Moderation of MDC - What do you think? - Page 17 - Mothering Forums
View Poll Results: Moderation of MDC - What do you think?
I think the current minimal moderation is great. It allows members the freedom to express their opinions without fear of their thread being shut down or a warning issued. Discussions of all types should be permitted and the community should be allowed to respond with their opinions unrestricted. I feel there are some situations where heavy moderation may be necessary but these are very few (explain). 416 56.68%
I do not like the minimal moderation and feel that it is leading to problems. To help protect the integrity of the forums and make the community a comfortable place to post we need the moderators to return to their previous moderation approach. They should oversee discussions more and remove things that are mean, snarky, sarcastic, and harassing. They should remove threads and posts that are against Mothering's parenting philosophies. Members who refuse to post appropriately should be moderated and those who persist in such behavior should be warned consistently and, if necessary, their membership removed. 204 27.79%
Other (explain what sort of moderation you think should be in place) 114 15.53%
Voters: 734. You may not vote on this poll

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#481 of 612 Old 06-21-2011, 05:07 PM
 
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yea!  Now I get what a troll is!!

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#482 of 612 Old 06-21-2011, 05:08 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Bena View Post

This exactly.

Divergent opinions are ok.  Name calling is NOT ok.

If we don`t accept our children to treat eachother that way, then we shouldn`t accept adults to do the same.


 



 


I'll third that!

 
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#483 of 612 Old 06-21-2011, 05:17 PM
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yea!  Now I get what a troll is!!



Actually....quite some time ago, I got a mod-spank for referring to someone as a troll because....it's namecalling.

 

So what do y'all think? Was my previous post as offensive as the cry-baby/loser post?

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#484 of 612 Old 06-21-2011, 07:34 PM
 
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I didn't call anyone a crybaby, I was referring to classes of posters that are being moderated using one-size-fits-few rules.

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#485 of 612 Old 06-21-2011, 07:41 PM
 
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What am I doing in this forum? -- I answered that previously in another post.  If my input is unwelcome then please ask the system mod to remove my e-mail from the auto notification list.  I joined in 2007 and if memory serves my opinions were too powerful for folks to handle then too.

 

Have a wonderful evening!

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#486 of 612 Old 06-21-2011, 08:13 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Bena View Post

This exactly.

Divergent opinions are ok.  Name calling is NOT ok.

If we don`t accept our children to treat eachother that way, then we shouldn`t accept adults to do the same.

 

I just want to be clear; I *rarely* if ever resort to "name-calling" -- What I do do it to summarize an incorrect statement that someone makes and, tell them in the first person. e.g. "You inferred I resorted to name calling in the italicized text above."

 

I make statements like that unashamedly, and frequently.

 

Regarding the multiple assertion by others that I am a troll -- well that's just water off of my back.

 

In this thread I began with a response to a home page poll about moderation; 'in general'.  The title "Moderation on MDC - What do you think?" seemed like an invitation to comment -- I took it as such.  No one in particular was targeted by my comments.  If my comments hit a nerve with any readers... well... 'nuf said.

 

In another thread someone took offense that I complimented a regular poster at the expense of the OP on that thread.  When someone starts a thread on a public board, I assume it is to collect opinions on the topic.  If the OP was only hunting for comfort and acceptance, devoid of variations of opinion she should have sought counsel from a priest, not a web board.  The OP wasn't even the one who expressed dissatisfaction with my post...

 

If there is one think that I have to admit failing to remember, it's that I always assume that adults are mature individuals that understand the truth may not always be pleasant, but it's still true, and that my children routinely demonstrate maturity that I'm probably unwise to expect from the general public.

 

Have a wonderful evening!

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#487 of 612 Old 06-21-2011, 10:50 PM
 
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Is anyone else wondering if Peggy and Cynthia are ignoring this thread b/c they're hoping if they don't post we'll lose interest?  For awhile there Cynthia was posting a few times a page.  Now nothing.


