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#1 of 25 Old 05-11-2010, 10:24 PM - Thread Starter
 
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What do you think about skipping the vitamin K shot for the baby?
How dangerous it is for the baby to not get the shot?

My situation:
I had my baby 11 days ago and didn't do the vit K shot for her. Instead my midwife suggested me taking Alfalfa pills during the pregnancy and postpartum, which I did. I've been taking the pills so far, but feel that they are the cause for my enormous milk supply, plugged ducts and engorgement. So I want to stop the pills, but don't know if it will deprive the baby of the vitamin K source.

What do you think?

Thanks
Sophie

Sophie, wife to DH, AP mama to DD1 (12/07) and DD2 (04/10)
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#2 of 25 Old 05-12-2010, 12:21 AM
 
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how much vitamin K are you eating a day?
here is a way to evaluate your diet-- lower incidence of vitamin K related bleeds early or late(up to 3 months) if mom gets above the RDA of vitamin K a day- somewhere around 230 micrograms/day looks good but there is not absolute studies on diet alone - maternal supplementation seems to increase vitamin K levels in breastmilk exponentially - you could consider getting the oral drops for yourself and taking them to increase K in your breastmilk if you are having trouble eating at minimum the recommended daily amount- and if you or the baby end up on antibiotics or get sick or if the baby has any bleeding or bruising or prolonged jaundice, decreased nursing/bms get the shot-

http://www.nutritiondata.com/
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#3 of 25 Old 05-13-2010, 11:23 PM
 
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I actually believe that if babies were meant to have a certain level of Vit K at birth, then they would have it. I did not do Vit K shots with either of my boys...no health problems! No regrets at all.

Curiously, I had been craving foods that were sources of Vit K both before & after the birth. Though I have heard mixed info about whether or not a significant amount of that actually passes over to the baby.

mama to 2 busy boys (may 2007 & december 2008)
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#4 of 25 Old 05-13-2010, 11:56 PM
 
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Just had my second and skipped it with both kids. I agree with PP about baby being born with what they need. I eat reasonably well and take high quality supplements and I like to think this is all my baby needs (through breast milk).

Single HB mama to 2!
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#5 of 25 Old 05-14-2010, 01:27 AM
 
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We chose not to have the shot with babies #2, 3 and 4. There were no adverse effects for us of skipping it.

Midwife (CPM, LDM) and homeschooling mama to:
13yo ds   10yo dd  8yo ds and 6yo ds and 1yo ds  
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#6 of 25 Old 05-14-2010, 09:59 AM
 
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I wouldnt bother. Your baby is fine without it.
My baby was even born via emergency section and since they didn't use any 'tools' to get him out (just their hands) - they felt it as pefectly fine for him to not have any vit K at all.

Mummy me : > Thats Ann! and my beautiful SONS Duncanand Hamish 19/09/05 & 22/04/10!
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#7 of 25 Old 05-14-2010, 07:31 PM - Thread Starter
 
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So you don't take any Vit K pills after you had your babies?

Sophie, wife to DH, AP mama to DD1 (12/07) and DD2 (04/10)
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#8 of 25 Old 05-14-2010, 08:04 PM
 
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nope, nor did my midwives suggest it (had 2 different ones).

mama to 2 busy boys (may 2007 & december 2008)
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#9 of 25 Old 05-14-2010, 09:55 PM
 
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We are not planning on doing the shot.
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#10 of 25 Old 05-14-2010, 10:13 PM
 
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We skipped it but I made sure to take extra just to be safe. HTH!

Amy~ Crunchy mummy to Dane (9-15-07) & Kai (9-14-09)
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#11 of 25 Old 05-14-2010, 11:07 PM
 
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We planned on skipping it, but our son was 10.5 lbs..pushed for 2 hours..compound presentation..etc. Basically his entire head was bruised and purple. The excessive bruising worried us so we decided to go ahead and do it. We soaked gauze in arnica and put it under his hat as well.

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#12 of 25 Old 05-15-2010, 07:13 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by micah_mae_ View Post
We planned on skipping it, but our son was 10.5 lbs..pushed for 2 hours..compound presentation..etc. Basically his entire head was bruised and purple. The excessive bruising worried us so we decided to go ahead and do it. We soaked gauze in arnica and put it under his hat as well.
If this happened to us we would give the shot as well.
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#13 of 25 Old 05-15-2010, 10:28 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by micah_mae_ View Post
We planned on skipping it, but our son was 10.5 lbs..pushed for 2 hours..compound presentation..etc. Basically his entire head was bruised and purple. The excessive bruising worried us so we decided to go ahead and do it. We soaked gauze in arnica and put it under his hat as well.
We would do the same.

