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#421 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 07:20 AM
 
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That's an interesting way to think about it Annie2186. And also very true. For me, I would have avoided or delayed most of the vaccines if DD had not been born with a CHD. Rotavirus is a good example of one that strikes me as unnecessary. Yes, babies can die from dehydration from excessive throwing up and diarrhea but it's not very commom. But with DD's, shunt, we can't risk her getting even a bit dehyrated because her shunt could clot up and then she wouldn't be able to breathe and she would die. But the variacella vaccine? Nah, prettysure we will be skipping that one. MW, I have one of the new Nook tablets. I think in order for you to go online with your nook, it needs to have a web browser. Ryan might be able to root it and install Chrome or Firefox on it for you. Even though we are only gone 24 hrs and just 100 milws away, this has been a nice little vacation. My BIL negotiated an awesome rate at this hotel and it's very nice. And our first trip with all five kids! It's been relatively uneventful!

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#422 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 07:42 AM
 
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Originally Posted by jeninejessica View Post

Ok so vaccines. How do you guys decide what to get and when to delay them until. DD has her two month visit that we have to book, and she's supposed to get two shots. I want to delay them, but I can't figure out until when. I feel like a year is when I'd like to start them, but DH thinks that's too late. I need to sit down and seriously go through all the information, but I haven't had a chance to do it uninterrupted. My doctor (and DD's) is good about respecting my choices as long as I can carry on a conversation with he to back them up (which I respect).

 

So this was another multi-part response so an update :) DD woke up at about 715 from a 3 hour nap. She nursed, changed, and then played with us -- happily-- until 9 when we put her down for the night. Then she screamed bloody murder at DH for 20 minutes, but by the time I went in there to pass off, she was worn out, and fell asleep pretty much immediately. She's on my lap now, and it's not a solid sleep, but at least it's an improvement! 



Which two is she supposed to get?  Is Canada's schedule the same as the US?  

 

The thing with delaying til a year, or til 2 years is that within that time frame, there are scary things like pertussis that are only dangerous to young infants.  So, waiting until 2 to vax for pertussis doesn't make much sense, when the risk is for babies Tenley's age.  Same with rotavirus.  Once they hit I think 6 months (someone correct me if I'm wrong), they don't need that vax anymore b/c the real risk is to smaller babies.

 

Did you do hep b at birth?

 

What I do is weigh the risk of the disease (taking into account the risk of contracting it, knowing the risk is never 0) and then decide based on each vax. It isn't an all or nothing for me.  Most of what I worry about is pertussis, meningitis, and possibly rotavirus.  But that's with Finn.  I didn't bother with rotavirus with Nora b/c she was home, breastfed, no day care, etc.  Now, DD is in preschool, wipes herself after the bathroom, and I worry if she's not careful or touches someone else who wasn't careful, and then touches Finn we could have an issue - a gross barfing diarrhea issue!

 

And we'll do the CP vax.  I can't find wild pox.  And the older Nora gets, the worse it's going to be, and she unfortunately needs that vax (or an actual case of pox) for school.

 

Pentacel (the combo shot) scares me though.  I do the separate shots instead, even if it means a whole bunch more visits.  

 

oh -- and Yay for sleeping!!!

 

 

 


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#423 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 07:56 AM
 
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That's an interesting way to think about it Annie2186. And also very true. For me, I would have avoided or delayed most of the vaccines if DD had not been born with a CHD. Rotavirus is a good example of one that strikes me as unnecessary. Yes, babies can die from dehydration from excessive throwing up and diarrhea but it's not very commom. But with DD's, shunt, we can't risk her getting even a bit dehyrated because her shunt could clot up and then she wouldn't be able to breathe and she would die. But the variacella vaccine? Nah, prettysure we will be skipping that one. 

 

I always wondered what I would do if I had a baby with a compromised immune system. Hard to know exactly until you are in that situation......

