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Old 10-31-2007, 01:57 PM
 
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Originally Posted by CherryBomb View Post
Yes. And what's insulting is comparing women here to women on a different board who are ignorant on what a normal birth and normal baby looks like.
I was not comparing women on here to women on Ivillage. I was trying to illustrate my point that it is extreme stuff like that on mainstream boards that drive NFL gals like myself to MDC and many of us are sensative about discussing or having to be constantly subjected to talk of medically unneccessary procedures and interventions during pregnancy and birth in what we consider to be perhaps our only "safe haven." For all of you that feel left out because you make choices that may not reflect the overall Mothering Magazine philosophy, please understand that there are just as many of us that feel left out because there is almost nowhere to go for any support in our decisions.
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Old 10-31-2007, 02:14 PM
 
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Originally Posted by kerikadi View Post
Defensive much?


I don't think anybody said you can't have what you are looking for.

Nobody said DDCs HAVE to be more like MDC we just said our DDCs weren't what WE were looking for.
No, I'm not defensive at all. Insulted maybe, a little bitter, not defensive. I don't need to defend anything, and that was my ENTIRE POINT. And this post did not refer to DDCs, it referred to our non-existent medically necessary CS support board. So yes, someone did say I can't have what I'm looking for--the MDC administrators, with the blessing of the poster whose post I was quoting. It didn't refer to anything you posted.
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Old 10-31-2007, 02:21 PM
 
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*deleted because Chrysta defends herself admirably.
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Old 10-31-2007, 03:27 PM
 
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Originally Posted by tyisrrs
For all of you that feel left out because you make choices that may not reflect the overall Mothering Magazine philosophy, please understand that there are just as many of us that feel left out because there is almost nowhere to go for any support in our decisions.
Really? Because I'm a pretty militant vegan, I drive a recycled veggie oil car (rarely; I usually walk), am having a minimally-assisted homebirth, will breastfeed, babywear, cosleep, and CD, and I feel completely supported and encouraged in my decisions by my DDC. And from popping into other DDCs, I'd probably feel the same there, too. Not saying that you have to feel supported, but "left out"?

I'm curious as to why birth is such a determining factor in whether someone is NFL enough. There are mamas in my DDC who make their own clothes, live off the grid, breastfeed until their kids are 6...and decide to have many u/s and induce at 40 weeks because that's what they're comfortable with. I probably wouldn't do any of those things, and I consider those mamas to embody the mothering.com "philosophy" far more than I do! The birth element is just one bit of NFL.
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Old 10-31-2007, 04:41 PM
 
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Originally Posted by lovingmommyhood View Post
I believe you think pretty highly of yourself if you think you made me feel inferior. That is not the case. Unwelcome, yes. Inferior? No.

I love my hospital births. I love the whole experience. That doesn't make me mainstream. Mainstream people don't question anything, they just go with the flow and follow their OB's blindly.

whoa. just...whoa. enjoy yourself, enjoy your pregnancy the way you want to experience it. if you feel unwelcome b/c of MY post, then i don't know what to tell you. again - i am not the one calling you anything or making assumptions. i'm not labelling you. you're doing just fine with that all by yourself.

the point is - i don't care what YOU specifically do personally - i just don't "feel" the whole mdc experience that i used to know when i read about endless procedures, etc...why you do what you do is your business and a totally separate issue in my mind. you 're taking this waaaaaaaaaaaay personal. i was talking about the board/ddc vibe OVERALL. take care and best wishes.
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Old 10-31-2007, 04:43 PM
 
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Defensive much?


I don't think anybody said you can't have what you are looking for.

Nobody said DDCs HAVE to be more like MDC we just said our DDCs weren't what WE were looking for.
ummm, exactly. thank you.
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Old 10-31-2007, 05:11 PM
 
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Originally Posted by veganjoy View Post
Really? Because I'm a pretty militant vegan, I drive a recycled veggie oil car (rarely; I usually walk), am having a minimally-assisted homebirth, will breastfeed, babywear, cosleep, and CD, and I feel completely supported and encouraged in my decisions by my DDC. And from popping into other DDCs, I'd probably feel the same there, too. Not saying that you have to feel supported, but "left out"?

