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#121 of 223 Old 11-14-2011, 12:12 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mittens View Post

Starrlight, sorry about the temp spike, but to try to give you a little hope, the same thing happened to me this month and FF chart at first said i o'd on cd 10. i KNEW it was wrong and waited it out to see how my temps went after a few days and then FF changed my o date to cd 13, which i knew was wrong, too and THEN today FF changed my o date to cd 14, which i know is right! so, maybe something like this will turn out for you as well.

Neither the software on FF or TCOYF has said I ovulated, because without a + OPK, it'll take another 3 days to confirm I ovulated. I'm really hoping it's just a fluke. Thanks for sharing your experience. Did FF tell you ON CD 10 that you Oed? or did it wait until several days later? I'm looking at your chart and it still says CD 11.

 

I never dreamed BFing would complicate charting so much! ;)


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#122 of 223 Old 11-14-2011, 02:21 PM
 
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Starrlight, that's strange, when i look at my chart it says i'm on CD 17, 3dpo, and that i ovulated on CD 14.

hmmmm....

 

To answer your question, it told me days after cd 10 that i o'd on that day, then the next day or two it changed to cd 13, then today it changed to a permanent line for O on cd 14.


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#123 of 223 Old 11-14-2011, 03:17 PM
 
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Mittens - LOL I was looking at the date, rather than the cycle day! Oops! whistling.gif


toddler.gif Stephanie - Wife to trekkie.gif and Mom to Baby Bubo ecbaby2.gif

 

Oh, yeah, we femalesling.GIF , cd.gif familybed1.gif, have two cat.gif, and we're loving life!

 

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#124 of 223 Old 11-14-2011, 03:20 PM
 
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babymae I'm sorry I can't be much help to you! I don't know what it could be, and I have the opposite problem of long cycles + a late O.

 

starrlight I hope that temp was just disturbed for you and you can still try this month!

 

gardenbelle Sorry AF found you!

 

AFM I think I probably O today or will very soon. I got positive OPKs yesterday afternoon and evening. I haven't tested today b/c things have been crazy. We BDed (baby danced) last night luckily and hopefully will again tonight. I thought this cycle might be a bust since my husband has been working about 18 hours a day, but now I have hope! Move me to the TWW, please!


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#125 of 223 Old 11-15-2011, 08:51 AM
 
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Well, it looks like yesterday's temp was a disturbed temp after all. Yay!! It might have something to do with my swollen hand and a wasp sting. My temp is back down this morning, and last night I had a bit of egg white, so hopefully it'll be here soon. Still no + OPKs, though.

 

 

UPDATE: I got a + OPK!!!!!!!! :-D


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#126 of 223 Old 11-15-2011, 10:24 AM
 
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AWESOME!!


My BFP chart: http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/389e31

Me (40) DH (37) DD (24months) still breastfeeding around the clock. Planning another home birth with our second, due in September.

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#127 of 223 Old 11-15-2011, 03:30 PM
 
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QUESTION: Have any of you mamas ever used progesterone cream under the direction of a doctor or midwife? I've read that you're supposed to stop taking it once AF shows or you get a BFP. If we're nursing mothers, stopping the cream won't cause a miscarriage will it? I believe it was on KellyMom.com that I read once implantation takes place, nursing no longer affects fertility. So since implantation takes place BEFORE you would get a BFP, it follows all would be well. Correct? Thanks for your input.


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#128 of 223 Old 11-15-2011, 05:02 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Starlight -- Not sure if this answers your question, and I claim no expertise, but I am also active on the fertilityfriend message boards, and one of the mamas in my group is a CNM, and she wrote this to me about the topical progesterone cream: 

One thing you MUST keep in mind though, is that if you begin topical progesterone and you become pregnant, you MUST faithfully continue using it until you are 10-12 weeks pregnant (I'd go with 12 to be safe) when the placenta takes over production. If you were to stop using the cream, or even miss a few days, you could inadvertently cause a miscarriage. 

 

I had never heard this before.  I think it would be worth a call to your obgyn/midwife? 