 

Deciding not to vax at all was the hardest and most scariest thing I have ever done forsure. (Ok, actually, the thought of giving my kids a vax was the only scarier thing! LOL, which is probably why I decided against it) I feel a lot more confident in my choice now that M is a very very healthy three year old.

 

RE: rotavirus......that is one I was very tempted about because I am super super super super susceptible to the tummy bug. The problem with that is there are so many different strains of rotavirus and noravirus that it really isn't very effective at all. 

 

ALSO - I had either noravirus or rotavirus when A was about a month, and then we had all those problems for about 3 or 4 months. Barf, the runs, upset tummy, rinse repeat in one way or another. 

Arianna was perfectly happy and fine through the whole thing - the only reason I know she caught some version of it was because her poop smelled like a cat crawled up there and died! 

 

 


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#424 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 08:09 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Pertussis isn't really that scary. Healthy, breastfed babies are very unlikely to get it, and if they do, very unlikely to get extremely ill from it.

When I decided to re-examine vaxing (Ryan had been completely vaxed on schedule until 12yo and Ethan had been vaxed on schedule up to 4 months), I started with the CDC website, reading the info about what the diseases are and how they work and analyzing the data about how dangerous (or not) they really are. I think the CDC has taken that info down now because I can't find it anywhere anymore. Anyway, after reading all of that I came to realize that none of these diseases are really as scary and dangerous as we are led to believe. Even polio, one of the scariest ones, is not. The info on the CDC website said that most people who get polio don't even bother to get diagnosed because it presented just like a cold and went away on it's own, no iron lung, no paralysis. Only a very few cases end up like that.

measles, mumps, rubella, chicken pox, flu, rotavirus, and even pnuemococcal bacteria (that the ER doc just scared the crap out of me with) are not really all that dangerous. look up the likelihood of your child getting one of these diseases and then the likelihood of serious complications from them and you will find that the risk of anything serious is very small.

what other vaxes are there? i don't even know anymore. lol.gif

i agree that i'd rather treat the disease if contracted naturally, if needed, than purposely infect my child with it. i agree with annie that vaxes are not how our bodies are built to fight disease. injecting our bodies bypasses the first part of the immune response in the gut that would be triggered by ingestion or inhalation. instead, it triggers an overactive blood response and throws the immune system all o ut of whack. that's why some doctors and scientist wonder and study the relationship between vaccination and other chronic diseases.

here's an interesting, ongoing stdy comparing disease rates in vaxed vs. unvaxed kids. it has flaws but the results beg further investigation and caution against vaxes, imo. http://healthfreedoms.org/2011/10/14/big-study-vaccinated-kids-2-5-more-diseases-than-unvaccinated/

a website that has info in ingredients in vaccines: http://www.novaccine.com/

another website with vaccine info: http://insidevaccines.com/wordpress/

disclaimer: all of those websites are run by people who are anti-vax. unfortunately, i have yet to find any truly unbiased info. it's either pro or anti.

i can't find a really great article i read about how vaxes bypass the natural immune system response and then cause further health problems. i'll keep searching when i can.

AFU, D now has a nasty diaper rash from the antibiotic injections. they told me it would cause diarrhea and the end result of that is a very sore bum. greensad.gif

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#425 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 08:12 AM - Thread Starter
 
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oh, when i was at the pharmacy the other day, i saw that they have a vax for shingles for adults 55+. when did that come out?

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#426 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 08:21 AM
 
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Originally Posted by MarineWife View Post

AFU, D now has a nasty diaper rash from the antibiotic injections. they told me it would cause diarrhea and the end result of that is a very sore bum. greensad.gif

 

Would you change your opinion on vaxes if you worked, or had kids in daycare or school? Or, had a child with special circumstances, like Ava?  I'm just curious.  I think situation and risk level changes things, and I've had to re-evaluate my decisions -- even those I've already made for Nora.  You know?

 

I'm sorry about D's bum.  Finn had awful gas and tummy issues from his amoxicillin liquid.  I'm going to keep giving him the probiotic powder b/c it really seems to help with his discomfort.  Poor Dylan, diaper rashes are the worst. greensad.gif
 

 



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oh, when i was at the pharmacy the other day, i saw that they have a vax for shingles for adults 55+. when did that come out?


