May 2011 Whatever Ladies Graduates - Mothering Forums
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#1 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 06:14 AM - Thread Starter
 
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lyeterae ~ Baby boy born February 2011
annie ~ Baby girl born April 7, 2011
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Link to old thread: http://www.mothering.com/community/forum/thread/1305135/the-whatever-ladies-graduate

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#2 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 06:21 AM
 
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Subbing!!!  Thanks MW!!


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#3 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 06:42 AM
 
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wave.gif  I've been poking my baby, too.  And wiggling her little parts around.  luxlove.gif  I don't think there's any harm in it unless we're actually trying to move them (like an external version).  LOL!  I think she's more posterior now...not completely, but instead of getting kicks in the upper right quadrant they are now center to upper left, plus quite a bit in the lower left that I'm not sure if they are kicks or punches.  I'm a bit concerned about her being breech, even.  I've been doing a lot more hands and knees, pelvic tilts, etc., esp. when she's active, and I finally got my birth ball blown up to sit on at the computer.  It's not big enough, though, so I'm thinking about getting a new one.  It's a 55 inch & I've seen different places say that size is good for up to 5'2" or 5'3".  I'm 5'2", but I must have a bit longer legs than the average 5'2" woman.  lol.gif  I do have it overinflated now to get enough height, but I guess that could make it more likely to pop.  The best part about switching from my desk chair to the birth ball is my feet aren't falling asleep when I sit anymore.  

 


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#4 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 06:54 AM
 
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I think that feeling, poking, prodding the baby is perfectly safe. They ARE pretty well cushioned in there after all. I'm constantly poking around at mine but I'm terrible at telling what is what. I know the baby is head-down and I can usually tell which side the back is on, but other than that I don't know. Sometimes there is something poking out and I don't know if it is a foot, hand, elbow or what!

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#5 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 06:57 AM
 
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Thanks for the new thread MW! Can you do me a favor when you get a moment? My due date is 7/21 not 7/2 although with the way things are going, she could be here by 7/2.

 

MW: I like the changing table from Target best. Mostly because I like the way it looks. You could probably resell it pretty easily too when you are done with it.

 

Baby_Cakes: That's so awesome that you get to be a SAHM! I'm really starting to have a hard time with the fact that I'm going to have to leave Ava at 7 weeks PP. I'd love to be able to stay home for the first year at least.

 

JJ: GRRRR! That's so frustrating that you are having such a hard time with finding a midwife or an OB! I hope something opens up but not because someone has lost their baby. Maybe someone is moving or has decided that they want OB care rather than a midwife.

 

AFM: To answer the "poking" question, yes, I poke Ava a lot in the evenings. That's when she really gets going in my belly so I'll lay in bed and poke her and she will kick me back. It's super fun but DH is always saying "Leave that baby alone!" and then saying to my belly "Ava, tell Mommy to stop messing with you!". Oh and for you ladies that are hearing the heartbeat with the regular stethescope, how are you finding it? Whenever I've tried, I mostly pick up the sounds in my intestinal tract rather than anything that sounds like the baby!

 

I did some research over the weekend regarding my low PAPP-A level and Ava's growth. I decided that I didn't want to just wait until my next appointment to discuss this with my doctor so I called his office this morning to schedule something and they had not received the results yet from the scan on Friday. So I have to call back this afternoon after my OB has taken a look at it. I'd like to know if there is anything that I can do to improve her blood flow, even if it means modified bedrest. Also, if she is delivered at 34 weeks or sooner, I have to switch hospitals which means switching OBs and I would like to avoid that if possible.


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#6 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 07:15 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Oh, thank goodness I'm not the only one messing with my baby. I'm obsessed. I do it mostly at night, too, Annie, because that's when this one gets to really moving around. I lay in bed and watch my belly dance and then try to figure out what position he is in. The only reason I can maybe tell body parts is because I asked my MW at my last prenatal. She can't tell a foot from a knee or hand, either, though. At least I know that I was right that it was an appendage. I can tell baby's back when he's on one side or the other because it's long and hard. I can't really feel his head lower down in my belly so I have to take my MW's word on that.

Last night, he was head down with his back running along my right side. This morning when I got up he had switched sides so that his back was running along my left side. That's new because he's almost always been on my right side. I see large movements and bulges and feel very definite somethings in between my belly button and my ridcage and little fluttery movements down low near my pubic bone that makes me confident he is mostly head down. He does still turn transverse sometimes, though.

