

On a side note -- I have never been told to give up sushi.  Never when I was with an OB practice or even now with my midwives.  Granted, I cut down on it, and mainly stuck to cooked stuff, but still never fully gave it up.  =)

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#9 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 09:37 AM
 
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I had my son in a hospital and used a regular OB all along.  My grandmother's mom died during her "homebirth"(I'm pretty sure it wasn't by choice) with her and preeclampsia runs in my family so I wasn't taking any chances.  I did end up with pre e at the end of the pregnancy and I'm glad I was in a hospital so that if something did go wrong, and I need a c sec or something, it could be done.  

 

I'm all for natural parenting and being AP, anti circ, antio CIO, and all of that.  If people are comfortable with having a homebirth, I think that's great and they should go for it.  But personally, I am way too paranoid.  Things can and do go wrong with pregnancies and I would much rather be safe than sorry.  Back 100 years or more ago, many these babies and moms who do have issues would have just not made it.  I'd rather have a c section than be in that situation.  Even if it's not common, I'd hate to be one of the statistics.  

 

I didn't have PPD.  The nurses at the hospital were all super nice and I never would have been able to breastfeed had it not been for one of the lactation consultants there helping me in the middle of the night when I couldn't get my baby to latch. She even met with me for a few weeks after because we had so many BFing issues. (He was early and had a very weak suck right off the bat).

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#10 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 09:39 AM
 
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ick, have to stay away from negative judgmental people. if you ever decide to stay friends (not sure why) or if she presses you as to what was wrong with her attitude, just ask her to think about all the negative comments that homebirthers get... she is doing exactly the same thing in reverse. (and I've had one HB and I'm planning another but I surely hope I wouldn't behave this way about any issue! Even the ones I feel strongly about...)

 

 

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#11 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 09:48 AM
 
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Your friend seems to be missing one of the major points of homebirth in the first place-putting the mother's choice first. It's ironic that she would argue your choice to birth in a hopspital!

 

I do understand her view, (and I myself would prefer a home birth)-but not to the point that she's taken it and insulted you with. I really wish people would be less militant with their opinions.

That, and it sounds like you've made an informed decision already. You've already stated why a homebirth wouldn't be best for you, and if your midwife agrees then you' ve probably made the right decision!

 

I liken this to the situations where a woman truly is unable to breastfeed, yet everyone feels the need to tell her that "breast is best", including medical professionals who haven't a clue on the woman's or baby's history, or the reasons that led them to not breastfeed etc.

 

People should keep their dang noses out of other people's business, because when it comes down to it, no woman is going to make a choice that she feels is going to jeopordize her baby's health. We all feel that the choices we make when it comes to delivery are for the best of the baby, regardless of what others think. -Whether that be the decision to birth in a hospital, birth centre, at home with a midwife or unattended.

 

A side note-I do tell a lot of people about the option to have a midwife and homebirths-only because so few people actually know about it. I feel like it's  a bit of a"gospel" that I need to share. Not to the point of one acheiving some form of delivery "salvation' and insisting that it's the only way...but I just want people to be informed. I'm really glad that someone told me that I have the option!

Again though...not to the point that your friend has taken it. argh.

 

P.S-My midwife and naturopath have given me the OK for sushi.lol (no tuna though, and not a lot of salmon -only due to the possible mercury content.) Their argument is that women in Japan have been eating sushi /raw fish for hundreds of years without problems. Same with goats cheese etc. I haven't actually had any because food just sounds awful right now...but i'm looking forward to it in a month or two when this SHOULD go away...lol.

Dang, too bad she didn't say the same thing about wine....

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#12 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 09:53 AM
 
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This sounds really frustrating, and I'm so sorry that you had such a negative experience with this person!  I know it is one thing when a stranger judges our personal birthing choices, but coming from someone you expected to support you and be excited for you sounds like a double blow.