Its relatively recent, though I think it's the same or similar to the varicella vax kids get.

 

I wish I could feel comfortable not vaccinating.  I give you mamas who don't such credit.  I suppose it's b/c I believe they do work.  It'd be different if I felt they didn't work, I think.


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#427 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 08:39 AM - Thread Starter
 
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here's the CDC website page on vaccine-preventable diseases. you have to go to a specific disease and then scroll way down to the references to possibly find facts about the actual dangers of the disease. for example, i just read a bit on bacteremia, the blood disease that Dylan supposedly had, that (supposedly) could have been prevented by the pneumococcal vaccine. According to the disease and death rates caused by pneumococcal, out of 5,013,700 kids infected, 13,000 get bacteremia and 700 get meningits. 200 of all of those kids die. so, only 1.5% of kids who get invasive pnuemococcal disease die. even more pronounced, only 0.3% of those infected get a more serious disease than otitis media. that means that only 1.45% of 0.3% of all kids who contract this bacteria die from it. that is a miniscule number. it becomes even smaller if you factor in the percentage of the population that never gets it. does that make sense? I don't know about controls for those immuno-compromised or who were exclusively breastfed. That's a big factor to me that no one ever takes into account.

http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/vpd-vac/default.htm

here's what you want to read for actual scientific data on the diseases: http://www.cdc.gov/vaccines/pubs/pinkbook/index.html. scroll down and you'll see where you can view the book online or download it.

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#428 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 09:38 AM
 
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Which two is she supposed to get?  Is Canada's schedule the same as the US?  

 

The thing with delaying til a year, or til 2 years is that within that time frame, there are scary things like pertussis that are only dangerous to young infants.  So, waiting until 2 to vax for pertussis doesn't make much sense, when the risk is for babies Tenley's age.  Same with rotavirus.  Once they hit I think 6 months (someone correct me if I'm wrong), they don't need that vax anymore b/c the real risk is to smaller babies.

 

Did you do hep b at birth?

 

What I do is weigh the risk of the disease (taking into account the risk of contracting it, knowing the risk is never 0) and then decide based on each vax. It isn't an all or nothing for me.  Most of what I worry about is pertussis, meningitis, and possibly rotavirus.  But that's with Finn.  I didn't bother with rotavirus with Nora b/c she was home, breastfed, no day care, etc.  Now, DD is in preschool, wipes herself after the bathroom, and I worry if she's not careful or touches someone else who wasn't careful, and then touches Finn we could have an issue - a gross barfing diarrhea issue!

 

And we'll do the CP vax.  I can't find wild pox.  And the older Nora gets, the worse it's going to be, and she unfortunately needs that vax (or an actual case of pox) for school.

No Hep B at birth, it's not standard here, so we didn't even have to decline it. As long as I'm reading the chart right, it doesn't get given until grade 4. 

 

This is the chart for Canada: Vaccine Schedule
 

So she's supposed to get the 5 in 1 for Hib, Tetanus, Diptheria, pertussis and then polio... and then the pneumococcal conjugate. They're both ones that get shots at 2, 4, 6 months and then 18 again. Then the next ones aren't until 12m, the chicken pox, which we know we're declining at least until she starts school, probably until puberty, and the MenC. We will probably get that one, as DH had a bad case of meningitis in high school, which apparently means he's at a higher risk of contracting it again. I figure that works both ways-- him passing it to DD, or DD passing it to him, neither of which are good. 

 

Re: the difference between Finn and Nora, that's kind of what I'm thinking-- it would be different if Tenley was going to daycare or being out and about tons with other children and risk factors. But she's not, and she is breastfed. I've received all my vaccinations, as has DH, so there's less of a chance of us bringing something home to her as well. 

 

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i can't find a really great article i read about how vaxes bypass the natural immune system response and then cause further health problems. i'll keep searching when i can.