I got involved in a What Position Is My Baby In? thread on my DDC and it's kind of funny. Women came on there posting that baby was head down at 22 or 24w and would stay there or were worried that baby was breech at their 20w u/s. I don't get it. There was still so much time for baby to move around. I've asked several times how anyone can be confident that baby will stay head down after 24w and got no response. I googled it a little and it doesn't seem to be an issue until after 36w so I don't get why people are worried about baby being breech in the 2nd trimester. shrug.gif

Shannon ~ What is posterior? I can never keep posterior and anterior (or whatever the opposite is) straight. I think in my brain the names should mean the opposite.

Annie ~ What is a PAPP-A level and how does that cause blood flow restriction? I've never heard of that before. Is that essentially the same as IUGR?

You made me laugh with your dh's comment about leaving Ava alone. I can so hear my dh saying that to me. It's so amazing, though, when you think about having this whole other person moving around inside your body. Last night this little guy was going crazy. My belly was rippling and bulging and jumping like crazy. It was so fun to watch! My ds2 is sometimes interested in feeling baby move but neither ds1 nor ds3 are. I think ds3 just doesn't have the patience/attention span to wait for him to move. It never fails that baby will be squirming around in there like crazy until I tell someone to look or put their hand on my belly. Then he stops.

DS2 is more interested in my pregnancy in general. He was asking me the other day when the baby would be opening his eyes. He gets this stuff from reading my weekly Babycenter pregnancy emails. I couldn't remember but he said he thought it was 28w. I got my 27w email, which said baby would be opening and closing his eyes. I told ds that but didn't mention that I was 27w. So, he looks at me and says, "Hm...you are 27w now, right? Interesting." That from a 7yo. lol.gif

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#7 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 07:26 AM
 
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Annie, fx for good results so that baby Ava can cook as long as possible, and you can stay with your OB!

 

I see no harm in poking the baby, really. They are well cushioned, and generally we aren't trying to move them with our hands or otherwise force things.

 

As for the stethoscope, it may be the sort of stethoscope you are using. I have one similiar to this, but not heart shaped. It is still early yet, so when I do find the heartbeat, it is faint. it also helps to be in an area that is otherwise completely quiet so I can focus. It really does sound like a horse galloping. sometimes I hear taps and bumps too, which might be movement. I can usually rule out bowel sounds, as I am placing the stethoscope right on my uterus, and most of the bowels are moved up or to the side to accomodate the baby. I also press down firmly. any slower swishy sounds are either my own heartbeat, or echoes of bowel sounds.

 

MW: I like the 2nd one . . .it is more like furniture, but I am a sucker for a sale, so if the Target one is more in line with your budget, do that instead.

 

Carrie, yay on the SAHM front! wish I could also join you! There is no way DH will make enough money once he is out of school - for massage therapy - to support us. But it is something he can easily do in my off hours, so we can keep the kiddo(s) out of day care. He will graduate 9/2 I think.


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#8 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 08:51 AM
 
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Posterior is a baby who is facing up or out, rather than facing your back.  I used to get them mixed up all the time.  DD was posterior and rotated late in labor, I think I was stuck at 7 or 8 cms and had to lay on my side, blowing thru ctx for like an hour (OMG the most painful thing I ever did) and then all of a sudden I felt a pop and a turn/flip and she was anterior.  Then I was complete in like a minute and pushing!

 

I was talking to DH last night about how I'm not really looking fwd to labor, and said that I was really just eager to get to pushing.  That I like pushing.  That if I can just have a little bit of a shorter labor it would be nice, but that I really just can't wait to be pushing this baby out.  And he was like, "That's so weird. I would think it would be the opposite.  Just coming from my perspective, it seems like pushing is the tricky part and the labor is the easy part."  What a thing for a man to say, huh?  I told him that's just not how it feels.  Labor is intense and crazy and you have to deal with each ctx and hope to make it through each one -- but pushing!  Pushing is productive!  Pushing actually gives you your baby!!  LOL!!

 

 

MW - that is adorable about your DS.  How fun that he's so interested and involved. 

 


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#9 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 09:12 AM
 
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Annie ~ What is a PAPP-A level and how does that cause blood flow restriction? I've never heard of that before. Is that essentially the same as IUGR?

You made me laugh with your dh's comment about leaving Ava alone. I can so hear my dh saying that to me. It's so amazing, though, when you think about having this whole other person moving around inside your body. Last night this little guy was going crazy. My belly was rippling and bulging and jumping like crazy. It was so fun to watch! My ds2 is sometimes interested in feeling baby move but neither ds1 nor ds3 are. I think ds3 just doesn't have the patience/attention span to wait for him to move. It never fails that baby will be squirming around in there like crazy until I tell someone to look or put their hand on my belly. Then he stops.
 


