Marijuana and Pregnancy in KS - Mothering Forums

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Old 05-13-2012, 08:00 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Okay so I need some advice I am 27 wks pregnant and have smoked almost daily... we recently moved to Kansas and from what I can tell about it on the internet they have very strict marijuana laws... I have always lived in MO and as long as you are clean at the time you give birth then it's not a problem... but I have NO CLUE what the rules are in KS... Can someone explain what the marijuana laws are regarding pregnancy and drug testing in this state?? P.S. I'm not on medicaid or medicare I am on a self pay plan through the local hospital. I have a son already so the last thing I need is any unnecessary drama from the local CPS...  My plan is to quit smoking the day my 3rd trimestar starts but I still want to know what to expect going into labor. Thanks for your help/advice... 

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Old 05-13-2012, 08:39 PM
 
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If you quit at 28 weeks, you won't test positive when you go into labor.


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Old 05-13-2012, 09:11 PM
 
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Why are you smoking so much pot?


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Old 05-13-2012, 10:50 PM
 
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Why are you smoking so much pot?


 Some women use it as a nausea aid for morning sickness. Other people in general use it for sleep aids, or appetite stimulants, or various other uses that are legitimate reasons for partaking. That's why it's a good addition to the medical field. It's so beneficial for the right people, vs just smoking it to get high (which I think is silly personally).


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Old 05-14-2012, 02:40 AM
 
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There is ABOSOLUTELY nothing wrong with smoking cannabis during pregnancy, as a matter of fact it's safer than any other man made drug out there.  Many MD's prescribe pregnant women with what ever drugs based on the problem they have, for example if a prego is feeling the blues, they will prescribe anti depressants, and guess what!? the baby is born with defects or dead.  WTH!? And this is okay??? Because it's legal??? But in the history of marijuana, NOT ONE PERSON/EMBRYO HAS EVER DIED FROM IT'S USE.  If death has occured, it's simply because the prohibition laws, the government is against it for their own beneficial reasons ---MONEY?!  They care not for the health of us, nor the life of our unborn child.  Now i support cannabis use during pregnancy if needed and it's the best for any ailment.  All you judgemental people out there, go and do some research, stop being so brainwashed by what this government has shoved in your head, EDUCATE YOURSELF!

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Old 05-14-2012, 06:48 AM
 
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Why are you smoking so much pot?

not helpful.

 

 

Mama, the THC should be out of your system in about 3-4 weeks, since you are a regular smoker. I wouldn't worry too much. I'm not sure about KS as I am in the Southeast, but here, I believe women are routinely tested for drugs during birth. I don;t know anyone who has had their baby taken because of a positive test alone, though. If you are going to quit during your 3rd tri., I think you will be just fine.


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Old 05-14-2012, 06:54 AM
 
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Why are you smoking so much pot?

where did the op say she was smoking "so much?"


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Old 05-14-2012, 07:28 AM
 
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where did the op say she was smoking "so much?"

OP did say she was smoking pot almost daily.


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Old 05-14-2012, 04:01 PM
 
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I did a little research into this issue when I considering trying medical marijuana to cope with some of my first trimester problems. I guess your question is what is the likelihood that you will be tested for marijuana in your system and what is the likelihood that a positive test result would be reported to CPS? Certainly, there is a lot of variance in local policies and procedures, so I would not claim to know whether that is something that could happen where you live. My research indicated that although a lot of people were paranoid about this happening, it was rare and was something that never happens in my state, California. (Of course, California's attitude towards marijuana is a far cry from Kansas's.) Even if you were tested, in most places CPS has much bigger fish to fry. But I will say that legally, no one can force you to undergo a blood test without your consent, or a court order. I have read a lot of people on the internet saying that such-and-such test is mandatory, but legally they are not. The problem is that at some point during your pregnancy someone is likely to shove some papers at you and tell you that you need to sign them. And one of these papers may say something about consenting to tests necessary for the health of your baby, which unbeknownst to you means drug testing. It's also possible that the hospital could test you even if you did not consent. (For what it's worth, I am a lawyer, but keep in mind that I am able to give you legal advice that applies to your specific situation.)

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Old 05-16-2012, 08:28 AM
 
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Marijuana is used as a medication.   It has active ingredients and  an therefore it has side effects. So, a question "Why do you used pot daily" is just as legitimate as "Why do you use Vicodin daily" or "Why do you use Ambien nightly"

 

 

Cannabis proponents lite to taut how natural  marijuana is but im   reality is marijuana has side effects. The  negative effect on short term memory has been been well documented. People do becomes psychologically  addicted and that has been documented as well as  well as decreases in ambition. To put is simply, marijuana tuners some people into forgetful couch potatoes.

