Charting to Avoid/Fertility Awareness, May 2010 - Page 7 - Mothering Forums
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Family Planning > Charting to Avoid/Fertility Awareness, May 2010
MarineWife's Avatar MarineWife 11:59 AM 05-14-2010
Quote:
When I discussed coming off the pill with my DB he said "its your choice". I knew part of him was just saying that because he had to. So I told him straight up, thats all fine and dandy, but, if we get pregnant it cant be my fault because I'm not on the pill. It was frustrating at first but we are on the same page and it feels good to know he supports me.
I think it's very important to make sure that your dp understands that you are both equally responsible for this form of bc. If the partner is not willing to be responsible, s/he should abstain. If s/he refuses to abstain, then s/he is responsible for whatever happens. Men shouldn't be let off the hook.

K-Mom3 ~ Whew! Yay! What BFS said. You need to have at least 3 fully charted ovulatory charts before relying on FAM for bc. Use your chosen method of avoiding during your entire cycle until you have those at least 3 charted cycles.

Thinking on the CF dry up thing without a thermal shift, I don't have my TCOYF book so I can't look it up. However, if the section on that was discussing determining your BIP during an infertile period, like while breastfeeding, then I'm sure that your BIP, either dry or sticky, is what is meant by "nonwet" CF.

Nothing going on with me. I'm on cd9. was over 2 days ago. I'm just waiting for some CF to show up to start temping.

Mummoth's Avatar Mummoth 02:44 PM 05-14-2010
This morning when the alarm went off I grabbed the thermometer and started temping while SO was still in the room (I made sure I put it in front of the clock so I won't have to fumble in the dark anymore) The thermometer beeps every few seconds, and then does a different beep when it's done. The whole time SO is going "What's that sound? Hon, can you hear that? Something's beeping. Is that a watch? Is that your phone? Why aren't you answering me? What's funny?" Dork.

We talked some more last night, and I really think we might stick with this plan. He said taking the pill or not is my choice but he didn't like that I was dealing with feeling sick or worrying about side effects all the time just so he could do nothing. He'd rather help out and have me feel good
RaraAvis's Avatar RaraAvis 02:57 PM 05-14-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnnieA View Post
I like the rules that I teach needing a .4 degree shift instead of a .1 degree shift. [/url]

Sometimes I ponder how much I'm pinning to .1 degree difference and it's scary -- I mean, it's amazing that such a tiny temp difference can show you so much (even .4 is amazingly small!)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mummoth View Post
The whole time SO is going "What's that sound? Hon, can you hear that? Something's beeping. Is that a watch? Is that your phone? Why aren't you answering me? What's funny?" Dork.
That is so funny
M.Q.'s Avatar M.Q. 03:00 PM 05-14-2010
My DH wasn't sure about this in the beginning, either. That's why he splurged and bought the Lady Comp... he's a total software developer and trusts technology more than most people. I think the whole reason he was willing to try (even with advanced technological assistance) was that we have friends who have used FAM exclusively for a year with no issues. I was positively ill on hormonal BC and these days I have changed my diet so much that I honestly wouldn't eat meat that took hormones like that, so I'm sure not going to voluntarily dope myself with that stuff.

We're going into our 3rd cycle now; and I cannot stress enough that NFP is not altogether reliable until you have a few charts to your name and can recognize your fertile symptoms (either by being aware in the moment, or seeing the pattern on your chart). My O day was 3 days before I thought it should be last month (I get a relly nice temp dip, but very little CF) and we were not as careful as we might have otherwise been. There is a learning curve, but just taking care (withdrawal, condoms, etc.) should keep you from getting PG until you want to be.

Best of luck with charting!
-MQ
annie2186's Avatar annie2186 03:40 PM 05-14-2010
Don't you just LOVE it when your chart looks like this??

http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/26af7e

grrrrr

I'm not sure what is going on - but I think I am going to start taking maca or vitex

Stupid body!
MarineWife's Avatar MarineWife 04:04 PM 05-14-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by RaraAvis View Post
Sometimes I ponder how much I'm pinning to .1 degree difference and it's scary -- I mean, it's amazing that such a tiny temp difference can show you so much (even .4 is amazingly small!)
It's actually a 0.2 degree rise but, yeah, it's still such a minute rise. I like knowing how to use both FAM and NFP rules. I use FAM primarily because that's what I know but I'll use the NFP rules to verify if there's a question.