It stands for Pregnancy Associated Plasma Protein-A. Basically, it's a protein that our placentas release. If the level is low, then it can cause IUGR, pre-eclampsia and/or small gestational age. I'm not sure exactly what it means but here's what I found:"Early placental cells invade maternal spiral arteries transforming them from small muscular arterioles to large vessels of low resistance. In pregnancies destined for pre-eclampsia and IUGR, the cytotrophoblasts infiltrate the decidual portion of the spiral arteries not the myometrial portion. The vessels remain narrow leading to hypoperfusion. PAPP-A is a protease for IGFBP-4. IGF binding proteins inhibit the action of IGFs, which play a key role in regulating fetal growth and trophoblastic invasion of the decidua." So I guess what that means is if the protein level is low, then there is less inhibition of the IGFs which allow the cytotrophoblasts to go to the wrong place. Did I interpret that right?  Early placental cells invade maternal spiral arteries transforming them from small muscular arterioles to large vessels of low resistance. 

 


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#10 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 09:51 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Thanks, Carrie. That explains why I can't ever keep those straight. Posterior is back so I think of the baby facing the back when I guess what it actually means is that the baby's body is in the back and it is facing front. I think mine is sideways. Like I've said, I can usually feel his back along my right side. That would mean he'd be facing to the left, right?

Annie ~ I don't know if I could make sense of that. I'll have to read it several times. I did get that if you don't have enough of those proteins, your arteries won't expand enough to accommodate the needs of the growing baby. Does that sound right?

PAPP-A is an IGF binding protein, right? So, if you don't have enough PAPP-A, then the activity of that particular IGF protein is not inhibited enough to allow for the placental cells (cytotrophoblasts?) to enter the correct area of the maternal arteries so that they will enlarge to vessels. This, in turn, inhibits blood flow and, therefore, oxygen and other nutrients to the baby.

As for the stethoscope, I haven't used one this time but I did have a fetascope when I was pg with ds3. I never had an easy time hearing his heartbeat with it. It was hit or miss even really late in pregnancy. When I did find it, it was very, very faint so I had to be in a completely quiet place. I think a lot depends on how baby and placenta are positioned.

Carrie ~ I totally get what you are saying about labor. When you are in the middle of labor before pushing you have no idea when it will end. You just have to get through each contraction knowing that another is coming soon. When you finally get to pushing, even if it's hard and still hurts, you feel like you are accomplishing something. You know the end is near, relatively speaking. It's the not knowing of stage 2 labor (that's the right one, right?) that is so hard.

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#11 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 10:47 AM
 
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Annie, I hope things work out for you.

AFM, ack! Now I'm GBS positive! greensad.gif Anyone have advice or experience with this? I made another appointment with my GP in case I need to go to the hospital and need her to deliver, since I have only seen her twice. I don't know whether to give up on my homebirth or to still try for it if I make it to 37 weeks. If I transfer care from my HB midwife before 37 weeks I get most of the money refunded, which I paid out of pocket. But I also lose my homebirth. But she can't do antibiotics at home, and I'm not sure if I'm comfortable with the alternative. Now there is a lot more stuff to think about - I will have to actually talk to my GP about pushing in different positions, etc. when before she was mostly a doc for my kids, lol. But she did come recommended as a back-up doctor for homebirth so she should be very natural-birth friendly. One would think.

Ugh. I need a nap.

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#12 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 11:29 AM
 
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Wow, thread is crazy today. 

 

BFS: That sucks. That's one of the things DH and I have talked about, and I have pre-warned him that we'll need to talk about it later on, probably quite a bit. I lean towards skipping the antibiotics unless you have risk factors, prior to or during labor. What always stuck in my head is the idea that the antibiotics don't necessarily mean baby won't get it, but in general, babies who get the antibiotics and still contract gbs, get a worse case of it. Also the idea that testing positive right now has no bearing on whether you will be positive at birth. Would she be willing to do another culture closer to the birth if you make it another few weeks? If you do want the antibiotics, some practices now are able to give an IM injection. Nobody really seems to talk about it in the medical world, but I've seen it suggested here on MDC several times. It's hard, there's so much to think about with GBS. 

 

For posterior-- I always think that posterior hurts your posterior-- because the baby's head and spine are essentially dragging down your spine as youre progressing. MW it sounds like your babe is in ROA-- meaning the right side of his head (occiput) is facing anterior. I don't have my book with me, but that sounds right. I was born LOA if I remember correctly, so facing the other direction. 

