Homebirthing and circumcision - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 151 Old 03-23-2006, 09:16 PM - Thread Starter
 
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After my twins were born my midwife was going over some things with me before she left. She wanted to confirm that I had declined the Vitamin K and PKU and then she asked if I was going to circumcise. I guess she asked because she wanted me to wait a week or so until the baby's blood could clot better. She is very anti-circ and I when I told her I would NOT be circing she was like "YES!" and seemed very relieved. I guess I always assumed homebirthers didn't circ. I was just very surprised she asked me this. Did any of your midwives ask this?

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#2 of 151 Old 03-23-2006, 09:24 PM
 
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I'm sure a midwife could answer this better, but from what I gather, it seems about 50/50 (about the national average). You'd think that someone who spends the time to educate themselves about birth and trust in their body to have a natural birth at home would also view circumcision as unnecessary or a violation of human rights, but...not so, I guess.

My former midwives said about half their clients chose to circ.

There's still a lot of work to be done to get rid of the misconceptions that often drive people to circ.
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#3 of 151 Old 03-23-2006, 09:32 PM - Thread Starter
 
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[My former midwives said about half their clients chose to circ
Wow, that is really shocking. I should ask my midwife, because I would have thought something like 1%.

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#4 of 151 Old 03-23-2006, 10:37 PM
 
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My midwife does ask.
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#5 of 151 Old 03-23-2006, 10:57 PM
 
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all the midwives I know ask. Many people will see thier Ped for it. There is one group of midwives here with a CNM who will do it in thier office after 1wk. They insist on the pundal block (sp) and refuse to use the bell... None of them agree with Circ, but they do agree with a parents right to choose so they do thier best to inform clients but some people are just bull headed...
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#6 of 151 Old 03-23-2006, 11:21 PM
 
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My MW has been a homebirth MW for 27ish years and in one of our birth classes a couple of years ago a Dad asked about circ. He asked how many parents choose to circ and she told him that she didn't want to share that information with him because she thought the decision should be theirs and not based on what others do. He pressed her and she said ZERO, to my knowledge ZERO of the babies I have delivered have been circumcised. Now, I live in Houston where the circ rate is probably 50ish percent.

She did tell him that if they chose to circ (they had a girl) that she had the name of a Moyel and she would rather they use him than an OB/GYN or ped.

I can tell you though that I have one homebirthing neighbor that did circ but of all my homebirthing friends - about 15 none of the circ'd.

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#7 of 151 Old 03-23-2006, 11:44 PM
 
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It does seem counterintuitive. i would have thought they asked because of the vitamin K thing. We weren't asked but we had a girl. If it's a boy this time, we definately won't circ. no way. It must be hard if you are a mw who doesn't believe in it, to see parents who make sure the birth is gentle but then go one to do that.
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#8 of 151 Old 03-24-2006, 02:58 PM
 
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I have several homebirthing friends who circ'ed for religious reasons. They typically have used a local mohel who will do a non-ritualistic circ in the home.
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#9 of 151 Old 03-24-2006, 03:30 PM
 
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Yeah, I know homebirthers who do it for religious reasons and use a moyhl (sp?).

My sister-in-law asked me if I was going to do the circ myself if we had a boy. She wasn't even being snarky, just curious. Um, no. We're not circing at all.

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#10 of 151 Old 03-24-2006, 03:36 PM
 
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I don't remember my midwives asking, but I asked their circ rate among their clients, and I forget the number, but it was a lot lower than the provincial rate.

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#11 of 151 Old 03-24-2006, 03:40 PM
 
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My midwife with my last birth asked at about 30 weeks what my circ plans were. She was very anti-circ, but had a fair amount of clients who did circ for religious reasons (she is widely used through the local Orthodox Jewish community). So I would say her rate was probably 50/50
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#12 of 151 Old 03-24-2006, 04:54 PM
 
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When I was apprenticing with a birth center the midwives never asked about circ. They let the parents bring it up, didnt really give their opinions, but had anti circ literature avaliable in the waiting room. I gave a mom an anti-circ book because she wanted the information, she didnt know why people get it done but knew that dad wanted it done. I kinda got repremanded for the situation but I didnt mind. The woman did end up letting her son be circed but I totally respect her decision, she and her husband had read the entire book and still made the decision, I have to respect that at least they were informed and had both sides to the story. I guess I have become a bit of a no circ nazi, and a bf nazi, and an AP nazi; I might calm down about it someday but for now its all so new and wonderful to me I want to share it with everyone...I can totally understand why christians stand on the corner and preach I feel like doing the same about AP.
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#13 of 151 Old 03-24-2006, 05:17 PM
 
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the hb practice i used to work in had a few clients do it, but so few that after my son was circ'd (at hubby's firm insistance), i freaked out, and still worry, b/c i don't really know how a circ'd penis is supposed to look. i have to ask hubby all the time
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#14 of 151 Old 03-25-2006, 12:15 AM
 
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My midwife asked if we were going to circ our son and I said no. She said, "Oh good! No point in cutting off half a perfectly good d***." A little crass, but to the point.

My midwife says that about half of her patients circ too...but midwifery here has taken off with most people having hospital births, I believe. It's become trendy to use a midwife...which is fine by me, anything to get the public educated.

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#15 of 151 Old 03-25-2006, 01:03 AM
 
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My midwife asked at both the first visit and the 36 week visit. When I said no at the 1st visit she said, "Thank goodness." It was the 1st time dh had met anyone besides me who was anti-circ.