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#488 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 05:32 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Honey693 View Post

Is anyone else wondering if Peggy and Cynthia are ignoring this thread b/c they're hoping if they don't post we'll lose interest?  For awhile there Cynthia was posting a few times a page.  Now nothing.


I know I'm not Peggy or Cynthia, but I'm still reading. I think it's an important conversation and one that would never have taken place a year ago. People need to have their say and the poll is definately being watched. I haven't seen a change between 1 or so percentages for awhile. Are there questions you have that haven't been addressed yet?
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#489 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 06:32 AM
 
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I've posted a new thread twice, yet just tried to do a third and a message popped up saying "since you are new here, your post is being held for moderation." I am guessing it is because of my first one which didn't go well AT ALL and got deleted when all I did was ask for advice. But wouldn't that message have been more beneficial had MDC done that the first time I had posted something (even though I still see nothing wrong with anything I said!).  I was allowed to do a second thread with no problem. My third? No. This just makes me dislike this place even more. Moderation is great, but only when it is done correctly! 


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#490 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 06:37 AM
 
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I think there should be a happy medium.  Not a free for all but not heavy handed moderation.

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#491 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 08:05 AM
 
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Don't we still have the option to report individual posts?

 

If a person thinks that someone posted something that is simply mean and cruel (namecalling, etc.), then the person has the option of reporting the post

 

We don't need whole forums to be moderated and whole threads shut down just because a poster gets passionate about something.  Offense is subjective, as is respect, and I don't need anyone else telling me what I should be offended by or what I should find disrespectful.  I had a childhood and I'm glad those days are behind me!

 

There is no one truth out there.  The best way I've found to know what I believe in is to see the contrast and think about my values.  If life is not black and white, but grey, then we must remember that there are many shades of grey.  And, that is why it's important to be able to discuss (ad nauseum at times) subjects and ideas from many various viewpoints. 

 

While I strive to be as compassionate and kind as possible, I also recognize that other people's feelings are not my responsibility.  It is an important part of growth to be able to peacefully move through the "lesser" behaviors and attitudes that are rooted in fear, anger, and sadness. And, how can we learn to do that without opportunities to practice it? Even online.  I accept that not everyone is in the same place (emotionally, mentally, spiritually) as I am and that is okay.  I don't need MDC moderators to protect me from the real world.  After all, I exist outside of Mothering forums.  I have not become a recluse and don't aspire toward it. 

 

I welcome the opportunity to practice the beliefs I say I hold.  If that means I will sometimes encounter angry folks, that's okay.  I sometimes feel angry, too, so I understand.  Another person's anger is not my problem,but my decision to engage that angry person or take that anger personal may be. 

 

Obviously, I voted that the current moderation level is fine. 

 

However, I have noted that there is still the overhanded moderation involved when questions are raised that MDC staff does not want to address.  This is a problem, IMO. 


Yes, yes.  I'm fabulous. loveeyes.gif  Moving on...

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#492 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 08:51 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ansley View Post

I've posted a new thread twice, yet just tried to do a third and a message popped up saying "since you are new here, your post is being held for moderation." I am guessing it is because of my first one which didn't go well AT ALL and got deleted when all I did was ask for advice. But wouldn't that message have been more beneficial had MDC done that the first time I had posted something (even though I still see nothing wrong with anything I said!).  I was allowed to do a second thread with no problem. My third? No. This just makes me dislike this place even more. Moderation is great, but only when it is done correctly! 


Your thread is open now.  Ansley, you have been given a rough beginning.  So sorry for that.  It's because you joined at a strange time and things are calming down now.  Welcome to MDC!  I hope the rest of your time here is bettergreet.gif

 

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#493 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 08:59 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ansley View Post

I've posted a new thread twice, yet just tried to do a third and a message popped up saying "since you are new here, your post is being held for moderation." I am guessing it is because of my first one which didn't go well AT ALL and got deleted when all I did was ask for advice. But wouldn't that message have been more beneficial had MDC done that the first time I had posted something (even though I still see nothing wrong with anything I said!).  I was allowed to do a second thread with no problem. My third? No. This just makes me dislike this place even more. Moderation is great, but only when it is done correctly! 



