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Old 05-18-2011, 10:53 AM
 
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You could try the Trading post on here; I have bought a couple things a while ago that way.

 

I wouldn't do ebay myself. wonder if you can do amazon marketplace?


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Old 05-18-2011, 02:11 PM
 
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I think the last of you posters maybe didn't read her earlier birth story - she's a precipitous labor gal.

Actually, I did read what she posted. She had several hours, overnight and into the next morning, of early, mild labor. Seems to me that with that she could wait a few hours to make sure any milder contractions are regular and ongoing before heading to the hospital. I'm not saying to wait until labor gets hard. I'm saying to wait a little while until it's clear that contractions are ongoing rather than heading in at the first sign of contractions. If I misunderstood, I apologize.

BFS ~ Is this doctor you keep mentioning your OB that will attend your hospital birth or is she a FP? Did you ask the MW what she thought about when you should head to the hospital?

My MW is a HB MW so she has no opinion about when to head to the hospital, but she did make it sound like she thought I MIGHT not make it in time to get the antibiotics for 4 hours. My doc is a GP. She will be delivering my baby in the hospital. She told me she expects me to go fairly quickly because a) it's a fairly small baby according to her estimation, b) I've been at least 3 cm dilated/80% effaced (and now sounds more like 4/5 cm dilated according to the nurse at the hospital) for at least 2.5 weeks, and c) it's a second baby, and isn't the time supposed to be roughly halved (on average) for those anyway? Which would put me at a labor length of 5 hours if that were true. And it takes them a little while to start the antibiotics once you get there. So that's why I felt like I needed to go in right away, since the antibiotics are my only reason for going to the hospital in the first place. But if they aren't going to give those to me, and instead just hook me up to monitors and shove their fingers up me and presumably stall my labor, or conversely, if everything I experienced the other night is prodormal labor and I just have really fast true labor, well then heck yes, I guess I will stay home longer next time I start cramping up. winky.gif

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Old 05-18-2011, 03:11 PM - Thread Starter
 
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BFS ~ All of that does make it hard to figure out when to go. You need to be at the hospital for at least 4 hours to get the two doses of antibiotics or is that just for one dose? You can always refuse the cervical checks and tell them they'll have to go just by the monitors. From what I read, cervical checks are one of the things that increases the chance of baby getting GBS. They might not like that much but just thinking of myself, those internal checks bother me way more than the monitors and I can see that being more likely to stall my labor. KWIM?

I really don't know what to tell you. I think it really depends on how important you think getting the antibiotics is. If that is extremely important to you, you might just have to keep going in every time you think you could be in labor. That will be a major pain but probably the best way to ensure you have time for the antibiotics. Your other option is to wait until you are pretty sure this is it and just take your chances that you might not make it in time or at all.

I know the ROT is that 2nd and subsequent babies come faster but that's not necessarily the case. Both of my labors with ds2 and ds3 were essentially the same in length and in how the stages were. Because of that, I expect this one to be about the same, too. I'll have to try to keep in mind that it might go a lot faster.

Katrina ~ Isn't there a fee for listing things for sale on the TP? I quit using it when they changed everything a few years ago and said they were going to charge fees for something. I can't remember all the details now.

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Old 05-18-2011, 04:01 PM
 
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MW, they give you the second dose after 4 hours. My doctor said it's best if you get up to the time for the second dose, even if you don't quite get the second dose in. I HATED the cervical check the other night OMG super-painful. But the monitors also really bothered me because I had to lean back in order for it to read baby's heartbeat. I couldn't move around - it wasn't picking up the heartbeat when I did. And that made the contractions really uncomfortable. They have no problems just using Doppler monitoring at my hospital, and that's what I have on my birth plan. That's what they did after the first 20 minutes or so on the monitor, but I'm going to refuse that baseline next time and just have them use the Doppler. But how are they going to tell whether I am progressing if they don't do the cervical checks? I really don't ever want to get another cervical check if I don't have to, TBH.

The antibiotics are obviously important to me, seeing as I switched to a hospital birth for them, but they are not important enough for me to go through multiple false alarms. So I will be waiting a little longer next time. If I don't make it in time for the four hours but make it for the birth, that will be fine. I'll still be glad to be in the hospital for 24 hours or so to observe the baby. And if I don't even make it for the birth, that will be fine too. My midwife can come check us out and we'll just be diligent in watching the baby for symptoms and get him/her a checkup with the doctor as soon as possible too. So at the moment, I am fine with all these possibilities. It'll work out. Now I just have to get myself to be fine with having my MIL witnessing the birth, cuz my mom leaves tomorrow, and if we go to the hospital, my MIL will need to be there for DS.

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Old 05-18-2011, 06:24 PM - Thread Starter
 
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But how are they going to tell whether I am progressing if they don't do the cervical checks? I really don't ever want to get another cervical check if I don't have to, TBH.

How necessary is this? I know it seems necessary to the hospital staff but is it really necessary to you? Your body will progress if you let it and you will be able to tell by the way your contractions are going. I know it's hard for many women to believe that and trust in their bodies but it's the truth. We are the only animals on the planet that think we need constant monitoring and cervical checks to make sure labor is progressing properly. It's really not necessary.

