What if to have another birth you had to choose C/S? - Mothering Forums

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Old 01-06-2009, 02:42 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Hello all,

I'm in a quandary - I want to have another child but with my last home birth I tore very badly and had to have a quick surgery to repair.

Everything has healed nicely but my doctor said I should not have another vaginal birth. I agree, since I've torn with every birth. And I really do believe that for some reason or another I just tear and I'm OK with that.

But, I WANT another baby so bad.

"Natural" C-sections - do they exist? Anyone with any experience having to choose a C - section and being OK with that choice? Anyone chose to not have another baby because they didn't want a C/S?

I would love to hear all/any opinions - I can take it!
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Old 01-06-2009, 02:56 PM
 
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Hm, that is indeed quite the quandry.

I've seen threads in the past on how to make CS as friendly to a crunchy-mama as possible. So that might have some helpful info.

I also remember a thread asking if a Mama should attempt vaginal birth again after a 4th degree tear. There was even an OB who posted & said "yes" - attempt vaginal again. Not sure if that thread might be of interest to you.

But finally, YES, I think I'd have a CS again if I wanted my family to grow. It's awful that so many are done unnecessarily. Yes, it's more risky than vaginal birth, but the vast majority of women are just fine after them. & if it's really required, we're lucky to have the option. I'd have the CS if I wanted the baby - particularly if it would be my last baby (then I wouldn't have to worry about the possible complications to future pregnancy that a CS could cause.)
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:02 PM
 
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here are some encouraging words - with my second, I had my son, nursed him on the operating table while they were still working on me, held him in my arms while being wheeled to recovery, no bath, no vaccines no eye ointment nothing. kept him in my bed and then went home exactly 24 hours later. my 1st and 3rd csections were not nearly as good. csections always suck, no matter how warranted. but you can make them more mother and baby friendly than they usually are with a little planning and a strong voice.

yes, i would have another csection if i wanted more children. good luck mama.
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:02 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thank you Megboz for your thoughts and resources .

I might attempt a vaginal birth - but really I've had three supportive, understanding midwife teams and each time I tore- so the history is the history.

Hmm maybe a doctor should really look at my hmm-hmm?

Any others?
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:03 PM
 
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I knew before I got pregnant this time that the pregnancy would be high risk, highly monitored and would end in a scheduled induction and possibly a c-section if the induction didn't go well.

I mourned the loss of my wonderful midwives and it was hard knowing that I would not get to repeat the wonderful homebirth I had with my son. I cried a lot about giving up that part of the dream.

In the end though, I really just wanted to add one more child to our family. How she gets here doesn't matter to me anymore, only that she arrives safely.
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:04 PM
 
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I think I'd get a second, third, and maybe even fourth opinion from a variety of sources--midwives, OBs of various philosophical backgrounds, and other mamas (as you're doing right now!).

Also, I'd do a lot of research into tearing. Physiologically, what is happening with a tear? Why do some women not tear and others do? What factors make the most difference, and are they controllable? What's the biggest risk of another tear vs. the risk of a c/s?

My hunch, and my hope, would be that there would be some unexplored aspect of vaginal birthing that would allow me to have another vaginal birth without tearing. If there was no such thing, and I were seriously, seriously opposed to another tear, I think I would be sad for a while, and then accept it. I wouldn't go for a c/s.
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:04 PM
 
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I think the worth of another life is definitly worth sacrificing the birth you want.... I mean to add to your family another child....a whole other lifetime of memories and hugs and kisses and grandchildren....etc. To me THAT is worth way more than a 20 minute procedure. As anti- "elective CS" as we all are or can be- i don't think there would be a single person here who would stop having children because that was their only birth option.

Blessed with two BEAUTIFUL little girls: Kylie (09/06) and Maggie (4/09) :
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:06 PM
 
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I would really look into why you tore, what position did you birth in, can you breathe the baby down next time, etc?

