Charting to Avoid / Fertility Awareness - June - Mothering Forums

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Old 06-03-2011, 03:38 PM - Thread Starter
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flower.gif   June 2011  flower.gif


Click Here for Last Month's Thread

 

Welcome to the May 2011 charting to avoid and fertility awareness thread. We are all at different stages in family planning and our own fertility. Some of us are very ardently Charting to Avoid (CTA); some are CTA but would be thrilled with a BFP; and we even have a few who are "whatevering" or pregnant and continue to hang out here.

 

If you did not post in May, you may have been deleted from the list. If you have joined recently, please double check I have your chart linked correctly. If you were mistakenly deleted, you would like to be added/removed, or you spot anything you would like me to change, please post or PM me to let me know. Remember, you must post in June if you want to be on the July list!

To those who are new, welcome! Welcome.gif


 

 

    Who We Are

alyadri BFPChart2.gif

Angelorum

azgirl BFPChart2.gif

BirthIsAwesome

Brendalee

CarsonBookworm BFPChart2.gif

Ecologystudent

goinggreengirl BFPChart2.gif 

jodi5 BFPChart2.gif (STM/MM)

JuliMummy

justKate BFPChart2.gif (STM)

kcroto42

librarygirl BFPChart2.gif

MillieJane BFPChart2.gif

mirpmama BFPChart2.gif

miss_honeyb BFPChart2.gif 

physics girl BFPChart2.gif

RknOHMum BFPChart2.gif

sosurreal09

Stefibeth BFPChart2.gif
Toolip BFPChart2.gif

treeoflife3

wilson (CrMS)

 

Graduates

Pregnant! belly.gif

Jaimee (November 2011)

mommy2two babes (December 2011)

lactatinggirl (January 2012)

 

No Longer TTA

JMJ (STM)

Good luck to those now TTC! fingersx.gif
 

 

 Summary of FAM Rules

(sympto-thermal)

Pre-ovulation rules:

1) First 5 Days Rule: You are safe the first 5 days of your menstrual cycle if you had an obvious temp shift 12-16 days before.

2) Dry Day Rule: You are safe to DTD after 6PM if you have been dry all day.


Post ovulation rules:

1) Peak Day Rule: The last day of fertile mucus is called the peak day (the day before your mucus begins to dry up). You are safe to DTD on the fourth consecutive day after the peak day. If another patch of more fertile mucus appears, start your count over.

2) Temperature Shift Rule: You are safe the evening of the third consecutive day your temp is above your coverline. If your temp falls at or below the coverline during the 3 day count, begin your count again.

BOTH rules must be satisfied to be considered in your infertile phase.


How to set a coverline:

When you see a temperature shift of at least 0.2° F above the highest of the previous 6 temps, draw a line 0.1° F above that highest temp.

 

 

 Resources

Books

 

Taking Charge of Your Fertility by Toni Weschler

Garden of Fertility by Katie Singer
Honoring Our Cycles (workbook) by Katie Singer
The Art of Natural Family Planning by John and Sheila Kippley

Natural Family Planning: A Complete Approach by John and Sheila Kippley (available for free download with registration)
Breastfeeding and Natural Child Spacing by Sheila Kippley

The Seven Standards of Ecological Breastfeeding by Sheila Kippley

The Art of Natural Family Planning Student Guide by Couple to Couple League

The Art of Natural Family Planning Postpartum Student Guide by Couple to Couple League

The Art of Natural Family Planning Premenopause Student Guide by Couple to Couple League
Fertility, Cycles and Nutrition by Marilyn Shannon

Natural Family Planning User Manual Marquette Method Manual free download


Websites

TCOYF (Ovusoft) charting software, and brief fertility library
Fertility Friend charting software, and ttc charting guide
myfertilitycharts.com free software for ttc or tta

The Central London FertilityCare Center online charting for Creighton Model

Garden of Fertility author Katie Singer's website
Mothering Magazine article by Katie Singer
Billings Ovulation Method info
Billings Ovulation Method Association, USA
Billings Centre, CA
Couple to Couple League (find an NFP instructor) Sympto-Thermal Method
Creighton Model

