This Dr. Amy Tuteur woman drives me crazy. - Page 6 - Mothering Forums

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#151 of 168 Old 02-05-2014, 02:27 PM
 
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The only reason the woman in the first story needed more care was because her induction was killing her (and did ultimately cause her demise). The woman in the second story was a white middle class woman who died due to complications from a c-section.

Bottom line is that there are no risk free options with birth.

Again, I would not choose to put myself at risk of being abused and assaulted because of a small decrease in absolute risk. This is consistent with my behaviour throughout pregnancy where I opt to take on some known risks every day by driving a car, walking outside on the ice, and so on. It's absolutely fine with me of other women would choose differently. It all comes down to respecting women's choices even if they're different than the ones we would make.

Also, the amnesty report talks a lot about race but that shouldn't limit it's value. The findings should be alaming regardless of whether one is white/middle class or racialized and poor.
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#152 of 168 Old 02-05-2014, 02:59 PM
 
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There are questions about changes in the reporting of maternal mortality. 

 

You keep talking about what you would choose. That's fine. But you don't know what other people would choose, and they have the right to make an informed decision. "Things happen in the hospital too" is meaningless. The statistics acknowledge that there is no perfect solution. What they say is that these things happen less often, and it includes the complications from interventions that are often pointed out. 


What MANA has tried to do with this report, however, is highlight the findings that are favorable (lower rates of C-section, although I find the comparison to the national rate to be apples and oranges) and not the unfavorable (death). That's not acceptable. 

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#153 of 168 Old 02-05-2014, 03:32 PM
 
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But this thread isn't about the mana stats any more than its about informed choice.

What's sauce for the goose is sauce for the gander.

I'm more interested in talking about consent and the appalling treatment of women in hositpals.

Either way I'm unsubscribing again because I don't think this thread is healthy for a 37w pregnant person.

I'd really like a place where women who are choosing homebirth can get unconditional support from other home birthers. Women need information but they also need support.

I someone knows about such a place please pm me? I'd like to be able to talk with other like minded women about the positive and exciting aspects of preparing for a hb.
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#154 of 168 Old 02-05-2014, 04:13 PM
 
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This thread is all over the place.  I think in many ways most of us agree on the core things: women should be treated with respect, women have a right to make health care decisions for themselves, and mothers don't make birth choices they believe would put themselves or their kids in harms' way for the sake of experience.   But people do disagree about what they believe is risky, which is why we have such an array of decision making around birth.

 

The main disagreement seems to be whether or not talking about risk as something that can, in fact, be measured objectively is shaming or pressuring women.  

 

Dr. Amy is strident and irritating.  Sometimes the way she talks about moms who've lost babies bothers me and I don't think she necessarily understands why women make the choices they do. But the mana stats do seem to give us some information about how to improve home birth and make it safer.  I think that is worth talking about and not handwaving away with "but birth is risky no matter where you do it."  

 

Anyhow, good luck.

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#155 of 168 Old 02-06-2014, 11:10 PM
 
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OK, I have edited the posts that directly link to the blog of the person in title. If you want to talk about the MANA stats, please start a new thread.

I want to remind members of this part of the general conduct part of the User Agreement 

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With that in mind, we expect our members to keep conversations civil and on topic, and uphold the integrity and diversity of the community. We value the honest and supportive exchange of ideas and opinions, and we ask that members avoid negative characterizations and generalizations about others. Examples and calm explanation are more useful than condemnation of ideas that differ from Mothering's philosophies.
 

 

and this part of the Birth and Beyond forums guidelines

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 The Birth and Beyond boards are for discussion and respectful requests for information, personal experiences and evidence-based research to help mothers learn about natural birth, minimizing intervention and navigating the postpartum period.
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#156 of 168 Old 02-10-2014, 04:10 AM
 
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As a (non-healthcare) licensed professional, I find the argument about Dr. Amy letting her license lapse unconvincing. Licenses (and the ongoing educational requirements associated with them) can be expensive and time-consuming to maintain.

Judy, if you retired next year and let your license lapse would that immediately invalidate your degrees, your research and your experiences/training?

Also you assume that she retired at the same time she let her license lapse. Isn't it possible that she stopped practicing earlier and maintained her license for a while in case she missed practicing too much and then finally let it lapse when she decided to stay home permanently?
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I support homebirth that meets the qualifications set forth in the AAP's 2013 policy on homebirth.