 

I haven't attempted to palpate even though I'm sure I could probably feel my uterus now if I tried... I'm just not sure what to look for. But-- I have a doppler at home, and ever since the Dr said I should come in at about 10 weeks and she's try to find the HB, now I've wanted to pull it out. I'm forcing myself not to. 


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#13 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 11:44 AM
 
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Annie, I hope things work out for you.

AFM, ack! Now I'm GBS positive! greensad.gif Anyone have advice or experience with this? I made another appointment with my GP in case I need to go to the hospital and need her to deliver, since I have only seen her twice. I don't know whether to give up on my homebirth or to still try for it if I make it to 37 weeks. If I transfer care from my HB midwife before 37 weeks I get most of the money refunded, which I paid out of pocket. But I also lose my homebirth. But she can't do antibiotics at home, and I'm not sure if I'm comfortable with the alternative. Now there is a lot more stuff to think about - I will have to actually talk to my GP about pushing in different positions, etc. when before she was mostly a doc for my kids, lol. But she did come recommended as a back-up doctor for homebirth so she should be very natural-birth friendly. One would think.

Ugh. I need a nap.


Can you do garlic suppositories and probiotics and retest in a week or so?


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#14 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 12:24 PM
 
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I was going to suggest garlic too; seems several mamas on MDC have had good results with that. I think even so they can do some sort of wash in a peribottle prior to the birth (while you are in labor) that can help also (can't recall what it is though).

 

The whole paying out of pocket for a midwife and then maybe needing to go to the hospital, part of which would also be out of pocket, it one of the things that turns DH off from homebirth. In the event of a transfer, you have to pay both. If we were swimming in money, which we are not, he probably wouldn't care.

 

The thread is hopping today! Wish I could find the same energy to clean my house . . .


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#15 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 01:21 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I think the wash is called Hibiclens but I could be wrong. You can try that. Also using garlic as suppositories and oral capsules, grapefruit seed extract capsules, echinacea and maybe one other thing that isn't coming to mind right now might help. One big question is how/where were you tested? Were you tested only from the vaginal area or did they test a sample from your anal area as well? A lot of times women will test + from the anal area but not from the vaginal area. Since baby is not coming out of your anus, I don't really understand why that's important. I have always been GBS+ in the past. I learned about the anal testing while I was pg with ds3 and refused it. When only tested vaginally I was negative. There's also the whole question, like JJ touched on, about how dangerous being GBS+ is or how helpful preventive treatment really is.

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#16 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 01:55 PM
 
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I was going to suggest garlic too; seems several mamas on MDC have had good results with that. I think even so they can do some sort of wash in a peribottle prior to the birth (while you are in labor) that can help also (can't recall what it is though).

 

The whole paying out of pocket for a midwife and then maybe needing to go to the hospital, part of which would also be out of pocket, it one of the things that turns DH off from homebirth. In the event of a transfer, you have to pay both. If we were swimming in money, which we are not, he probably wouldn't care.

 

The thread is hopping today! Wish I could find the same energy to clean my house . . .


That's also why I couldn't justify a homebirth. I would have to pay out of pocket $3600 and then if I had to transfer, I would still have to pay an additional $1500 for the hospital birth. So as it stands right now, I will just have to pay $1500 for my hospital birth.

 


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#17 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 01:56 PM
 
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I think the wash is called Hibiclens but I could be wrong. You can try that. Also using garlic as suppositories and oral capsules, grapefruit seed extract capsules, echinacea and maybe one other thing that isn't coming to mind right now might help. One big question is how/where were you tested? Were you tested only from the vaginal area or did they test a sample from your anal area as well? A lot of times women will test + from the anal area but not from the vaginal area. Since baby is not coming out of your anus, I don't really understand why that's important. I have always been GBS+ in the past. I learned about the anal testing while I was pg with ds3 and refused it. When only tested vaginally I was negative. There's also the whole question, like JJ touched on, about how dangerous being GBS+ is or how helpful preventive treatment really is.


Good point about the location of the swabbing. I specifically asked my OB if he does the rectal swab as well and he said no. He thought it was silly since the baby doesn't come out of your rectum!


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#18 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 02:14 PM
 
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I've never heard of swabbing your butt!  OMG what on earth is the point of THAT!?

 

If it were me and I tested positive, I would do all I could (probiotics, garlic, hibiclense) and retest closer to my due date.  I know you're on shaky ground with when this baby is going to make an appearance, BFS, so maybe you could retest in a week or so.  But I would DEF ask for a retest.  And if that were still positive, I would still want my home birth UNLESS I had some of the bigger risk factors.  Meaning -- preterm labor, ruptured membranes for a while, fever, or GBS in urine.  

