Karen Strange and/or Ricci Bohaboy NRP classes? - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 17 Old 06-17-2010, 05:37 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Hi there!

I'm preparing to become a mw asst (for hb) and am wondering about the NRP classes offered by Karen Strange and Ricci Bohaboy (LM in FL).

Has anyone taken either of these? Anyone done both?

How prepared did you feel afterward and why? Would you recommend to others?

I'd love to hear thoughts and experiences that anyone is willing to offer.

Thanks so much!
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#2 of 17 Old 06-17-2010, 06:18 PM
 
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I've taken the one by Karen but not the other one so I can't compare. I would definitely recommend Karen's class. She talks about so much more than resus. and has a lot of good info. I really think every midwife should take her class even if they take other resus classes as well.

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#3 of 17 Old 06-17-2010, 07:38 PM
 
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I was able to attend a lecture Karen Strange gave for doulas when she was in Rochester and I loved it. She is a captivating speaker.

Midwife (CPM, LDM) and homeschooling mama to:
13yo ds   10yo dd  8yo ds and 6yo ds and 1yo ds  
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#4 of 17 Old 06-17-2010, 11:26 PM
 
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I have to vote for Karen as well! Attended two of her sessions at Trust Birth and she really knocked my socks off!

For My Website, Blog & Primal Pregnancy Tips: See my Profile Page!

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#5 of 17 Old 06-17-2010, 11:46 PM
 
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Another vote for Karen. I have taken her NRP four times. Don't miss it!
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#6 of 17 Old 06-18-2010, 12:28 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Wow- so good to hear so many good things about her!

I'd still love to hear any experiences about Ricci Bohaboy. Anyone?

Thanks, everyone!
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#7 of 17 Old 06-18-2010, 12:32 AM
 
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I can only comment on Karen Strange... I took her class recently in
PA, and loved it, it is so much more than a neonatal resus class, I highly recommend her
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#8 of 17 Old 06-18-2010, 03:41 PM
 
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I'm also only able to comment on Karen's class. I've taken it three times and it is awesome every time. She's said that she is not going to be traveling much after this year, so you should take it now since you might not have another opportunity.
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#9 of 17 Old 06-21-2010, 10:22 PM
 
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I have taken Ricci's class and loved it. Not only is she a CPM, but she is a nurse and was a respiratory therapist for 30 years. She doesn't just give you the NRP info but also goes into equipment maintenance and knowing how long your supply will last etc. She is very patient and gives you LOTS of hands on time which I prefer.
As far as Karen's class, I have not personally taken it. I know I am swimming against the stream here, but I have heard people talk about some of the things that she advocates and I feel 1. it is unsafe and 2. depending on if you are in a licensure state if you did some of what she teaches you could very well lose your license or risk prosecution (i.e. waiting for 1 minute before beginning resuscitation etc.) So I have never had any interest in her class.

Monique, CPM and Florida LM. Proud momma to 6 boys with 1 more on the way; wife to Shane my best friend.

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#10 of 17 Old 06-22-2010, 03:15 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by preciouspkgs View Post
As far as Karen's class, I have not personally taken it. I know I am swimming against the stream here, but I have heard people talk about some of the things that she advocates and I feel 1. it is unsafe and 2. depending on if you are in a licensure state if you did some of what she teaches you could very well lose your license or risk prosecution (i.e. waiting for 1 minute before beginning resuscitation etc.) So I have never had any interest in her class.
I must say that I don't believe that Karen anything teaches in her class is unsafe. She presents evidence based care which sometimes is not in line with what the AAP teaches. She makes it clear anytime she teaches something that is not AAP and also presents their stance on it.

For example, Karen has taught for years that it is preferable resuscitate a baby with room air rather than O2 because 1) O2 hasn't been shown to have better outcomes, and 2) Excess O2 causes free radicals and cell damage. She cites research and standards from other countries to support that teaching. And wouldn't you know, she's been teaching it for years and the AAP looks like they're going to revise their standards with the next publication of the NRP text to resuscitate with room air rather than O2.

As with any class you take or anything you learn as a practitioner, you have to make informed decisions about the application of your skills. I think that Karen is a fine and valuable instructor. Not teaching by the book does not make poor educator, especially when she specifies what she's teaching differently. And, doesn't it say something about the level of evidence she uses when she's at least 6 or 7 years ahead of the curve?
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#11 of 17 Old 06-27-2010, 11:11 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LauraCochran View Post
As with any class you take or anything you learn as a practitioner, you have to make informed decisions about the application of your skills. I think that Karen is a fine and valuable instructor. Not teaching by the book does not make poor educator, especially when she specifies what she's teaching differently. And, doesn't it say something about the level of evidence she uses when she's at least 6 or 7 years ahead of the curve?
Laura,
as i stated in my post I have never personally taken karen's class so i am going on hearsay. specifically I am speaking to her stance of teaching no resuscitation efforts of any sort for the first minute while you are apologizing to baby that you have to do it. Again, this is hearsay but I have heard this particular bit from a variety of people who have taken her class. In my opinion this is an unsafe practice. If she has evidence and studies to back it up, I would have to review and then possibly change my opinion. I have not nor would I say she isn't a good educator, as I have no in person experience to base that on. I never said not teaching by the book makes someone a poor educator.

Monique, CPM and Florida LM. Proud momma to 6 boys with 1 more on the way; wife to Shane my best friend.

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#12 of 17 Old 06-27-2010, 10:11 PM
 
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JUST took Ms. Strange's class a week ago last Friday.