We skipped Vit K with #2, planning on doing the same with #3 providing we don't run into the above scenario. I didn't specifically supplement, but I was taking chlorophyll before birth due to low hemoglobin levels, and continued to take it once my levels were up. I believe chlorophyll works as a Vit K supplement.

We didn't run into any health complications - quite the contrary, #2 was a very healthy (jaundice free *wink wink*) baby. The lack of Vit K did worry our ped, who had to call a specialist to see if the baby needed the shot. The specialist said "well, it's too late now" (this was at 3 weeks ppd).

Wife, Mom, Health Services Researcher
Uno ('03) Dos ('08) and Tres (Aug '10)
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#14 of 25 Old 05-15-2010, 10:43 AM
 
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Similar story as some other posters, DS was 10.5 pounds, two black eyes swollen nose looked he lost a fight with a prize fighter. I opted to give him the Vit. K but we did two oral doses. DD was a footling breech resulting in c-section skipped the Vit K.

Jenese Mama to Elliot 8/05 and Millie Jane 7/07 and Cecilia Kate 1/11
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#15 of 25 Old 05-16-2010, 07:19 PM
 
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We didn't do Vit K for our son.
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#16 of 25 Old 05-16-2010, 07:49 PM
 
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We had planned to skip it with DD but her delivery was (unnecessarily) traumatic and I was c-sectioned well after she was engaged in the birth canal (I could feel her head). Given that they had to pull her BACK up through the birth canal, we opted to do it. Had she had a typical, non interventive vaginal delivery, we wouldn't have done it.

~ Fe ~
Mama to C (3-25-06) and A (1-17-09) and Jameson Grant (9-25-10) my HBA2C baby!
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#17 of 25 Old 05-19-2010, 10:50 PM
 
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in most cases they don't need vit K and it is really just for clotting and if you aren't cutting parts off- well no need to clot ykwim? Babies have thier highest natural vit k levels at something like 8 days old. So I would say lay off the alfalfa.

DS2 was our first 'natural' babe and I did take him in for a bili stick when he was about 5 days old. the nurse did comment on how much he bled though. He actually needed a bandaid.

Iowaorganic- mama to DD (1/5/06), DS1 (4/9/07), DS2 (1/22/09), DS3 (12/10/10), DD2 (7/6/12) and a new kid due in early 2014

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#18 of 25 Old 05-19-2010, 11:09 PM
 
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Wean down off of the alfala... Because it is used to increase breast milk, if you just drastically stop, your supply could drastically dip too

~ Fe ~
Mama to C (3-25-06) and A (1-17-09) and Jameson Grant (9-25-10) my HBA2C baby!
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#19 of 25 Old 05-19-2010, 11:43 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by sophi4ka View Post
So you don't take any Vit K pills after you had your babies?
I didn't.

Midwife (CPM, LDM) and homeschooling mama to:
13yo ds   10yo dd  8yo ds and 6yo ds and 1yo ds  
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#20 of 25 Old 05-20-2010, 03:57 PM
 
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we didn't do the shot and i didn't alter my diet at all.

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#21 of 25 Old 05-20-2010, 11:32 PM
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We'll be skipping it this time, too. With being safe at home and no circ, I don't see a reason.
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#22 of 25 Old 05-21-2010, 02:06 PM
 
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DD1 was born in a hospital. She crowned for over 2 hours and was born with a bruise that covered over half her head. I had initially said that I didn't want the vitamin k for her, and after she was born, no one brought it up. I was really surprised, since she also saw two pediatricians who pushed hep b, but didn't care at all about the vitamin k. I didn't alter my diet at all, and her bruise was gone within 2 days.