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#157 of 168 Old 02-10-2014, 05:39 AM
 
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Godwin's Law: http://knowyourmeme.com/memes/godwins-law

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#158 of 168 Old 02-10-2014, 06:19 AM
 
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She's been blogging for nearly 8 years and she's always done so under her real name. She wrote a book before that. If she had never been board certified or worked as an OB, don't you think someone would have exposed her already? People have been digging for dirt on her for years and they haven't found anything convincing yet. 


This is up there with "She's a paid shill for ACOG."

 

Her husband is a lawyer, and I believe quite a successful one. She has 4 kids. She wouldn't be the first woman to quit working under those circumstances. 


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#159 of 168 Old 02-10-2014, 06:43 AM
 
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I'm pretty sure she commented once about the difficulties of having a reliable part time schedule while working in OB, and the fild is known for being a thing where you have to drop everything at unpredictable times when paged. You cannot reliably make after schoolpickups while being a patient care physician even part time.

So I don't find that suspicious. I'm on my phone at the moment and can't check, but would her licensure info include her board certifications? Her credentials should be pretty checkable.

I've sometimes found Dr Amy strident and abrasive, and I sometimes think her conversational strategies backfire, but I've found her data generally good, to the extent that I can check it. She makes brash and contentious statements, but not hyperbolic ones.
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#160 of 168 Old 02-10-2014, 08:35 AM
 
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Didn't she appear in an article on time.com? While I don't think the journalistic profession is what it was once, I can't believe that if there was something problematic with her qualifications that Time (or one of the other media outlets that have interviewed her) wouldn't have found SOMETHING by now.

I support homebirth that meets the qualifications set forth in the AAP's 2013 policy on homebirth.

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#161 of 168 Old 02-10-2014, 11:53 AM
 
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Assuming they are close in age and an assuming a pretty typical two tier partnership track, she would have retired roughly around the time he made equity partner.

I support homebirth that meets the qualifications set forth in the AAP's 2013 policy on homebirth.

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#162 of 168 Old 02-10-2014, 01:44 PM
 
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Judy Slome- I was curious about all the articles you've authored.  Is this typical of them?

 

Quote:
 

The epidural trip: why are so many women taking dangerous drugs during labor?

Abstract

Two million American women will take an epidural trip this year during childbirth. In most cases, they'll be ill–informed as to possible side effects or alternate methods of pain relief. In many ways, epidurals are the drug trip of the current generation. Similar to street drug pushers, most anesthesiologists in the delivery rooms maintain a low profile, avoid making eye contact and threaten to walk out if they don't get total cooperation. Women get epidurals for one of the main reasons so many women smoked pot in the 1970s—their friends are doing it. This article examines why so many women in the Western world are compelled to take powerful drugs during their labor and exposes the risks epidurals pose to both mother and baby.

 

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/20949786

 

Really?  Epidurals are a drug trip, and it's like smoking pot?  Anesthesiologists are like drug pushers?  Is this they type of scholarly article you write?

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#163 of 168 Old 02-10-2014, 02:23 PM
 
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my jaw dropped just from reading the abstract. Wow. I know anesthesiologists. They do not "not make eye contact" and they're usually very kind, and they explain that the "total cooperation" that they need is to avoid putting the drug in the WRONG PLACE in the woman's spine! Hello, they're putting a needle and then a tube in your spinal cord!! That's kinda dangerous if not done exactly right and with the full cooperation of the patient. They MUST cooperate to avoid injury. Epidurals can help women who cannot cope any longer with pain or exhaustion. I have seen women have "natural" births with an epidural. They managed to rest and then have the vaginal birth they were hoping for, safely and with little to no side-effects. I used to think epidurals were "evil" because that's what I was taught by the "birth community" both here and in real life. What a crock that turned out to be. There are many grossly undereducated women spouting the same and even more radical nonsense than I learned and learned to parrot, now. It's very pervasive. I had 5 natural births, some with medication, most without. I preferred non-medicated birth because I didn't like how meds made me feel, but I never had a long, protracted, horribly painful birth. If I had, I might have consented to an epidural. To be made to feel as if I was a pot-smoking hippy for doing so would have made me really upset and angry. Had it happened during my bout with PPD, it may well have horribly affected how I recovered from it. What nonsense! How irresponsible! That doesn't show caring and non-judgmental support I thought midwives were renowned for showing. :( I'm so disappointed to see this.