I refused cervical checks during my hospital induction with ds2. I only let the nurse check me once after about 8 hours of labor when the contractions were very painful. The only reason I let her check me was because I was so close to caving and getting an epi and I thought with the contractions was having I must have been very close to done. I figured she'd tell me I was at least 8 cm and I could tell myself to hang on just a little bit longer. Unfortunately, she said I was still only 3 cm so that actually backfired on me.

I refused everything they wanted to do other than the initial induction and the fetal monitor. That made some of the hospital staff and at least one doctor angry.

With my homebirth with ds3, I didn't have any cervical checks. I don't think I let my MW even check baby's heart rate. I remember her trying to at one point and I told her not to touch me. I also never had any internal exams by her when I was pg or at the OB practice where I went for my dual care and I haven't had any internal checks this time.

You definitely have the right to refuse constant heart rate and contraction monitoring, too. You may need someone else with you to help intercede with the hospital staff for you at some point.

Sounds like you've got things settled as far as what to do. Technically, you're not even full term yet. You won't be there until you are 40w. Try to relax and just let things be however they will be. (Easier said than done, I know.)

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Old 05-19-2011, 06:17 AM
 
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Part of the monitoring system is the contraction thing, which I could see if you are not having internal checks to monitor progress, so to speak, they want to be able to see the strength and pattern of contraction as a way of seeing where you are in your labor. (just a thought). DS did not like the external monitors at all. I had to be absolutely still in order for them to stay on him, and even then he tried to kick them away. Much as in theory I do not like the internal monitor (pathway to infection), it allowed me a great deal more freedom of movement. But they can only do that after your water has broken.

 

Assuming you may have a bit more time before the birth, have you tried any of the other methods for reducing or eliminating GBS, like internally applied garlic, or a hibiclens wash, and being re-tested? If you could become GBS(-) then the hospital birth would be a non-issue.If you have, or plan to obtain, an emergency birth kit in the event of a precipitous labor, you could order some hibicleanse with it, just in case, to use during the birth.

 

MW, not sure, about the fSOT here, I will look. I know I didn't pay any fees to buy.

 

Nothing new here. Must say I really, really like my doula so far. she has been so communicative and helpful, and willing to work with me with payment plans, etc. Makes me really wish I had hired a private doula for my first birth. It wouldn't have been her, as she has only been fully trained for 8 months, and started her study while I was pregnant with DS. but still, it is something I wish I had done. oh well.

 

and between the chiro and the massage therapist, I have nearly had no hip pain since I saw them 2 weeks ago! yay!


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Old 05-19-2011, 06:20 AM
 
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MW: from the FSOT guidelines:

 

All members may post items for sale, trade or items to give free of charge. Simply start a new thread in the forum most suited for your item.

so go for it!


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Old 05-19-2011, 07:19 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Thanks, Katrina. I've been meaning to check on that the FSOT board but hadn't gotten around to it. I think I will do that. I used to buy and sell on there all the time until they changed it. Then it got really slow and I just quit checking.

That's wonderful about the chiro and massage helping you. I can't afford to do either right now. Well, that's not entirely true. I could afford it if I stopped buying yarn but I do have my priorities! winky.gif Sometimes my pain is so bad when I try to get out of bed that I cry. I did not have this pain with any of my other pgs. I don't know what the issue is this time, I guess either age or not being in as good physical shape when I got pg. I still can't motivate myself to exercise regularly. Believe it or not with as much as I seem to be on the internet, I spend so much time running around, cleaning, getting up and down to get food or clean someone or check to see if kids can play or just going to the bathroom (lol.gif) that when I do have free time all I want to do is sit.

My babies don't like those monitors either. I don't know how much more info you would get about your contractions with a monitor than you would just know from how you feel. Electronically monitoring contractions would really only be needed (if at all) if Mom is medicated so that she can't feel them herself. I think all of that is more for the convenience of the hospital staff than for any real need to know. I can only compare having to have constant monitoring for my induction and no monitoring at all for my homebirth. I don't know if they can do intermittent contraction monitoring. The constant monitoring was a pain because I couldn't walk around except to use the bathroom. That can definitely stall labor, too. I was able to stand or sit on a birthing ball right next to the bed but, man, that gets boring after a while.

I kept my pediatric appointments for today. I was going to cancel but ds3 has been sick with diarrhea and sporadic vomiting for about 5 days now so I figure I can ask the doc about that. Also, I can ask him about ds2's ears. He gets these splits right where the bottom of his ears meet his head. From what I've read, I think it's related to his eczema but I've never had it looked at because we can't ever see a doc before it clears up. He doesn' t have that now so I don't know if the doc will do anything. He also got his nose smashed on a seesaw a few days ago and now it's bleeding. Seems strange to me that it would start bleeding several days after the injury. He swears he's not picking at it. IDK, though. I hope it doesn't backfire on me. I'm worried about what might happen if the doc starts suggesting all kinds of tests and meds and I refuse, especially after he learns my boys aren't vaxed.

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Old 05-19-2011, 07:37 AM
 
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Hi girls!  I'm back from MD and just going to jump back in!

 

BFS - If I were you, I'd go to the hosp and just hang out in the lobby until I was sure things were moving.  You have no way of knowing how long your labor is going to last, or whether you will manage to squeeze in 2 doses of abx.  Nobody has that knowledge.  I think a lot of times, we think we can micromanage our labors down to the last milisecond b/c we are so educated and know what we absolutely DO NOT want done to our bodies and our babies.  But sometimes, there are things we just cannot know.  If you get to the hospital, hang out a bit in the lobby on the birth ball (excellent suggestion, and something my sister did once.  She told me about this b/c I was freaking out about when to leave for the hospital.  She said worst case, you're there too early and you wait for things to pick up a bit).

