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So...if you refuse tests and baby is born at home, with an issue, can CPS take your child?!

1K views 9 replies 7 participants last post by  MsBlack 
#1 ·
I am freaking out slightly. Just saw a story on facebook of a mom who birthed her baby at home, apparantly she was breech and told to have a CS. Baby had some minor nerve damage in her arms- parents took baby to ER a few hours after birth because she was being overly fussy, and she was taken from them because of child endangerment and medical neglect
They still havent gotten her back.

So, my question is, if you refuse tests (say GBS) and your baby has a problem because of it, can you be held in medical neglect and child endangerment?

My platelets have been mildly low, and I have been working in conjunction with my family doctor and midwife this whole pregnancy. On the doctors end i have had so many unnecessary ultrasounds and referrals to rheumatologists all based on stuff that turned out to be nothing. I am done with tests. I just had them checked at 32 weeks and they were 114- up a bit from the last time. I am not having my platelets checked yet again, because based on my previous history, and everything I have read, it really is NOT an issue. The blood tests give me so much anxiety and stress for DAYS. My midwife is fine with this. But lets say the baby has some mild issue as a result- can they take her from me? Ahhh I am stressing.
 
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#4 ·
My midwife is FINE with the platelets as long as they are above 50. I guess technically we wouldn't know that unless I got tested right before I went into labor, but honestly, mine have gone up from the last time (although still low) since I began supplement therapy. And they have never been under 100. My doc ultimately said it is up to me and my midwife, but wants to see me again and order more tests, and I just don't want to do them. There is basically no risk to the baby, as maternal platelet counts don't predict newborn ones...I just know i am fine, and the stress of another test is probably worse for me than anything else. I am just freaking because of the story I read.
 
#5 ·
I think it really depends on your state. If that person was in a non-homebirth friendly state then yes it seems plausible. If they weren't then maybe there was more to the story? Not sure....

Here in my state homebirth isn't illegal, isn't regulated nothing. So really its not looked upon as something great but not generally reguarded as something horrid either. I guess I'm not sure how they can claim medical neglect against your friend since she took baby in, and chose to seek care vs waiting until there was something huge going on.

I think its aweful something like that can happen, but unfortunately ANY accident with a child especially a newborn is an automatic report policy within hospitals.... sometimes that's where it pays to have back up care and do a transfer vs just going into ER...
 
#6 ·
My son was born in a birthing suite with CPM's. I waived tests and u/s. He was born with spina bifida and we rushed him to the ER and he was then taken to a big children's hospital. We got some questions (Was he actually born in the water?) and there was a neonatologist who was incredibly unprofessional- rolling her eyes at us and yelled at us once even. But no one tried to take him away- it's something I've worried over though.

I'm really glad that I waved u/s and the pre natal tests though. I might have been forced into a C section, u/s causing overheating and decavitation of the tissues, and most importantly, we would have been stressed and depressed about our son's birth. The ultrasound can't tell you the extent of the damage, just that the defect exists. We would have been told that our son would never walk, pee, have bowel control or sexual function. All of those things (except sexual function, but that looks promising since he seems to have feeling down there and proper urinary function) have happened. Well, he doesn't walk yet, but at six months he's working on crawling and sits really well. He has beautiful head control and loves "standing" with mommy and daddy's help. The orthopedic surgeon said our son might be a little on the late side for walking, but that if anyone will walk early, he will since he has use of both legs and feet. If we had had all the tests we would have been worrying over nothing. Despite (and I think because of) not being u/s scanned, he is the healthiest, most normal spina bifida baby they have ever seen at the hospital- and the hospital he has been seen at is huge! They see kids from all over the western US and even Alaska!

Incidentally, u/s can't tell you everything. The night we were at the ER, the doctor there told us that sometimes ultrasound just doesn't pick these things up. (Yet another reason I didn't want to bother with one.) He said that a few weeks ago there was a baby born at that hospital with spina bifida and it hadn't been picked up on the ultrasound. I believe it's better to not get the tests because then it's like, "Well, they didn't know." If the woman had a baby in breech and had been advised to have a C/S- that's something she knew. It's more unforgiving if you actually know. But it's ridiculous the way parental rights are being taken away in the name of "child protection". Our governments- federal and state are getting way too big. I'm with Thomas Jefferson, "The government that governs best governs least." OK, I'm off my soapbox now. =)
 
#7 ·
PS, I did waive GBS. But after meeting another mom in the NICU whose baby was in there for Group B Strep complications, I will get it next time. Just my thoughts.
 
#9 ·
It depends a lot on your state. Where I live, our CPS is so overwhelmed with cases of true abuse that they don't hassle parents who make mistakes while trying to do their best for their kids. (mainstream medicine would put homebirth complications in this category). So they might REPORT you to CPS, but nothing will come of it. And since waiving med tests and home birthing are both legal here, they also have no legal justification for taking the child.

But I also know that refusing reasonable care for a child (like not setting broken bones) will result in foster care placement. So you do have to be careful once baby is born. Best course that I've heard is to not refuse care outright, but rather delay. Ask for time to decide, second opinion from normal ped, that sort of thing.
 
#10 ·
I saw the same fb story you did--it is so sad and infuriating!

However--it seems to me from my own experiences and hearing stories from all over, that it is all about WHO is 'on duty' that day. It can also be about the particular hospital you go to (should that become needed)--and the state you're in. In some states, hb is far more disapproved and oppressed than in other states (almost regardless of licensing or not of mws). Still, even if you live in a hb UNfriendly state, there are still huge variations in what happens on transport--that is all about 'who is on duty that day', and also, it's about how families respond to care suggestions from Drs/NICU.

Not saying you'd necessarily have to accept all forms of suggested care, but it does help to have a generally calm, cooperative attitude rather than go in all defensive and ready to fight with them. I agree with the PP who mentioned choosing to delay consent in acceptable ways, if you want more time to think (and the situation is not emergent).

Talk to your mw about her experiences so far with transfer of care. Find out if she knows anything about the hospitals closest to you--from her own experience or that of other mws/fams she knows. See if you can choose a certain hospital over others, in advance, for the 'just in case' scenario. With or without having a 'better option' to choose from, make a plan, think about ways to handle a possible transfer of care--make some choices about how you, dh, and mw will act, work together, in making a transfer as easy/successful as possible.

I will again say that it depends so much on 'who is on duty'. I used to live in one of the worst states where hb is concerned, and numerous mws along with me have been prosecuted or otherwise legally harrassed there--same state as the people in the fb story. Fortunately, families have only rarely been prosecuted though they are sometimes harrassed/threatened by hospital staff or legal agents along the way--or CPS was called in, as with this family. Still--it is also true that in many cases of transfer of care, NOTHING bad came of it for anyone. And this has everything to do with 'who is on duty' during care--because it is always INDIVIDUALS (individual docs, nurses) who instigate legal action. It also has very much to do with how families and mws handle transfers--remaining calm and courteous, having a plan together, cooperating with some 'lesser' things (such as vit k, for instance) while pondering 'greater' forms of care when time allows--all this goes a very long way to help a family manage transfer without incident.

Just because you feel you could be entering a 'war zone'--and perhaps you might even do so, as far as the attitudes you could encounter--you really are NOT bound by anyone else's 'rules of engagement'. You do not have to enter that war--not as someone who will try to be an 'equal opponent', and not as someone who 'knows they don't have the resources/strength for the fight, and therefore must utterly surrender their power and choices'.

So let your fear motivate you to prepare, not be the source of your undoing before you even get to the crunch! You really do have choices--the first and foremost being your own attitude--the others possibly being in choosing a hospital carefully, having a plan, etc.
 
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