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October 2009 Charting to Avoid Thread

10K views 378 replies 27 participants last post by  BarefootScientist 
#1 ·
Welcome to the October 2009 charting to avoid thread. If you would like to be added or removed (or have anything changed) from the roll call list, please let me know by PMing me. PM me if you'd like to start next month's thread.

Here's a link to last month's September thread.
If you did not post in August or September, you may have been deleted from the list. If you were mistakenly deleted, or you would like to be added/removed, please PM me and let me know. I cannot promise to make changes requested in the thread, but I will try to get to everything.

*Charting/Using FAM/NFP to AVOID*

who we are:

54mama - since 8/09
Ajbaby - since 8/09
alicewyf - CTA since 9/09 plus 6 m before
AnnieA - since 12/07
annie2186
BarefootScientist - since 08/08 and 12 cycles in '05-'06
bbrandonsmom
brittneyscott - since 8/09
Carlin - CTA since 8/09
craft_media_hero
DanaMarie
eirual - CTA for 2.5 years
elonwy - since 8/09
Eresh - since 8/09
GriffsKat - since 4/09
heathermarie73
HulaJenn - since 4/09
JoyFilled
Kelm711
LadyBee
laurelg - CTA since 10/09, plus 16 months before
MarineWife - CTA for 10 months, now CFS&G
michelleoverby - since 8/07
mommyevekitty - since 9/09
momtokimari
motray36 - charting since 10/04
MovingMomma - since 02/09 + some time before
mystic~mama - CTA for 3 years
NaturalMindedMomma -
Nazsmum
nerdymom - CTA since 8/09
phatchristy
pmojzak
RaraAvis - CTA since 8/09 plus 13 months before
ScarletBegonias - CTA since 4/09
Smylingeyz - CTA since 06/08
whitekole
wholewheatchick - since 05/09

Graduates (no longer charting to avoid)
maggirayne -- CTA 02/08-10/08
JuicyPakwan - CTA 06/07 - 06/08 (?)
jul511riv - CTA 17 mo
Mrs_Lurker - CTA 11 mo
augustinem -- cta 6 mo
DanelleB - 12/07 - 05/08
Runner29 - CTA since 07/07 + 2 years previous
ShwarmaQueen - CTA since 09/07
BananaBreadGirl - CTA for 2 years
sk8ermaiden - 09/07-10/08
texaspeach - 10/04 - 01/09
cfiddlinmama - CTA 11/07 - 01/09 + more prior
CanidFL - CTA 06/08 - 02/09
Shell_Ell - (FF) (OS) 11/04 - 02/09 (15 cycles)
Juliacat - CTA 03/08 - 03/09, +33 cycles prior from 2001-2004
mommy2twobabes - CTA 7/08 - 03/08
Othermother'n'madre - CTA 02/08 - 04/09
cahwilson - 01/09 - 04/09
lacysmommy - 04/09-05/09
DucetteMama21842 - CTA 11/08 - 7/09
Danielle283 -
Teenytoona - 2/09-8/09
Virginia884 - 2/09 - 8/09
momongeon
Laggie - 1/09 - 9/09
wannaBmom_NICU_RN - 1/09-9/09
dachshundqueen - since 6/04

Pregnancies per Month (due to user error or condom failure unless otherwise noted)
February - at least 1
March - 2
April - 2
May - 2
June - 0
July - 0
August - 0
September - 1

Happy charting!

Summary of FAM rules (sympto-thermal)

Pre-ovulation rules:

1) First 5 Days Rule: You are safe the first 5 days of your menstrual cycle if you had an obvious temp shift 12-16 days before.

2) Dry day rule: You are safe to DTD after 6PM if you have been dry all day.

Post ovulation rules:

1) Peak day rule: the last day of fertile mucous is called the peak day (the day before your mucous begins to dry up). You are safe to DTD on the fourth consecutive day after the peak day. If another patch of more fertile mucous appears, start your count over.

2) Temperature shift rule: You are safe the evening of the third consecutive day your temp is above your coverline. If your temp falls at or below the coverline during the 3 day count, begin your count again.

BOTH rules must be satisfied to be considered in your infertile phase.

How to set a coverline:

When you see a temperature shift of at least 0.2 degrees F above the highest of the previous 6 temps, draw a line 0.1 degrees F above that highest temp.