 

And so glad you got that +OPK!!!  Hope you get some good BDing in tonight!


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#129 of 223 Old 11-15-2011, 06:09 PM
 
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So what do you think, is it better to skip the progesterone cream in the first place and just wait until my luteal phase is back to normal (and possibly waste this cycle, if it's not)? I actually have no idea if it's normal or not, since this is my first PP cycle. I guess I'm just afraid that when I get pregnant and go see an OB, s/he'll chew me out for using OTC progesterone cream. Silly...I know. I just hate getting belittled by doctors. I personally have no qualms about using it, just curious what other mamas think or have done. Thanks!


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#130 of 223 Old 11-15-2011, 07:31 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Starlight -- I know what you mean! Have you routinely had short luteal phases before you conceived? I have never had short luteal phases before, so I know it's due to nursing.  I think it's so common for bfing women to have short luteal phases that I don't see how or why your OB would belittle you, especially if you have evidence of a short luteal phase from your first PP cycle.  That said, I bet it's also likely that your luteal phase will lengthen naturally at some point. So, to me both options seem totally rational.  

 

Another push for me to use the progesterone is that creams like the Progestelle seem to be entirely natural -- only derived from yams and coconut oil for a base, so it doesn't seem terrible to me :)

 

I'm going to be trying it for the first time this cycle...!   


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#131 of 223 Old 11-15-2011, 08:08 PM
 
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I think (but would hope not) that an OB might belittle a patient for "self medicating." I am going to my OB Thursday for my annual and keep trying to decide if a discussion about me trying to conceive while breastfeeding is a good idea or not. I feel pretty confident that I'm doing what I need to do (taking B6 and using NPC after O) and don't feel like he would have any info to offer me that I don't already know. I will also get irritated if he even suggests I wean or cut back on nursing. My nursing relaionship is for me and my DD to decide.

 

I have also heard that if you start NPC you need to continue using it until the placenta takes over production in the second trimester, then gradually wean from it. Stopping use before then, even as early as when you get a BFP, can cause a miscarriage because of the drop in the hormone. When I talked with Dr. Eckhart before ordering the Progestelle, he too told me not to miss even one day using the cream b/c of the risk of miscarriage. He made sure to tell me not to let it run out, order early!

 

I agree with moonstones that your LP will probably lengthen on its own at some point, but who knows when that point might be? I personally decided to use B6 and NPC to help lengthen my LP more quickly, but make the right decision for you, starrlight. If I were in your situation I would wait one or two cycles to see where my LP was at before considering using something to lengthen it. But I can see your view that the first cycles may be "a waste" if your LP isn't long enough to sustain a pregnancy.

 

moonstones, I am looking forward to hearing how Progestelle works for you!


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#132 of 223 Old 11-15-2011, 09:35 PM
 
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Natural progesterone cream (NPC) is outstanding for a short luteal phase!!!! After DS2, (not using NPC) my first PP cycle had a 3 day luteal phase. I just had my first PP cycle after DD and I had a full 9 day LP because of using NPC. I'm using emerita but I also really like ProgesterALL. emerita is really economical though if you buy it through amazon and do subscribe and save. :) Regardless of brand, make sure to look for natural, bioidentical and paraben free. 

 

During the LP, the average woman has approx 24-30mgs of progesterone in her system. I try to take around 25 mgs on NPC during my LP to help extend it. I use 1/8 tsp in the morning and 1/4 tsp at night. Rotate what area you put it on at each application (so if you put it on your left inner thigh in the morning, put in on your chest at night). You can put it on any part of the body but *some* say it absorbs better in thin skinned areas. I prefer using it on inner thighs and lower abdomen.

 

I'm pretty confident that next month my LP will  be long enough to sustain pregnancy. I too have never had a short LP, it's only from breastfeeding. I love that with NPC I'm able to keep nursing safely and also get pregnant! :) 


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#133 of 223 Old 11-16-2011, 08:29 AM
 
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I think I will go ahead and talk to DH about the NPC, but chances are he'll just tell me to do whatever I want. I think I will probably go ahead and use the NPC. I ovulated before my first PPAF, and if I got the O date right, my luteal phase is only 7 days. (It may be a tad off, because I hadn't been temping until I suddenly got EWCF.) I never had short LPs before, so I know it's from the nursing. I've been sleeping in total darkness for lunaception, so hopefully that will help, too. I have the Emerita brand of NPC in the pre-measured doses. I like the idea of not having to guess on the dose. winky.gif Unfortunately, DS was up ALL night nursing, so my temp is probably off today. I'll see what an OPK says later.