 

 

It can increase anxiety in others. Marijuanna has cause tachycardia usually in combination with certain medications.

 

So, I think it is silly at best to say "It is naturally and thereof it is safe"

 

Yes, no fetus died from marijuana but research show mother's cannabis use has effect on memory and learning abilities as well as hyperactivity:

 

http://www.webmd.com/baby/news/20030325/marijuana-may-harm-fetus

 

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/05/070524145037.htm

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Old 05-16-2012, 09:29 AM
 
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In this study, researchers examined the effects of exposure to an artificial component of marijuana called WIN in the offspring of rats who received the synthetic cannabinoid while pregnant. The mother rats received a daily injection of the drug that was comparable to a low-to-moderate marijuana dose inhaled by a human smoker.

 

 

^^^^This study make absolutely no sense. I'd also like to know how it was funded. You can't just copy and paste articles form web MD of all places and expect it to be factual, unbiased information. An ARTIFICIAL component of marijuana, INJECTED into the bodies of RATS? What? How is that comparable to marijuana use in humans? Point being, the OP did not ask whether or not mj is safe for use during pregnancy. She asked what to expect, probably from someone who has BTDT, during labor and birth. There is a HUGE difference between mj, Vicodin, and Ambien.


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Old 05-16-2012, 09:30 AM
 
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Marijuana is used as a medication.   It has active ingredients and  an therefore it has side effects. So, a question "Why do you used pot daily" is just as legitimate as "Why do you use Vicodin daily" or "Why do you use Ambien nightly"


Cannabis proponents lite to taut how natural  marijuana is but im   reality is marijuana has side effects. The  negative effect on short term memory has been been well documented. People do becomes psychologically  addicted and that has been documented as well as  well as decreases in ambition. To put is simply, marijuana tuners some people into forgetful couch potatoes.


It can increase anxiety in others. Marijuanna has cause tachycardia usually in combination with certain medications.

So, I think it is silly at best to say "It is naturally and thereof it is safe"

Yes, no fetus died from marijuana but research show mother's cannabis use has effect on memory and learning abilities as well as hyperactivity:

http://www.webmd.com/baby/news/20030325/marijuana-may-harm-fetus

http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2007/05/070524145037.htm

Thank you.
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Old 05-16-2012, 10:33 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Thanks for all of the advice that everyone has given...I really appreciate it and it has relieved some of the stress... to answer some of your questions I have been extremely sick with this pregnancy and it has helped me reduce vomiting, and helped me have an appetite so that I can eat. The doctor gave me a medication to help but when I googled it I found out it was to reduce nausea in chemo patience and this isn't something that I felt comfortable taking on a continued basis. When I thought about smoking to help me I did my research and found out that there were no definate side effects that could be linked... just hints of what might happen and all of them were far less severe then the medication I was on. 

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Old 05-16-2012, 01:36 PM
 
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Pot is used in chemo patients as well. Zofran has been better studied than pot

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Old 05-16-2012, 04:06 PM
 
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Pot is used in chemo patients as well. Zofran has been better studied than pot

 

That's a shame since Zofran has so many ridiculous side effects and marijuana typically does not. 

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Old 05-16-2012, 06:48 PM
 
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Studies where ACTUAL mothers(not rats) and ACTUAL babies(not rat babies) were studied after the mothers smoked ACTUAL pot (not an injection of the synthetic version of one chemical component of pot) during pregnancy have shown that clean pot is NOT dangerous at all.

 

These studies followed women and children not just for the first year or so of life...but tracked children for many many years with specific and very intense scrutiny of their performance in school (as well as their social health, mental health and behavior, etc).

 

Many people like to discredit these studies because they have all, due to the insane laws in the US, had to take place outside the country. But they are valid and very well documented and meet/far exceed what anyone here would agree is acceptable scientific process for a study of this nature.

 

exactly. 

 

Saying that "MJ is harmful for women in pregnancy PERIOD. Just look at this super fucking stupid link I posted from WebMD" is like saying "Food is harmful for women in pregnancy...just look at this link to a study on what happens when women eat nothing but McDonalds during pregnancy!"

 

It's stupid. Weed is like food. When it is grown and distributed by criminal enterprises...it is a gross, nutritionally disgusting product which will bring ill health to it's consumer. When it is grown without pesticides and is of high quality, it has the ability to heal, nourish and lift up the mind and body in very significant and completely awesome ways.