NaPro Technology Gynecological healthcare using the Creighton Model

NFP International John and Sheila Kippley's Website, Sympto-Thermal Method

Marquette Method


Abbreviations

AF: Aunt Flo, menses, your period
BBT: basal body temperature
BC: birth control
BIP: basic infertile pattern
CD: cycle day
CF: cervical fluid (same as CM)
CHs: crosshairs (intersection of coverline and ovulation)
CL: coverline
CM: cervical mucus (same as CF)
CO: cervical opening
CP: cervical position
CTA: charting to avoid
CTW: charting to "whatever" (not avoiding, not preventing)
DPO: days past ovulation
DTD: do the dead (sex)
EWCM: eggwhite cervical mucus/fluid
FAM: fertility awareness method
FF: Fertility Friend (website, see above)
HBC: hormonal birth control
HTL: high temp level (0.4°F above LTL, temp rise needed to indicate O)
LAM: lactational amenorrhea method (breastfeeding as birth control)
LP: luteal phase (between ovulation and menses, average 10-16 days)
LTL: low temp level (highest of the 6 temps immediately before temp rise)
NFP: natural family planning
O: ovulation
SHOW: soft, high, open, wet (characteristics of the cervix near ovulation)
SR: seminal residue
TCOYF: Taking Charge of Your Fertility (book and website, see above)
TTA: trying to avoid
TTW: trying to whatever
other common abbreviations

 

 Happy Charting Everyone! 

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Old 06-03-2011, 04:04 PM - Thread Starter
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I updated the thread for this month.  Please check your information to make sure it is correct.  If you haven't posted in the past 2 months, I did actually delete you from the list, so let me know if you would like to be added back in or if I missed your posts and accidentally deleted you.

 

I also added a bunch of new links.  What's new?

-New NFP books from the Couple to Couple League and NFP International (The founders of CCL recently broke away and founded NFP International, and each organization has since developed their own materials.)

-A link for NaPro Technology, gynecological health care based on the Creighton Method

-Marquette Method information

-Link to new edition of "Fertility Cycles and Nutrition" by Marilyn Shannon

 

ETA: And I almost forgot... I also added Sheila Kippley's new book, "The Seven Standards of Ecological Breastfeeding" including the results from the Kippleys' 2 studies testing ecological breastfeeding in the USA and much more scientific research on the place of ecological breastfeeding in world family planning and how to use ecological breastfeeding in conjunction with systematic NFP (charting).  Her old book, "Breastfeeding and Natural Child Spacing" remains a great support for the ecological breastfeeding parenting and lifestyle.  Both are a must for anyone wishing to do it.

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Old 06-03-2011, 04:06 PM - Thread Starter
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JustKate, whenever you get back, I'm not taking over permanently.  I'm actually TTC now, so you can take over as soon as you get back.  I just figured that you were busy with your move and could use a break for the month.  I hope everything is going well and you get back to MDC soon.

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Old 06-03-2011, 10:48 PM
 
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Thank you for starting the new thread JMJ!

I've been Oing later the last 2 cycles.... I don't know what's up with that. Normal I suppose.
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Old 06-04-2011, 06:20 AM
 
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notes2.gif  Thanks JMJ!


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Old 06-04-2011, 08:14 AM - Thread Starter
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Toolip, it could be normal.  Our cycles do change throughout our lifetime.  Have you been under any more stress than normal?  What about diet/nutrition?

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Old 06-04-2011, 05:57 PM
 
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Hi! I will be joining you guys in taking my temperature tomorrow. I was charting for part of last year, but never really got into it enough for it to actually be useful- I'm going to do better this time! Part of the problem is that I'm a mouth breather, and was attempting to take temps orally. Do you guys have a specific brand of thermometer for taking temps vaginally? Or do you just use a normal mouth thermometer? Thanks!

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Old 06-04-2011, 06:14 PM - Thread Starter
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Welcome, Ecologystudent!