annie ~ That looks like fun.
MovingMomma's Avatar MovingMomma 04:57 PM 05-14-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarineWife View Post
It's actually a 0.2 degree rise but, yeah, it's still such a minute rise. I like knowing how to use both FAM and NFP rules. I use FAM primarily because that's what I know but I'll use the NFP rules to verify if there's a question.
ditto, except vice versa on the FAM vs. NFP.

annie: wow, that's quite a rollercoaster!
peabean26's Avatar peabean26 05:49 PM 05-14-2010
What are maca or vitex? How do they help? Could you give me some references?

I thought TCOYF said a 0.4 degree shift. That means from one day to the next? So if on monday I'm at 97.0 and on tuesday I'm at 97.4 then that indicates ovulation, right? Because my temps pre-O fluctuate alot more than 0.4.

Right now I'm a bit confused because I'm not very far into my cycle but my temps are in this kind of steady climb. I will have to chart for a few more days to see whats going on. At this point I dont seem to have any CF, but my cervix did feel a bit softer today. I've been sick and last night I took some robotussien, which I'm concerned might mask the onset of sticky CF.

Here is my chart for this cycle. All my 'hearts' are withdrawl, unless otherwise specified. My notes are days I took some kind of cold medicine. I'm missing some temps due to my teethy toddler's frequent night waking this week.

http://www.tcoyf.com/members/peabean26/pccharts/4.aspx
annie2186's Avatar annie2186 06:08 PM 05-14-2010
Hi Peabean,

I'm not sure about NFP rules - but FAM rules is it has to be .2 above the last SIX temps and then you draw the coverline at .1 above the last six temps.

It's hard to understand, but just post your chart and ask if you are safe! That is what I did (still do actually) until I figured out how to chart!

Yes, my chart is driving me crazy! I am wondering if it is once again going to be annovulatory........that would be two out of the last 3 annovulatory.

Who knows, I could still O too - time will tell!!
MarineWife's Avatar MarineWife 06:17 PM 05-14-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by peabean26 View Post
I thought TCOYF said a 0.4 degree shift. That means from one day to the next? So if on monday I'm at 97.0 and on tuesday I'm at 97.4 then that indicates ovulation, right? Because my temps pre-O fluctuate alot more than 0.4.
First, no, just a difference of 0.4 degree from one day to the next does not indicate O. I think TCOYF might say that, usually, the initial temp rise on the first day after O is at least 0.4 degrees higher than the day of O but that doesn't always happen. More importantly, to indicate a possible O the higher temp has to be at least 0.2 degree higher than the highest of the previous 6 temps. You are looking for the pattern of a group of higher temps following a group of lower temps. You can't just look from one day to the next.

You look at the group of 6 temps before what you think might be a thermal shift and draw your CL 0.1 degree above the highest of those 6 temps. Then you look to see if you have 3 consecutive temps at least 0.1 degree higher than your CL, or 0.2 degree higher than the highest of the previous 6 temps. Until you get that clear and sustained thermal shift, your CL can change with each new temp you put in.

On your chart, first you don't have 6 consecutive pre-O temps so that can make things less clear. Since you do have 6 temps, your CL is 97.5 for now, which is 0.1 degree higher than your highest temp of 97.4 on cd12. You would now look for your cd13-14 temps to all be at least 97.6 to confirm O for cd12. If that doesn't happen, you have to re-evaluate your CL with each new temp and continue looking for the 3 consecutive temps that indicate a clear and sustained thermal shift.

Sorry if that is confusing. Someone else can probably explain it better.
lyterae's Avatar lyterae 01:23 PM 05-15-2010
I think I may have ovulated... waiting another day or so to make sure I can confirm. I'm soo tired. I went to a Zumba class today, trying to inspire myself into exercising

Hope everyone is having a good weekend!
MarineWife's Avatar MarineWife 02:33 PM 05-15-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by lyterae View Post
I think I may have ovulated... waiting another day or so to make sure I can confirm.
2 more high temps should do it.
nerdymom's Avatar nerdymom 12:40 AM 05-16-2010
Last month my chart was a mess, with me missing temps a lot due to illness (DS's and mine). Then my grandmother passed away on May 7th. It was very, very unexpected. She was 67. She cared for me for my first year of life, and we remained close. I lived with her during college and when I had my son she was my gentle mothering role model. She was my best friend, we talked almost every day and saw each other about once a week. I can't even begin to express how much I miss her.