People who smoke during pregnancy are not bumbling around their kitchens, staring at their hands and feeding their children ho-hos for dinner. A lot of them are smoking VERY good, clean strains of MJ and are able to break free from practically crippling MS and other debilitating pregnancy related pains/troubles to be the good mothers/partners/pregnant women they want to be.

You people with this terrible idea of pot smokers being these idiot, "munchy-having" couch dwellers are so fraking ill-informed it's not even funny....and no, I don't care about some dude you know who is a pot head and is a stupid douche bag. HE isn't the face of pot. DO THE RESEARCH.

(And for the record, no, I don't smoke anymore (since becoming a mother) and I haven't had a medical reason to smoke during pregnancy...but if I did, I WOULD).

 

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Old 05-16-2012, 07:01 PM
 
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I would give yourself a pretty wide window. In some people (my sister for example) pot takes longer than 3-4 weeks to leave your system. I think it's rare and I'm not sure anyone knows why it can work that way but I'd imagine just like any other medication in that we all metabolize differently. It's probably not a huge deal if you live in a state where the laws are more lax or DHS as a practical matter doesn't get involved for "just pot" (for example, here my understanding is just testing positive for pot doesn't put you at risk for losing your kids, there would have to be other factors). Since you mentioned the state you are in now has strict laws though I'd be more concerned.

 

I'd also be a little concerned that your doctor or a nurse might drug test you without your knowledge at one of your appointments. I know when I saw my regular doctor during my pregnancy for a bad yeast infection they tested me for things I didn't consent to (mainly GBS--they were supposed to only be verifying it was truly yeast and not bacterial). Granted it wasn't a drug test but I wouldn't put it past some medical providers particularly if the mood in the state is very anti-pot. They are supposed to get your consent for testing but as a practical matter that rarely happens.

 

That being said, we have some seriously silly laws in this country :(  Good luck mama! I hope the rest of your pregnancy is easier at least in terms of nausea!


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Old 05-16-2012, 08:05 PM
 
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I'd also be a little concerned that your doctor or a nurse might drug test you without your knowledge at one of your appointments. I know when I saw my regular doctor during my pregnancy for a bad yeast infection they tested me for things I didn't consent to (mainly GBS--they were supposed to only be verifying it was truly yeast and not bacterial). Granted it wasn't a drug test but I wouldn't put it past some medical providers particularly if the mood in the state is very anti-pot. They are supposed to get your consent for testing but as a practical matter that rarely happens.

 

I haven't smoked in years - and definitely not while I was pregnant - but I can confirm that I was drug tested without my knowledge at my first MIDWIFE appointment.  (I may have signed a general consent form, as Laurucha mentions above, but I certainly wasn't told that I was going to be drug tested at that appointment.  I wasn't told that I was going to have an HIV test, either.)  Imagine my surprise when I got the itemized bill listing all the tests I'd had that day!

 

I am in NJ, though, not KS. 

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Old 05-16-2012, 09:58 PM
 
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I live in the area with high quality medical pot. Everyone and their mother has a card.  And no matter how much you swear and post....it causes sort term memory issues in adult. Expensive or not, pot is potent medication with potent side effect that is at best, poorly studied. I would not risk my fetus. I certainly would not smoke it if I was in the state where it is illegal and CPS can come after me.  It is a risk no one need to take. What sort of bonding breastfeeding experience an infant would have if she was put with foster family at birth? Do you think foster parent will be collecting donor's milk?

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Old 05-16-2012, 10:12 PM
 
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Broodywoodsgal well said!

I actually found Mothering when doing research about the effects of MMJ on pregnancy. See this article: [=http://mothering.com/pregnancy-birth/medical-marijuana-surprising-solution-severe-morning-sickness][/]. Sure, you can find a lot of things on the Internet that will tell you that marijuana is bad. Just like you can find a lot of things about cosleeping/extended breastfeeding/non-vaxing/whatever are bad. Don't drink the kool-aid, people! Use your critical thinking skills.


OP, I second the recommendation to give yourself more than 3-4 weeks. Depending the amount of THC in your system and, well, your system itself, it may take longer to clear out.

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Old 05-17-2012, 02:03 AM
 
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You definitely need more than four weeks to clear it out. As a previous poster already stated (was it phathui?) you need to stop smoking by at least 28 weeks. This is because it is in the BABY'S system, and if you keep smoking past that point, it will be in the baby's meconium. Since some hospitals test the meconium, they will find it. 4 weeks is certainly not enough to solve that problem.