Many, many women, without SROM to initiate labor, have no idea what's going on/how far they are/how much time they have.  Even if water does break, who knows if labor is going to start right away?

That strip seems like a doozie.  You have to lay on your back for 20 min or so, right?  Hmm.  Any way you could bring an ipod with hypnosis track on it, or even just calming music, to zen you out while they're doing the test?

 

 

Old convo - Timing/frequency for DD was BD O-2 and O-4, O-5.  Timing/frequency for this boy - O, O-1, O-3, O-4.  HAHA, covered our bases for this little booger, huh? winky.gif

 

27w2d and Baby is still transverse.  I'm going to do some belly mapping today to see really what I'm feeling, but I'm pretty positive I have feet on my lower right and hands on my lower left.  I have no idea what other crazy position he could be in to get that kind of movement going on.  I really want him to get the head-down memo sooner than later.  Otherwise me freaking out about it isn't good, even though I know he has time to turn!  I might just seek out some webster based chiro care for peace of mind.

 

Otherwise, I feel GREAT.  I know last pg by this time I was having so much back pain, early ctx, and just overall malaise that I'm just not having this time.  I wonder if it's less weight gain.  I'm up 30 lbs but I know with DD, I was up at least 40 by this time.  I wonder if my current mw has my old mw's chart info.  I'll ask her at my appt in 2 weeks.

 


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Old 05-19-2011, 08:00 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Well, it seems everyone had boy favorable timing or else it was just in the middle and didn't favor either one. I don't think anyone had a cut off of O-3 or more or every day for several days leading up to and including O, which is supposed to be girl favored timing. If we end up with an essentially equal # of boys and girls, I guess that could help discount the Shettles Method (except for the extremely small sample size, of course).

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Old 05-19-2011, 10:48 AM
 
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as for monitors and contractions, I don't know if I could tell the staff how intense they were, and that is really what they want to know. Ideally they would have more staff to keep better track of the laboring mothers without monitors that they could view from the nurses station. Realistically I know that is just not the reality of staffing at the hospital; they need to keep an eye on several, possibly at once, and can't be with every mama all the time. Now, does every one really need continuous monitoring? NO, and I would say most don't.  For the intensity I can judge comparitively speaking more intense than before, but I never even liked the pain scale. I mean, I think what I am feeling might be an 8, but who is to say how much worse it could get? it may really only be a 3. Or it could be a ten. Honestly I can't even relate contractions to pain. That isn't to say they don't hurt, it just seemed to me more about intensity than pain. When I remember saying, that was a big one! I didn't mean that it was that much more painful, but it was very, very, intense. ( I don't even know if I am making any sense)

 

Carrie, glad you had a good appointment! good luck with the belly mapping. I have another couple months I think before I can really do that, much as I want to! and getting baby to turn . . . the earlier the better!


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Old 05-19-2011, 11:26 AM
 
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I think it also depends on the hospital. At the hospital where I will be delivering, the nurse to patient ratio is 1:1. So my nurse will be able to stay with me for long periods of time to judge the intensity. They do ask for a 20-30 minute baseline strip when you get there but if you are in active labor and it's obvious, they usually skip that and are fine monitoring w/the handheld doppler.


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Old 05-19-2011, 02:33 PM - Thread Starter
 
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as for monitors and contractions, I don't know if I could tell the staff how intense they were, and that is really what they want to know. Ideally they would have more staff to keep better track of the laboring mothers without monitors that they could view from the nurses station. Realistically I know that is just not the reality of staffing at the hospital; they need to keep an eye on several, possibly at once, and can't be with every mama all the time. Now, does every one really need continuous monitoring? NO, and I would say most don't.  For the intensity I can judge comparitively speaking more intense than before, but I never even liked the pain scale. I mean, I think what I am feeling might be an 8, but who is to say how much worse it could get? it may really only be a 3. Or it could be a ten. Honestly I can't even relate contractions to pain. That isn't to say they don't hurt, it just seemed to me more about intensity than pain. When I remember saying, that was a big one! I didn't mean that it was that much more painful, but it was very, very, intense. ( I don't even know if I am making any sense)


My point was that none of that monitoring or trying to gauge pain levels is really necessary. Even with all of that there's still no way to know ahead of time how long it will be. If labor is allowed to progress naturally, it will just happen regardless of how easy or difficult or intense it may seem. The problem is that hospital staff need to have someway to judge where you are for their own purposes that really have nothing to do with whether or not everything is okay.

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Old 05-19-2011, 04:03 PM
 
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Excuse my brain, it's a bit fuzzy, but what about talking to your Dr about it, and perhaps having him leave instructions to start the antibiotics when you get there, without having an internal/monitoring, or maybe doing one quick 15-20 minute strip, and then not doing the checks or strips after that. You can do the abx in a 20 minute dose, and then they could turn them off, and you can go about your thing, being your own judge of whether you're progressing enough to stay, or go home. I know it's a long shot to get them to agree to it, but it may be worth it. And the worst case scenario is that you get an extra dose of the antibiotics. If you feel like things are progressing you can submit to another monitoring period after a few hours, and then stay, or you can go home, and just come back again once things feel like they're moving again. 