I guess I must have attended a different training than her critics did.

That's all I can say.

CD Labor/Postpartum (MSTM), Doula trainer (BAI), Midwifery Student/Apprentice, CPS Tech
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#13 of 17 Old 06-28-2010, 12:32 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Joyce, so you also liked it and got a lot out of it? Did her info mesh with your understanding of the immediate post-partum care of the newborn, or if not, was it sufficiently compelling to make you consider changing your practices?

I would have to travel a good bit to take her class, and probably could take the other one (Ricci's) cheaper, but want to make the best choice possible.


Thanks again everyone, for sharing your views and experiences!
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#14 of 17 Old 07-01-2010, 07:04 PM
 
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I can only say yes, I liked it and got a lot out of it. Karen presented what is supposed to be taught at a neonatal resuscitation class... PLUS more!

I'd love to take that other training also at some point too.

Do your will.


CD Labor/Postpartum (MSTM), Doula trainer (BAI), Midwifery Student/Apprentice, CPS Tech
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#15 of 17 Old 07-02-2010, 01:32 AM
 
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I'm a bit late, but I'll weigh in for posterity!

I have actually taken both Karen Strange's (in Nov 2008) and Ricci Bohaboy's (June 2010) NRP trainings. I felt that Karen's presentation was geared in a more customized way toward home birth midwifery. She definitely puts together a package of information about resuscitation in the context of the baby's experience of birth and does not worry too much about presenting American NRP by the book. She incorporates parts of British Newborn Life Support, research from other realms (on neonatal psychology, maternal psychology, etc), and birth trauma healing methodology, all in a one day training.

My impression was that Karen wanted us to be calm, centered, and communicating with the baby while performing resuscitation, not "apologizing" before starting! For babies that are vigorous, just not breathing, she did advocate waiting a moment before jumping in with the routine care. It isn't my impression that it applied to babies in obvious distress (limp, pale, etc). I am one of those people who believes that the baby IS a sentient being, even exquisitely sensitive, so treating the baby as a participant in his or her own resuscitation isn't a foreign idea. Some midwives who were in my training with Karen did scoff at all the focus on the baby's experience (ie, "It's going to be so much better than at the hospital anyway, don'tcha know!")

Ricci, though a home birth midwife, has a long history of working in medical settings, and teaches the material as packaged by NRP (even using the video provided). I also got the impression that she sees oxygen as a great good (she added in oxygen therapy for our group--how to choose and use oxygen equipment properly), whereas Karen seemed to downplay the importance of oxygen. With Ricci we did practice a wider range of interventions (infant bulb suctioning, DeLee suctioning, infant O2 mask use, and orogastric tube), and someone in our group also certified to do intubation because Ricci was able to supervise it. However, Ricci had only two manikins for our group, meaning 3-4 people were sharing a manikin (vs 1-2trainees/ CPR manikin in Karen's much larger class). However, one of Ricci's babies was an actual NRP manikin, which could be intubated/DeLee suctioned, etc, which was useful. I don't know if Ricci has more manikins and just didn't bring them. I also felt that the time management aspect of Ricci's training was off. We spent too much time watching the videos together, going over the material step-by-step, and less time than I would have liked practicing with the manikins, even though it was a 2 day training!

In short, I felt Ricci did a fine job of training midwives to do resuscitation by NRP standards thoroughly and accurately. Karen's class, however, was deeply enlightening, far beyond what one would expect of an NRP training.
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#16 of 17 Old 07-02-2010, 11:30 PM
 
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Originally Posted by preciouspkgs View Post
Laura,
as i stated in my post I have never personally taken karen's class so i am going on hearsay. specifically I am speaking to her stance of teaching no resuscitation efforts of any sort for the first minute while you are apologizing to baby that you have to do it. Again, this is hearsay but I have heard this particular bit from a variety of people who have taken her class. In my opinion this is an unsafe practice. If she has evidence and studies to back it up, I would have to review and then possibly change my opinion. I have not nor would I say she isn't a good educator, as I have no in person experience to base that on. I never said not teaching by the book makes someone a poor educator.
Not just hearsay, but rank falsehoods. As I stated, I have taken the class four times over 8 years. She has NEVER said any such thing. Complete BS from start to finish. And she has TONS of documentation for everything she says in class. I think you should delete every one of your posts since you have zero personal experience of it and what you are saying is outright slander/libel.
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#17 of 17 Old 07-04-2010, 01:34 AM
 
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Originally Posted by homewithtwinsmama View Post
I think you should delete every one of your posts since you have zero personal experience of it and what you are saying is outright slander/libel.
As someone said above Karen apparently advocates waiting a moment for vigorous babies (not ones in distress so thats great). AND that some people in the class apparently thought she spent too much time on the babies experience. OBVIOUSLY the people who have given me their OPINION of the class and what they heard while in it - were of that mien. I am not slandering, as I stated in my op and every one since I HAVE NOT TAKEN KAREN'S CLASS! The original poster asked for opinions, I gave mine for having taken Ricci's class, and what I had heard of Karen's class that is all. I then clarified where my remarks were coming from admitting they were from hearsay. So..not slander. Nor is there a reason for you to attack me. I am glad to hear that isn't what Karen actually says.
Since apparently not having an opinion that Karen's class is awesome and amazing isn't welcome here I will no longer post here.
Thanks

Monique, CPM and Florida LM. Proud momma to 6 boys with 1 more on the way; wife to Shane my best friend.

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