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Old 05-17-2012, 05:46 AM
 
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Yeah MJ being stored in fat cells means it hangs around for a while....so people generally say that MJ can test positive in the system for a month. But the truth is, if someone is a daily smoker for a very long period of time, it stays around longer than that.

OP if this is something you are truly worried about, I would honestly stop now. Seriously. I don't think it's going to end up being a big deal for you, but if you are having weird thoughts or deep intuition tell you that you need to not test positive or have your baby test positive, you should stop this very day. <3<3
 


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Old 05-17-2012, 12:29 PM
 
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OMG all these questions about why are you smoking... I want to know why are women being drug tested at birth?????


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Old 05-17-2012, 02:56 PM
 
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One thing I notice about some  habitual pot users is there propensity to rant, to rave and to believes every conspiracy theory on the Internet.  I do not see you posting any links to peer reviewed studies.

 

One does not have to use a drug to be aware of the results.

 

 

As a healthcare worker I come across people who us marijuana all the time. Some do well and have and experience no side effects. Others experience side effects.

 

 

If something is potent enough to provide beneficial effect then something is potent enough to have side effect.

 

Every medicinal substance will have side effects. You own millage may vary.

 

What is something is natural or not it is meaningless . Cancer is natural.  Lets, face it, the marjuana plants of today are not the same gentle plant  people smoke hundreds of years ago. You can think selective breeding for it.

 

 

When someone had to use pain or sleep or nausea medication daily, the natural question that should arise is "Is there anything else can be done with deal with the root cause of this condition", not "Yes, just use Vicodin, Ambien, pot whatever daily till the end of times"

 

Does this really worth the risk"

For 3–4 year old children, prenatal marijuana exposure negatively affected the verbal and memory domains in both the OPPS and MHPCD studied groups. Cognitive development assessed by the Stanford-Binet Intelligence Scale demonstrated a negative association of short-term memory and verbal reasoning with first and/or second trimester marijuana usage.[57] Similarly, memory and verbal domains, measured by the McCarthy Scales of Children’s Abilities, decreased with daily marijuana usage.[56] However, composite intelligence scores in both studies were not impacted at this age by maternal marijuana use.

When children reach school age at around 5–6 years old, reports on the consequences of prenatal marijuana exposure begin to diverge. Exposed children from the OPPS cohort appear to have no memory deficits,[58] while those from the MHPCD cohort report short-term memory deficits that correlate strongly with heavy second trimester exposure.[59] Cannabis-exposed children in the OPPS cohort scored significantly lower in tests for sustained attention, while those from the MHPCD group actually displayed increased attention (measured by fewer errors of omission in a continuous performance task) from second trimester exposure.[60] Both groups reported an increase in impulsive and hyperactive behaviors. Follow-up studies found that problems of depression, hyperactivity, inattention and impulsivity persist into the 9–12 year age range,[47,61–64] raising speculation of deficits in higher cognitive processes such as executive function.[65]"

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Old 05-17-2012, 04:43 PM
 
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One thing I notice about some  habitual pot users is there propensity to rant, to rave and to believes every conspiracy theory on the Internet.  I do not see you posting any links to peer reviewed studies.

One does not have to use a drug to be aware of the results.


As a healthcare worker I come across people who us marijuana all the time. Some do well and have and experience no side effects. Others experience side effects.


If something is potent enough to provide beneficial effect then something is potent enough to have side effect.

Every medicinal substance will have side effects. You own millage may vary.

What is something is natural or not it is meaningless . Cancer is natural.  Lets, face it, the marjuana plants of today are not the same gentle plant  people smoke hundreds of years ago. You can think selective breeding for it.


When someone had to use pain or sleep or nausea medication daily, the natural question that should arise is "Is there anything else can be done with deal with the root cause of this condition", not "Yes, just use Vicodin, Ambien, pot whatever daily till the end of times"

