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#1 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 02:14 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I don't know if this article has been posted anywhere yet....

http://kfor.com/Global/story.asp?S=2160222&nav=6uyAPkmP

Pretty sad, scarey, and a whole lot of other bad feelings.

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#2 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 02:20 AM
 
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Wow! Truly truly disturbing. A slippery slope too. How soon before the insurance companies begin trying to dictate other delivery choices I wonder?
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#3 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 02:23 AM
 
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Holy crap on a stick. Like a C-section is an infinitely "safer" procedure. :

It's all about crunching the numbers. Not a F'ing thing about offering better healthcare.

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#4 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 02:27 AM
 
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Horrifying...truly.

UCK
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#5 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 02:54 AM
 
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Quote:
Plico, the liability insurance company for Oklahoma physicians, says effective December 31st, doctors will not be covered for the procedure.
Quote:
"They have more problems with the uterus rupturing when it contracts," said Dr. Gregory Cox, an obstetrician/gynecologist. "Then, you worry about high blood loss, large amounts of blood loss. There have been some fetal deaths and even mothers have had to have hysterectomies immediately."
So, none of these problems will happen before the end of the year - it's just at the beginning of next year that it will suddenly be risky?
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#6 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 03:22 AM
 
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Anyone else think it's interesting that there is no mention of what increases the risk of uterine rupture, such the use of certain labor inducing drugs?

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#7 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 04:45 AM
 
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Not surprising for Oklahoma, this state sucks :LOL :LOL
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#8 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 09:24 AM
 
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That's disgusting!

Anybody else notice the ad to the left that says "Over Medicated?" It should be an exclamation point...
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#9 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 09:50 AM
 
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I can't believe that!

I can't even get the word out--seriously..I've started 5 rants and erased all of them!

it makes me SICK.

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#10 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 09:58 AM
 
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That's horrible what is happening because of frivolous law suits!!

Still, after reading the guy talking about scary things that can happen with VBAC, I got a bit concerned. I know nothing about the pros and cons of VBAC, but my sister was thinking about it, but now ay 33 weeks she is afraid.
I told her many women do it and all, but I was wondering if any of you guys could PM with links with good info about VBAC.
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#11 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 11:41 AM
 
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Sigh ~ Lovely, hope it doesn't happen IL!
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#12 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 11:45 AM
 
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Okay, I have to be quick as have to get in the shower and go get my ds. My first was a cesarean(after alot of pushing, trying to turn him, etc.), my second a vbac. What I was told was it depended on whether or not your first c-section was vertical or horizontal ( horizontal is less risky for a vbac) and how big the baby is. My first baby was 7 lbs. 6 oz...my second was 6 lbs. 6 oz. I had to be induced for my second one, but NO pitocin, they just broke my water and that triggered labor just fine. I am 4' 11"...and had narrow hips...I did have an episiotomy and did rip fairly extensively. My doctor just said some women are built to deliver big babies, I am not one of them. My little 6 pounder was almost more than I could do. I almost ended up with a second c-section, but in the end it worked out.Um, they did use this thing like a vacuum to help him out. Gotta go!

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#13 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 11:57 AM
 
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how are they going to define who is a good canidate for vbac and who isn't?
this is really scary...
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#14 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 12:01 PM
 
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I really don't like the direction this country is going! What next? I don't even want to think about it. What can we do about this????
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#15 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 12:14 PM
 
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WTH!!! Urgh this country is going to hell in a handbasket because of lawsuits and greed, lovely.
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#16 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 12:33 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by witchbaby
how are they going to define who is a good canidate for vbac and who isn't?
this is really scary...
I was wondering the same thing
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#17 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 12:34 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by paccookie
I really don't like the direction this country is going! What next? I don't even want to think about it. What can we do about this????
Have homebirths.... it would be the only way. Fight for midwives, support your midwives.

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#18 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 12:34 PM
 
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How sad for all the mama's that live there


And how infuriating for those of us who know better. It really makes me wonder what's next. Will it slowly become nation wide? Or maybe they can find some way we can have babies without all the risks of pregnancy and birth. Maybe some sort of pod for the babe to grow in, you know just keep it in the nursery till the babe is full gestation. Then bring it to the hospital so the DOCTOR can open it up and give you your babe. That way mama's wouldn't be so attacted, it'll make it so much easier to listen to the babe CIO down the hall in the nursery.