 

I don't think it is EVER appropriate to tell someone how sorry you are for their birth choices or experiences.  My old boss had a daughter born with Downs Syndrome, and was so mystified why all the doctors and nurses kept telling them "I'm so sorry."  When we tell someone how they are supposed to feel, we're robbing them of their experience.  This couple was not sorry at all- they had all boys up until this point and were absolutely thrilled about their new daughter, even if she would be high needs.  If a woman plans on having a natural birth and ends up with an emergency c-section, it is still not appropriate to tell her you're sorry about her awful birth.  It IS approprite to let her know you support her and would love to hear about her experience if/when she's ready to share.  It is not appropriate to tell a woman planning a HB how irresponsible and reckless she's being for wanting a HB either. 

 

Research indicates that PPD is much lower in cases where a woman is EMPOWERED and VALIDATED in her choices and decisions, and especially when she feels confident that she made an informed and educated decision.  Even if you were to have a planned c-section and wanted all the bells and whistles and interventions that a hospital could offer, you (all women) still deserve to be respected for their decision if that is their choice.  Getting pressured into an unmedicated HB if your're not comfortable with that is just as harmful to the woman as getting pressured into unnecessary interventions.  If you feel confident and good about your choices, and go into the birth experience with a flexible attitude and ultimately trusting in the birth experience, no matter how it ends up, I think you WILL have a positive birth.  I think where a woman gives birth is less important than how she feels about it, and the support she has during the birth (her OB/midwife/partner/doula/family etc).

 

I'm sorry you were on the receiving end of these negative comments and uncool judgement.  I hope you're able to surround yourself with others who truly support you and help you feel supported!  This is your birth experience, and you are definitely the best judge of what is best for you. Good luck, Mamma!

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#13 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 10:01 AM
 
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Sounds like a jerk to me.

I'm hoping for a homebirth myself, but unless I ask for an opinion, I really don't want to know what anyone else thinks of that plan. I'm willing to tolerate a certain amount of well-intentioned inquiry - "Do you think that is safe? What happens if something goes wrong?" - but I'd be pretty annoyed if anyone tried to tell me I was making the wrong decision. Likewise, if I were planning a hospital birth, I could understand questions like "Aren't you worried about unnecessary interventions?" but telling someone that she is doing it all wrong is awfully presumptuous. Telling a type 1 diabetic that she doesn't have a legitimate reason to be in the hospital is just asinine.
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#14 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 10:24 AM
 
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Boo to your friend.

 

I had ds in the hospital and not a lick of PPD (AND I ended up going through some rough stuff with my (then) fiance (ds's bio dad) and ended up leaving him when ds was less than 2 months old so I'm sure I was a prime candidate for PPD).

 

A baby has no idea where it is born. Period. End of story. If I birth at home and hold the baby immediately then fine. If I birth in a hospital and hold the baby immediately- what's the difference? In 5 years the baby isn't going to say "I'm really not well adjusted because you gave birth to me in a hospital- why didn't you have me at home instead?" lol.gif

 

The hospital I will deliver at strongly encourages "rooming in" and will only take the baby to the nursery if really needed. It's not like you plan on pushing the baby out (or delivering via c-section) then giving no second thought to it, sitting in the nursery alone, crying, for a couple days until you take it home. It doesn't work that way. You will still have plenty of time to bond with the baby, no matter where or how you deliver.


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#15 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 01:09 PM
 
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Wow, what a jerk!! I think she's missing the point - that homebirth is supposed to make a mother more comfortable and safe-feeling. If you feel comfortable and safe with your choices even in a , gasp!, hospital than so be it. Sorry your 'friend' was so rude to you.

 

And, I know you know it to not be true, but I had two hospital births and have never had PPD.


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#16 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 04:51 PM
 
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You said you don't want a debate so I will spare you the details of my horrific homebirth at the hands of a negligent midwife.  I guess I'm old enough and experienced enough with birth by this point to just mentally or actually tell a person to screw off if they don't like how I'm going to proceed with my body and my baby.  Your friend is no friend if she speaks to you that way and is so arrogant.  Stay away and good riddance for her to be out of your life!

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#17 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 07:12 PM
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Ugh. I am so sorry.

 

T1D is not well understood in general, and some people in NFL circles aren't really able to grasp what it means when you don't fit into the mantra, "women have been doing this for thousands of years," because, you know, up until less than a hundred years ago, type 1's just plain died, usually before reaching childbearing age. We don't have that history.