This is my big thing about so many of the vaxes. I came from a family that vaxed, but my mother didn't really treat us for illnesses. I never went to the doctor for an illness my entire childhood, only regular checkups. As a result, our bodies were able to learn how to fight off sicknesses without getting destroyed by them. Even now, I'll watch the people around me get sicker than anything, and all I'll get is a bit of a cold or something. DH's family was the opposite, his mother throws drugs and medicine at them at the slightest sign of discomfort, and he's got a crappy crappy immune system now. 

 

I need to go through them one by one. Like Carrie pointed out, I have the option of not doing it as a combined shot, which I've heard is safer anyways... but then I worry about the tradeoff of giving her more shots than necessary-- ie instead of a 5 in 1, giving her 3 separate, you know? 

 

So many decisions!

 


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#429 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 09:39 AM
 
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I'm not sure if I would vax if I had a kid who had a compromised immune system. Honestly - I think I would be MORE scared vaxing said kid. Just because of how *I* view vaccines. 

 

Like MW said - we are all browbeaten into thinking if we don't vax our kids our going to die a slow, painful death.  The truth is that these diseases we are being *protected* from were going way way down just due to better healthcare and better hygiene etc. If you do your research they really aren't that scary. Especially for us momma's who take a more pro-active stance on our kids health by giving them vitamins and such. 

 

Speaking of, have I told you all how awesome vitamin D3 is??

 

I also think that the true after effects of the vaccines are not only death and/or severe brain damage, autism, etc. I think dyslexia, ADD, learning disabilities and behavioral problems come from it too. 

 

However, I also believe that aluminum and mercury are things that should never be injected into our bloodstream.........

 

A good website is www.thinktwice.com (or org) They *say* they show an unbiased opinion but of course it is more anti-vax. However, they aren't beating you over the head with it and do show both sides. 


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#430 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 10:03 AM
 
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I need to go through them one by one. Like Carrie pointed out, I have the option of not doing it as a combined shot, which I've heard is safer anyways... but then I worry about the tradeoff of giving her more shots than necessary-- ie instead of a 5 in 1, giving her 3 separate, you know? 

 

So many decisions!

 


It's so crazy having to make decisions for someone else right?? I remember when I (very stupidly as I am sure we can ALL agree giving hebB to a baby is r.e.t.a.r.t.e.d) had to sign the permission paper for J to get her shot after birth it just felt weird.........

 

I personally would rather give them separately, especially to such a young baby. The doses all together are just soooooooo much, KWIM? Even though you are giving her *more* shots if you give them separately it is actually the EXACT same amount as the all in one dose, if that makes sense. 

 


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#431 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 10:05 AM
 
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Eeeek! I'm posting like crazy today, but the website I was talking about is thinktwice.com

 

 thinktwice.org does look like a vaccine something or other, but I have never looked through it.


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#432 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 12:15 PM - Thread Starter
 
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because of what i understand about the diseases and the immune system, i wouldn't vax even if my kids did go to daycare or school. it's not that i think the vaxes don't work at all. i just don't think they are necessary. i think getting the diseases and natural immunity is much better. even with this scare with bacteremia, i'm not inclined at all to get the kids vaxed. my dh travels overseas for extended periods to places that harbor all kinds of nast diseases. he could bring anything home. he usually does come home sick and says he has some sort of desert funk or whatever. since my kids are relatively healthy and i trust their bodies' abilities to fight disease, i don't worry about it too much. if there were an outbreak of something in my area, i would just quarantine us. i also think that if one of my children were imunno-compromised, i would be more adamant about not vaxing. it just doesn't make sense to me that they say you shouldn't vax a sick kid but then it's more important to vax an imunno-compromised person.

there was an article i read recently where an epidemiologist admitted that the vaxes don't even work at all in the first year of life. the sole reason for doing them so early is to get parents on a schedule for when it supposedly matters. i've read similar things in the past about having the early vax schedule to get parents, especially the poor, on a regular doctor visit schedule. apparently, people start being more lax about taking their kids to the doc as they get older. so, the younger they can get them in and vaxed, the better for the doctors and drug companies.