 

You need a Basal Body Thermometer, specifically designed for charting, not just a fever thermometer.  Fever thermometers are not accurate enough for charting.  There are several brands that work fine.  Many people prefer the BD brand, and the Walgreens thermometers get bad reviews.  Any BBT would work fine for oral, vaginal, or anal temping.  Happy charting!

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Old 06-04-2011, 07:19 PM
 
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I loved my old Walgreens basal body thermometer- I bought it back in 2005.  I've replaced the battery several times, but it finally rusted during my second pregnancy (it's humid in Austin, TX!).  LOL!  So I went to get another one and it's totally different!  It's faster and I feel less accurate AND less precise.  As annoying as it can be to wait the couple minutes for the longer kind, I feel the 30 second thermometers are just not as good. 

 

JMJ, where do you get the BD one you referred to?


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Old 06-04-2011, 07:59 PM - Thread Starter
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BD Thermometer

My personal thermometer is a store brand Good Neighbor Pharmacy one.  I've also heard good things about the store brand CVS ones.  I believe both go to the 100ths but take some extra time.  10ths is all that is needed for charting fertility, and sometimes it is more complicated to have the extra digit.

 

If you want accuracy and don't mind waiting 5 minutes, consider a glass thermometer.  You can't retake your temp if you think you messed up on a digital because it won't be accurate.  You can on a glass thermometer.

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Old 06-04-2011, 10:06 PM
 
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DS knocked my thermometer off the bed and now i can't find it anywhere! I am going to have to move the whole bed to find it! At least I confirmed ovulation before it was lost.

I also realized that I've been fertile for 10 months... which means if DH and I hadn't been careful, I could have a newborn right now! That is a very scary thought.

E, wife to D, mommy to G (born March 2010). joy.gif

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Old 06-04-2011, 11:15 PM
 
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I am a mouth breather and so far, it is working fine.  I do take my temperature orally.  I have a ladycomp but I don't think you need to do that.  I have also used a BD basal thermometer and found I got a similar result so I think a good basal thermometer should be fine.  View Post

 

 



Quote:
Originally Posted by Ecologystudent View Post

Hi! I will be joining you guys in taking my temperature tomorrow. I was charting for part of last year, but never really got into it enough for it to actually be useful- I'm going to do better this time! Part of the problem is that I'm a mouth breather, and was attempting to take temps orally. Do you guys have a specific brand of thermometer for taking temps vaginally? Or do you just use a normal mouth thermometer? Thanks!



 


Mom to three great boys Michael (Sept/01), Carter (Nov/05) and Reid (March/10).

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Old 06-05-2011, 06:39 AM
 
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I'm not generally a mouth breather but I take my temp vaginally and I HIGHLY recommend it! I'm usually tired when I take my temp, so it is challenging for me to hold it in my mouth well, lol. But one problem is that I can't hear the beep when it's under the blankets, between my legs... so here's what I do: Insert the thermometer vaginally when my alarm first goes off and hit snooze, and then I usually fall back asleep. When the alarm goes off (8 minutes later) I take the thermometer out and either get up, or go back to sleep. It's been working great for me for getting consistent temps at a regular time every day. For me, it's much more relaxing then trying to keep it in my mouth. It would probably work well for a glass thermometer too.
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Old 06-05-2011, 08:40 AM
 
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bag.gif  Sorry I've been MIA.  This move has been seriously chaotic, and we just got internet again today.  So much to catch up on!  I'm hoping to get started reading when DD goes down for a nap today.

 

JMJ, thanks so much for starting the June thread.  I'm really excited for you--wish I was in your shoes!  Be sure to lurk and keep us posted when you get that BFP!  I've learned lots from you and I know everyone will miss your insight.


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Old 06-05-2011, 08:58 AM
 
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Hi JMJ, it is a Basal Body Thermometer, just one intended for mouths! Thanks for the info.