 

If someone hasn't had anything pierce their bubble of health, it's really hard for them to understand what it's like to live with a real, live, life-threatening health condition. But that ignorance is no excuse for being rude. Good for you for telling her where to go. I am STUNNED at some of her comments.

 

As a fellow type 1, I'll tell you, DS' birth was hard in a lot of ways. I did feel like there was a stamp on my head, and it felt unfair and not always valid. It took me a while to get over the some of the attitudes I encountered and things that happened. BUT even though I had a very negative reaction (really seriously negative), first, I did get over it, and second, the further I go in the parenting journey, the less and less important it feels. Mother-child love is about so, so much more than birth. And, more importantly, LOTS of type 1's (and plenty of other women, too) have very happy, healthy births in hospitals. One of the best predictors of satisfaction with the birth process is alignment between you and your care provider, and it sounds like you have that, which is truly wonderful.

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#18 of 35 Old 03-22-2011, 07:58 PM
 
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Home doesn't really seem like the right place for someone on a titrated insulin drip, like many T1 diabetic women in labor.  Or for a baby with potential blood sugar adaptation issues.

Aren't you the very definition of "could benefit from that stuff that is often overkill for the average laboring woman"?

Gah!  I'm Livid for you!


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#19 of 35 Old 03-23-2011, 02:40 AM
 
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Everybody has already said what I was thinking, so I won't repeat.  Just wanted to offer more support and say that I also had a beautiful, natural, birth in the hospital and have no regrets about it at all.  

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#20 of 35 Old 03-23-2011, 03:07 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by StephandOwen View Post

A baby has no idea where it is born. Period. End of story. If I birth at home and hold the baby immediately then fine. If I birth in a hospital and hold the baby immediately- what's the difference? In 5 years the baby isn't going to say "I'm really not well adjusted because you gave birth to me in a hospital- why didn't you have me at home instead?" lol.gif

That's a good point. You know, I have never, not once for even a microsecond felt that my mother did me a disservice by having me in the hospital. eyesroll.gif
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#21 of 35 Old 03-23-2011, 06:17 AM
 
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Wow. Your 'friend' is definitely a big old bully!

 

Hard to imagine someone saying you're being tricked into believing that pregnancy is a condition requiring hospitalization- when HELLO- you have a condition that makes a hospital a smart place for you to bring your child in to the world since you already love them and want you and them to have as safe and healthy experience as possible. That condition is not your pregnancy, and for her to not recognize your legitimate concerns about t1 diabetes is plain ignorant.

 

Also- I know you're another one that has suffered through first tri, and it's hard to imagine a more powerful way to tell your child you care than suffering through months of regular puking and pure misery (this is at least what I'm going through, and I think you too!) I had never really thought of it that way until I was visiting my sister and her husband told my little baby nephew after I puked "see the things that mothers do for their babies because they love them sooooo much". It was a little thing that I thought was so sweet.

 

That lady sounds toxic, rude, and like a horrible listener! My mantra (also a bit of wisdom from my Bro-in-law):

DO NOT ENGAGE WITH THE CRAZIES.

 

Good luck and know you're doing the right thing for you no matter what someone else says!

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#22 of 35 Old 03-23-2011, 07:25 AM
 
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I have a former friend with that same condescending attitude towards hospital birth. And not just birth, but every aspect of pregnancy, birth and childcare that is not 100% natural, organic, AP and what have you. She is uber crunchy, which is fine if it works for her, but she continually tries to force her beliefs on other people, which is not fine at all. I will not be made to feel like a lesser person because I chose an epidural after 40 hours of labor. How and where I birth my child is entirely my decision. Her judgmental attitude and her steamroller tactics of sharing her beliefs are the reasons she is a former friend.

I don't appreciate "friends" making me feel like a moron ("Awww a hospital birth, poor you!") or a weakling ("Oh, you chose pain medication? You do know that women can give birth without any kind of pain medication at all, right? We've been doing it for millions of years.").