 



Quote:
Originally Posted by chaoticzenmom View Post




Your thread is open now.  Ansley, you have been given a rough beginning.  So sorry for that.  It's because you joined at a strange time and things are calming down now.  Welcome to MDC!  I hope the rest of your time here is bettergreet.gif

 


 

Hmmmmm .....

 

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#494 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 09:33 AM
 
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Hmmmmm .....

 



? Is that a "hmmm, I didn't get a welcome smiley when I complained about my defensio problem."  Or a "hmmm, she's full of it and Defensio is still holding all of my posts."  Or a "hmmm, maybe I'll stick around for awhile, this place isn't so bad."  In any case greet.gif

 


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#495 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 09:53 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Kerynna View Post


 



 




 

Hmmmmm .....

 



For real, what's the hmmmm for?

 


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#496 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 10:14 AM
 
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It was a 'hmmm, good to know I'm not alone in having this happen" kind of hmmmm.

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#497 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 10:48 AM
 
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i didnt vote, because i've essentially already left mdc for other reasons, but if i hadnt, or if i wasnt quite sure, the... situation here now would confirm my notion that it's no longer a place i care to be. which isnt to say it's "wrong"... just not comfortable for me, personally. best of luck to all who do remain!

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#498 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 10:59 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QueenOfTheMeadow View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by Honey693 View Post

Is anyone else wondering if Peggy and Cynthia are ignoring this thread b/c they're hoping if they don't post we'll lose interest?  For awhile there Cynthia was posting a few times a page.  Now nothing.




I know I'm not Peggy or Cynthia, but I'm still reading. I think it's an important conversation and one that would never have taken place a year ago. People need to have their say and the poll is definately being watched. I haven't seen a change between 1 or so percentages for awhile. Are there questions you have that haven't been addressed yet?


There are a lot of unanswered questions, most pressing is will MDC offer an official, public apology (not one post on a hidden  thread) for the Pat Roberston thing?  People have been asking and asking and they just keep getting told that issue has been addressed, even though no one can link to that answer.


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#499 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 11:04 AM
 
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It was a 'hmmm, good to know I'm not alone in having this happen" kind of hmmmm.



Cynthia has said several times that it is a software glitch that happens sometimes but not  always.

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#500 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 11:52 AM
 
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There are a lot of unanswered questions, most pressing is will MDC offer an official, public apology (not one post on a hidden  thread) for the Pat Roberston thing?  People have been asking and asking and they just keep getting told that issue has been addressed, even though no one can link to that answer.


Yeah, that's a good question and one that I'm not sure of. I honestly wish I could give you a better answer to that question, unfortunately it's not in the moderator's hands. I know it's not worth much, but I'm really sorry that happened. I know it was a big big mistake. greensad.gif
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#501 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 04:26 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by QueenOfTheMeadow View Post



Quote:
Originally Posted by Honey693 View Post

Is anyone else wondering if Peggy and Cynthia are ignoring this thread b/c they're hoping if they don't post we'll lose interest?  For awhile there Cynthia was posting a few times a page.  Now nothing.




I know I'm not Peggy or Cynthia, but I'm still reading. I think it's an important conversation and one that would never have taken place a year ago. People need to have their say and the poll is definitely being watched. I haven't seen a change between 1 or so percentages for awhile. Are there questions you have that haven't been addressed yet?

 

A real live apology.