 

I'm glad it works for you Jodi5, but I was getting really wild jumps from 98 to 96 back up to 97 the next day with oral, so I thought I'd give vaginal a try. Probably the reason for the mouth breathing and the temp irregularities is that I'm highly congested, and sometimes I can't breathe through my nose in the morning- thus contributing to varied temps, I'm sure.

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Old 06-05-2011, 01:41 PM
 
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I was sick with what I think is food poisoning....temp went sky high today.....grrrrrr.

Otherwise all is good in CTTA land.


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Old 06-06-2011, 08:02 AM - Thread Starter
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Welcome back, JustKate.  I'm glad to hear you made it, and best wishes for settling in.

 

EcologyStudent, BBT's tend to be be marketed only for mouths.  A lot of people don't like the idea of taking their temperature other ways, so the packaging materials don't talk about it, but it works just the same.

 

CarsonBookworm, I hope you are feeling better soon.  Food poisoning is no fun.  Ick.

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Old 06-06-2011, 08:41 AM
 
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Just an update, I got a high on the fertility monitor today.  It was strange since the strip didn't look like a high to me, but I have had some CM the last couple of days that was a bit more so I think it is probably right.  They say not to judge the strips by looking but I clearly could see it last cycle before I even put it in the monitor, lol.  I'm guessing I will see it more the next day or so. 

 

EcologyStudent - I do get some up and downs as well, but have been able to see the shift so far.  I will see how it goes and you never know, may try vaginal at some point but for now it is working okay. 

 

JMJ - interesting, the BBT's I have purchased here, describe oral and vaginal on the packaging.  Interesting these little tidbits, that perhaps vary from place to place. 

 


Mom to three great boys Michael (Sept/01), Carter (Nov/05) and Reid (March/10).

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Old 06-06-2011, 08:56 AM - Thread Starter
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I have been pondering, Ladies, and I could use some opinions.  I have recently run into a number of women in this forum (some on this thread, some on other threads) who are relying on or would like to rely on mucus-only or temperature-only and even calendar only methods of CTA.  In my opinion and experience on this thread, we are here to help women understand their fertility through any fertility signs they wish to chart and to support them in their choice to plan their families through awareness of their own fertility.  However, having basic rules above for FAM from TCOYF only (despite having resources for many FAM/NFP methods and organizations) seems to be giving some people the impression that this is a Sympto-Thermal Method only thread, when the intent is to be more inclusive.

 

The idea that I have been kicking around is to add a summary of the basic rules for several different methods in simple terms above similarly to how FAM has been described above.  (Options could include calendar, mucus-only, temperature-only, ClearBlue Fertility Monitor..... if we want to make it even more complicated, pre-PPAF breastfeeding rules.)  I am conflicted about this for a number of reasons and would love to hear your opinions.  Here are my thoughts:

 

-I am no longer CTA (though I likely will be again sometime... in a couple years), and I do not want to change the nature of the thread substantially and leave you all to deal with the fall-out.  If I make changes to the opening post, I want it to be because the general consensus among active participants is that those changes would be welcome.

 

-I have been a tutor for many years, and I am confident in my ability to present the information in clear, simple terms, though I tend to be wordy.

 

-I love the simplicity of one set of basic rules.  I don't want people to feel like they have to choose their method from a long, complicated list before they get started. They can branch out to what works best for them later.

 

-Some people have already chosen a method other than STM, and having some basic information on their chosen method would make them feel welcome and free to discuss their own method.

 

-Some people feel like they could never get accurate temperatures or have all-the-time mucus or hardly any at all, and if they perceive that STM is all that is offered to them, they may feel that FAM/NFP can't be for them if they can't or don't want to keep track of it all.

 

-While the STM can be effectively learned from a book, some methods (specifically Creighton) rely on face-to-face, one on one charting lessons to maintain a high level of effectiveness.  This obviously cannot be replicated to any degree in this thread.  I can list the basic mucus-only rules above that are used in Creighton and Billings, but I don't want to give the impression that without taking proper instruction in Creighton, you can assume that you will get the 99% accuracy advertised by the method.