Mom of 5 working full-time and waiting to go to nursing school! Whew! I need a nap! joy.gif

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#164 of 168 Old 02-10-2014, 02:43 PM
 
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Uugggghhh "Dr.Amy", never ceases to amaze me. Everytime I read something she's written, it breaks my heart more and more. Continuing to instill fear in birthing women. It's so absurd how much time she spends trying to break women down. It's good to know that there's 100x more women out there who are trying to combat it by raising each other up.
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#165 of 168 Old 02-10-2014, 02:58 PM
 
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Or, you know, she could think that women are interested in and can handle factual information about their health without needing to be protected like little children. "Love Story" is almost 35 years old -- haven't we moved on at this point?
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#166 of 168 Old 02-10-2014, 05:59 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by fairydoula View Post

This is so offensive! I am shocked that the moderators are allowing this ^ to stay. Comparing a retired OB blogger to a man directly responsible for killing millions of people? That is insanity and the worst kind of inflammatory libel. It's also actionable, and if the wronged party can prove damages, they can win their case.

I agree that it is ridiculous, offensive, and a bunch of other words that I can't use here, but it most certainly is not "actionable." In order to sue for libel, you need to prove, among other elements, that factually false claim has been maliciously made. Saying that Tuteur is "like Hitler" is really, really, really stupid, but it's a statement of opinion, not of fact.
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#167 of 168 Old 02-10-2014, 11:03 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by judyslome View Post
 
Amy's dialog reflects how she is unable to  formulate a logical argument.   
http://www.skepticalob.com/2011/03/epidural-hysteria.html   She calls my article garbage, but her conclusion at the end, actually supports my research.
Amy- "The bottom line is that what gets is (sic) to the baby is far smaller than the amount of medication injected into the mother's epidural space."
 (judy- I certainly hope so!)
Amy- If the epidural does not sedate the mother, it certainly won't sedate the baby."
 (judy- but the mother is sedated!)
 

 

Source?  I can't find anything anywhere saying the mother is sedated. 

 

For personal experience, I was sedated briefly once to have a dislocated elbow put back in place. I tried pot a couple times in my youth, and do drink on rare occasions still.  I had epidurals for two of my three births, and getting an epidural was not like any of those things.  I was wide awake - it did not make sleepy or feel stoned or affect my mind in the least.  

 

Quote:
 
But now that she is a spokesperson for AJOG, supposedly spoke at their conference in Hawaii last Sept,  it is time to confirm if she is who she says she is.  Her medical license lapsed in 2003, when she was about 40 years old.   I would like to know if she finished her residency and am asking everyone to find out she ever practiced.   judyslome@hotmail.com
 

 

Supposedly spoke there?  ACOG listed her as a speaker.  Are they supposedly making this up for some reason?

 

IIRC, she kept her license for several years after she retired from practice - I think in the mid-90s?  Many people have tried to prove her a fake going so far as to go back and find proof that yes, she actually was a clinical instructor at Harvard.  

 

Also, while she's always said that raising her children was the main reason, ,I'm pretty sure I read something from her saying that another reason was she was somewhat unhappy with some of the stuff going on in practice and burned out.  

 

She's always supported modern obstetric practice as being evidence based, she does not give doctors a free pass and has spoken out against some of the way stuff is done. She blames her father's death on medical malpractice - his cancer showed up on cans at an early stage, but doctors passing them around each thought someone else had given him those results, so the cancer was not found until much too late.  She has also written about being called in to testify at a malpractice case and finding that the testimony she'd originally given in the hospital investigation had been altered before being submitted to the court.  

 

Quote:
 I think it is no longer the time to ignore her.   The comparison to Hitler is apt.   Everyone ignored him until it was too late. 

 

Whoa.  Totally missed this until I saw people responding and re-read.  Tip: when trying to create a rational argument, going Godwin is pretty much an automatic fail. Also, in regards to rational arguments, those who live in glass houses....

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#168 of 168 Old 02-11-2014, 07:47 PM
 
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I understand hyperbole, but we cannot allow posts that compare people to Hitler. This thread is very contentious and not within keeping of getting support and information about  home birth, so I'm locking it permanently.  This isn't intended to be a debate forum for either side.

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