 

 

Told the families last night. So many funny stories, but I'm too fried right now to type. lol. 


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Old 05-20-2011, 06:11 AM
 
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Yeah, they don't know how long it will be, but medical staff in general (and most  laboring mothers) like to at least know where they are. Since it isn't a 1-1 ratio for care providers they need to know who to focus on when. I think, just by observation, they could tell which stage of labor a mama was in, (obs as in external cues), but how many women think they must be in or near transition, and really only be 3 cm dilated? especially when it is your first time. I guess my point is, outside a home setting, have some guage as to stage and progress of labor is helpful to those that are attending you, especially as some women go through several shifts of care providers. I think I went through at least 2 or 3. I lost track.

 

Inside the home, where you are the only patient, and your midwife and possibly doula are the only ones there, those measures are a lot less important.

 

Hope everyone has good weekend plans! even if all they are is sleep!


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Old 05-20-2011, 06:54 AM
 
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Busy weekend for us. This morning, I have an OB appt and we're going to do a NST to see how Ava's doing in there w/the restricted blood flow. And I have my first baby shower on Sunday! I'm so excited to get together with a large group of women that are important in my life and celebrate this new little woman that is coming in to our lives!

 

DH told me last night that he wants us to reconsider our pediatrician choice. The dr that we had chosen is the ped for my step-kids. I like him fine but I know that I'll have to play "the game" with him regarding an alternate vaccine schedule. He told me flat out that he prefers to stick with the schedule that the practice has created although he was o.k. with delaying the Hep B vaccine until it's time for her to start kindergarten. He's part of a larger practice so there are 3 locations in my town. At his office, it's just him and another dr. There are two main nurses there and they know us by name and when I call to talk to one of the nurses, they know me and I don't feel like we're just a chart there. At the main office, there are 8 docs and multiple nurses and they don't know us really over there. But there are a couple of more alternative-friendly docs at that office. I want to stay with the practice in general because they are the only pediatrician's office in town that has office hours until 10 PM Mon-Sat and until 8 PM on Sunday. So if something comes up after 5 PM, you can go there instead of having to go to an urgent care facility or the ER.  I really like that a lot. So I guess I need to schedule an appt to talk to one of the other docs to see if we want to switch over to the main office. I just really like the more personal touch at the smaller office. But is it worth playing the game so that the nurses know us by name?


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Old 05-20-2011, 07:21 AM
 
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The only reason I think they need to do cervical checks is in case the same thing happens again - I'm not really in labor or my labor stalls out. Of course, now I'm thinking there's a good chance it was the check itself that stalled it out if indeed it did stall out, because it was very uncomfortable.

I personally think the monitor is totally useless - the cervical check tells you more. I don't plan to get monitored again. I can't really figure out what it will tell them other than, oh the baby's heartbeat is too high, oh no wait, that was just something weird with the monitor...oh hey we lost the heartbeat...oh never mind, mom moved a little...hmm heartbeat is too slow...oh wait, that's mom's heartbeat we're hearing...at least that was my experience the other night. The whole time I'm sitting/lying back in a really uncomfortable position. The nurse was totally fine with just using the Doppler so that is not an issue.

I'm not going to go hang out in the hospital lobby, because I'm only 5-10 minutes or so away, and the ONLY reason I want to be in the hospital is for the antibiotics. If they're not going to start the antibiotics (which they're not, unless I'm actually in labor apparently, which how they can tell without cervical checks?) then I don't want to be there. That's the whole issue. winky.gif Anyway, I have pretty much thought through what I'm going to do. If contractions start off really mild or if they get kicked off by sex again, I will wait to make sure they are getting stronger and are at least regular, at least an hour or two before going in, so I don't stall out again. If my water breaks, I will go in soon afterwards, because I know they'll start the antibiotics then. I might wait for contractions, but then again, I might not. If contractions start out really strong, I'll go right away. And if I start pushing at home, well, I'll have a baby at home. smile.gif I'm also having my DH try to pick up some Hibicleans after work today so if we do wait it out at home for a little while and end up not making it for the antibiotics, we will have at least done something to get rid of some of the GBS. shrug.gif

Anyway, who knows what will happen with my labor. I'm just trying to be prepared for all the possibilities.

Weekend plans, anyone? The end of the world is tomorrow I guess...it would be fun to have an end of the world baby! lol.gif

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Old 05-20-2011, 07:31 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Annie ~ I'm definitely not one to ask about pediatricians right now unless you are in a mood to say F them all. lol.gif Excuse my language. I am so fed up with them. I didn't tell you all about my experience yesterday. I kept the ped appointment I had rescheduled because my boys weren't feeling well. They gave me all the paperwork to fill out at home the last time I was there, which I did for the most part. I wasn't really comfortable with the developmental and behavior questionnaires. I don't know why those are necessary unless someone expresses a concern. There was one other thing I had a major problem with. On the sheet to sign for acknowledging receipt of their privacy policies was a very general blanket statement that said something like, "I give permission for the doctors and staff of (the practice) to provide medical treatment for or to my child." I never have and I never will knowingly sign a blanket statement like that giving anyone permission to do anything to me or any of my children. I told the receptionist that I had issue with that and wouldn't agree to that statement. Of course, no one knew what to do because no one had ever refused to sign that. Finally, after talking to 3 other people, the officer manager said that they couldn't see my kids if I didn't sign that paper because the doctors needed permission just to see my kids. I tried to explain to them that I don't have a problem giving them permission to provide specific medical care on a case by case basis, such as the physicals we were there for at that time. I just wasn't going to give them blanket permission to treat my children any time in any way they saw fit. Obviously, if I take my kids there for physicals and am in the exam room while it is going on, I am giving them permission to provide that medical care. Either they didn't understand what I was saying or they just wanted to be hard-asses but they still refused to see my kids. I collected all my paperwork back up and left and I will not be going back there.