 

-I want to give enough information to give people a taste of different methods and to get started charting, but I do not think it wise to attempt to (or give the impression that I am attempting to) teach all of the NFP/FAM methods in one thread.

 

I would love some constructive feedback.

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Old 06-06-2011, 09:19 AM
 
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JMJ... I love how thoughtful you are about this subject.  I know from my own experience that I certainly could have used some more information presented to me in simple terms that went beyond what I had read in TCOYF.  I for one, would greatly appreciate this type of info in the opening post OR a sticky (if that is possible).  I think you could easily add disclaimers about the need for further one-on-one instruction to RELY on certain techniques (the CM, for example). 

 

I also think you could add a single sentence at the beginning stating that the thread is for all types of CTA techniques including STM, CM, MM, etc.... and that it's open to anyone interested in information even they are not actively CTA.  I think that would accomplish the inclusive part you're hoping for.  Once that is stated, it's up to people to jump in if they want to be included.


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Old 06-06-2011, 09:52 AM
 
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Quote:

Originally Posted by JMJ View Post

 

I would love some constructive feedback.

JMJ - I appreciate your thoughts here.  I think I've felt left out using Creighton - not because of anything you're doing here, but simply because I don't see anyone else using it!  I like that at the top you already have links to all of the various methods and I think that is pretty inclusive.  If you wanted to write basic rule summaries  - maybe you could link to it elsewhere (like in a sticky?) since the first post is already so long.  And maybe in the list of people's names for the thread, you could add in parentheses after their name which method they rely on?  That would let people quickly scan to see if anyone else is using their method.  Those wouldn't be very big changes, so you wouldn't have to worry about leaving for awhile.  :)
 

And since I'm new here - could you add me to the list? :)  Nice to meet all of you!


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Old 06-06-2011, 10:07 AM
 
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I'll go ahead and ask a couple of my Creighton system questions, if any of you want to toss in an opinion.

 

Just a little history on me: I used sympto thermal for a couple of years, after I had my second DD (two healthy pregnancies) I just felt like I couldn't consistently temp.  Then I tried using cycle beads because I was lazy and I thought I was regular enough - 6 months later I was pregnant.  I had a miscarriage in December, and started using Creighton in January, so I'm on my 6th cycle.  My cycles seem to be very much like they were before the last pregnancy, but since I was charting before I don't really know for sure.  My cycles fluctuate in length between 26-30 ish days, but I have very clear CM signs that make ovulation easy to identify (with Creighton you check your mucus every time you go to the bathroom, shower, and before bed, so you know exactly what you're body is doing every day).  We are CTA now, but will maybe TTC next year.

 

So my question:

My luteal phase has fluctuated between 10-15 (12, 10, 13, 15, 13) days, although there is a possibility I wasn't charting correctly in the early months. 

 

I had one month of light spotting before my period, which is a sign of low progesterone, too, but it was only one out of 5 months. 

 

And does anyone know exactly what the Mucus Cycle Score my Creighton teacher gives me indicates exactly?   She's given me the scale of what is normal before, but I've forgotten it.  mine is fluctuating between 6's one month (mid-low) and 15's the next (good). 

 

I may just be paranoid because of my miscarriage, but do these signs together indicate low progesterone, or any other condition that I may need to be concerned about, whether for general health or later when I TTC again?  At the very least it seems like my hormones are somewhat instable, fluctuating from normal to out of sync.  Thoughts?


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Old 06-06-2011, 11:04 AM
 
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JMJ, I LOVE the idea of making some changes to the thread.  Part of what I love about this thread is that it was such a great starting-off point for me when I started charting. I'd love to know more about relying more on CM, but I haven't been exposed to Creighton or Billings....so without the exposure, those methods seem really mystical to me.  If you would take the lead on the technical/teaching side, I can offer some suggestions for the formatting--

 

First, let's just keep a list of members, rather than dividing everyone into groups.  Maybe user name, method, since Month 20XX, any notes the person wants to include (like BFPs, no longer avoiding, etc.). As we state anyway, a lot of us are avoiding to different degrees or whatevering at times....