This might not exactly be on subject but it does explain my absence. I am hoping to get back on track with charting this month. But honestly I am not doing so well with thinking of the future, even the next morning right now.
K-Mom3's Avatar K-Mom3 12:52 AM 05-16-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by BarefootScientist View Post
Congrats!
Well...I wouldn't rely on FAM until you know what you're doing. If you're not opposed to condoms I would suggest using non-lubricated ones until you have the FAM thing down. And/or, you can only DTD after a confirmed O and for the first five days of the next cycle. The dry day rule is the one most likely to fail, the other rules are pretty air-tight. What is it exactly that you're having trouble with? We might be able to help...I'm sorry I haven't been paying very good attention but remind me of your situation...bfing? just coming off hormones? Your chart does look very erratic. Are you temping at the same time every morning? Are you using a BBT? Have you read TCOYF? (LOL, I feel like I'm asking this all the time. )

ETA: link to my chart.
We are using condoms but are kind of getting the hang of that as well. We had one break during a time that is usually post-O but it turned out that I had fertile CF and I was really worried. It was the combination of my cycle and the condom both doing unexpected things that made me so frustrated this cycle. I'm not satisfied with the success rate of condoms.

I stopped bfing during this cycle (quite possibly the cause of the weird chart). I am using a BBT. I have read TCOYF, a few years ago and reviewed before I started charting again. I'm NOT temping at the same time every morning because of my toddler. I guess you can't really rely on the temps if they're not consistent, huh. Also, during this next cycle I'm going overseas for a couple weeks so I'll have a time change issue.
MarineWife's Avatar MarineWife 12:56 AM 05-16-2010
holly

K-Mom3 ~ Many of us have temped and charted while nursing toddlers through the night. It can be done. To be most accurate, temps should be taken within a half hour window but, ime, an hour is good enough.
Mummoth's Avatar Mummoth 05:20 PM 05-16-2010
I have a question. I've been temping at 6:30 when the alarm goes off, before I get out of bed or do anything. This morning I woke up at 5 and really had to go pee, so I took my temp then (36.3) and went back to bed after going to the bathroom. I didn't really get back to sleep after that, tossed and turned, then took my temp again at the regular time (36.6) So far this month all my temps have been 36.3 - 36.5, aside from today. Which of the two temperatures do I use on my chart? Thanks.
MarineWife's Avatar MarineWife 10:40 PM 05-16-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mummoth View Post
I have a question. I've been temping at 6:30 when the alarm goes off, before I get out of bed or do anything. This morning I woke up at 5 and really had to go pee, so I took my temp then (36.3) and went back to bed after going to the bathroom. I didn't really get back to sleep after that, tossed and turned, then took my temp again at the regular time (36.6) So far this month all my temps have been 36.3 - 36.5, aside from today. Which of the two temperatures do I use on my chart? Thanks.
Use the first temp. One temp taken outside your normal time shouldn't be a problem. It's only when you have several inaccurate temps that it's a problem.
onetwoten's Avatar onetwoten 01:09 AM 05-17-2010
k-mom-- I would make sure you're making a note of which time each temp was taken for sure. Obviously the more you can take at the same time, the better, even if it's say 4 or 5am. Once your cycles regulate a bit more with stopping breastfeeding, you might find it's easier to see the patterns, even with time differences.

For me, I work scattered shifts, so I wake up anywhere from 5am-11am. I usually set my normal wakeup time at 7am, and then if I get to sleep in, I set an alarm and temp and then go back to sleep. If I have to get up earlier, then I temp and insert that temp into my chart with the 5am wakeup, and then I go back once a week or so and adjust the temps according to the normal .2/hour. I've found that -for me- it's incredibly accurate, and adjusting them always gives me a super clear chart, whereas leaving them, it's hard to read.

I guess what i'm trying to say is that while I wouldn't adjust the temps right on your chart permanently for now, you may find that looking at the chart and adjusting in your head for whether they were taken earlier or later, you may be able to see a more clear pattern. Then after you've been watching them for a while (probably a few months unfortunately...) you may be comfortable enough to adjust them. I wasn't at first, but after seeing how textbook my body appears to be with the time changes for early/late, now I'm fine with it.