the thing that really puts me off is that a vaccine against one disease usually results in other, more dangerous diseases popping up. because we've been vaxed against some, we don't have the natural, general immunity that comes from being exposed to or contracting the disease itself that would help fight against a similar strain. viruses and bacteria are always mutating. there is no way to erradicate all disease. there will always be something out there that can make use sick and sometimes kill us. that's very scary but, for me, it's not worth it to put my child at know risk in order to possibly protect him against a possible but not probable risk. KWIM?

the polio outbreaks in the early to mid 1900s were scary but there were certain social aspects that fed the disease that we are not exposed to today. dirty, overcrowded slum cities with no or minimal sanitation and clean water, for one, and poor nutrition. yes, those conditions do still exist but i believe the answer is to improve living conditions and nutrition, not inject everyone with nasty chemicals that can and do cause harm. it's easier and more profitable, however, to just shoot everyone up.

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#433 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 02:44 PM
 
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because of what i understand about the diseases and the immune system, i wouldn't vax even if my kids did go to daycare or school. it's not that i think the vaxes don't work at all. i just don't think they are necessary. i think getting the diseases and natural immunity is much better. even with this scare with bacteremia, i'm not inclined at all to get the kids vaxed. my dh travels overseas for extended periods to places that harbor all kinds of nast diseases. he could bring anything home. he usually does come home sick and says he has some sort of desert funk or whatever. since my kids are relatively healthy and i trust their bodies' abilities to fight disease, i don't worry about it too much. if there were an outbreak of something in my area, i would just quarantine us. i also think that if one of my children were imunno-compromised, i would be more adamant about not vaxing. it just doesn't make sense to me that they say you shouldn't vax a sick kid but then it's more important to vax an imunno-compromised person.
there was an article i read recently where an epidemiologist admitted that the vaxes don't even work at all in the first year of life. the sole reason for doing them so early is to get parents on a schedule for when it supposedly matters. i've read similar things in the past about having the early vax schedule to get parents, especially the poor, on a regular doctor visit schedule. apparently, people start being more lax about taking their kids to the doc as they get older. so, the younger they can get them in and vaxed, the better for the doctors and drug companies.
the thing that really puts me off is that a vaccine against one disease usually results in other, more dangerous diseases popping up. because we've been vaxed against some, we don't have the natural, general immunity that comes from being exposed to or contracting the disease itself that would help fight against a similar strain. viruses and bacteria are always mutating. there is no way to erradicate all disease. there will always be something out there that can make use sick and sometimes kill us. that's very scary but, for me, it's not worth it to put my child at know risk in order to possibly protect him against a possible but not probable risk. KWIM?
the polio outbreaks in the early to mid 1900s were scary but there were certain social aspects that fed the disease that we are not exposed to today. dirty, overcrowded slum cities with no or minimal sanitation and clean water, for one, and poor nutrition. yes, those conditions do still exist but i believe the answer is to improve living conditions and nutrition, not inject everyone with nasty chemicals that can and do cause harm. it's easier and more profitable, however, to just shoot everyone up.


You say things so much better than me! lol.gif I was trying to post some of the studies and stories that put me off about vaxing - but it just comes up as a PDF from the thinktwice.com website.

 

I forgot to tell you earlier that adults are getting shingles because either A. they didn't get it as a child or B. no kids get it anymore so they aren't exposed to it throughout their lives.

Basically, the natural order of things is to get chickenpox as a baby/child and then get re-exposed to it through the kids in your life as an adult to keep up your immunity. 

Since these things aren't happening older people are getting shingles (which is really really painful I have heard).

 

So, since we vax against this usually very non-life threatening childhood sickness we are messing with sh** - and just like MW said are introducing worse things than the thing we are trying to fix!!