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#134 of 223 Old 11-16-2011, 01:06 PM
 
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Just checking in again here. I'm on CD 35 (not temping this month due to general weirdness after the early m/c last cycle, misplacing my thermometer, and now just rolling with it). I am doing OPK's and checking CF, though. Still no + OPK, though I've had fertile CF and just almost positives -- close, but no cigar. It'd be nice to have the temps as another measure, but I'm hoping it's all moot smile.gif

babymae - I had a very short cycle (25 days) with a shortish LP (9 days) immediately coming of of birth control when we were TTC my daughter. TTC this time around, though, I've had really frustratingly long cycles and delayed O. What do you think is interfering with your cycles?

starrlight97 - Congrats on the positive OPK and good luck with the NPC!

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#135 of 223 Old 11-16-2011, 02:50 PM
 
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Hi all!

Well I did end up getting AF on day 35.  So I guess it's back to stay since I've had two.  My usual cycles are 28 or 29 days though.  Now that there is a chance that I am fertile, my feelings are mixed.  I do want another baby, but DD4 is only 6 months old. I don't mind babies close in age, but I don't want to compromise my milk supply.  I've nursed through 3 pregnancies before, but I really want to be sure I can continue to pump enough at work (3 days) to keep her fed at home. 

I also feel really good!  I feel better right now than I have in 7 years.  I'm 20 pounds lighter than before I was pregnant with DD4. (I've lost 55 pounds since her birth.) We have lots of travel planned next year and it would be nice to feel good and go on rollercoasters and stuff like that!  I'm totally torn between wanting to try ASAP and waiting for a year.  So for now, leave me in "waiting to be ready."  I can't stop coming back to the mothering boards though and what do you bet I get the OPKs out in a couple weeks!

I'm wishing you all the best in your TTC!


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#136 of 223 Old 11-16-2011, 08:18 PM
 
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Mittens: Thanks for the info I will definitely be reading it!

 

Geigeirn: I completely understand. I did the same!

 

Moonstones: Thank your for all of your encouraging words! I agree that i might just need patience... though no one ever likes that! haha :) I'm getting better!

 

Stellamia: I will look into that. Very interesting. I'm kinda up for anything! My luteal phase is around 11 days so that sounds like it might be it. :( I tried Vitex but it did bad things to me!

 

AFM: CD13. It kinda snuck up on me. Looks like i need to pull out the OPKs. I'm not overly hopeful though. We will see. All in due time! I'm just trying to kinda take a break and breathe a little more. We can only do what we can do. 

 

Good luck to everyone!

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#137 of 223 Old 11-16-2011, 09:55 PM
 
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Checking in guys. I read through everyone's posts and I don't have any specific advice to give to anyone, just a general sprinkling of baby dust!! dust.gif

 

AFM, I'm doing the clomid this cycle, 50 mg of CD 3-7. I'm also using the fertility monitor since I'm not being monitored (I was given the option to "give it a try"). I'm on CD 16. Its really late here, technically CD 17, but I haven't gone to bed so it doesn't count. I started testing CD 9 and got my first "high" CD 10. I can somewhat "read" the sticks and I can tell the estrogen line is getting lighter and lighter (which means my estrogen is getting higher and higher) but still no peak. I know from research clomid gives you more highs than usual on the monitor, but I was told to expect to O 5-9 days after taking the clomid, so if thats the case I don't think its going to happen. On CD 10 I started taking robitussin (only active ingredient guaifenesin) just incase the clomid caused CM problems, but so far things have been great there. Not sure if its the cough syrup helping or not. I get so frustrated pulling the sticks out of the monitor and seeing those 2 bars. I want a third bar!! I'm having sore ovaries like I had around ovulation time the last 2 cycles, but I chalked those up to cysts caused by really late ovulation (or what I thought was ovulation). My midwife was really vague when she called me with my ultrasound results about those a few months ago, and that really frustrates me sometimes. I can handle details. I'm not going to reply with "huh!?".