Ugh. Sorry guys I just got off work, and I feel like my brain is only half turned on. Pardon me if that didn't make sense. I keep going back to try to reword it and it's not getting any better. haha
Mummoth's Avatar Mummoth 01:12 AM 05-17-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarineWife View Post
Use the first temp. One temp taken outside your normal time shouldn't be a problem. It's only when you have several inaccurate temps that it's a problem.
Thanks!
kcroto42's Avatar kcroto42 08:36 AM 05-17-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by peabean26 View Post
What are maca or vitex? How do they help? Could you give me some references?
Hi, peabean!!! /waves frantically, because I am a big geek.

I've been pretty much absent this month; I had more mourning that I expected when our "failure to withdraw" didn't turn into anything. I hadn't really realized how much I wanted to be pregnant, I guess, and it was really hard to deal with, especially when he then continued to withdraw after that one event. Which worked out for the best, I know, but it was just...hard, emotionally.

Couple more months now, and we'll see what we see.

Nothing exciting to report yet.
BarefootScientist's Avatar BarefootScientist 09:10 AM 05-17-2010
I got my temp rise today!

Quote:
Originally Posted by Mummoth View Post
This morning when the alarm went off I grabbed the thermometer and started temping while SO was still in the room (I made sure I put it in front of the clock so I won't have to fumble in the dark anymore) The thermometer beeps every few seconds, and then does a different beep when it's done. The whole time SO is going "What's that sound? Hon, can you hear that? Something's beeping. Is that a watch? Is that your phone? Why aren't you answering me? What's funny?" Dork.
Haha.

Quote:
Originally Posted by MarineWife View Post
Sorry if that is confusing. Someone else can probably explain it better.
No, MW, I really don't think so. Your explanations are always quite clear.

Holly I lost my grandma whom I was very close to suddenly and unexpectedly a year and a half ago too, many many hugs for you.

Quote:
Originally Posted by K-Mom3 View Post
We are using condoms but are kind of getting the hang of that as well. We had one break during a time that is usually post-O but it turned out that I had fertile CF and I was really worried. It was the combination of my cycle and the condom both doing unexpected things that made me so frustrated this cycle. I'm not satisfied with the success rate of condoms.

I stopped bfing during this cycle (quite possibly the cause of the weird chart). I am using a BBT. I have read TCOYF, a few years ago and reviewed before I started charting again. I'm NOT temping at the same time every morning because of my toddler. I guess you can't really rely on the temps if they're not consistent, huh. Also, during this next cycle I'm going overseas for a couple weeks so I'll have a time change issue.
Sounds very complicated. My chart has looked absolutely crazy before when I've had issues like that. I've found that setting an alarm and just temping at the same time works wonders for regulating my temps. If that is possible for you. You wouldn't have to get up, just stick the thermometer in your mouth. Do you usually have to actually get out of bed to take care of your toddler? Did he/she just nightwean? I found that getting up and out of bed or moving around a lot in bed would make my temps crazy but just soothing a toddler back to sleep without moving much was fine. My DS also started sleeping through the night pretty consistently without any parenting on my part when he nightweaned...let's hope the same for you?
Sammerson0814's Avatar Sammerson0814 12:54 PM 05-17-2010
So now I'm at CD37. I forgot to temp this morning. Im so not good at and kind of daily routine!!! Still no AF, and im starting to wonder if hte pain i was having as ovulation or not. I am not a patient person so waiting fr AF and not thinking somthing is wrong is not a fun process for me.
lyterae's Avatar lyterae 01:31 PM 05-17-2010
Life is still crazy... My mom moved away(several states away) on Friday, my parents are in the midst of divorcing.

In the meantime I still have not ovulated, my chart looks rather erratic this month.

Sorry no personals guys - having a hard time focusing on anything right now.
peabean26's Avatar peabean26 01:40 PM 05-17-2010
Hi!!

I know how you feel, we had a scare last month. Seriously, I was terrified. But then my period came and I started feeling like I maybe want to get pregnant again soon.

I feel like I go through these phases of really wanting another one now and then snapping out of it. Truely, there is no way I would finish my PhD if I had another one and a PhD is a huge lifegoal for me. So shut up biological clock!!