 

Here's a helpful site:

 

http://www.homebirth.org.uk/gbs.htm


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#19 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 04:55 PM
 
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Thanks for the thoughts ladies. I am so conflicted. She did swab my rectum. I am talking to my husband about it now.

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#20 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 05:15 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thanks for the thoughts ladies. I am so conflicted. She did swab my rectum. I am talking to my husband about it now.

Definitely ask to be retested just in the vaginal area. There really is no reason for testing your rectal area.

I understand the issues with money but I have to say that there are reasons so much more important than money for having or not having a homebirth. If I went to the military hospital with the insurance I have, the only cost I would have would be $15 a day for the hospital stay. If I went to a civilian OB, I would have a 15% copay and a minimal hospital fee, if anything because there's a catostrosphic cap on how much I have to pay for any medical care. If I had the prime insurance and had referrals (if needed), my entire care would be free. I pay for my homebirth out of pocket even though my insurance company does cover a portion because the insurance company says my MW has a conflict of interest since she also works at the military hospital. If I have to transfer care, I will then have to pay my copays. We don't have a lot of money. One military income. It isn't much. It's worth it to me to pay, though.

I just had to say that because I think it's sad that one would pass up a homebirth mainly because of money. I mean, I do understand if you absolutely don't have the money to pay for the homebirth so that it's just not an option. That's very unfortuate. But that's not the same as not doing it for fear that you might end up transferring care and have an extra expense. I hope I'm not coming off insensitive or not understanding or anything like that but it bothers me that it's being presented as if the most important factor when deciding between a homebirth and a hospital birth is the cost. IMO, that's the least important factor.

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#21 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 07:27 PM
 
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@ Carrie- I cannot believe you are far enough to be thinking about your baby's position...where did that time go? How many weeks are you now?  You know what's crazy, if I didn't miscarry, I'd be 17.5 weeks along already. That is just NUTS! Makes me realize how fast this pregnancy will fly by. 

 

I'm super excited to be having morning sickness- it really kicked in this morning. Never had that last time so this must be a good sign! 


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#22 of 291 Old 05-02-2011, 10:57 PM
 
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yay Kinder!! You can HAVE it. I've been ravaged the past few weeks, but I'm 9/5 right now, and I think, at the risk of jinxing myself, that today may have been the first on the road to good days again. I hateeeeee morning sickness. I was so excited about it too, because it means the baby is really digging in and growing, but by now, I'd be good without the reminder. lol

 

It's hard for me to imagine paying at all for a birth, or any medical expenses, so I don't really have the same insight you guys do. Here everything to do with 'primary care' is covered. Any hospital stays, doctors visits, routine shots, casts, accidents, etc etc. It's only for ancillary type things-- massage, dental, vision, chiropractic, physio... those kind of things you pay out of pocket for, or can get additional insurance. But other than that for childbirth, the ONLY thing you pay for is if you want to pay extra to have a private room, or maybe to rent a tv in your room. That's it. Same with homebirth here, it's totally covered. 

 

But I can see how if you've had good experience with the hospital, either firsthand or through visiting others, spending time there, etc etc, then the idea of a hospital birth seems absolutely fine when the alternative could cost you thousands of dollars. It's only really after you've had a bad experience that you start to see the value of $4000 of piece of mind, you know? But if you're lucky enough to have care providers/facilities who are good to mamas, then I can see how it wouldn't be as big of a deal. And heck, finances can hurt. Even the idea right now of hiring a doula for $500 hurts my brain, and while DH and I are not rich by any means, we -do- have the money in the bank for it. But anyways, the point is that it is always hard to put out money for something when there's a free alternative (or close to)... especially if that alternative has never done wrong by you. 

 

BFS:  Hopefully you'll be able to find some peace with this issue. It's such a hard one because the consequences either way can be very serious. It's one of the issues that DH gets a bit more say than I do, because he's actually contracted meningitis before, and gone through the spinal taps, and the headahces and all the pain, whereas I don't have that experience, just the knowledge and statistics. Sometimes it's hard to balance the two. I would definately push for the reswab though, and start there. 


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#23 of 291 Old 05-03-2011, 04:45 AM
 
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@ Carrie- I cannot believe you are far enough to be thinking about your baby's position...where did that time go? How many weeks are you now?  You know what's crazy, if I didn't miscarry, I'd be 17.5 weeks along already. That is just NUTS! Makes me realize how fast this pregnancy will fly by. 

 

I'm super excited to be having morning sickness- it really kicked in this morning. Never had that last time so this must be a good sign! 



Yay for morning sickness!!  I was miserable this pregnancy, seriously miserable, but always thankful that I had that reminder.  And I'm TWENTY FIVE weeks today!  Holy moly, yes it's going by fast.  