 

DS and I have been sick with just a basic cold so I've felt kinda "beat" just from congestion. I had a serious discussion with DH about "giving up" tonight. Its been almost 8 months and things have been really really off with my cycles since the m/c in July. His mom has been acting super needy, causing alot of stress, and money has been super tight since we bought this house in September and medical bills just keep showing up and Christmas is coming. We have so many things we want to do with our new house and I'd like to take DS on a vacation. In a few months we should be back on track with money and we can start thinking about those things, and I can focus energy on something I have "control" over. DH said if we stopped trying that he'd want to start using protection because he didn't want to spend a bunch of money on new carpet or furniture then "surprise" a baby and we are broke again with more medical bills because we didn't plan for it. How ironic that would be. I just kinda laughed at the thought of a "surprise" after trying so hard. I know 8 months is not a long time in comparison to the bitter-sushi ladies, and I'm young and we have a young child, but for my little world its hard to deal with. We ended the discussion with that he really doesn't want to stop trying. The next step is to try a high dose of clomid so I guess thats what we'll do next. I really don't know what to do, but he feels firmly about this so we'll go with it.


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#138 of 223 Old 11-17-2011, 07:03 AM
 
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Hi Everyone -

 

I am on CD15 and on my fifth day of EWCM.  My temp went up a bit today, so I think today may be O, but I am not 100% sure.  Here is my chart if you want to check it out. [url=http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/32d812/]My Ovulation Chart[/url]  We are going to try to DTD again today.  I feel like by the time O gets here I am so tired of DTD!  It would have been a lot easier getting pregnant in my early 20s when I could DTD 3 times a day and still enjoy it!!


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#139 of 223 Old 11-17-2011, 08:46 AM
 
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Things aren't going too well here. As Ava's Mama intimated, I am getting weary of DTD, too. We've been at it for several days now, and the OPKs went from + to - yesterday and I think I dried up, but I didn't get the temp spike this morning. It may very well be a disturbed temp, since DS was frickin' UP ALL NIGHT last night. I am NOT a happy camper today. I am pretty well frustrated, to say the least. I even thought I had O pains yesterday, so why the heck is my temp still down?? Anyone have any ideas? I thought for sure we were doing well. *sigh*


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#140 of 223 Old 11-17-2011, 10:01 AM
 
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Hey everyone, just checking in. I'm at cd 15, and should hopefully O on cd 17 again. I've had lots of EWCM, so that's a plus, and DH has be cooperative on the DTD front. Hopefully he won't get tired of it for another couple days.

 

I was hoping to get some personals done, but DD has decided my computer time is up this morning.lol.gif  So I'll just send fertility vibes to everyone!


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#141 of 223 Old 11-17-2011, 11:55 AM - Thread Starter
 
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starlight -- you had a slight rise, no? it could just be that you'll have a gradual rise, particularly given the other signs -- no more EWCM and negative OPK.  


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#142 of 223 Old 11-17-2011, 12:02 PM
 
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Moonstones - Thanks for your response. Yes, I did have a 0.2 degree rise. I tell you what! Getting used to my cycle being soooo different from everything I've ever had is a bit frustrating! I never imagined my cycle would be so changed. shrug.gif

 

BTW, a slow rise doesn't mean progesterone deficient, does it?


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#143 of 223 Old 11-17-2011, 06:35 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by texasfarmom View Post

I think (but would hope not) that an OB might belittle a patient for "self medicating." I am going to my OB Thursday for my annual and keep trying to decide if a discussion about me trying to conceive while breastfeeding is a good idea or not. I feel pretty confident that I'm doing what I need to do (taking B6 and using NPC after O) and don't feel like he would have any info to offer me that I don't already know. I will also get irritated if he even suggests I wean or cut back on nursing. My nursing relaionship is for me and my DD to decide.