 

Second, lets find out if there's a way to host documents either on the thread, in a person's "account" or if Wikis are the only option.  I know nothing about Wikis, but I'm guessing it would be a way to host information and link to it in our thread without having copious amounts of info on the thread.  We don't want to make it more overwhelming than it is!

 

Third, I really like the links in the first post, so lets keep those for now unless there's a better way to do it.  That's all I can think of for now, but I'm really excited about making some changes.

 

 

wilson, welcome!  And welcome to all the other ladies I missed meeting during my move.  So glad that's over!  wilson, i'm not familiar with Creighton at all, but my LP has fluctuated a bit too, and the only things I can possibly attribute it to are nutrition and maybe stress.  My last 5 LPs have been 11, 10, 12, 12, and 10 days.  I know my last LP was affected by eating road food during my move and me being sort of stressed out about it.  Not sure if that means anything to you, but it seems to matter for me.  I also have more pre-AF spotting when my nutrition is poor(er).  For me, this means taking a mulit-vitamin to avoid spotting for 4 days pre-AF.  My "goal" at this point is to get a consistent 12-day LP and only one day of pre-AF spotting by paying more attention to my diet.

 

 

As for me, CD9 here. I rely heavily on temps because I don't feel very confident in my ability to interpret CM, and I rarely get EWCM.  Fortunately I got my three over six a day or two before our move, so I didn't have to deal with that on the road. My charts: http://www.fertilityfriend.com/home/320676

 

 


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Old 06-06-2011, 11:36 AM
 
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Originally Posted by justKate View Post

wilson, i'm not familiar with Creighton at all, but my LP has fluctuated a bit too, and the only things I can possibly attribute it to are nutrition and maybe stress.  My last 5 LPs have been 11, 10, 12, 12, and 10 days.  I know my last LP was affected by eating road food during my move and me being sort of stressed out about it.  Not sure if that means anything to you, but it seems to matter for me.  I also have more pre-AF spotting when my nutrition is poor(er).  For me, this means taking a mulit-vitamin to avoid spotting for 4 days pre-AF.  My "goal" at this point is to get a consistent 12-day LP and only one day of pre-AF spotting by paying more attention to my diet.


Thanks, JustKate!  My Creighton class/book says that a fluctuation of 2-3 days is still normal, but 4 or more days could be a sign of instable progesterone.  I don't know what other methods say.  I can see how nutrition could affect those 2-3 days though.   I've been really trying to be consistent with my vitamins lately, and I should do better about my food too.  Maybe things will get less weird over the next couple of months.

 


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Old 06-06-2011, 05:18 PM - Thread Starter
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Originally Posted by wilson View Post

I'll go ahead and ask a couple of my Creighton system questions, if any of you want to toss in an opinion.

 

Just a little history on me: I used sympto thermal for a couple of years, after I had my second DD (two healthy pregnancies) I just felt like I couldn't consistently temp.  Then I tried using cycle beads because I was lazy and I thought I was regular enough - 6 months later I was pregnant.  I had a miscarriage in December, and started using Creighton in January, so I'm on my 6th cycle.  My cycles seem to be very much like they were before the last pregnancy, but since I was charting before I don't really know for sure.  My cycles fluctuate in length between 26-30 ish days, but I have very clear CM signs that make ovulation easy to identify (with Creighton you check your mucus every time you go to the bathroom, shower, and before bed, so you know exactly what you're body is doing every day).  We are CTA now, but will maybe TTC next year.

 

So my question:

My luteal phase has fluctuated between 10-15 (12, 10, 13, 15, 13) days, although there is a possibility I wasn't charting correctly in the early months. 

 

I had one month of light spotting before my period, which is a sign of low progesterone, too, but it was only one out of 5 months. 

 

And does anyone know exactly what the Mucus Cycle Score my Creighton teacher gives me indicates exactly?   She's given me the scale of what is normal before, but I've forgotten it.  mine is fluctuating between 6's one month (mid-low) and 15's the next (good). 