I'm curious as to why birth is such a determining factor in whether someone is NFL enough. There are mamas in my DDC who make their own clothes, live off the grid, breastfeed until their kids are 6...and decide to have many u/s and induce at 40 weeks because that's what they're comfortable with. I probably wouldn't do any of those things, and I consider those mamas to embody the mothering.com "philosophy" far more than I do! The birth element is just one bit of NFL.
It's not, unless you're one of those "I did x, y, & z, so I'm better than you" kind of people.
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Old 10-31-2007, 05:54 PM
 
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ummm, exactly. thank you.
Another person who didn't read either my post or apparently my reply. This had nothing to do with DDCs.
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Old 10-31-2007, 06:10 PM
 
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Originally Posted by meisterfrau View Post
Another person who didn't read either my post or apparently my reply. This had nothing to do with DDCs.

again, it's not personal. i was replying to sentiment that was expressed by kerikadi. it reflects how i feel - that there is a lot of defensiveness here on this thread and that the ddc's aren't what WE are looking for.
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Old 10-31-2007, 06:15 PM
 
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forgot to add - meisterfrau - i certainly did read your posts. but i believe that what you are bringing up is both 1) valid, and 2) not what this thread is about.

i've gone above and beyond to state my beliefs that a medically necessary/c-sec trauma/healing forum be insituted here on this board, only to have threads shut down, etc. so...i feel for you, but...i think it is a separate issue.
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Old 10-31-2007, 06:22 PM
 
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Originally Posted by veganjoy View Post
Really? Because I'm a pretty militant vegan, I drive a recycled veggie oil car (rarely; I usually walk), am having a minimally-assisted homebirth, will breastfeed, babywear, cosleep, and CD, and I feel completely supported and encouraged in my decisions by my DDC. And from popping into other DDCs, I'd probably feel the same there, too. Not saying that you have to feel supported, but "left out"?

I'm curious as to why birth is such a determining factor in whether someone is NFL enough. There are mamas in my DDC who make their own clothes, live off the grid, breastfeed until their kids are 6...and decide to have many u/s and induce at 40 weeks because that's what they're comfortable with. I probably wouldn't do any of those things, and I consider those mamas to embody the mothering.com "philosophy" far more than I do! The birth element is just one bit of NFL.
Not getting all the animosity. Just trying to explain another point of view. Obviously, what I said doesn't apply to you. I said many, not all. And there are plenty of people who agree (and disagree) with me. What is your point?
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Old 10-31-2007, 06:23 PM
 
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I see both sides of the issues and while there are some educated people I am sure for the most part I love how moms here are concerned and educated and informed about the choices we make for our babies/children. However, what is right for some is not right for others and at the end of the day we are trying to make the best decisions for our babies.

I am by no means a mainstream mother but I just came back from an sonogram at 9 weeks. Why? not because I wanted to see the heartbeat but because I have thyroid issues and my TSH was totally supressed and they needed to know if it was due to twins so we could get my medication dosage adjustment right. Maybe the masses at mothering think that I am putting my baby's life in danger but hey I need to keep my thyroid stable so I can give this baby the best start possible and the decision had to be an informed one. These numbers are often seen in twins and they are treated differently if that is the case.

About birthing... My first was a csection - medically necessary yes. My labor was great at a birth center we tried everything under the sun but he was asynclitic and after my midwife tried everything under the sun and he was not moving and his heart rate kept dipping constantly we did a csection. I am glad we did. Especially after the outcome of baby# 2.
With baby number two. I had a home VBAC. It was wonderful but his cord was an occult prolapse and I lost my son after a week in the nicu. Do I belive in homebirth yes. But homebirth also has risks all births have some risks. So far my homebirth has been the most horrifing experience of my life. I wish it had been different. For my next birth I am going to be at a hospital with a midwife. If I have another VBAC GREAT I would love that and I hope for that. I also want to be monitored and I am well educated about what that entails. I also am not going to be as 100% about anything because I have been there and at the end I am ok with compromising because a great birth plan means nothing when you don't get to bring your baby home. Don't get me wrong I still belive and support homebirth I just know this time it is NOT for me and I am a lot more willing to compromise in areas which I feel ok in.

I think we all can quickly jump and judge others by a few lines writen here and we can feel superior because the choices we make or we are lucky to not have to make. To me nobody knows better than ME what is best for my babies and I strive to do the best I can for them with educated choices that sometiems fit the views here and sometimes might not. When I explain the situation everybody seems to understand but maybe if I just mention something I could be one of those that some might read and you quickly jump to judge as not NFL enough or mainstream.

I wish we could support eachother and lovingly educate one another when needed and requested. I love mothering but now that I have been on the other side of the statistics I extend a lot more grace and I feel a lot more humbled about birth and all the choices that come with it. What a great thing that there is so much info and support in this place. Why taint that with negativity and judgement.