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It's hard for me to imagine paying at all for a birth, or any medical expenses, so I don't really have the same insight you guys do. Here everything to do with 'primary care' is covered. Any hospital stays, doctors visits, routine shots, casts, accidents, etc etc. It's only for ancillary type things-- massage, dental, vision, chiropractic, physio... those kind of things you pay out of pocket for, or can get additional insurance. But other than that for childbirth, the ONLY thing you pay for is if you want to pay extra to have a private room, or maybe to rent a tv in your room. That's it. Same with homebirth here, it's totally covered. 

 

In a similar vein, it's really hard for me to imagine not being able to choose any provider for my medical care. True that for you everything is covered, but hearing about your struggles getting accepted by a midwife for a homebirth freaks me out. I love that, even though I have to pay for it, I can go online or ask around and choose ANY midwife or any doctor. While it might be covered a fraction by insurance (or not at all) I really like having that option. 

 

And I agree with MW too, that money shouldn't be the ONLY thing keeping someone from homebirthing.  I get it, I get that money is real and an issue, and if I couldn't afford my midwife's fee, I don't know what I would do.  I'd probably set up a payment plan or something.  And lets say I didn't have insurance, I'd rather work hard to pay off a couple thousand than the TENS of thousands a hospital visit would cost.  Of course, you can never know if you'll just have one of those cases where a c-sec is truly necessary, and can't plan for that.  But, just saying.


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#24 of 291 Old 05-03-2011, 05:36 AM
 
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Money was an important factor with DS' birth; If we could have swung it, I would have birthed at the freestanding birth center, and perhaps not have ended up as a c-section . . . With this baby money, while an issue, is the least of it. I can't even find a midwife close enough to pay, did I have the money to do so, that will attend a VBAC. The only one I have found is in NC, which between prenatal visits and the birth, is just too far away. and since I do work, it isn't like I could choose to stay closer to her (I have friends and family nearby) when the time draws near.  As it is, paying the doula will be a pinch for us. (DH isn't working; he is in school). If I already had a successful vaginal birth under my belt, so to speak, I would be far more comfortable attempting a UC. As it is, I would really like an extra pair of experienced eyes and hands.

 

I am thankful that I was spared extreme morning sickness. though lately brushing my teeth has become an issue - well, the back teeth - it makes me gag. why can't they invent a mouthwash that works as well as toothbrush? I still don't want to eat chicken . . .and it looks like that is on the menu for mother's day. It almost makes me want to skip it. (we do a potluck with the same family members we did Easter with; and there was chicken for Easter)

 

Kinder, yay for good strong signs!

 

 


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#25 of 291 Old 05-03-2011, 06:31 AM - Thread Starter
 
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JJ ~ I don't think it's entirely true that you don't pay for your medical care. You don't pay when you see a doctor but you pay taxes that cover the cost for everyone. I wonder if tax rates were compared, if cost wouldn't actually break pretty even for both. I've always wanted to work that out just for my own curiosity.

Also, I've had 2 hospital births and 1 homebirth. I wouldn't say that either of my hospital births were traumatic or even bad experiences. I knew going in with my first that I would have a c-section. It was disappointing but not something that I felt guilty or bad about or coerced/forced into. My 2nd hospital birth was really fine for a hospital birth. Like I've said before, I don't even mind staying in the hospital for a day or two. It's nice to have someone wait on you hand and foot and bring you meals and all that. Even with a very attentive dh it's hard to not do anything at home. KWIM? The thing is that even the best hospital birth cannot compare to a good homebirth. They are two very different animals. I guess it would be hard if you haven't had both to understand that but the entire setting and feeling and atmosphere and whatever else is so different once you enter that hospital and are surrounded by medical personnel compared to being at home with a midwife. It is impossible to go to a hospital in the USA to have a baby, no matter what stage of labor you are in, without having some sort of medical intervention, people poking and prodding you. Hospitals have procedures that much be followed no matter what.

I'm with you, Carrie, which is why I choose to keep my fee-for-service military insurance that allows me to see any doctor at any time for any covered reason rather than switching to the HMO-type where I have to have a primary care manager whom I have to see before I can see anyone else. I'll gladly pay for that, especially when my copay for an office visit to a specialist has never amounted to more than $20. Of course, the military insurance is a lot cheaper than many private insurances.

I was thinking later last night how ironic it is that we are complaining about how we can't afford to not use medical care while there are people in other places who complain that they can't afford to get medical care. It's all about perspective, I guess.