 

I may just be paranoid because of my miscarriage, but do these signs together indicate low progesterone, or any other condition that I may need to be concerned about, whether for general health or later when I TTC again?  At the very least it seems like my hormones are somewhat instable, fluctuating from normal to out of sync.  Thoughts?



The Mucus Cycle Scoring System is a quantitative way of judging the quality of mucus during the days before, during, and after peak day.  A higher number indicates a mucus pattern that indicates proper hormone functioning and sufficient quantity and quality of mucus to nourish and aid sperm in fertilization.  A higher score (maximum is 16) has been correlated with a higher probability of conception given intercourse in the fertile period in couples without infertility issues.  To a certain extent, some variation is normal.  I don't know to what extent variation is normal or what would indicate a problem.  That would be a question for your instructor or physician.  That is one of the great things about Creighton is that you are in a good position to be connected to the best in women's reproductive healthcare with your charts.  Your instructor would be in the best position to recommend to you if and when you should seek medical care and would know which physicians are trained in NaPro Technology in your area.

 

I'm sorry for your loss.  I would be paranoid too.  Maybe it would be helpful for you to have a preconception appointment with a NaPro trained physician just to set your heart at ease.  That also gets you connected in case you show signs of needing medical support for progesterone or anything else in early pregnancy to prevent another miscarriage.  You won't have to waste time trying to convince a physician that you need help.

 

That said, there is a lot you can do with diet that can aid in helping out your cycles.  For me, I specifically notice that when I eat much sugar, I have terrible mucus patterns and very irregular cycles.  Within my first year of marriage, I had cycles ranging from 27-65 days with LP's ranging from 9-14 days.  I cut out sugar and processed foods, and things got much better so that I was able to conceive.  Before conception, I don't know what my MCSS scores were, but I know they weren't great.  Still, we managed to conceive on our first time trying and had a healthy pregnancy.  More nutrient-rich foods and less sugar can make a huge difference.

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Old 06-06-2011, 08:16 PM
 
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It is great to have someone so knowledgeable here JMJ and I think this is a good discussion.  Personally for me, I am doing a mix of Marquette and symptho-thermal, especially as I learn better my cm patterns.  In my cycle postpartum, I did not get a peak reading on the monitor  (high only) but my temperature did shift so having had both indicators was helpful.  I think as I become more comfortable I will pick but for now, I'm waiting until I am safe under both methods which may make my fertile window longer but help me to relax through this process. 

 

Anyways, great to see everyone's thoughts here!


Mom to three great boys Michael (Sept/01), Carter (Nov/05) and Reid (March/10).

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Old 06-06-2011, 09:28 PM - Thread Starter
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OK, I added you, wilson, and I noted what method those of you who have stated your method are using.  If there is any information (method, how long charting, link to chart, etc) you would like me to add next to your name.  For now, I have left those who are pregnant or TTC separate.

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Old 06-07-2011, 01:48 PM - Thread Starter
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I'm thinking that a wiki might be the way to go. Anybody can update it, so it's not tied to the presence of one person, and as new research/methods come out, people can update it to meet their own needs.

 

In looking around, I found this wiki already, basically what the top of this thread looked like before I made some edits this month. The thing is that it is very specific to the Sympto-Thermal Fertility Awareness Method taught in Taking Charge of Your Fertility. It contains resources for other methods, but it does not go into any details on any other methods... not that it should. It has served us well as an introduction to CTA for a long time. I'm just trying to figure out how to go about this given that there is already a wiki out there with this information. I see three options if we want to go with a wiki/wikis. Feel free to add your own ideas.

 

1. Since this is a wiki, anybody can edit anything except the title. We could attempt to edit this wiki to include all the information we would like to have to introduce all the methods. The only difficulty I see with this is that the title, the only thing that cannot be changed, very clearly states that it is FAM and goes on to explain how FAM is different than NFP. Most of the other methods are NFP and would not fit well under this title.