 

Similar was when I was researching mumps when I thought M had it - we are supposed to get it as kids (when its not that big of a deal) and then we are immune. NOW - since we are vaxed, we end up getting it as teenagers or adults when it is much worse (and slightly more serious).

 

Anyways - blaaaaaaaah dizzy.gif

 


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#434 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 02:51 PM
 
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On the phone so won't do a lengthy response.

 

We choose no vaxes, mostly for all the reasons stared above. I might change my mind if we lived somewhere where the diseases were more prevelant, more difficult to treat, etc. but we don't. 

 

If I did, I would do separate shots. So if baby had a reaction , it would be easier to pinpoint to what. I would delay probably until 2, when the blood brain barrier is fully functional, and then do just the ones mostikely to affect the 2 and up crowd in a bad way. 

 

If I did any, that is.

 

Ofc to a new years eve party!


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#435 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 03:06 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I forgot to tell you earlier that adults are getting shingles because either A. they didn't get it as a child or B. no kids get it anymore so they aren't exposed to it throughout their lives.

Basically, the natural order of things is to get chickenpox as a baby/child and then get re-exposed to it through the kids in your life as an adult to keep up your immunity. 

Since these things aren't happening older people are getting shingles (which is really really painful I have heard).

 

So, since we vax against this usually very non-life threatening childhood sickness we are messing with sh** - and just like MW said are introducing worse things than the thing we are trying to fix!!


yeah, older kids, teens and adults had, historically, gotten natural boosters to varicella when they were around young children who had it. now we;ve messed with the natural order enough that we have created a new and possibly worse problem. my grandfather got shingles years ago. it was extremely painful and he never fully recovered. he still has pain because of it, kind of like fibromyalgia.

maybe Annie can chime in about the issues surrounding an imunno-compromised baby. since i've never had one, i don't know the specifics.

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#436 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 03:30 PM
 
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So, since we vax against this usually very non-life threatening childhood sickness we are messing with sh** - and just like MW said are introducing worse things than the thing we are trying to fix!!


Hmm, I never thought of things that way.

 

I had shingles as a child.  I must have had a light case of pox as an infant, my mother can't remember.  If I had them it wasn't bad.  Then when I was 9 I had shingles and was hospitalized.  It was excruciating.  I still have neuralgia (shooting pain, debilitating at times) where the lesions were.  It was on my face, too, so I have scars.  Sucks.

 



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yeah, older kids, teens and adults had, historically, gotten natural boosters to varicella when they were around young children who had it. now we;ve messed with the natural order enough that we have created a new and possibly worse problem. my grandfather got shingles years ago. it was extremely painful and he never fully recovered. he still has pain because of it, kind of like fibromyalgia.


I honestly never thought of it all that way.  Such food for thought.  Thanks.

 

 

 


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#437 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 03:44 PM - Thread Starter
 
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oh, it's called neuralgia. i was on the right track. so, you know the pain i'm talking about.

another way i look at it is that it's a risk/benefit issue. is the risk of the disease greater than the risk of the vaccine? do the benefits of the vaccines outweigh the risks? for me, the answer to both of those questions is no. it has been shown and vets will admit that the rabies or distemper (can't remember which now") vaccine causes cancer at the injection site. if that can happen with cats, why can't it happen with humans? i'd rather take the risk of a natural disease than the risk of something unnatural.


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#438 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 04:06 PM
 
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I wouldn't vaccinate even if my kids went to daycare. It's just a risk I'm willing to take after being on both sides of the issues. My oldest dd almost died from pneumonia (which apparently might have been prevented with Prevnar and I stress might since we didn't know the exact strain). I went on to begin vaccinating her only for her to become autistic after the MMR shot. I still choose not to vaccinate anymore having seen my oldest through both situations. If I had more access to homeopathy back then, I know for certain her pneumonia illness would never have gotten as bad. I was young and at the mercy of her regular pediatrician who hardly checked her out all 3 times I took her in the week she ended up in the ER. I even asked him for medicine and he wouldn't prescribe them! In the hospital, he admitted to me that "I should have listened to you". So, it was at the very least preventable with antibiotics. Thank God for homeopathy again which cured my daughter of autism. I honestly think the experience with her autism was way more scary than actually seeing her close to death. What would I have done with a child who suddenly, out of the blue, became comatose and/or was running up against walls and banging her head. Scary stuff. 