DC2 will be born at home, and we are opting out of the shot again. I agree that babies are born with what they need, and breastmilk provides them with the rest. Babies have been born for a very long time, they have crowned and bruised for a very long time. If the extra vitamin k was necessary, I think their bodies or ours would have accounted for it by now.
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#23 of 25 Old 05-21-2010, 03:29 PM
 
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people for a very long time have eaten far more vitamin K foods than we now eat- historically 6-7% of daily caloric intake was from green veggies. It makes a difference what you eat - somethings in breastmilk are relatively fixed but vitamin K just like essential fatty acids change with the amount you consume- if you eat more vit K then your breastmilk has higher levels- if you supplement with vit K it exponentially increases in your breastmilk-
not to mention the benefits to your own health from reduced cancer risks to lower incidence of hardening of the arteries, less incidence of metabolic syndrome....
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#24 of 25 Old 05-21-2010, 04:45 PM
 
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OP re- the plugged ducts Jack Newman suggests lecithin has helped some women who have this problem- how is it going now?
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#25 of 25 Old 05-24-2010, 10:26 AM
 
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I haven't read the other responses yet, but I will say my DH and I were against the Vit K shot at first, but in the end we got it since we were going to circumcise (I know many on here are anti-circ and I respect that but we do it for cultural reasons). Anyway, had we had a girl we would not have gotten the Vit K shot, OR we would have done the drops.

Here is some info on Vit K that my doula mailed out to everyone the other day...


This is some great info on Vitamin K for your baby at birth. I now carry a bottle of Vitamin K oral drops for newborns I purchased at www.PreciousArrows.com. You only need 6 drops so if you are a parent, sell the bottle to a friend when you are done or back to a midwife/birth assistant. 2 drops at birth, 2 drops at 10 days old, 2 drops at 30 days old. Most babies, though, don’t need any Vitamin K supplementation at all. The baby will get plenty through mom’s breastmilk especially if she is eating foods high in Vitamin K like green leafy vegetables and maybe also taking an alfalfa supplement. If your baby has a traumatic birth, your baby might need supplementation as usually there is a bruise on the baby’s head that you don’t want to continue to bleed and cause pressure on the brain. Other than that, you might not need the Vitamin K supplementation. Also, it should be known that synthetic Vitamin K shots have also been shown to increase the chance of leukemia in children – one study found it to be an 80% increase. Do your own research and talk to your providers! Here is a good article about that - http://thebabybond.com/VitaminKinjectORnot.html



If you opt for Vitamin K oral drops, you must buy and administer them yourselves and decline the Vitamin K shot that your provider carries (few carry the drops for oral administration especially hospital births).



Those who may choose circumcision for your sons, should not do so in-hospital at the normal Day 2 or Day 3 of life but wait until your baby boy is at least 8-10 days old if not a few weeks old as the Vitamin K levels are higher then. You can take baby back and do the procedure as an outpatient surgery with an obstetrician or use a mohel (even if you are not religious). I know everyone chooses to do things differently when it comes to circumcision so I’m not advocating for or against it here but giving you proper Vitamin K info should you choose to do so. Waiting should decrease risks of hemorrhaging but this is certainly not always the case. Severe hemorrhaging and even death can occur with circumcision so know your risks well and talk to your provider about this important decision, too. But I do think it is important to know for those of you who do wait to do the surgery til Day 8/10 or weeks later, that taking the oral drops would be a good idea to help avoid hemorrhaging.



I hope this helps all of you having babies soon or in the near future!



http://www.givingbirthnaturally.com/...vitamin-k.html



Newborn Vitamin K Injections

What is it?

In the United States, the practice of newborn vitamin k injections has become almost universal. However, this routine newborn procedure is unique to the US and is controversial in other nations. This practice was born (pun intended) during the hospital age of routine separation of mothers from their babes, before rooming-in was an accepted practice.



Why is this done?

The rationale for newborn vitamin K injection at birth is that newborns are born with a "deficiency" of vitamin K. This perceived "deficiency" can lead to decreased clotting ability of the blood, that can leave the newborn more susceptible to hemorrhage. The risk is quite small, only about 1 in 200, but it does exist. The following factors increase risk of hemorrhage in newborns:

Risk Factors for Cerebral Hemorrhage

· Precipitous Labor

· Prolonged Labor

· Significant Fetal Head Molding

· Birth Trauma

· Forceps Delivery

· Vacuum Extraction

· Variable Heart Decelerations in Late Labor

· Circumcision



Points to Ponder on Routine Injection

While newborn vitamin K injection may sound like an acceptable intervention, there are several points to ponder.