 

See below:

Quote:
Originally Posted by JMJ View Post
In that vein, Cynthia, I find your use of the term "troll" to be offensive and not an example of the high level of gentleness and respectful language that I would hope to see from a mod, especially the top mod on this forum.  I understand that you have been in the trenches of moderating a site with thousands of diverse users for a long time, and you've seen a lot more than I have, and I am sure you have developed a method of communicating that you find to be most helpful.  I'm also sure that you have a better idea than I do of when a member is up to no good.  However, I see calling mothers who are posting here "trolls" as name-calling, and while it is a reasonably well defined term in internet forums, it does not address well the exact behavior that you are criticizing.  For example, in the thread criticizing MDC for the add for Operation Blessing, your final statement would be so much more clear and gentle (but firm) if you have excluded the line "mostly from trollish members."  The description of "attacking, insulting, harassing and namecalling" was a much more clear description of what was going wrong in that thread, but your description would lead one to believe that most of the members posting in that thread were members who constantly made a habit of making such degrading statements and that most of the members posting in that thread have been banned.

 

 

I'm quite concerned about the evolving 'definition of troll'. I too find the use of 'troll' in the contexts where it's been used both offensive and inaccurate. It seems to me that people who were expressing anger were suddenly called 'trolls'. I read the Mothering Supports Racist Homophobic... thread and while I heard a lot of cranky voices calling for a formal apology, I saw nothing that would leap out to me as 'troll'. People were venting anger, but I didn't see any blatantly egregious posts trying to stir up the pot. Repeated asking for an apology ought not to be considered troll behavior. So, unless the bad posts were edited out, I can't figure out what the fuss is about.

 

The implied message that I've gotten from that thread and a couple others has been 'don't criticize MDC or you'll be banned'. Quite honestly, the last post in that thread sounded to me like a tantrum, not an explanation. We're all allowed tantrums now and then, but it doesn't leave a good taste in my mouth when they're coming from the leaders. Now, the intended message may not be "don't criticize us", but unless there's some clarity as to what will get you banned without warning, it's the implied message. Because of that, I'm going to change my vote to: You need more moderation. MDC can't say "OK, we'll not moderate" and then attack people with dissenting views as trolls. Right now, I feel like that's what's happening. (And hey, if you ban me for this one, I'll have a lot more time on my hands to clean my house!)

 

 

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#502 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 04:52 PM
 
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IMO  there has GOT to be some sort of a happy medium! Why is the poll inferring that it either needs to be one extreme or the other?   It doesn't have to revert to the strict UA we had previously, where mods had to ding members for every tiny thing... but the snark that has come onto the boards changes the entire feel of this site... and not in a good way!    I do not understand why people cannot be honest and express their opinions, without being rude and snarky to others.... we are (at least I think) all adults here.   

 

There have also been mutterings about 'support only' sections of the board being an issue... and I assure you that should the support only rule be removed from areas like spirituality, I will be exiting along with a LOT of other members.    I post on a thread there that I can really see becoming very unpleasant if people were allowed to come on board and be unsupportive. 

 

 

Honestly, if the NEED for $$ is that great just to keep the site open, that Mothering is willing to degrade the original intent & feel of this site (as a place where parents interested in doing things OUTSIDE the mainstream way could find support) to the point that CIO and other previously unacceptable topics are creeping onto the boards... well... Maybe it's just time to let Mothering die while it's still at least a shadow of it's former self.   

 

I cannot tell you the things I learned, and the ways this site has changed my parenting for the better... and how sad it makes me to see what it is becoming now :(


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#503 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 05:05 PM
 
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i have been a member of mothering for a long time, read the magazine for years and always felt like mothering was a safe place to come and talk about things that were important to me, YET not always the most common of things to do in the parenting community. now, i don't know. i felt that mothering was a place to come and NOT get advice to circ, cry it out, spank, and the rudeness! OMG it is nuts here. even if i people didn't agree it always felt safe, now... not so much. it is sad. mothering was a safe place, now it isn't. that is why i haven't been around much. i have noticed that people will say things that they would never say to your face in real life. i won't be staying here. i will have to find my support else where... maybe old mothering magazines.

maybe this safe place is a thing of the past and mothering should just close up shop instead of letting all this yuck come in. 

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#504 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 05:16 PM
 
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I haven't read the rest of this thread, I just wanted to chime in briefly.