Namaste
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Old 10-31-2007, 06:54 PM
 
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Originally Posted by tyisrrs
Not getting all the animosity. Just trying to explain another point of view. Obviously, what I said doesn't apply to you. I said many, not all. And there are plenty of people who agree (and disagree) with me. What is your point?
I really did not intend to post in a spirit of animosity, and I apologize if it came off that way. You said, "there are just as many of us that feel left out because there is almost nowhere to go for any support in our decisions." My focus was on the latter part; I wasn't claiming that you were trying to speak for me.

And my point is that if you (general you) make statements about your DDC being too mainstream, and everyone can see which DDC you are talking about, these posts are aimed at actual people. I'm tired of women in my DDC (and others) feeling the need to defend themselves against a "mainstream" title, when they're quite educated and absolutely not mainstream.

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Originally Posted by Barcino
I wish we could support eachother and lovingly educate one another when needed and requested. I love mothering but now that I have been on the other side of the statistics I extend a lot more grace and I feel a lot more humbled about birth and all the choices that come with it. What a great thing that there is so much info and support in this place. Why taint that with negativity and judgement.
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Old 10-31-2007, 07:32 PM
 
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Originally Posted by dove View Post
forgot to add - meisterfrau - i certainly did read your posts. but i believe that what you are bringing up is both 1) valid, and 2) not what this thread is about.

i've gone above and beyond to state my beliefs that a medically necessary/c-sec trauma/healing forum be insituted here on this board, only to have threads shut down, etc. so...i feel for you, but...i think it is a separate issue.
You're right, it is a separate issue. I originally only brought it up to say that maybe if CS mamas had somewhere else here to talk about their CS experiences, we wouldn't discuss it on other parts of the boards where it isn't as good a fit, like this one and the DDCs. It did get off on a tangent b/c I had to respond to pamperedmom's post.

Sorry I'm getting a little heated. The topic is one I get worked up over, especially since i *just* had a cs three weeks ago.
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Old 10-31-2007, 11:42 PM
 
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People keep insisting they're only talking about "unnecessary" stuff, but if that's true, why is this thread even here? Is there a big group of women on MDC running around championing circumcision and elective c-sections?? I certainly haven't seen them.
Bingo. Threads like this come up about all different topics, but the trend is always the same. Group X is criticized, the criticizers are confronted and backpeddle into an, "Oh, I didn't mean all of Group X, just this tiny segment of Group X." But if we're just talking about a few exceptions and not the group as a whole, why does the thread even exist?

Over the years, I've seen threads like this about SAHM's ("Oh, I don't mean all SAHM's are bad, just the ones who feed their kids Ding-Dongs at every meal), WOHM's ("Oh, I don't mean all WOHM's are bad, just the ones who work 100 hours a week), poor people ("Oh, I don't mean all poor people are lazy, just all the ones who live in my town), etc., etc., etc. And the trend is always the same.
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Old 10-31-2007, 11:56 PM
 
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Originally Posted by meisterfrau
I originally only brought it up to say that maybe if CS mamas had somewhere else here to talk about their CS experiences, we wouldn't discuss it on other parts of the boards where it isn't as good a fit, like this one and the DDCs. It did get off on a tangent b/c I had to respond to pamperedmom's post.
First of all...I would, as a c-section mom, really appreciate it if folks would stop assuming that all "cs mamas" agree to the same things and fit in the same mold. There are at least a couple of threads (B&B and FYT) that are VERY specific as to their intent and may very well be very valuable to you. But, SERIOUSLY, let's not assume that all c-section moms want and or need the same thing. Case in point for me...NEITHER of the c/s "support" threads are places that I would EVER feel comfortable.

And yes, this is something I get worked up about just as much as you do.
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Old 11-01-2007, 12:18 AM
 
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First of all...I would, as a c-section mom, really appreciate it if folks would stop assuming that all "cs mamas" agree to the same things and fit in the same mold. There are at least a couple of threads (B&B and FYT) that are VERY specific as to their intent and may very well be very valuable to you. But, SERIOUSLY, let's not assume that all c-section moms want and or need the same thing. Case in point for me...NEITHER of the c/s "support" threads are places that I would EVER feel comfortable.

And yes, this is something I get worked up about just as much as you do.
I never claimed, and would never claim that women who have c-sections all want or need the same thing. I think that was actually my point.

I think there's a difference between saying that you don't want, or need, or would not feel comfortable in a dedicated CS support forum and saying that you're glad such a forum was not created...why not? If you wouldn't find any benefit in such a forum, then that's fine, but maybe others would, and I don't understand why anyone would deny them that. That sounds to me like you want all CS mamas to fit into your mold. Obviously support means a different thing to you than it does to me.

If my idea of support looks different from yours, on such a large board with thousands of members and dozens of subforums (subfora?) why can't we both have what we want? That's all I don't get.
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