I should have gone with my initial gut instinct, which was that place was not for us. It occurred to me that this baby will be covered by TriCare Prime for the first 2 or 3 months of life. If I really need to take him to a doctor, I will be able to take him on base, I believe. I guess there could be an issue with whomever is assigned as his PCM since I won't be choosing one but I can always have that changed. I also need to check on the details about that anyway. I don't recall having any difficulty seeing or needing to get referrals for the civilian doctor I wanted to see when ds2 and ds3 were very young like that.

Here's what really irks me about all of this. Doctors are supposed to be providing a service to us, just like any other service. The only difference is that their services can save lives. We go to them for their expertise but the decisions on what to do should be left up to us as consumers/clients. They should not be able to refuse to provide us with their expert opinions just because we may choose not to accept it. Because of the vulnerable position that we, as parents, are in when we take our children to doctors, refusing to even see our children unless we agree to do what they want is the worst kind of coercion. If they are really mainly concerned with caring for people and keeping them healthy, how can they, in good conscience, refuse to provide minimal medical care? It makes me wonder why most of them really went into medicine. Ok, rant over. Off my soapbox.gif.

So, yeah, I'm not going to comment much more on what to do about doctors because I don't have anything nice or positive to say right now.

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Old 05-20-2011, 07:35 AM
 
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Wow, MW. Yeah, doctors are really not authority figures, they are people who happen to be knowledgeable medically who we come to for medical advice and help. They shouldn't have authority over us, and we shouldn't have to give them permission to do whatever they want in order for them to do anything for us...

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Old 05-20-2011, 07:43 AM
 
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MW: I would be totally hacked off too if that had happened to me! Blanket statements like that are the worst and I can understand why you wouldn't sign it. Of course, in my situation, it probably would have been DH that refused to sign it because it wouldn't have set off any warning bells to me at first but that's why we make a good team. At the end of the day, the current ped has not refused treatment of any of the current kids because we have declined certain things but I just don't want to have to deal with the fight, you know? For instance, DH had to have a pretty lengthy convo with him when it was "time" for DSD 13 to get the Gardasil vaccine. When DH said "no thanks" when the vaccine was offered, it wasn't the ped's first response to say "o.k. that's fine". And I guess I can understand why he felt the need to debate it with DH. I'm sure he sees many parents that have not done their homework and so are not clear on what they are refusing or declining. So he feels the need to make sure the parents know exactly why he feels it's necessary. But I'd like to get to the point where the ped, whoever we choose, respects that DH and I do our homework and if we say "no thanks" or "not right now" then we are doing it from a learned position. That's the point that I am at with my OB and I'm thankful that he understands that I'm not just making decisions by the seat of my pants, you know?


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Old 05-20-2011, 08:07 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I'm so glad you all understand. I left there feeling like maybe I was some sort of over-reactive freak. I almost told them the reason no one else had ever refused that was either because they didn't read it or they are too ignorant to understand what it means, legally. They kept trying to tell me they would never do anything without my express permission and I kept telling them that it didn't matter if they told me that, especially when I wasn't even talking to the a doctor, becauase, legally, if I signed that statement, anyone in their staff could. My dh is not one to say no or even think about anything. If a doc tells him something needs to be done, he just goes along with it. That's a big concern for me if he ever has to take the kids to the doc without me. I've talked to my dh about this many, many times but he either just doesn't get it or can't handle the confrontation. I think it's a little of both. He's always had issues with confrontation.

As to the cervical checks and monitoring, I think it's actually the opposite. I think regular contractions is what alerts everyone that a woman is in labor. Cervical checks only tell if and how quickly or slowly the cervix is dilating and effacing. The problem with relying solely on that is that labor can go on for hours before the cervix shows any signs of really moving. With my labor with ds2, I had regular, good contractions for about 10 hours that got very strong, intense and painful at the end of that 2 hours but my cervix was still only 2-3 cm dilated according to the nurse. However, 2 hours later I was fully dilated and ready to push. That doesn't mean that those first 10 hours weren't real labor and only the last 2 hours counted. It just meant that either it took a while for my cervix is relax enough to move or the nurse doing the check didn't know what she was doing. So, to me, it seems the hospital staff would get more info out of contraction monitoring that would show them how long, strong and frequent the contractions were rather than one cervical check, especially if you've already been a few centimeters dilated and effaced for a few weeks. KWIM? Now, if they kept you in the hospital for a few hours and did comparison cervical checks and could tell that your cervix was moving, that would support the fact that your labor was progressing. But I don't see how doing one cervical check when you first get there would really tell them much of anything unless you were over halfway dilated.