 

The biggest problem I have with vaccines are that they are creating more disease on more levels for us as a whole. Kids are way sicker than they ever used to be and the rates of autism are continuing to rise. There is more childhood disease than ever before. It's about quality of life. Should we continue to inject brain-altering, immune-altering toxins in the short-term only for us to have rates of auto-immune, non-epidemic diseases go up? Where's the quality of life in that? In some cases, I feel the benefits outweigh the risks but I think it's rare when they do. We're talking BRAIN-ALTERING chemicals! Once you lose your loved ones to these chemicals, you will never see them in the same light again. It feels conspiratorial that pediatricians and vaccine makers do whatever they can to cover up these reactions! 

 

Carrie, with homeopathy, you could actually treat that ongoing neuralgia. You would have to see a homeopath to get a full case work-up. 

 

MW- Antimonium Tart sounds like it would be a great remedy for Dylan should he have breathing trouble again in the future. There are other remedies to but that one is top of the list. Definitely keep up the probiotics and his rash will clear. I would continue the probiotics for a long while. 

 

 


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#439 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 04:09 PM
 
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PS- Pertussis.....ah....I love when that one comes up! There are constant outbreaks where we live! My neighbors are doctors and they are always diagnosing Pertussis but you never see it in the news and no one panics ...... but we vaccinate for it! WTH! 

 

Homeopathic Pertussin is great to have on hand should Pertussis visit your house. Again, it's not a big deal. It's a bigger deal for adults who are now the ones getting it! Adults get sicker than healthy, vibrant kids. 


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#440 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 04:25 PM - Thread Starter
 
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kinder ~ i've been meaning to ask you what brand of homeopathic you recommend. the only thing that concerns me about them is that there isn't a universal quality control that i know of.

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#441 of 446 Old 12-31-2011, 08:29 PM
 
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So with my DD, she is not immuno-compromised. The issue with her and with other heart babies is that if they get sick, they get sicker than a heart-normal baby would get. So protecting her from getting sick is our big focus. That was one of my big issues with the Prevnar13 shot because fever spikes are specifically called out on the CDC handout but I'm told over and over again that it's a problem if DD gets a fever. headscratch.gif Now, one of her cardiologists said there is a difference between a vaccine fever and a fever from a virus or bacteria and I get that but when she gets a fever, we don't know right away what's causing it. So we have to do a full workup rather than just going "Oh it's probably from the vaccine she got the other day.". Also, with heart babies, it is a big deal to keep them away from respiratory illnesses. Hence the RSV shot (which isn't a vaccine in the true sense).

 

For me, I had to make the decision on whether or not I could live with myself if DD got sick from a vaccine-preventable disease or illness and died. Because in her situation, death is a likely result. The week DD was in the PICU, I watched the family of a 7 month old little boy who also had Tetralogy of Fallot with Pulmonary Atresia gather together as they made the decision to turn off the ECMO machine that he was hooked up to and let him die. I passed the mom and dad in the hallway as they walked away from the PICU for the last time with the few worldly possessions that had belonged to their son clutched in their arms. I had spoken to the mom a few times and she told me some of her son's history. He was repeatedly sick from the time he went home the first time from the hospital with various respiratory illnesses. It weakened his body and he was not able to make it through the major repair surgery. I don't know what his vaccine history was. 

 

I do take precautions that her doctors think are unnecessary like splitting the vaccines up. But they don't give me a hard time about it. We don't have to do Hep B until it's time for DD to start school. And I won't be doing the variacella vaccine. I'll probably delay the MMR until after she's two at least if I do it at all.