 

I'd like to see slightly more moderation of *content*, but not of tone.  Mean, snarky, saracastic (within reason) is fine; presumably grown adults can handle someone being something less than perfectly gentle and supportive on an internet message board.  But if we have people promoting/defending, say, using CIO, in a thread about dealing with sleep difficulties, then what's the point of posting here as opposed to any other parenting forum out there?  We;ll end up constantly rehashing the basic "is attachment parenting valuable or not?" 101-level debate instead of being able to have in-depth conversations about the details of parenting with this basic philosophy already established as a shared baseline.

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#505 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 05:28 PM
 
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I haven't read the rest of this thread, I just wanted to chime in briefly.

 

I'd like to see slightly more moderation of *content*, but not of tone.  Mean, snarky, saracastic (within reason) is fine; presumably grown adults can handle someone being something less than perfectly gentle and supportive on an internet message board.  But if we have people promoting/defending, say, using CIO, in a thread about dealing with sleep difficulties, then what's the point of posting here as opposed to any other parenting forum out there?  We;ll end up constantly rehashing the basic "is attachment parenting valuable or not?" 101-level debate instead of being able to have in-depth conversations about the details of parenting with this basic philosophy already established as a shared baseline.

 

Huh, interesting.  I feel the exact opposite.  I feel there needs to be more moderation of tone.  I'm not saying you are wrong --  and I agree that defending CIO, spanking etc.  is not OK here, but by and large what offends me these days is the increase in the obnoxious tone that seems to pop up here by a small, loud minority.  And, yes, the cursing.  Not into it at a mothering site.  Sorry.  I curse with close friends, etc. but not here on a parenting discussion board with people I've never met.  It just feels rude.

 

I guess acceptable tone and language has regional/cultural differences.  The way I was raised, with intimates, cursing is OK.  With people you don't know well -- not cool.

 


 

 

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#506 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 06:19 PM
 
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Huh, interesting.  I feel the exact opposite.  I feel there needs to be more moderation of tone.  I'm not saying you are wrong --  and I agree that defending CIO, spanking etc.  is not OK here, but by and large what offends me these days is the increase in the obnoxious tone that seems to pop up here by a small, loud minority.

 


 

I agree. The constant snark and obnoxious, over-the-top meanness is really making this place feel ugly and unwelcoming. I keep reading posts calling such behavior "adult", as if it's somehow a mark of maturity to be rude to people and make snide comments in response to their honest posts. I don't talk to people like that in real life and somehow I doubt most of the snarkier posters do either. I also don't think it's very in-line with AP and gentle parenting to snipe at each other like the mean girls table in a middle school cafeteria. It's certainly not behavior I'd want to model to my children, and I wouldn't associate with other adults who behave that way.

 

Here's where someone will tell me to "pull on my big girl panties" and just accept that "we're all adults here" and so it's okay to be rude, dismissive, and hostile. I disagree. There are so many sites where it's okay to treat other posters like garbage. Why would that be welcomed here? The previous moderation was way too heavy--I was warned a few times myself, for things that I thought were so benign--but do we really have to swing in the opposite direction and stay there? I don't think it's asking too much to expect members of the community to treat each other with basic decency and respect.

 

The cursing isn't my favorite but it doesn't really bother me. The rest...gross.


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#507 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 06:56 PM
 
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I agree. The constant snark and obnoxious, over-the-top meanness is really making this place feel ugly and unwelcoming. I keep reading posts calling such behavior "adult", as if it's somehow a mark of maturity to be rude to people and make snide comments in response to their honest posts. I don't talk to people like that in real life and somehow I doubt most of the snarkier posters do either. I also don't think it's very in-line with AP and gentle parenting to snipe at each other like the mean girls table in a middle school cafeteria. It's certainly not behavior I'd want to model to my children, and I wouldn't associate with other adults who behave that way.