 

 

 



Well, I did go to my OB today. I brought up TTC, BIG MISTAKE. Just...not good. What do they learn in medical school anyway? Ok, I'm too tired and irritated to write a long vent right now (lucky for ya'll! lol.gif).

 

2 DPO...yay!

 


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#144 of 223 Old 11-17-2011, 09:00 PM - Thread Starter
 
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texasfarmom -- now I'm super curious.  Spill the beans -- what did s/he say?  Are ob/gyns really that anti-breastfeeding when TTC?  


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#145 of 223 Old 11-17-2011, 09:02 PM - Thread Starter
 
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starlight -- I don't think a gradual rise in temp is related to progesterone deficiency, but I honestly don't really know!  Maybe others will be able to chime in...

 

ETA: I bet FF will give you crosshairs on CD21 after a few more days of temps.  


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#146 of 223 Old 11-18-2011, 12:59 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by crystal_buffaloe View Post

babymae - I had a very short cycle (25 days) with a shortish LP (9 days) immediately coming of of birth control when we were TTC my daughter. TTC this time around, though, I've had really frustratingly long cycles and delayed O. What do you think is interfering with your cycles?

 

I'm not sure, but this cycle was a day longer than any cycle recently, so I think maybe the drop in times that DD is nursing each day might have something to do with it. Also, she stopped night nursing completely just a few weeks ago.

 

Another thing that's new is that I've been taking Garden of Life Raw Probiotics (their bend for Women), and I feel like it's helping me a lot. It has all kinda of vitamins and minerals in it, which has to help, but besides that, the women's formula is designed to help with not only the colon and digestive issues, but also fungus and bacteria in the vagina as well. It can also help with candida yeast, which I've read can affect the LP as well. You can buy their women's blend on Amazon for $35 with no shipping costs. I don't know if they cold-ship it, though, and since it's raw that might be a big deal. I get mine at my local market for $40 (they have a $5 off cupon that's good until June hanging there).

 

I'm going to see my mid-wife (who works in an OB's office) to get a full work-up on the 2nd. I'll let everyone know how it goes.

 

Fertility vibes to everybody :)


Me,yummy.gif   DS, Peace.gif and DDdust.gif Grateful to the baby I lost for sticking around long enough to teach me what I needed to know so badly  candle.gif  We  love our forest valley home, our goats and chickenschicken3.gif, and wild harvested food-medicine coolshine.gif

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#147 of 223 Old 11-18-2011, 07:03 AM
 
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CD21 here in a usually 28 day cycle, but who knows right now with the increased breastfeeding....

 

 

Wondered if anyone who likes to look at charts would mind having a look at mine http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/389e31 ? This is my first cycle charting, and i'm wondering if i should be a little concerned that since ovulation my temps have only gone up up up. I thought they go up and down above the cover line, not only up. And what could temps only going up be indicative of? Thanks for having a look!


My BFP chart: http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/389e31

Me (40) DH (37) DD (24months) still breastfeeding around the clock. Planning another home birth with our second, due in September.

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#148 of 223 Old 11-18-2011, 08:34 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Mittens View Post
Wondered if anyone who likes to look at charts would mind having a look at mine http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/389e31 ? This is my first cycle charting, and i'm wondering if i should be a little concerned that since ovulation my temps have only gone up up up. I thought they go up and down above the cover line, not only up. And what could temps only going up be indicative of? Thanks for having a look!


Wow, Mittens! GREAT chart! Temps going up is exactly what you want. Progesterone increases after ovulation and causes temps to increase. A continued increase in temps can also be indicative of pregnancy. A few more days and you should know for sure!!

 

AFM - My temp went up a little more today, so it's finally above the coverline! Yay! FF still hasn't pinpointed an O date, but, as a PP said, after a few higher temps, it should assign a date. I sure hope so! Does anyone else chart on "Taking Charge of Your Fertility?" The whole sight has been wonky the last two days. Just wondering if it's just me.