 

2. Have a separate wiki for each method of FAM/NFP. This would allow us to speak in the terms that are used by that particular method, but it could be more difficult for a reader to compare and combine methods.

 

3. Leave that wiki alone for the most part (besides updating sources or perhaps deleting sources that are specific to another method), and make a separate wiki as an introduction to charting and the rules used by different methods.  There would be some redundancy, as the second thread would include basic information on FAM as taught in TCOYF, but it would leave the first wiki with the purpose of being an introduction to FAM and create a second with the purpose of being an overview of the rules of different methods, using common terms to make it easier to compare and combine methods.

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Old 06-07-2011, 03:17 PM
 
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Hi! Since I've been pregnant I haven't been checking this thread much, but I'm the one who created the FAM wiki page and I would love to see others get in on editing it. I'm pretty sure I invited the CTA thread to do just that when I first put it up.

For what it is worth, here are my 2 cents:

On your suggestion #1: If I recall, I called it FAM only because I thought FAM/NFP would be a mouthful and FAM was more recognizable than CTA. That said, I wouldn't be at all offended if you wanted to create a more general wiki. Then we could edit the FAM article to be just a description of FAM and link to the more general article (maybe titled Charting to Avoid Pregnancy?) for further information.

On your suggestion #2: Again, if you linked each article to the main article and the main article to each individual article, I could see that being very useful. That, of course, would be more work though, and I'm not volunteering! wink1.gif

On your suggestion #3: That would also be fine, as far as I'm concerned.

Oh, and did you see there is also a Types of Natural Family Planning wiki? If you are getting ambitious about the wiki stuff, it would be nice to incorporate that into whatever you come up with.
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Old 06-07-2011, 03:57 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by JMJ View Post

The Mucus Cycle Scoring System is a quantitative way of judging the quality of mucus during the days before, during, and after peak day.  A higher number indicates a mucus pattern that indicates proper hormone functioning and sufficient quantity and quality of mucus to nourish and aid sperm in fertilization.  A higher score (maximum is 16) has been correlated with a higher probability of conception given intercourse in the fertile period in couples without infertility issues.  To a certain extent, some variation is normal.  I don't know to what extent variation is normal or what would indicate a problem.  That would be a question for your instructor or physician.  That is one of the great things about Creighton is that you are in a good position to be connected to the best in women's reproductive healthcare with your charts.  Your instructor would be in the best position to recommend to you if and when you should seek medical care and would know which physicians are trained in NaPro Technology in your area.

 

I'm sorry for your loss.  I would be paranoid too.  Maybe it would be helpful for you to have a preconception appointment with a NaPro trained physician just to set your heart at ease.  That also gets you connected in case you show signs of needing medical support for progesterone or anything else in early pregnancy to prevent another miscarriage.  You won't have to waste time trying to convince a physician that you need help.

 

That said, there is a lot you can do with diet that can aid in helping out your cycles.  For me, I specifically notice that when I eat much sugar, I have terrible mucus patterns and very irregular cycles.  Within my first year of marriage, I had cycles ranging from 27-65 days with LP's ranging from 9-14 days.  I cut out sugar and processed foods, and things got much better so that I was able to conceive.  Before conception, I don't know what my MCSS scores were, but I know they weren't great.  Still, we managed to conceive on our first time trying and had a healthy pregnancy.  More nutrient-rich foods and less sugar can make a huge difference.


Thanks, JMJ!  My OB who recommended Creighton to me is NaPro trained, and I feel really lucky to have stumbled upon him.  I know he will be a big help we we do TTC, but that's still far off, and I don't have another yearly check up until November.  I guess I'm just curious and eager to know.  But I think it will be helpful to have several more months of charts before I go see him and ask all my questions.  So I should probably just be patient.

 

Also, i emailed my instructor for more specific details about the MCScore.  In the past she's told me about what you did, and I guess I was just hoping for more explicit info.  Maybe there is a reason they don't give us the equation to do it ourselves. 

 

 

I don't really have an opinion about all the wiki stuff, but I'll try to support whatever you decide!

 


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