I hope you get pregnant soon. I know it's tough waiting. Maybe he can be convinced a little early? Although, I do think it would be great to be pregnant through the winter and give birth in spring. My daughter was born in January and being snowbound with a newborn definitely had an impact on my baby blues.
Mummoth's Avatar Mummoth 03:18 PM 05-17-2010
I understand the wanting one/ snapping out of it thing. With my first two, it didn't feel like I had to sacrifice anything to have them. Now I have school aged kids, it's a lot easier than having babies or toddlers... and a lot of the fun stuff we do would be a lot harder with a baby.

I think even camping would still be do-able with SO though, he's a really involved stepdad and waaay easy going. He doesn't have any biological children, and my ex wasn't a real partner (completely uninvolved/not interested in the kids) so it would be a new experience for both of us.

Well, SO put the fan on in our room last night and I woke up to a really low temp this morning. I think I'm going to have to make a note of stuff like that on the chart, too!
MarineWife's Avatar MarineWife 04:47 PM 05-17-2010
Check out The Natural Fertility Shop for info on maca and Vitex.
kcroto42's Avatar kcroto42 07:45 AM 05-18-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by lyterae View Post
Life is still crazy... My mom moved away(several states away) on Friday, my parents are in the midst of divorcing.

In the meantime I still have not ovulated, my chart looks rather erratic this month.

Sorry no personals guys - having a hard time focusing on anything right now.
Sorry to hear about all that; I hope this is for the best, and that everyone involved is able to move on peacefully. Sending and .

Quote:
Originally Posted by peabean26 View Post
Hi!!

I know how you feel, we had a scare last month. Seriously, I was terrified. But then my period came and I started feeling like I maybe want to get pregnant again soon.

I feel like I go through these phases of really wanting another one now and then snapping out of it. Truely, there is no way I would finish my PhD if I had another one and a PhD is a huge lifegoal for me. So shut up biological clock!!

I hope you get pregnant soon. I know it's tough waiting. Maybe he can be convinced a little early? Although, I do think it would be great to be pregnant through the winter and give birth in spring. My daughter was born in January and being snowbound with a newborn definitely had an impact on my baby blues.
It just blew my mind, because he just didn't ask if he needed to pull out, and then was like "oh, was that okay?" And I couldn't come up with anything better to say than "uuuuuuuh...." but clearly, it panned out. I was just...excited, you know? And so let down when it became clear that nothing would come of it. It was the only time I've been sad to be charting, because when I hadn't o'd a couple of days after that, I knew it would come to nothing, and his relief was pretty horrifying at first.

At this point, we're planning on actually trying in July, with the hope of a spring baby. I'm good with that, I like that plan. If we have an oops before then, he's fine with it, but he won't actually TRY until then. And I understand his reasons...I just think they're silly.
AnnieA's Avatar AnnieA 12:03 PM 05-18-2010
Good morning ladies! I want to bring attention to my chart as an example of the differences between FAM and NFP. I have my FF account set to FAM and it is giving me crosshairs. But according to NFP rules, I am not "safe". I've been sick the last few days and running a low-grade fever. CF has dried up but I do not have a clear thermal shift according to NFP rules.

With that said, you will notice that I have intercourse marked for last night. I explained the situation to DH and he made the decision. As you may know, I do not want to CTA and he is the one that wants to right now so it's his decision.

Feel free to ask questions if you don't understand why I don't consider it a "safe" time yet.

My chart: http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/1f0436
Toolip's Avatar Toolip 12:17 PM 05-18-2010
Quote:
Originally Posted by AnnieA View Post
Good morning ladies! I want to bring attention to my chart as an example of the differences between FAM and NFP. I have my FF account set to FAM and it is giving me crosshairs. But according to NFP rules, I am not "safe". I've been sick the last few days and running a low-grade fever. CF has dried up but I do not have a clear thermal shift according to NFP rules.

My chart: http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/1f0436
I don't understand why that is not a clear thermal shift
echospiritwarrior's Avatar echospiritwarrior 12:21 PM 05-18-2010
I'd like to know as well. This place is a learning mecca!

DH and I are also not totally CTA anymore, but I now if we do get pg I would like to pick up and CTA afterward again so I'd love to learn as much as I possibly can right now.
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