UGGHH!!!!
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#19 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 01:24 PM
 
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I'm seriously confused. I read that the great majority of women who attempt VBAC succeed, so wouldn't that be a MUCH lower rate of infection, death, complications, etc? Wouldn't insurance companies WANT women to attempt VBAC to reduce costs? Wouldn't MDs know this from personal experience/medical research? Someone please enlighten me!
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#20 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 01:30 PM
 
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wemoon, not to go ot, but my midwives were willing to let me drop dead from hyperemesis & i ended up having a rockin' great vbac (from the ob i had fired, saying i didn't trust him to let me birth naturally.) blame trial lawyers, blame insurance companies, but to drop it all in dr's laps is doing some of them a disservice.

hey, but thank god they still pay for circumcisions, right?

suse
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#21 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 02:15 PM
 
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Originally Posted by KiwiZ
I'm seriously confused. I read that the great majority of women who attempt VBAC succeed, so wouldn't that be a MUCH lower rate of infection, death, complications, etc? Wouldn't insurance companies WANT women to attempt VBAC to reduce costs? Wouldn't MDs know this from personal experience/medical research? Someone please enlighten me!
The malpractice insurance company (the one restricting VBACs) is concerned primarily with the cases of infant death or severe injury (that they feel could be prevented by C/S) that force them to pay huge, huge amounts. They aren't concerned about risk of infection or the longer hospital stay or other increased costs because that is paid for by the health insurance companies.

I don't feel this is right, I feel the doctor should be the one to make the choice about which is safer for that particular patient.

Have much to say but must log off, DS is awake.

Kaye

Part-time L&D RN and Full-time Mama to Xander 4/01 & Carly 6/08
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#22 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 02:29 PM
 
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This is horrifying and so sad. I don't understand why it's suddenly so dangerous to have a VBAC.

My grandmother had 7 children. The first 3 were vaginal, the fourth was a c-section, and the last 3 were VBAC. She had her children in Holland between the 1930s and the 1950s. I'm pretty sure most of the vaginal births were homebirths, too. My grandma rocked! I'm really confused as to why it was ok for Grandma to do it but not women today?
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#23 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 02:36 PM
 
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Well, how about addressing what causes the most uterine rupture to begin with? If docs weren't so frikkin Pitocin/Cytotec-happy, there wouldn't be nearly as many uterine ruptures. And when a woman has her first c/s, she should be sutured properly so that her uterus is strong enough to handle labor the next time. In "Ina May's Guide to Childbirth" she says that the uterine rupture rate for VBAC when no drugs/AROM/synthetic hormones are used is about .5%. Introducing all these various interventions increases that rate substantially. Don't doctors know this by now?!!! This whole article just disgusted me. My next baby is absolutely going to be an HBAC with a midwife. Do you know how difficult it is to recover from a c/s?!! It's miserably depressing and painful. I bet that our soaring c/s rates coincide with soaring ppd rates.

And I love what the previous poster said about supporting midwives more and homebirth.

I HATE INSURANCE. I always have. Can't live with it, can't live without it. I think this deserves some kind of action. Letter-writing campaigns, protests, the works. You name it. I'd be willing to drive up to Oklahoma to do something.

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#24 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 02:50 PM
 
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Here's a link to Plico Insurance Company:

http://www.plico-ok.com/pro-main.stm

You can find emails to their employees, phone numbers, the works. They've also listed the names of their Board of Directors and CEO. I'm thinking we ALL have some letter writing to do and phone calls to make.

It is our responsibility to do something. We CAN'T just sit back and let this happen. WE HAVE TO DO SOMETHING. I hope that every single person here who has read about this will do something.

(Can you tell this has upset me?! I'm going to take a breather now.)

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#25 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 02:53 PM
 
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I might be the only one here who knows next to nothing about VBAC, but would like to help my sister (who is giving birth in september after a c-section 2 years ago) to make an informed decision. She would like to do it vaginally, but is afraid of the risks. All she knows is that she went through hell with the c-section, long recovery and bad infection afterwards
Please, once again, can someone share some links with info on VBAC?
Thanks
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#26 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 02:57 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by polihaupt
I might be the only one here who knows next to nothing about VBAC, but would like to help my sister (who is giving birth in september after a c-section 2 years ago) to make an informed decision. She would like to do it vaginally, but is afraid of the risks. All she knows is that she went through hell with the c-section, long recovery and bad infection afterwards
Please, once again, can someone share some links with info on VBAC?
Thanks
She should read "Ina May's Guide to Childbirth" by Ina May Gaskin. It has the most wonderful information about the risks involved with many medical interventions as they pertain to childbirth and VBAC. It's the best book I have ever read on the subject to date.