IMO, there's no need for internal checks regardless of where you are giving birth. If you follow your body's cues and your body tells you it's time to push, then it's safe to assume that your cervix is fully open. You do not need anyone there to catch your baby when s/he comes out unless you're on your back with your rear end all the way at the end of the bed or table so that baby would fall out on the floor. If you don't have an epi you can be in any position that allows you to hold/catch your own baby as s/he comes out or your SO or another support person you have with you can do that. The idea that someone needs to be underneath you with their head stuck between your legs is really not necessary. That's all for the convenience of the doctor and hospital staff, who don't really need to be in the room. Of course, it's a different story if the mother wants them in the room. All I'm saying is that what the doctors and the hospital staff say is necessary isn't really necessary for mom and baby. It's necessary for hospital procedure and the convenience and liability of the doctors and staff.

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Old 05-20-2011, 08:11 AM
 
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MW, that would have steamed me, and really set off DH. He is way more sensitive to those sorts of things than I am. I know when we were seeing the ped, we went with a wait and see approach to the vaccines (verbally - in our head we know it's not gonna happen). It is one of those things that helps keep the peace. We will likely do the same with this baby.

 

as it is, we had to fight the hospital to leave without naming DS; it isn't that we really hadn't decided, it was just we far prefer to do the registration ourselves, and in our own time. It was the weekend, so the registrar person wasn't in. Turns out, we got an extremely apologetic phone call on Monday letting us know (which we did already) that OF COURSE we don't have to name the baby right away; you have up to a year to do all that. I wanted to tell the people in the hospital to try telling our insurance company that they are holding us for no good medical reason and try getting them to pay for additional hospital days for nothing more than a bullying admin measure.

 

I would stick with who I know, and the small office. The ped we technically use is a small office, we have friends that even work in the office, so that is nice.

 

DS is 18 months old today!


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Old 05-20-2011, 08:55 AM
 
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I'm so glad you all understand. I left there feeling like maybe I was some sort of over-reactive freak. I almost told them the reason no one else had ever refused that was either because they didn't read it or they are too ignorant to understand what it means, legally. They kept trying to tell me they would never do anything without my express permission and I kept telling them that it didn't matter if they told me that, especially when I wasn't even talking to the a doctor, becauase, legally, if I signed that statement, anyone in their staff could. My dh is not one to say no or even think about anything. If a doc tells him something needs to be done, he just goes along with it. That's a big concern for me if he ever has to take the kids to the doc without me. I've talked to my dh about this many, many times but he either just doesn't get it or can't handle the confrontation. I think it's a little of both. He's always had issues with confrontation.

As to the cervical checks and monitoring, I think it's actually the opposite. I think regular contractions is what alerts everyone that a woman is in labor. Cervical checks only tell if and how quickly or slowly the cervix is dilating and effacing. The problem with relying solely on that is that labor can go on for hours before the cervix shows any signs of really moving. With my labor with ds2, I had regular, good contractions for about 10 hours that got very strong, intense and painful at the end of that 2 hours but my cervix was still only 2-3 cm dilated according to the nurse. However, 2 hours later I was fully dilated and ready to push. That doesn't mean that those first 10 hours weren't real labor and only the last 2 hours counted. It just meant that either it took a while for my cervix is relax enough to move or the nurse doing the check didn't know what she was doing. So, to me, it seems the hospital staff would get more info out of contraction monitoring that would show them how long, strong and frequent the contractions were rather than one cervical check, especially if you've already been a few centimeters dilated and effaced for a few weeks. KWIM? Now, if they kept you in the hospital for a few hours and did comparison cervical checks and could tell that your cervix was moving, that would support the fact that your labor was progressing. But I don't see how doing one cervical check when you first get there would really tell them much of anything unless you were over halfway dilated.

IMO, there's no need for internal checks regardless of where you are giving birth. If you follow your body's cues and your body tells you it's time to push, then it's safe to assume that your cervix is fully open. You do not need anyone there to catch your baby when s/he comes out unless you're on your back with your rear end all the way at the end of the bed or table so that baby would fall out on the floor. If you don't have an epi you can be in any position that allows you to hold/catch your own baby as s/he comes out or your SO or another support person you have with you can do that. The idea that someone needs to be underneath you with their head stuck between your legs is really not necessary. That's all for the convenience of the doctor and hospital staff, who don't really need to be in the room. Of course, it's a different story if the mother wants them in the room. All I'm saying is that what the doctors and the hospital staff say is necessary isn't really necessary for mom and baby. It's necessary for hospital procedure and the convenience and liability of the doctors and staff.

I agree with everything you're saying. I know cervical checks and everything else is not strictly necessary. Of course. That's why I was going to do a homebirth originally. My HB MW would never have touched my nether regions unless I asked her too. I'm just saying, I can time the contractions and tell the staff whether they are getting stronger, if they are regular, and so forth. I don't need the monitor to tell me that. But I don't know what my cervix is doing, and if the hospital won't give me antibiotics until they see my cervix dilating, or if they don't believe the contractions are doing anything and want to send me home, then they "need" to do cervical checks. And I'm not talking about one, I'm talking about the two they did the other night that showed I hadn't changed (much), thus they sent me home. It was just that the first one was the more uncomfortable of the two, and if anything stalled my labor, I'm sure it was that.

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Old 05-20-2011, 11:04 AM
 
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BFS: Have you read Ina May's Guide to Childbirth? She talks a lot about rough or unexpected vaginal exams stalling or reversing dilation. It's the Sphincter Law.