 

I had a hospital birth, with an epidural, with my oldest and I wouldn't have traded it for the world. The hospital was awesome, everybody was lovely, and the OB and nurse that were there during the delivery were so supportive, and absolutely wonderful. Some scary stuff happened and I am positive that if she had been born at home, she would not have lived. She had no heartbeat and wasn't breathing (due to the chord being wrapped around her shoulder, keeping her from descending). The OB had to call in the NICU team. Her first APGAR was 2. 

 

My point (and yes, I do have one lol): your friend, like my former friend, is a sanctimonious twit. She is the kind of woman that gives homebirthers everywhere a lousy reputation. 


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#23 of 35 Old 03-23-2011, 07:30 AM
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Jane, I don't want to derail livacreature's thread, but please see spinoff thread here.

 

 

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mainebirdgirl View Post

 

My mantra (also a bit of wisdom from my Bro-in-law):

DO NOT ENGAGE WITH THE CRAZIES.

 

Good luck and know you're doing the right thing for you no matter what someone else says!

 

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#24 of 35 Old 03-23-2011, 08:02 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Snugglebugmom View Post

 

My point (and yes, I do have one lol): your friend, like my former friend, is a sanctimonious twit. She is the kind of woman that gives homebirthers everywhere a lousy reputation. 



LOL i love this line. "sanctimonious twit"...that' rocks.

 


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#25 of 35 Old 03-23-2011, 08:18 AM
 
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I tend to be very subtle when I'm ticked off. orngbiggrin.gif


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#26 of 35 Old 03-23-2011, 01:12 PM
 
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Just my two: Your friend's approach was certainly not one of love and acceptance. Her approach was filled with guilt and judgement which just doesn't go far in my books!

 

I do agree with her however, that we "give birth" to our babies-in that we actually give their birth to them as our first gift-birth as a noun. That doesn't mean however, that every hospital birth is a "bad gift". I just think it's about being aware and doing everything you can to create an environment of love and bonding for those first few hours. There are many many ways you can accomplish this even with a C-section.

 

I don't think any baby would vote for their mother to be at risk of serious injury or death in order to have "the perfect" birth-so doing what will keep you safe, and reassure you in your health care needs is very important.

 

(hugs)


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#27 of 35 Old 04-25-2011, 10:43 AM
 
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As a fellow type 1, I've experienced the judgment of those who feel that they are "more natural then thou," when they just can't understand the choices that someone with a chronic illness like this faces. You've made a choice with the best intentions and information you have.


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#28 of 35 Old 04-25-2011, 12:07 PM
 
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I too, will be having a "hospital birth" because I am very high risk and I feel much, much more comfortable having my baby in a Birth Center affiliated with a hospital delivered by an OB, near a NICU and Perinatologist. I think it's great for women who want home births to have them and I respect their choices. I think people like us, who want hospital births especially if they feel it's in the best interest of them or their baby/babies, deserve the same respect. The only way I am having a home birth is if Baby Valentine decides to make a lightning fast appearance, hahah. 

 

That being said, your friend seems to be riding a "holier than thou" wave and I don't think there's anything you'll be able to do to get her off of it. I don't know if she's so much bullying you as she is demeaning you, your knowledge, and personal preferences for a very special time in your life. She's not a friend. I could understand if she approached you with "Would you like to see if a homebirth would be possible for you? I can help you research or can put you in touch with someone that would be a great resource for you." But she didn't. Nothing she said was constructive or supportive. 

 

As far as what she actually said, I think their are great doctors and not so great doctors. Same with hospitals, birth centers, and birth experiences. I think her use of "ALWAYS" and "NEVER" shows just how arrogant and ignorant she it. I could use my personal experiences to directly contradict her but I won't. She's not worth it. I will say though that all of mine have been hospital births and I never once experienced PPD.


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#29 of 35 Old 04-25-2011, 01:05 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by ~pi View Post


Jane, I don't want to derail livacreature's thread, but please see spinoff thread here.

 

 

 

yeahthat.gif
 

 


Yes, do not engage with people who indulge in maternal oneupmanship. It's not worth the aggravation.

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#30 of 35 Old 04-25-2011, 03:40 PM
 
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Hugs to you, livacreature!  What a drag to have to defend your decision.  Bah to your friend.  Who does not sound very friendish to me.


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