 

I talked to DH last night about NPC, and he didn't seem all that happy about it. He doesn't want me dependent on something unnatural to keep the pregnancy. I told him it's bioidentical and I'm NOT going to forget to use it. I was fairly surprised he cared at all, and he's never been one for all  natural. Go figure.

 

QUESTION: I'm supposed to confirm ovulation before starting NPC. How many days do you ladies plan to wait? It's taking longer for me to confirm than I'm used to, so I guess I'm just anxious and don't want to mess things up.

 

 


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#149 of 223 Old 11-18-2011, 08:46 AM
 
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**Vent-no obligation to read** winky.gif

 

Thinking about my OB visit yesterday still frustrates me and exhausts me so much. I didn't even get to ask most of my TTC questions beacuae I was so frustrated and incredulous at what he was saying anyways.

 

First off, I have never and will never use artificial birth control. It is against my beliefs. Make a note of that in my chart! So the visit starts, "You are not using any kind of birth control?" "No, we are trying to conceive." "No...condoms, or natural means or anything?" "Well, I've been charting my cm, and I've always used NFP." "So, do you at least keep track of when your period began, and when your next one begins?" eyesroll.gif I thought that was implied.

 

So I wanted to ask him a specific question about OPKs that I told him I've been using. I didn't get to ask because he said I really didn't need to use those expensive things anyway. He said I would O 14 days before the start of my next period.  Well 14 is an AVERAGE, and is not true for all people. I explained to him my cycle lengths have been varying which is probably due to bfing.  "Well when a woman has a 28 day cycle she will O on CD 14, but if the cycle is 29 days long she will O on CD 15." UGH! That is based on an AVERAGE and not true for all people. I go on to explain I usually O later than that, bfing or not. "Well, your LP will still be 14 days." "Well, mine was short before DD and has been around 9 days now," I say. "Well, that is a little short," he replies. Geez! I assume he tells all his patients the 14 day line and doesn't explain there can be great variation. I go on to say I've been using NPC which he has no reply to.

 

He says I'm welcome to breastfeed as long as I like, but as soon as I get pregnant the weaning process needs to begin if she isn't weaned already. And by 20 weeks she needs to stop bfing completely because there is a risk that bfing past that will send me into preterm labor. That is not true! It just isn't! irked.gif I expect that if you are going to practice obstetrics you need to stay up-to-date on current research and literature on the subject!

 

I also told him I would probably use a midwife for my next birth, but again had a specific question that really didn't get answered. A long comment shortened-He basically said I can't and won't be your back-up if you end up transferred to the hospital. Oh yeah, he also said that situations that turn into a transfer from home are just "a mess". His saving grace for the day was, "There is a 98% chance or higher that 2nd and 3rd deliveries will go fine and there will be no problems." Ok, great! smile.gifThat makes me feel even more confident to use a midwife.

 

I really liked using him for my prenatal care for previous pregnancies and he was really understanding and caring after I had a blighted ovum m/c. He was on board with my natural birth plans in the hospital and supported me doing that, no problem. But, now I'm beginning to wonder how much I do really like him. eyesroll.gif

 


Catholic, SAHM, Married 5 yrs. love.gif, Miscarried Sept. '08 April '09 & Jan. '14, DD is almost 4, DS is 20 months-we had a wonderful homebirth.jpg, EDD early Jan, 2015! I'm also a first time foster mom to a girl-22 months. 
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#150 of 223 Old 11-18-2011, 09:34 AM - Thread Starter
 
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wow, texasfarmom -- no wonder you are upset!!  How can someone who deals with women, pregnancy, and fertility say that women who have 28 day cycles always O on CD 14 and always have a 14 day luteal phase?! What the heck!  I'll bet that MOST women don't have this type of cycle.  And then the breastfeeding thing, ughhh. How can you be an "expert" in your field without keeping up on research in your field?! This bothers me to no end too...


Kelly: Mama to a spunky, joy-filled DD kid.gif(10/04/10), and a loving wife to a music-making DH broc1.gif (07/14/07) We fly-by-nursing1.gifand familybed1.gif, and are just starting to TTC#2 dust.gifhh2.gif

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