 

AFM: Just back from my OB appt. NST went well. Baby's heartrate looks good so nothing further to do until my ultrasound next Friday. After that, I will be on weekly appointments and we will do the NST at every appointment. It was nice to sit and listen to her heartbeat for 20 minutes! Oh and the sweetest thing happened while I was hooked up to the monitor. I got to the appt before DH and so I was already in the room and hooked up when he walked in. As soon as she heard his voice, her heartrate shot up! She recognized him! love.gif


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Old 05-20-2011, 11:29 AM
 
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Annie, how sweet!

I have read Ina May's guide.

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Old 05-20-2011, 11:51 AM
 
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Hi ladies!  Hope everyone is having a good Friday!  

 

Good news about the itching - it seems to have passed for the most part - still get it once in a while but not nearly as often or as intense.  But I did read something interesting - not at all proven but just a theory someone had - they tested the papules or rashes of women who had PUPP (which I DO NOT have) and they found that they had male DNA in them - so there is theory (the website really stressed that this is just a theory and not to be taken too seriously) that male DNA can sometimes cause skin irritation in some women.  So now my DH is convinced that we are having a boy!  That and the fact that the car seat and stroller combo I bought was blue! lol

 

Also, I went to my family doctor yesterday and she finally checked the heart beat and the fundal height - of course all she said was that it was fine.  I think that the only reason she checked it was so that she could write on my chart that she had because she asked me first when my apt with the OB was and when I said next month she said - oh, well come lie down and she checked me out.  So thankfully that was the last time I see her for this pregnancy and now I can got o someone who actually seems to know what they are doing and they seem to care a little more - the only down side is that it is 1.5 hours away, but I am ok with that.

 

So I has read earlier int he thread that some of you were taking iron?  I think I may need extra as well - I am soooooo tired - I went to get groceries today and couldn't even finish it I had to come home.  Just wondering how much I should be taking?  I do take a prenatal, so I don't want to overload on it but I am ready to try anything at this point.  My kids are so sick of me hearing "not right now mommy is too tired".

 

Annie - how exciting for you to be so close to meeting your baby!  I can't wait for that time - although I am trying to enjoy every minute of this pregnancy since it will be my last.

 

MW - I would have been mad too - my husband would have picked up on it before me though, you would think they would have let you wrtie your own statement at the bottom and sign that - that's what they do here at the hospital - when we sign the forms when we are admitted we can change, cross out or add anything to it as long as we initial it.


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Old 05-21-2011, 05:21 PM
 
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AFM: Just back from my OB appt. NST went well. Baby's heartrate looks good so nothing further to do until my ultrasound next Friday. After that, I will be on weekly appointments and we will do the NST at every appointment. It was nice to sit and listen to her heartbeat for 20 minutes! Oh and the sweetest thing happened while I was hooked up to the monitor. I got to the appt before DH and so I was already in the room and hooked up when he walked in. As soon as she heard his voice, her heartrate shot up! She recognized him! love.gif


Oh goodness, that's awesome!  So sweet!!

 

So far, the only way we know baby knows Daddy is around is b/c whenever DH puts his hand on my belly, baby stops moving!  He could be kicking up a storm and as soon as I gesture for DH to feel, he's completely still and silent.  What a booger!  I think that's pretty common but I really wonder WHY that happens.  It's so not cool!!  

 

Nm going on with me, just taking it as easy as I feel.  

 

Only 5 more weekends of work left before I'm done!!  I can't even tell you how happy that makes me.  And how freaked out I am that I have so little time left in this pregnancy!!  Holy how this is FLYING!! 

 

 

 


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Old 05-21-2011, 05:31 PM
 
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Dh was putting lotion on my belly this morning, and I was talking about feeling my uterus and attempting to find the HB again (I haven't been to the dr since 8 weeks, 12 now, so I haven't heard it yet. Any tips for finding either? 

 

I'm pretty small to begin with, but I know I'm supposed to try to find the HB with a full bladder, and I just. cannot. do. it. The pressure makes me feel like I'm going to explode. I can find mine at either side inside my hip bones, but no luck with baby's yet. I know I'm looking pretty far down, but I don't remember how far down. DH thinks the doppler isn't strong enough, but it says 10-12weeks. Any tips other than low down?

 

Also, I got curious and wanted to try to find my uterus, because I'm under the impression that I should be able to feel it, but everything i feel DH laughs at me and tells me it's just a muscle. What am I looking for, and what will it feel like once I've found it? lol


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Old 05-21-2011, 06:20 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Annie ~ That is very cool!

Carrie ~ The same thing happens here any time one of my boys tries to feel the baby move. Baby seems to know the difference between my touch and everyone else's because he continues to move like crazy when I put my hand on my belly but stops immediately for anyone else. Even if I just tell someone to look at my belly because it's moving like crazy, he'll stop. It's so strange.

JJ ~ I don't know if I can explain it in a post here. I never needed a full bladder so I'd say quit trying that, especially if it's so hard for you. I don't know that you necessarily have to have the doppler really low. I think I always found the baby's sort of right in the middle between my pelvic bone and my belly button. I suggest you move the doppler around and try several different places. My baby always moved away from the doppler as soon as I found his heartbeat so it was a quick, fleeting sound rather than a continuous thumpity, thump. He does the same thing still every time my MW listens for it at my prenatals. So, you may hear it for a second and then it's gone and you'll have to move the doppler slightly here or there.