Resources

Books:
Taking Charge of Your Fertility, by Toni Weschler
Garden of Fertility and Honoring Our Cycles workbook, by Katie Singer
The Art of Natural Family Planning by John and Sheila Kippley
Breastfeeding and Natural Child Spacing: How Ecological Breastfeeding Spaces Babies by Sheila Kippley
Fertility, Cycles and Nutrition
by Marilyn Shannon

Websites:
Ovusoft charting software, and brief fertility library
Fertility Friend charting software, and ttc charting guide
Author Katie Singer's Garden of Fertility website
Billings Ovulation Method info
Billings Ovulation Method Association, USA
Billings Centre, CA
Couple to Couple League (find an NFP instructor)
Creighton Model

Abbreviations:
AF: Aunt Flo, your period
BFP: what we are trying to avoid, a positive pregnancy test
CD: Cycle day
CM: cervical mucous (same as CF)
CF: cervical fluid (same as CM)
DPO: Days past ovulation
DTD: Do the deed
GIO: get it on
EWCM: eggwhite cervical mucous/fluid
LP: Luteal phase - the time from ovulation until your period, average 10-16 days
LTL: low temp level (basically 1/10th below FAM's CL or on the highest of the 6 previous temps)
HTL: high temp level (4/10ths above LTL, temp rise needed to indicate O)
 
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#52 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by motray36 View Post
Hi everyone, just popping in to introduce myself! Im back to CTA at 10 months pp. I know my charts will be a little kooky for a while, but I still want to try to get back into the swing of things! I do have a quick question for anyone who may be in a similar situation....DS wakes up at random times (usually 3-4 am, then back to sleep until 6-630). Should I try to temp at the 3-4 wake up? TIA!
Welcome motray!
My little guy is 2 months older than yours, congrats! I found this awesome forum right after my first PPAF and it is so helpful! I always temp early, since my wake up time varies a lot with my kids. I have one with a built in alarm so i just take it and go back to sleep.
 
#53 ·
Welcome Motray


I've gotten up at a few hours before 6, and didn't notice a temp change. This would be to check the boys, get something to drink, loo break etc.

Finally I got crosshairs on ff! I had to switch to fam to get them. I still have some patches of ccf though. And this cycle I have an increased bd interest, and usually after O, I could care less. Wierd. Full moon or something this week?
 
#54 ·
bbm ~ I looked at your chart and wondered why you didn't get crosshairs. Creamy CF after watery or ew is considered dry up. Your peak day would be your last watery or ew day.

I've been wondering about the moon again. There was a full moon just a few days ago, right? I think I got AF a day or two after the new moon (?). How is that supposed to affect your cycle? Is it that you are supposed to O around the full moon and get AF around the new moon?
 
#55 ·
Welcome, Motray!

MW: yes, ideally, on a 28 day cycle (yeah, cause those are so common! lol) you would O the day/night of the full moon, and have your period the week of the new moon. They used to call it "moon blood." But, as discussed last month, that is VERY rarely ever useful for TTC or not TTC in our society; too much night lighting, not enough living in Nature. LunaCeption does kind of create that, but you REALLY have to stick with it vigilantly; not a good idea when you have little kiddos, etc.

AFM: well, CD 39. I had that super EW yesterday, like all day. I've been almost completely dry today--a huge difference. But no temp rise. So I don't know what's up. I am interested to see what my temp tomorrow will be. But I'm secretly freaking out b/c DH and I DTD on my super EW day...which theoretically is fine, since we're "whatevering" not CTAing.
But usually we use KY as kind of a "kill some sperm while we can" and I know it's not a spermicide, but it does a little bit. And yeah, def. didn't last night. Def. didn't need to! lol

I know I'm probably jumping way ahead of the game here, since I haven't ovulated since June, but I'm still nervous. And excited but trying not to be excited. Which makes it very difficult to fall asleep! Ugh. I"ll report back tomorrow on my temperature!
 
#56 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by wholewheatchick View Post
MW: yes, ideally, on a 28 day cycle (yeah, cause those are so common! lol) you would O the day/night of the full moon, and have your period the week of the new moon. They used to call it "moon blood." But, as discussed last month, that is VERY rarely ever useful for TTC or not TTC in our society; too much night lighting, not enough living in Nature. LunaCeption does kind of create that, but you REALLY have to stick with it vigilantly; not a good idea when you have little kiddos, etc.