Katrina ~ Bring your own meat dish. I always bring my own protein dish to potlucks or eat before I go because I am a very picky eater. I rarely can eat what other people make for those sorts of things.

I'm getting my new kitchen floor today! joy.gif I hope it looks good. I'm a little nervous about putting new wood next to wood that's 7 years old. We'll probably have to have it buffed and refinished before we sell, anyway, so hopefully that will even out any difference. Oh, and now I've lost my debit card so I can't return those Target clothes, which means I can't buy that changing table just yet. Aaargh!

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#26 of 291 Old 05-03-2011, 07:51 AM
 
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did you purchase them with a gift card? or still have the receipt? either way, you should be able to return them and get store credit. (unless you really wanted the money to go on your debit card)

 

It is tempting . . . not sure what I'd bring. It's not that I am entirely opposed to chicken; I really want to make chicken enchiladas next week, but at least in something like that, the chicken is smothered in cheese and sauce and a bit less chicken-y. hmmm. I will think of something. It is bad enough that I am just not southern enough in my eating habits and pick around things as is (don't really like country style green beans, but I cook them for everyone else. or lima beans, or grits, or half a dozen other things that end up at these things. I do love me some potato salad, but can't live on that alone!)

 

When dad was in the service, and I was a dependent, we always did the full-fledged sort of care, we just went to the clinic at the NH; now eventually mom was able to get us to see a regular pediatrician (meaning, one that we saw regularly) but by that time I was in high school and really frustrated with them anyway. (telling me that DD boobs aren't enough to cause back pain, it must just be my weight, which at that point was a relatively reasonable 140 lbs - among other things). Though I recall mom deciding to see outside OB's for her last pregnancy, and not the NH doctors.

 

Honestly, DH and I have discussed it, and generally it would be cheaper for us to be uninsured. DS doesn't do well-visits as we don't vax (well, we did a few in the beginning - up to 4 months), and other than that we only use it for chiro and pregnancy stuff. If I could have homebirth, with a midwife, it would be cheaper than what I pay per year for family coverage. (which is in the neighborhood of $5k) what keeps us from doing it though is the thought  of what if something truly catastrophic happens; especially with a child you just don't know. I am sure Gabe will have stitches and broken bones at some point. As rough and tumble as he is now at only a year and a half, it is bound to happen eventually.

 

it is a fine line. I would rather the goverment's energy be put to better maternity leave, etc than the healthcare stuff. but that is just me.


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#27 of 291 Old 05-03-2011, 07:53 AM
 
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I should have provided more info when I was talking about the cost of homebirth vs hospital birth. For me, the other factor that played in to my decision was we only have one group of homebirth midwives in my town. I met with them at the beginning of my first pregnancy and I LOVED one midwife and really disliked the other one. They work as a team so both would be at my birth. I couldn't reconcile my idea of homebirth with having someone there with this really abrasive personality. Adding that to the fact that it would cost more than double and we are on a VERY tight budget, I just couldn't get there. I love homebirth. I support it when it makes sense. If I lived in a different area, perhaps like where my sister lives and I had to choose between going to a hospital that I knew would have unbearable rules and restrictions or dealing with an abrasive midwife, I would probably have come to a different decision. But I have access to a hospital that professes to use evidence based care. I've attended a birth there as a doula and seen how that evidence based care plays out. So far, I've had wonderful care from my OB and not felt slighted in the least. I'm happy with my decision to birth in a hospital. Did finances play a large role in the decision? Yes it did. But were there other factors as well? Yes indeed. I readily admit that I am very lucky to have access to a care provider that is willing to work in a more "midwife-type" fashion. He's the only OB in town that has a midwife on his staff. I'm also very lucky to have access to a progressive, forward thinking hospital. I know that unless it's medically indicated, I will not have to fight with anyone about having a hep-lock or an IV. I will be able to do as I please while in labor once I give them 20-30 mins on the monitor to get a baseline. Would it be wonderful to stay in my home and have my baby and not have to go anywhere? Yes probably but I also have four older stepkids that may or may not be home with us when I go in to labor. I may WANT to go somewhere different where I can focus and not have the noise and distraction that naturally occurs when they are home. For me, my personal goal when discussing labor and birth choices with other women is that they make an informed decision. Get all the facts, don't just go by what a care provider or someone else is telling you, educate yourself and then make a decision. If it's your own decision, then it should be honored, even if someone else doesn't agree with it.


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#28 of 291 Old 05-03-2011, 08:23 AM
 
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Annie - I hear you!!  I would probably make a similar choice given your circumstances.  And trust me, if I lived with other people no WAY would I want to run the risk of laboring/having the baby @ home.  I don't even want my MIL here watching Nora!  I'm going to have her pick her up and take her to her house instead, lol!