And on the fundus, did you tell your dh that it is a muscle? Of course, that's what you are feeling. lol.gif That's another one that's hard for me to explain because I don't know all the technical terms and such. If you start down low pressing and move up, you should eventually get to a point where your belly is much softer than before and your fingers sink in. Go back down a little bit and you should feel a harder resistance. Find the edge of that and that should be your fundus. You can do it the opposite direction, too. Start up higher where your belly is soft and move down until you feel a harder resistance. Feel back up until you find the edge of that hardness and that should be the top of your fundus. I hope that all makes sense.

mom2one ~ That has always been my experience, too. I've been able to cross out, initial and date anything I didn't want to agree and put in my own statement. I was perfectly willing to write at the bottom that I would give them my express permission to treat my children on a case by case basis. That's why I wonder if the office staff didn't understand what I was talking about. They just kept saying that no one would do anything without my permission. eyesroll.gif

With the iron, I was told to just follow the directions on the bottle, which is 2 tsps. two times a day. My MW did tell me not to eat or drink any dairy or take any calcium for an hour before or an hour after taking the iron because calcium can interfere with the absorption of iron. After having my iron checked again, I may be able to lower the dose a little. Can you call your FP or the OB you are going to see and ask about the iron? Iron can be dangerous if you get too much. I'm not sure how important it is to have your iron level checked rather than just going by how you feel.

AFM, I've decided I am definitely depressed. My sadness and crying and irritability has gotten worse rather than better. I haven't gotten around to trying to find any mood tea or St. John's Wort. I have a prenatal on Monday so I'll try to bring it up then. I don't know how successful I'll be because I'll probably start to cry and I hate to cry in front of others.

Part of what is causing my sadness is not hearing from my dh. He finally sent me an email today after 10 or 11 days in response to the last email I sent him. He didn't say much. Just said he was sorry for being out of touch but he'd been out and about. Just got back and it was the middle of the night so he was going to sleep. Somehow I knew he's respond to that email because it was about the house and not being able to sell it. I knew that would get his attention when regular family chat wouldn't. That's another reason why I'm depressed. It's hard to explain. I feel like he's not sharing anything with me and not really interested in us. He has not once asked how I'm feeling or how the pregnancy is going. He'd probably say that's because I always tell him if something comes up but, still. I'd think he'd ask sometimes. I feel abandoned and very alone.


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Old 05-21-2011, 06:33 PM
 
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So far, the only way we know baby knows Daddy is around is b/c whenever DH puts his hand on my belly, baby stops moving!  He could be kicking up a storm and as soon as I gesture for DH to feel, he's completely still and silent.  What a booger!  I think that's pretty common but I really wonder WHY that happens.  It's so not cool!!  

>

We always figured it was because DH's hand was warmer and he used more pressure than me. shrug.gif I don't know if that's the real reason or not.
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Originally Posted by jeninejessica View Post

Dh was putting lotion on my belly this morning, and I was talking about feeling my uterus and attempting to find the HB again (I haven't been to the dr since 8 weeks, 12 now, so I haven't heard it yet. Any tips for finding either? 

 

I'm pretty small to begin with, but I know I'm supposed to try to find the HB with a full bladder, and I just. cannot. do. it. The pressure makes me feel like I'm going to explode. I can find mine at either side inside my hip bones, but no luck with baby's yet. I know I'm looking pretty far down, but I don't remember how far down. DH thinks the doppler isn't strong enough, but it says 10-12weeks. Any tips other than low down?

 

Also, I got curious and wanted to try to find my uterus, because I'm under the impression that I should be able to feel it, but everything i feel DH laughs at me and tells me it's just a muscle. What am I looking for, and what will it feel like once I've found it? lol


It feels kind of like a ridge to me. MW described it well. Try after having an orgasm if you can...that was the only way I could feel it for a while.
Quote:
Originally Posted by MarineWife View Post

AFM, I've decided I am definitely depressed. My sadness and crying and irritability has gotten worse rather than better. I haven't gotten around to trying to find any mood tea or St. John's Wort. I have a prenatal on Monday so I'll try to bring it up then. I don't know how successful I'll be because I'll probably start to cry and I hate to cry in front of others.

Part of what is causing my sadness is not hearing from my dh. He finally sent me an email today after 10 or 11 days in response to the last email I sent him. He didn't say much. Just said he was sorry for being out of touch but he'd been out and about. Just got back and it was the middle of the night so he was going to sleep. Somehow I knew he's respond to that email because it was about the house and not being able to sell it. I knew that would get his attention when regular family chat wouldn't. That's another reason why I'm depressed. It's hard to explain. I feel like he's not sharing anything with me and not really interested in us. He has not once asked how I'm feeling or how the pregnancy is going. He'd probably say that's because I always tell him if something comes up but, still. I'd think he'd ask sometimes. I feel abandoned and very alone.

hug2.gif I'm so sorry you're feeling this way MW. And sorry your DH isn't being in contact with you enough. When does he come home this time?

AFM, I am having irregular, completely manageable contractions. Not as strong or close together as the other night. So not sure if they will fizzle out or turn into something. I did have sex at about 2:30 and these started around 3:45, so not sure if they're connected to that or not. I kinda wish they would get obvious.

Mommy to an exuberant 3 yo bouncy.gif and a new one!  nak.gif

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