She also needs to remind him, it is not HIM having the MAJOR surgery, it is her, and if she does not wish to go through it, she shouldnt!
How about the new study done by the CDC that babies are 3x mroe likely to die if they're born via c/s?
Childbirth Connection is an EVIDENCE-BASED organization with a very "rational" presentation of material that would probably appeal to a man. There's all kinds of stuff about VBAC vs. ERCS there.
I am a member of ICAN, a chapter leader, in fact, but find that organization to be more helpful for and appealing to women than men. JMO.
I echo the sentiment that HE is asking her to go through MAJOR SURGERY... AGAIN... for a physiologigical event. One thing that tends to make an impact too is the fact that the risk of UR in a non-induced, non-augmented VBAC is only slightly higher than the risk ALL LABORING WOMEN have for UR. Also, there are common tests and interventions, like amnio, that docs recommend that have mortality/morbidity risks that equal or exceed the risk for rupture in a VBAC.
He needs to do his research before he asks his wife to submit to MAJOR SURGERY and a hugely over-used surgical procedure. The World Health Organization recommends a c/s rate around 10% with 15% having been deemed the upper limit of reasonable. Beyond that, the risks outweigh the benefits. 31.8% (our national avg) is irresponsible, and many hospitals have rates WAY WAY over that.
Kimberly, mom & wife - about pregnancy and birth
DD 2004; 3 babies 2007-08; twin DDs 2009; DD 7/12/11 hospital VBAC after 2 cesareans!
Proud mommy 9/2004 , 11/2007 , 2/2011
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--> find 2010 NJ hospital birth stats here!
step-mommy to (11), mommy to (5), (3) (0)
sweet little one in Heaven ~ about 7 weeks 3 days ~ 12-28-11
I really enjoyed the book "Pushed" by Jennifer Block. I checked it out from my local library and it has great stories and lots of statistics in it.
And how about (not to sound harsh but...) HIM having the unnecessary major surgery for no reason! It's a huge deal to have them cut into you like that, and once you have 2 c/s, the difficulty in ever having a normal, natural birth skyrockets (believe me, I'm there right now!).
She needs to tell him how important it is for her to experience childbirth the way nature intended it and he needs to trust her that she knows her own body and support her. I can not even imagine if my DP didn't support my decision to VBA2C this time. I don't even think I could be with someone who refused to consider my decision to refuse an *elective* surgery!
Kaiti, in with Shane, astrological mama to Sophie *12.27.05*, Maya *09.25.07*, Phoenix *08.23.09* & due *12.04.11* Having a after 3 cesareans!
Blair, mom to the amazing Nora (8/06) , sweet Anneliese (2/10) , and super Henry (8/12)
Momma to DD (12/04) and DS (11/09) .
I survived 16 mos! Ask me about breastfeeding a baby with posterior tongue tie, high palate, and weak oral motor skills- whew!
NOT my husband though, he would NEVER consider that. He won't even CONSIDER doing the colon cancer check when he gets to that age. And, I actually brought that up to him, since he isn't totally a UC fan, but he tolerates it because he trusts me. That why is it that I am suppose to let other people put their fingers in my private parts, look at my privates, and invade my privacy over and over, yet he can't have ONE rectal exam every five years? I think he understands a whole lot more. Kymberli
I had my daughter at a birth center. DH, however was dead set against it at first because back in the mid 70's, his mom's first baby (a little girl) died at one. He yelled. He screamed. He even said he would refuse to drive me there. "Why can't we do it at a hospital like everyone else?"
I stood my ground and told him "Yes, I know it's your baby too, but I'm the one giving birth. What are you going to do, drag me into the hospital in labor? This is my decision and oh, I checked into your mom's case. Did those midwives have ANY certification at all?"
"Right," I continued, "because that was before midwives and birth centers started getting regulated. You told me that she died because she needed a shot of oxygen and they didn't carry carry it, right?"
"DH, even home health care aides carry oxygen with them. Those people weren't even health care professionals and that wasn't a birth center. This one is. Oh, and the difference between where I want to go and the hospital is, uh, 500 FEET."
So DH reluctantly gave in. Was I bullheaded? Yes. Did I have any sense of tact? No. Did the experience of our daughter's birth eventually win him over? Thankfully, yes.
But yeah, willfullness has worked for me so far. The vasectomy card, that sounds like a good one too, haha.
I do think it helped a bit going to the midwife first, then the OBs, it let him see the difference to some extent. He got rather annoyed at the OB as well-they read a report wrong, insisted that I was 2 weeks earlier than I was, and refused to even try to get a heartbeat-I was 11 weeks according to them, 13 according to me. This was after we went through hell trying to get a babysitter so he could go back-they didn't want 4 kids in the patient room.
Compared to the midwife, where the kids just play in the waiting room right outside the door and are free to come in and out of the patient room...yeah. He still left it up to me but basically said he actually prefered the midwife. Actually over the course of all of that, he got really excited at the prospect of a homebirth and possibly a UC! I couldn't believe it!
Anyway, I think most men would look at the statistics and say ok, you're right. I mean, even a trial of labor is better than no labor at all, even if it ends in a cesarean. It gets those hormones flowing.
I don't call myself a feminist at all, but I am appalled at the reasoning that since a marriage is a "partnership" when there is a disagreement the wife defers to the man. That is absurd. She should feel every right to put her foot down, it's her body, her life and the life of her child.
I am all for being submissive to the husband, as the Bible tells us, but Jesus was a feminist. I do have a difficult time with the mandate in our Book, even though I believe in it, because that is just in my nature. But when it comes to birth, there is just not anything in the Bible that says that I must put my body to be sacrificed on the alter of male tyranny. Men can't give birth, women can. That simple. I think that the husband's have some right to have their say about the baby (moreso if she wants to abort), it is theirs too, but they have to defer to the woman's instinct and intution when it comes to birth and the giving of life in the safest way possible.
Before DH and I were married, we were expecting, and I was still nursing my son. Some girl at his work told him that by nursing, I was going to m/c. Actually, BFing extends the PG. But, not ever having a child or being married, he just got all frantic. So, he came to my parent's house to talk to me about this, and my sister started throwing all that submissiveness stuff in my face. Saying that even her LLL leaders wean their babies when they get PG. I assured him that it was okay, all was going to be fine, and we went on. He gives up easily on a fight, so I do have a difficult time balancing our roles. Later on, when the family dr wanted to refer me to an OB cause he was too lazy to get my records, to have a RCS JIC I had the wrong scar (which we both knew I didn't) at 34 wks, my DH said, "well, we will just go home and have the baby ourselves!" I went, "uhhh, whoa!!! I don't think so!" We got that straightened out, and had our 3rd baby together UC. LOL And, BTW, that first VBAC baby was 23 days LATE.
Marsden Wagner also has some articles that are posted on line that are very good. Here is his bio on midwifery today.
oAlisha- eternal companion to mike:, mother to three energetic boys (02):, (05), and (07) and one sweet little girl 3/13. Two in heaven.7/21/2010, 11/05/2011 .
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