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#27 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 02:58 PM
 
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From http://www.askdrsears.com/html/1/t012300.asp


4 WAYS TO INCREASE THE CHANCE OF A VBAC
1. Select birth attendants and a birth place friendly to VBAC's. Be sure both your practitioner and your hospital are up on the latest studies. The nationwide success rate is around 20 percent. Yet if a mother is under the care of a practitioner who regards VBAC as no riskier than any other delivery, the mother delivers in a hospital that does not consider VBAC women "high risk," and the mother uses the suggestions for helping the labor progress that are mentioned below, the VBAC success rate is 75-90 percent. This means that a mother choosing a VBAC may, in fact, have an even smaller chance of having a cesarean than the general population. Find out what your prospective birth attendant's VBAC success rate is. For normal low-risk pregnancies, it should be at least 70 percent. Shun practitioners and hospitals that try to label you "high risk" even if you have no risk factors besides a previous section. Studies show that even mothers with two or three previous cesarean births have a 70 percent success rate with VBAC if they deliver in a birthplace supportive of VBAC's. Obstetrical centers that specialize in VBAC's do not consider most VBAC candidates as high risk, and treat them no differently than any other obstetrical client. In fact, they consider it counterproductive to attach the "high risk" label to VBAC mothers. Most women wishing a VBAC should be treated like any other woman delivering a baby. They require no more or less technology, intervention, or monitoring. Beware especially of birth attendants who have a "pelvic prejudice" against small-hipped mothers wanting a VBAC. Many petite women have successfully pushed out big babies.

2. Employ a professional labor assistant. If you're serious about delivering your next baby vaginally, a PLA is a must. In our experience, mothers using a PLA were much more likely to have the birth they wanted.

3. Don't let technology or the measurements it produces scare you. VBAC studies fail to show any correlation between the size of the baby and the chances of uterine rupture. Also, estimates of fetal size and weight by ultrasound are not always accurate, especially in the final month.

4. Join a support group. There are support groups for mothers who need help in grieving about their previous cesarean or in avoiding another one. ICAN (International Cesarean Awareness Network) is one of the best, and has chapters nationwide. This support group will help you deal with feelings of regret from your previous cesarean while arming you with information on how to avoid another one. You will hear helpful suggestions from mothers who have gone the surgical route once and were highly motivated to try a VBAC the next time. One great piece of advice from this and other support groups is to keep your mind in your present labor and not allow yourself to have flashbacks from the labor that led to the cesarean. Otherwise, you may panic at the first monitor alarm and undo all the good work of a previously efficient labor. If you want to feel fully empowered for VBAC, a support group is your best bet.
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#28 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 04:01 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by be11ydancer
She should read "Ina May's Guide to Childbirth" by Ina May Gaskin. It has the most wonderful information about the risks involved with many medical interventions as they pertain to childbirth and VBAC. It's the best book I have ever read on the subject to date.
You should also read Silent Knife. It's old and needs updating, but still valid.

Christina
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#29 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 04:08 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Well, maybe this thread should get moved to activism or have a thread of the same sorts there so that we all can put forth an effort with letters and phone calls so this could be changed?

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#30 of 71 Old 08-13-2004, 06:11 PM
 
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What we all need to realize is that things like this that put limits on our birth choices are all rooted in the same fundamental notion that pregnant women lose the right to control their own bodies.

I strongly believe that stuff like this is happening largely because anti-abortion ativists are legitimizing the notion that pregnant women need to be controlled.

What I'm saying here is that our fight for reproductive rights is not just a fight for abortion rights. It is a continuum that includes the whole reproductive cycle including our right to choose how we give birth.

Women's reproductive rights are a critical issue in the upcomming November election. Your vote won't directly change the attitude of insurance providers in Oklaholma, but it may change whether insurance providers in Oklaholma will be able to get away with denying medical choices to people merely because they happen to be pregnant women.

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