 

AFM - had a pn appt this morning!  Went well.  Baby's hb was 148, and he's sort of transverse/breech still.  Not worried about that @ only 25 weeks.  We talked more about the genetic testing and she can use cord blood which is great -- I'd rather that than have to draw blood from my brand new baby!  Talked about getting the fishy pool, the diabetes test next visit, etc.  Pretty uneventful, really.  Good.  I like uneventful after the rollercoaster month I had!!


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#29 of 291 Old 05-03-2011, 09:08 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Katrina ~ I was wondering about choosing to be uninsured, too. If everyone took the money they would spend on health insurance and saved it, they would get to make money off of it rather than letting the insurance company make money off of it, which is what they do. Most people would probably have enough savings if an emergency medical event happened, especially if you didn't use any of that money for regular preventative check ups. Although, for adults an annual exam wouldn't cost more than a few hundred dollars, which would easily be covered by the savings. That's one thing that I think of because I only go to a MD if someone is really sick or injured while I do go to chiropractors on a somewhat regular basis and would like to be able to go to an acupuncturist. I spend my money on herbs and OTC medicines/treatments rather than prescription drugs. My health insurance doesn't cover any of that. Since I don't have to pay a premium for my insurance atm it's not an issue, but if it were, I may choose not to have it at all so I'd have my money for what I wanted or needed.

I used the MTFs when I was in Hawaii. I'm not opposed to seeing military doctors. I just don't like having to go only there or getting permission to see someone else (which may or may not be approved).

I called Target about my dilemma. I was told they would give me another gift card for the amount of that that I used and I don't need my card for them to refund the remainder back to that. Whew! I didn't want just store credit because the changing table is only available online unless by store credit you meant like a gift card. Anyway, that works for me so I can get it done.

Carrie ~ Uneventful is good. Glad everything went well.

Annie ~ I know other factors went into making the decisions you made. It just sounded from the conversation at that moment that things were reduced to the only major factor to consider when choosing between homebirth and hospital birth was the cost. I was not in a good mood when I came home from TKD last night, either. I had to sit there and listen to a couple of women talk about leaving a 4 week old baby to CIO so she wouldn't be spoiled. I mentioned an article I read recently about a study showing that it was actually physically harmful to do that to babies because it causes so much stress. These ladies looked at me like I had 2 heads. The one, who is the aunt of the baby she brought, calls the baby a pig because she eats all the time. Well, um, isn't that what babies are supposed to do? She tells the baby she's a brat and ugly when she cries for more food. I know the baby doesn't understand what she's saying but still...that baby will eventually start picking up on the insults. Then they went on to bash breastfeeding, even though one of them breastfed her children each for a year. They all agreed that it was disgusting to breastfeed past a year. It will be interesting to see how they all react to me sitting there with my baby in a sling, breastfeeding on demand. The whole thing just left me feeling sad and angry. I don't know if I can sit there with this woman and the baby if she's going to keep behaving that way toward her.

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#30 of 291 Old 05-03-2011, 09:52 AM
 
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MW: those are very hard attitudes to deal with. Most of my IRL friends have no issues with CIO (though one couple I wish we saw more of cosleeps still with both of their children, almost age 4 and 1, and nursed both past a year), rarely BF past 6 months, and I think take their ped's parenting advice too seriously. (for me, doctors are for medical advice, not parenting - but that is just me). It is hard being with them and hearing them discuss sleep training methods, etc, as I didn't use any of that. I think you did the best you could, and really, I might consider either continuing to go to TKD so you can kind of live as an examle of crunchy-ness and show that it isn't odd to feed on demand, or past a year, or stop going if the attitudes grate on you (I am a non-confrontational sort, so I might choose to not go).

 

As for healthcare, I think one of the reasons it is the way it is, is because alot of people - me included - are horrible savers. I am plain not good at it. So we give our $$ to the insurance company hoping they would be better stewards of it than we would. - I work in disability insurance, and I hear alot from people who are like, if I just put aside the money I pay your company, I wouldn't have all these issues (like us needing employer and doctor statements of disability, etc). And I agree with them. If they had; but they chose not to, and therefore must abide by the terms of the policy. It seems really callous, but there it is.

 

Store credit anymore really means gift card, so you can use it online or in store. I think Target was just switching to the plastic cards when I went to work for them back in 1999. don't anymore, but I did like working for them.

 

I do mind seeing military doctors; I saw them mess up way too many times (not with us, but with friends) to be really ok with them. I know all doctors are bound to make mistakes some of the time, but I would rather be able to choose.


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