Does this really worth the risk"
For 3–4 year old children, prenatal marijuana exposure negatively affected the verbal and memory domains in both the OPPS and MHPCD studied groups. Cognitive development assessed by the Stanford-Binet Intelligence Scale demonstrated a negative association of short-term memory and verbal reasoning with first and/or second trimester marijuana usage.[URL=][57][/URL] Similarly, memory and verbal domains, measured by the McCarthy Scales of Children’s Abilities, decreased with daily marijuana usage.[URL=][56][/URL] However, composite intelligence scores in both studies were not impacted at this age by maternal marijuana use.
When children reach school age at around 5–6 years old, reports on the consequences of prenatal marijuana exposure begin to diverge. Exposed children from the OPPS cohort appear to have no memory deficits,[URL=][58][/URL] while those from the MHPCD cohort report short-term memory deficits that correlate strongly with heavy second trimester exposure.[URL=][59][/URL] Cannabis-exposed children in the OPPS cohort scored significantly lower in tests for sustained attention, while those from the MHPCD group actually displayed increased attention (measured by fewer errors of omission in a continuous performance task) from second trimester exposure.[URL=][60][/URL] Both groups reported an increase in impulsive and hyperactive behaviors. Follow-up studies found that problems of depression, hyperactivity, inattention and impulsivity persist into the 9–12 year age range,[URL=][47,61–64][/URL] raising speculation of deficits in higher cognitive processes such as executive function.[URL=][65]"[/URL]

Thanks. I appreciate your posts. Drugging an unborn child with ANYTHING that is not a dire necessity to living and dying, crosses a line that I find wrong in many ways.
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Old 05-17-2012, 04:50 PM
 
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Thanks. I appreciate your posts. Drugging an unborn child with ANYTHING that is not a dire necessity to living and dying, crosses a line that I find wrong in many ways.


Oh....so DAMN ALL THOSE WOMEN on zofran, right? What about those "evil" women who are battling depression during pregnancy and have to take a pill to help them hold on to their sanity??

Because both of those things are more serious and have more dangerous side effects than medical MJ. So? What say you, to the women of this very forum, who are using drugs with risky side effects AND unknown long-term consequences to fight depression and extreme m/s....??


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Old 05-17-2012, 05:49 PM
 
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I've truly enjoyed the discussion/debate that this question has braught up. I don't think anyone as addressed the carbon monoxide issue. When we smoke we inhale a good bit of it which temporarily deprives the blood of oxygen (and the placenta and fetus). Marijuana benefits aside, how much carbon monoxide is too much? Can anyone address this. If a mother was to inhale ten breaths containing CO per day, would this significantly deprive a baby of oxygen to say decrease potential intelligence or stunt growth?
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Old 05-17-2012, 06:27 PM
 
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Originally Posted by budwana birth View Post

OMG all these questions about why are you smoking... I want to know why are women being drug tested at birth?????

 

 

I tried to get at this in my previous post... Where I live what is going on is that healthcare providers are testing pregnant women for more serious drugs. Women who test positive are referred to drug counseling, but not reported to CPS. They are doing this with the consent of the women, though few women probably realize they signed a consent form authorizing this, because the form doesn't say anything about drug testing. Only because this issue was on my radar and because I am an attorney did I realize what the form meant. I find it troublesome that healthcare providers are routinely tricking women into consenting to tests. If they don't understand what they are consenting to, it's not informed consent. And there seems to be a paternalistic attitude towards pregnant women. Few people seem willing to accept the idea that women retain the complete right to control their bodies, even when pregnant.

 

Anyway, I can't be certain that it never happens, but I do not believe that women anywhere are being routinely tested for THC and reported to CPS for positive results, though a lot of women fear this could happen. It is definitely illegal to test them without their consent. (The U.S. Supreme Court addressed this in 2001.)

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Old 05-17-2012, 06:45 PM
 
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Oh....so DAMN ALL THOSE WOMEN on zofran, right? What about those "evil" women who are battling depression during pregnancy and have to take a pill to help them hold on to their sanity??

Because both of those things are more serious and have more dangerous side effects than medical MJ. So? What say you, to the women of this very forum, who are using drugs with risky side effects AND unknown long-term consequences to fight depression and extreme m/s....??


Not to mention any woman who has anything less than 100% natural childbirth.

 

I took vicodin occasionally during my first trimester. I had constant headaches, which were occasionally debilitating.The doctors assure me it was completely safe, but it concerned me. I considered seeking out marijuana because I thought it might be safer. Should I have just spent months in bed suffering?

 

I am surprised that there seem to be so many people in this forum who do not believe that women have the right to make all decisions about what to do with their bodies.

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Old 05-17-2012, 06:50 PM
 
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Anyway, I can't be certain that it never happens, but I do not believe that women anywhere are being routinely tested for THC and reported to CPS for positive results, though a lot of women fear this could happen. It is definitely illegal to test them without their consent. (The U.S. Supreme Court addressed this in 2001.)
[/quote]
I'm glad that the original question was answered. But I wonder if we can go on with the other questions that have been raised. Perhaps another thread is in order. I don't think that there is another space on the web where this specific debate (maternal usage/morality/scientific clarity) is playing out in such a balanced way. I appreciate the things I've read from either side.
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