AFM: well, CD 39. I had that super EW yesterday, like all day. I've been almost completely dry today--a huge difference. But no temp rise. So I don't know what's up. I am interested to see what my temp tomorrow will be. But I'm secretly freaking out b/c DH and I DTD on my super EW day...which theoretically is fine, since we're "whatevering" not CTAing.
But usually we use KY as kind of a "kill some sperm while we can" and I know it's not a spermicide, but it does a little bit. And yeah, def. didn't last night. Def. didn't need to! lol
Thanks for that explanation. I know the moon phases don't really work in our society. I'm curious, though, to see if my cycles line up with the moon phases at all. For example, I did (by pure coincidence) get my last AF a day or two after the new moon. I'm not anywhere near Oing as far as I can tell and the full moon has come and gone. It will be interesting to see if I O around the next new moon, though. That seems possible since my average O day is cd28.

You haven't Oed since June?! Wow! I didn't realize it had been that long. I have especially long cycles but even that would drive me crazy. I'm sure you've mentioned this before but I can't remember. Are you planning to see a doc any time if your cycles don't get shorter?

When I wasn't getting AF after having my 2nd Norplant removed, I went to the doc every 3 months and got progesterone. It still took over a year before I started having my own cycles and they've been long and irregular ever since. The progesterone probably didn't do anything to regulate my cycles.
 
#57 ·
Well, I ovulated last on July 6. So 3 months ago. I haven't had a regular, ovulatory cycle since Jan of 2007; part of that was being on the Pill from April 08-April of 09; but Jan 2007 - Apirl 2008 I only had I think 3 periods? Maybe 4? Because of my eating disorder. Next month it will have been 6 months since I've been off the pill. We're moving in early Feb., and I'd rather have some better continuity of care, so I think I'll wait till we move till I go see somone about this. I'm strongly considering taking vitex starting in Dec. Anyone have experience with vitex?

I am just really worried that not having the hormones to ovulate now will affect me when we are really wanting to get pregnant.

Here's my chart. http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/277407 Temp still down, I think, and still fertile CF.
 
#58 ·
Do you know what is pretty crazy? I was looking into those moon phases a few months ago AND

Even though I have always had crazy eratic periods that have not followed the actual moon phases at all (like 59 and 49 30 45 day cycles - LOL)

BOTH of my LO's were conceived within days of a full moon............pretty crazy huh?

(cue twilight zone theme) :p
 
#59 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by annie2186 View Post
Do you know what is pretty crazy? I was looking into those moon phases a few months ago AND

Even though I have always had crazy eratic periods that have not followed the actual moon phases at all (like 59 and 49 30 45 day cycles - LOL)

BOTH of my LO's were conceived within days of a full moon............pretty crazy huh?

(cue twilight zone theme) :p
That's cool! And really, the moon does affect us a lot more than we give it credit for; it's just not reliable.
There are more ER visits on a full moon; there are more babies born on a full moon. Some people say it's just coincidence...but ask an ER nurse or a midwife! lol
 
#60 ·
WWC ~ Yep, temp still down. I'd put your CL at 97.4 for now. That could change, of course. Only 40 days since cd1 isn't that bad. I thought you meant you hadn't had an AF since June. Your lp was short last cycle, which could cause problems with ttc if it stays that short. Since you recently came off the pill and you had issues because of your eating disorder, it's probably too soon to get really worried yet since you aren't ttc. If your cycles don't become shorter and more regular and you are ready to ttc, then I'd definitely see a doc. I have not taken Vitex personally but I know people who have. They seemed to have good results with it. I don't know if it actually helped anyone get pg but I do remember it helping to shorten and regulate their cycles.

annie ~ That is interesting. I wonder if I could look back to see where the moon was when I conceived.
 
#61 ·
MW - I actually googled..........uhhh moon phases? I don't know - but I didn't know that until after both my LO's were born (like after I found this forum
) So if you know when you conceived, you could easily check if you googled a little. I would give you an actual link, but I don't have one! LOL

WWC - I totally agree it does affect us more than we give it credit for.........and although I don't GO by it - I do have them written down so I know when to be EXTRA careful!
 
#62 ·
I googled moon phases and found a link that goes way back so I was able to check for even my first born who was conceived in 1990. At first, I thought there was going to be a pattern. My most recent 3-4 pgs were all conceived 6-7 days after the full moon. However, as I went further back I found no regular timing between my conceptions and the moon phases. Oh well.

According to the FF cycle planner predictions, I should O within a day or two of every other new moon for the rest of the year. This cycle is very strange, though. I almost always O late. That's not strange. But I usually have too many days of CF, especially fertile CF. I'm at cd20 and have had barely any CF at all. I think it might've picked up a little yesterday. I still didn't see much of anything when I checked but I felt more.