I don't know what her circ rate is.
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#16 of 151 Old 03-25-2006, 01:06 AM - Thread Starter
 
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My midwife asked if we were going to circ our son and I said no. She said, "Oh good! No point in cutting off half a perfectly good d***."
Oh my! :

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#17 of 151 Old 03-25-2006, 12:14 PM
 
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I am constantly surprised by how many of our clients want to circ. I usually ask them at around 30 weeks if they are thinking about circ'ing, and unless they are Jewish or Muslim, try my best to talk them out of it.
Many couples are surprised when they hear that circ'ing is un-necessary, they simply thought it had to be done! Younger couples seem to be more open to not circ'ing, while older couples seem to be more resistant. In one practice I worked at, the rate was probably about 50/50, but the one i'm in now is much lower, I'd guess less than 10%.
I do have the name of a mohel I refer to, who does a quick, moderate circ for those who insist. Fortunately, in my state, insurance will not pay for a not medically indicated circumcision, and the going rate is about $350, so that is often the deciding factor for a lot of couples. Not just the financial aspect, but the fact that it considered elective, cosmetic surgery drives the point across. (This is the only time I can say the ins. companies greed benefits the consumer!)
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#18 of 151 Old 03-26-2006, 12:51 AM
 
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I was just going to say that my mw didn't ask... then I realized DUH! I had a girl! Major pregnancy brain. I guess I'll find out after this one. I don't see why they ask though when it's the parents responsibility (should they decide to circ, goodness forbid) to make the appt and take the baby in to the hosp to have it done.

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#19 of 151 Old 03-26-2006, 01:51 AM
 
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I ask because I want to make sure they know the facts. I usually ask around 30 weeks or so and have a great, balanced video to loan out. I ask that parents who want to circ at least watch the video so they know how it's done.

In the Pacific NW, the rate of circ'd boys is about 30%, and I'd say about 5-10% of my clients circ - for cosmetic or religious reasons.
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#20 of 151 Old 03-26-2006, 03:38 AM
 
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Hmmm .... I think with each midwife (a different one for each of my three) the subject did come up, along with vitamin k, breastfeeding and so on. Seems to me it's just a natural part of being a healthcare provider, especially as each of my midwives provided several well-baby checks over the first couple of weeks.

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#21 of 151 Old 03-26-2006, 05:55 PM
 
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Well, I wish I could say that all midwives ask so that they can teach their patients about circ, but many ask so they can advocate for it.
Many Christian midwives seem to think that it is religiously necessary and are not up on their medical facts on the topic.
Hopefully we can get midwives of all religions to learn about the religious and medical reasons to leave boys the way that God and Nature made them.

If you choose to have a homebirth, you choose to do so for reasons of privacy, increased safety for mother and baby, physical and emotional comfort, among others. I'm not sure I understand how a parent can violate the safety and comfort of the homebirth experience by torturing their brand-new family member for a cosmetic procedure with no medical, hygienic, or social benefits.

It's not your penis, leave it alone.
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#22 of 151 Old 03-26-2006, 05:56 PM
 
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oops...duplicate post
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#23 of 151 Old 03-26-2006, 06:36 PM
 
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I offer all my clients - even those that circ for "religious" reasons info on circ. However, it is NOT my place to question their religious beliefs...especially when I'm not part of their religion. I offer them factual information, but do not downplay their spiritual beliefs. I think that's important, no matter how I feel about circ.
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#24 of 151 Old 03-26-2006, 09:25 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Thmom
None of them agree with Circ, but they do agree with a parents right to choose so they do thier best to inform clients but some people are just bull headed...
excuse me while i puke! i cannot understand how someone could do that to a baby. yea, i know, if she doesnt do it, someone else will blah blah blah. no excuse IMO

i think a HUGE part of my role as (soon to be) midwife is to be an advocate for babies. i think i would be doing a HUGE disservice to families if i didnt lay out the info for circ. i think once you build up a trusting relationship with a family, you are in a good position to give them this info in an innoffensive way.

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#25 of 151 Old 03-27-2006, 01:40 AM
 
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I would not hire a midwife who would harass clients about their religious beliefs. At the same time, I would not hire a midwife who supported Routine Infant Circ.
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#26 of 151 Old 03-27-2006, 12:59 PM
 
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"I'm not sure I understand how a parent can violate the safety and comfort of the homebirth experience by torturing their brand-new family member for a cosmetic procedure with no medical, hygienic, or social benefits.

It's not your penis, leave it alone." Leosmama

Well said Leosmama!

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#27 of 151 Old 03-27-2006, 01:08 PM
 
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A mw doesn`t need to ever go there at all with a client about religious beliefs. If I was a mw, I would say something like "circumcision defies logic, its purely cosmetic, its excruciating pain for a baby and hurts him for weeks and can make breastfeeding harder." Or, why even discuss it, a mw doesn`t do circs and if somebody wants a religious circ, what the heck does the mw have to do with that? If they don`t already know somebody who will come to the house and do it, then a mw shouldn`t have to find anyone. If it were me, I would probably give out a video that showed one happening, and a good article & say I don`t support it & you`re on your own if you want it done.

Just comparing it to baptism, if a mw`s client is Catholic, do they expect the mw to find a priest? If they don`t already have a church they can get out the phone book & look. The mw can avoid the whole subject if she`s opposed to circ.

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#28 of 151 Old 03-27-2006, 01:28 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I would not hire a midwife who would harass clients about their religious beliefs. At the same time, I would not hire a midwife who supported Routine Infant Circ.
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#29 of 151 Old 03-27-2006, 03:08 PM
 
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my midwife did not ask either...probably bcuz she already knew that we wouldn't if the baby was a boy (it was!). My 1st boy was circ'd bcuz we didn't know much about it...we figured, dad is...baby shld be. But when we had our 3rd & 4th baby, we just said that if it's a boy, we would not circ.

Rhonda

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#30 of 151 Old 03-27-2006, 03:35 PM
 
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My mw did ask during one of our prenatals. She asked to mark it on my records.
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