 

Here's where someone will tell me to "pull on my big girl panties" and just accept that "we're all adults here" and so it's okay to be rude, dismissive, and hostile. I disagree. There are so many sites where it's okay to treat other posters like garbage. Why would that be welcomed here? The previous moderation was way too heavy--I was warned a few times myself, for things that I thought were so benign--but do we really have to swing in the opposite direction and stay there? I don't think it's asking too much to expect members of the community to treat each other with basic decency and respect.

 

The cursing isn't my favorite but it doesn't really bother me. The rest...gross.


This is exactly what I've been thinking. Most of my friends are very outspoken and have strong personalities. I've had disagreements with a few of them. But, not once was there namecalling involved. Not once was there meaness or rudeness. To me being able to express your opinion respectfully, even when you disagree with someone, is adult like behavior. Getting snarky and nasty is not.

 
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#508 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 07:57 PM
 
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i liked the old moderating better than this but voted other bc i think we would al lbe better served with a middle ground. personall, i liked being able to come here, hear nothing but polite conversation, receive gentle but blunt info. i liked being disagreed with in a way that taught me instead of angering me or offending me. my children benefited greatly from my frequent activity on here. it fostered in me a polite and respectful tone that i carried on into my everyday parenting. I had something to strive for. i also had great access to invaluable information that wasnt cluttered up by posts that do not support all of what mdc (i thought) stood for. i come here for info and learning. I have not been here once in the last 2 weeks before today, bc I felt that I can not learn anything more here. My children can feel the diffrerence in our household. It is harder to keep our household a positive place lately bc i am missing what mdc gave me before. :( i especially miss the physical reminder of the magazine that I always took with me everywhere and shared with everybody. 

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#509 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 08:12 PM
 
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I haven't read the rest of the posts, but I was a member of MDC for a long time, and dropped out because on the rare occasion I would get worked up about a post, I would respond to the poster directly, and if I didn't phrase something perfectly, I'd end up with a UA violation warning, and no way to resolve the issue being discussed.  I also found it annoying to have posts moved because a moderator decided it belonged somewhere else, especially if it was done without explanation.   Honestly, most of my problem with the moderation was due to one moderator who was quite heavy-handed, and seemed to be trying to direct conversation by locking and moving posts-- I wouldn't give her name if I remembered it.  On the other end of the spectrum, Dar has always used her powers to avoid pointless arguments and keep the site organized, and she'd explain why she was taking whatever action she was, and that all helps make it seem like "our" community, as opposed to feeling like we're visiting someone else's house and must therefore go by their rules. 

 

I haven't noticed any problems on the boards since I got back.  I don't love getting email by default from MDC, but that's unrelated to the moderator issues.

 

I don't want MDC to start moderating based on tone, because tone is subjective, and people couldn't be sure whether or not their post was acceptable until they put it out there.  I do agree with MDC saying "you may not post here in support of spanking" and similar ideas.  

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#510 of 612 Old 06-22-2011, 08:15 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by LionessMom View Post

i liked being able to come here, hear nothing but polite conversation, receive gentle but blunt info. i liked being disagreed with in a way that taught me instead of angering me or offending me. my children benefited greatly from my frequent activity on here. it fostered in me a polite and respectful tone that i carried on into my everyday parenting. I had something to strive for. 



Lioness Mom, you put into words what I've been trying to say when I say the more aggressive tone seems out of place at MDC.   The civility at MDC when I joined in 2004 was supportive of my attempts at calmness and gentleness with my new baby.   As I learned to nurse, bathe, soothe, heal my little ones, the last thing I would want is to read people attacking each other.  

 

Now I cringe when some decent questions and threads veer into a gratuitous snark frenzy.  I don't think the Mods are to blame -- it's a momentum from a few members that we all get swept into.  Gradually, the more civil people fade away or post less.

 

It is, like you say, kind of survival of the toughest, baddest "mean girls."  Not entirely, but these people seem to hold sway rather than some of MDC's  really wise ones   People could be fierce before, but they were doing it to educate and open some minds.  Now, I don't know what the motive is.

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