My Chart
 
#63 ·
Hi ladies! Just checking in to say hello...I don't really have anything to add.

CD 5 for me...still CTA...still wishing I was TTC. I did go back through my charts and notice that for some reason, I had in my head that my LP was 9-11 days but it really is more like 11-13 days. So just something for me to keep in mind.
 
#64 ·
I am humming a little Tom Petty to calm my nerves
Day 28. . .
I feel like there should be a defined "phase" in the tail end of the LP cycle called the TP or "Terror Phase" roughly day 27 to please-God-AF

Does this feeling go away after a few months, if you are being TOTALLY careful and following ALL rules? Or do you always get butterflies those last few days?

My Ovulation Chart
 
#65 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by RaraAvis View Post
Or do you always get butterflies those last few days?
I pretty much always do. I'm right there with you now, even though we didn't DTD this cycle until yesterday (DH was out of town).
I'm day 11 of my LP with zero PMS, and my last 2 LPs were 9 days. My chart.

Oh, and the moon phase thing...I looked mine up and there is no correlation for me between conception or birth dates and moon phases.
 
#66 ·
No PMS is a good thing, isn't it?

I do get butterflies but not for the same reason. I've never been in a position to be worried that I was pg. I always hope that I am pg except, of course, when we didn't dtd during my fertile window.
 
#67 ·
I started taking the vitex yesterday; I am just sick of this fertile CF for 2 + weeks, and no O! It takes a while to "kick in" but I'm hoping that it makes a difference

Happy Friday!
 
#68 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by MarineWife View Post
No PMS is a good thing, isn't it?
Yes! I'd be glad to suddenly stop having PMS!
With so few temps this cycle, I'm concerned I didn't actually O when I think I did.
 
#70 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by MovingMomma View Post
With so few temps this cycle, I'm concerned I didn't actually O when I think I did.
I was wondering that myself. Your CF seems to have dried up. I guess if you start to get fertile CF again, you should be cautious.

I think anything that is supposed to affect hormones can take 3-6 months to become fully effective. That doesn't mean you won't start to see an effect sooner than that. It also doesn't mean that you will absolutely start to notice effects by 6 months. It could take longer, too. It all depends so much on the individual.
 
#71 ·
mortray - welcome!

Rara - I usually get a little nervous as AF approaches IF I have bent the rules at all. If I'm pretty confident it would practically take a miracle or a broken condom to get me pregnant (like this cycle) I don't worry about it at all. Looks like you should be getting AF within the next day or two - try to relax!


MovingMomma - yeah, your O doesn't look for sure to me at all. Oh, and I can't for the life of me figure out your abbreviation NTBCAMA.


I am 7 dpo - here's my chart.

Have a great Friday and weekend ladies!
 
#73 ·
Well, big temp jump this morning! http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/277407 Dont know if it will mean anything, but i am hopeful.


Yeah, vitex can take a while to work, but that's ok. It is a long term solution vs. the pill or prescription meds being a quick fix. I LOVE the fact that it helps to regulate cycles without actually containing hormones. I can take this for years if I need to without any side effects or complications, though not while pregnant. It is actually recommended for women who are coming off the Pill. In a way, it actually really makes me angry that this herb exists, it's pretty cheap ($7/month) and it actually helps your body--it actually helps solve the problem vs the Pill which creates more prolems while covering up the existing problem!!!! And yet as soon as I or any other female says she is having a problem with cycles, they immediately throw you on the Pill
 
#74 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by BarefootScientist View Post
Rara - I usually get a little nervous as AF approaches IF I have bent the rules at all. If I'm pretty confident it would practically take a miracle or a broken condom to get me pregnant (like this cycle) I don't worry about it at all. Looks like you should be getting AF within the next day or two - try to relax!

it came!
Exactly on time -- temp dropped and AF started after LP 11 days. It seems a little unfair that the nervous part of all this comes RIGHT when I'm PMSing. . .

NTBCAMA -- I keep trying to pronounce it
 
#75 ·
Well, Dear Aunt Flo has finally paid me a visit..............10 months, 1 week and 4 days..........

It's pretty funny that it is about the exact same time frame - almost to the day - from my first PPAF after my first LO as well EVEN THOUGH I had completely stopped BF DD1 for like 2 months - and this time I am still completely BF........not sure for how much longer though - it seems like my supply really drops as she has been SUPER fussy over the last couple of days.

Well - wish me luck!!!!!!!! I am going to need it
 
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