1. The amount of Vit K injected is 20,000 times the needed dose. Yes, I kid you not. 20,000 times. Additionally, the injection may also contain preservatives which are known toxins to the infant.

2. Large doses of Vit K are a cause of jaundice in the newborn. A "cure" for one perceived ailment then becomes the cause of another.

3. Colostrum, which precedes breastmilk, is rich in Vit K. Thus, an infant who is breastfed immediately at birth will receive a natural source of Vit K, in most cases significantly raising the Vit K level.

4. Vit K is typically designed to be absorbed by the gut from foods we eat. However, the injection is an intramuscular one, which bypasses the gut and delivers the Vit K in a way the body wasn't designed to receive.

5. Birth is an overwhelming sensory experience for the baby - it has never before been cold, hungry, been blinded by light, felt the touch of cloth or the pull of gravity. Sticking a needle into its body and inflicting pain isn't the best way to allow the sensory system to gradually adjust to the outside world. Not a very warm welcome, is it?

6. Subconsciously, it sends the message that nature is inadequate, that medical interventions are are necessary to save us from ourselves.



Simple Solutions

1. Request an oral dose rather than an injection.

This eliminates the overdose and lessens the risk of hemorrhage and jaundice, as well as the pain of the injection and exposure to harmful preservatives. Also, the Vit K is absorbed through the gut, as it was intended to be. While this may seem like an easy solution, be sure to discuss this option first with your care provider. Since hospitals are accustomed to standard operating procedure, it can be difficult for them to correctly determine the oral dosage for your infant. We personally had to wait for several hours while the correct dose was determined. To give the hospital the benefit of the doubt here, our daughter was born on a weekend, which means that less staff is available and even simple procedures take longer than usual.

2. Nurse immediately after the birth with no supplementation given.

3. During the last few weeks of pregnancy, load your diet with foods rich in Vit K.

While this hasn't been shown to improve newborn vitamin K levels, it has been shown to increase the amount of Vit K in breastmilk.



By following these simple solutions, you can receive the benefits of an accurate newborn vitamin K dose while avoiding all the negatives of an injection. It's too easy a solution for the medical establishment to consider it.



References

Puckett RM, Offringa M. Prophylactic vitamin K for vitamin K deficiency bleeding in neonates. Cochrane Database of Systematic Reviews 2000, Issue 4. Art. No.: CD002776. DOI: 10.1002/14651858.CD002776.

Hey, E. Vitamin K--what, why, and when. Arch Dis Child Fetal Neonatal Ed. 2003 Mar;88(2):F80-3.

Vitamin K prophylaxis to prevent neonatal vitamin K deficient intracranial haemorrhage in Shizuoka prefecture. Nishiguchi T, Saga K, Sumimoto K, Okada K, Terao T Br J Obstet Gynaecol 1996 Nov;103(11):1078-1084.

Plasma concentrations after oral or intramuscular vitamin K1 in neonates.
McNinch AW, Upton C, Samuels M, Shearer MJ, McCarthy P, Tripp JH, L'E Orme R.
Arch Dis Child. 1985 Sep;60(9):814-8.

[Effect of oral and intramuscular vitamin K on the factors II, VII, IX, X, and PIVKA II in the infant newborn under 60 days of age] [Article in Spanish] Arteaga-Vizcaino M, Espinoza Holguin M, Torres Guerra E, Diez-Ewald M, Quintero J, Vizcaino G, Estevez J, Fernandez N. Rev Med Chil. 2001 Oct;129(10):1121-9.

Delayed cord clamping in very preterm infants reduces the incidence of intraventricular hemorrhage and late-onset sepsis: a randomized, controlled trial.
Mercer JS, Vohr BR, McGrath MM, Padbury JF, Wallach M, Oh W.
Pediatrics. 2006 Apr;117(4)5-42.

[Vitamin K 1 concentration and vitamin K-dependent clotting factors in newborn infants after intramuscular and oral administration of vitamin K 1] [Article in Hungarian] Goldschmidt B, Kisrakoi C, Teglas E, Verbenyi M, Kovacs I. Orv Hetil. 1990 Jun 17;131(24):1297-300.

Vitamin K - An Alternative Perspective. Midwife Sara Wickham provides a much-needed update on vitamin K prophylaxis. AIMS Journal, Summer 2001, Vol 13 No 2

Mommy to beauties DS1 (7), DS2 (4, autism), & DS3 (2)

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