 

I take other precautions that some would consider unnecessary. I give her probiotics and vitamin D daily. Based on my research, that's one of the best ways to keep her immune system functioning at it's highest level. I can't keep DD in a bubble. I can't keep her older siblings away from her. They attend school and they have four younger siblings at their mom's house who are frequently sick. DSD 12 has acquired her yearly winter lingering cough/lung issue. I wish that I could keep them healthy but their mom doesn't buy in to the probiotics and vitamin D so they get sick. DD's stomach bug that landed us in the hospital came from them. It happens. BUT, I don't go overboard with antibacterial stuff which my mom disagrees with. I wash my hands with regular soap. I don't make the kids use hand sanitizer. I don't freak out if DD's pacifier falls on the floor. I wash it off if I'm near water but if not, I just wipe it. I think it's important to get natural immunity from the germs that are always around us. I let other people hold her when we are out but I make sure to wash her hands or give her bath when we get home.


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#442 of 446 Old 01-01-2012, 07:47 AM - Thread Starter
 
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OIC, Annie. Thanks for explaining that. I guess I assumed Ava was immuno-compromised but all of that makes sense. Her immune system is fine but, because of her heart condition, she could get much more sick than normal from one of those diseases. I can't imagine seeing that family go through their loss with your baby in the hospital, too. That is so heartbreaking and scary.

I'd guess that Ava has a higher chance of contracting an illness, too, just because she has to see the doctors and be in the hospital sometimes and have surgery. All of that probably exposes her to more than the average baby.

I would be devastated (obviously, as I'm sure any of us would be) if one of my children got very or died from a supposed vaccine preventable disease. I might even blame myself, as I'm sure many other people would, for not having them vaxed. The fact is, though, that there would be no way to know if any child who died from one of these diseases would have survived if they had been vaxed since no one can 100
% guarantee full protection from the vaxes.

Maybe we can say that it appears that people who are vaxed are less likely to contract these diseases. Maybe we can say that these diseases occur more often in unvaxed populations. I say maybe because I haven't seen the studies that compare vaxed populations with unvaxed populations with other other factors being equal. And there are arguments about whether it was the vaxes that helped to control the diseases or if it was improved sanitation, nutrition and the natural progression of a virus or bacterium through the population. Vaxed people do still contract these diseases sometimes and even die from them and many more unvaxed people contract these diseases and don't die than those who do die. Does that make sense?

Well, happy new year, everyone! One more baby to go for the new year who will be here soon. joy.gif

A new thread for the new year:

http://www.mothering.com/community/t/1340508/january-2012-whatever-ladies-having-babies-waiting-on-the-last-one#post_16808985

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#443 of 446 Old 01-01-2012, 07:51 PM
 
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He's here! joy.gif

Everest was born at home today after 2hrs and 20m of true labor. He's 8lbs even and 20 1/2 inch long. I'm in heaven and I feel like a rockstar! I gave birth without any pain meds....I've done it before but still I can believe I made it through it so fast! I pushed him out in, I think, 4 pushes!

Pics coming soon!

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He's here! joy.gif
Everest was born at home today after 2hrs and 20m of true labor. He's 8lbs even and 20 1/2 inch long. I'm in heaven and I feel like a rockstar! I gave birth without any pain meds....I've done it before but still I can believe I made it through it so fast! I pushed him out in, I think, 4 pushes!
Pics coming soon!

 

joy.gif  Congrats!!!!! Yay on a super fast labor! Enjoy your babymoon 
 

 


caffix.gif wife and forever in love with J jammin.gif  - Mom to 4 girls K blahblah.gif '01' J energy.gif '06' M bouncy.gif '08' &  A drool.gif '11'  nocirc.gif  saynovax.gif

 
 

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#445 of 446 Old 01-02-2012, 06:52 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Congratulations, Kinder! joy.gif See, all that early start and stop labor was good for something. When the hard part hit, it was very short. winky.gif

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#446 of 446 Old 01-02-2012, 07:33 AM - Thread Starter
 
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LWAB thread: http://www.mothering.com/community/t/1340622/january-2010-whatever-ladies#post_16810275

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