But as to the question, I would not never have another child if I felt that c/s was the only birthing possibility. Mothering is about so much more than birth!
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:06 PM - Thread Starter
 
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here are some encouraging words - with my second, I had my son, nursed him on the operating table while they were still working on me, held him in my arms while being wheeled to recovery, no bath, no vaccines no eye ointment nothing. kept him in my bed and then went home exactly 24 hours later. my 1st and 3rd csections were not nearly as good. csections always suck, no matter how warranted. but you can make them more mother and baby friendly than they usually are with a little planning and a strong voice.

yes, i would have another csection if i wanted more children. good luck mama.
How did you make your 2nd c-section this nice? Did you have a great birthing plan or a great doctor? Details Mama!

And thanks for the love , I'm needing it today.
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Old 01-06-2009, 03:14 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thank you all - you are really giving me things to think about and bolstering my courage

"My hunch, and my hope, would be that there would be some unexplored aspect of vaginal birthing that would allow me to have another vaginal birth without tearing."

HoneyTree I've heard that a lot, but I'm still not sure what emotional stuff I'm holding - I wish I could just open my brain and sort it out. Thanks for the idea though.

Keep the ideas/thoughts coming please!
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Old 01-06-2009, 06:08 PM
 
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That's what I am facing. I posted about my experiences and my fears on the "Children Born By C-Section Tribe" thread. No doubt about it, C-sections suck. But having children is life's greatest gift, and some of us just seem fated to bring them into the world this way. I am seeking treatment with a professional hypnotist to deal with my anxiety (now and right before the birth) and to help with the pain afterward. After our daughter is born I will post again on how well it worked.

p.s. The "awake" option is not necessarily better...few things are worse than botched spinal anesthesia!
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Old 01-06-2009, 08:31 PM
 
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Have you checked the "Natural Family Living c/s Resource Thread" that is stickied at the top of this forum? There are a lot of ideas there for making a necessary c/s as natural as possible. A lot depends on the hospital/your care provider but there is a lot you can do to tailor the experience even when policy says "no". And there is a really amazing "ideal cesarean" described on this website. Oh, and the hypnobabies people make a cd for planned c/s mamas... I haven't listened to it, but there is a hypnobirthing yahoo group open to all mamas interested in using self hypnosis techniques during birth and I bet a mama there could give you a BTDT review of the program.

I can sympathize with your situation... I had a 4th degree tear with dd2's vbac and although the repair went well I've seen several specialists and they are split on the advisability of a future vaginal birth. Most agree that if I don't tear, yay! But that if I do tear again my risk of permanent fecal incontinence this time is pretty high. Better than 50%. So I have to decide how the risk of a life long debilitating condition balances against the physical/emotional risks of a c/s. And I'm pregnant now. It's not a fun place to be, I know.

I'm getting more opinions... in fact, I'm going to see a homebirth midwife this week who is very encouraging of my trying another vaginal birth. I'll let you know what information she shares! I know she has suggested acupuncture and herbal treatments to release the scar tissue, and supports hands off slow water delivery for mamas who have torn previously. But you've probably tried these things already.

Anyway, I had the exact question you did about a year ago... if I had to have a c/s for a future birth, could I TTC? (my c/s was emotionally devastating so this was a BIG question for me) And my wonderful vbac OB told me to wait and see. That I didn't need to plan a c/s. I could wait until the birth and see how it went. If they noticed the tissue starting to swell/tear or if there were other indications that a tear was likely then I could move to a c/s right then and there. But if there was no indication of a tear then huzzah another vbac!

Although that thought is less comforting now that I'm actually pregnant and facing this situation for real , it did help me relax enough to become pregnant again.

I hope you find the balance you need to make peace with whatever path you choose.

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Old 01-06-2009, 08:46 PM
 
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I'm having my fifth c/s in June. Am I okay with it? Not even close...but not having another baby would be even more mentally/emotionally damaging to me. For me, it's a matter of deciding which particular hell I want less. I have to remember all my nasty experiences with c-sections, whether I have another one or not...so I'll add one more to the collection in order to have my last baby. I've wanted four children since I was 18 years old (I'm 40). Giving up now, just to avoid more trauma, doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Don't get me wrong - I totally understand why some women go that route, but it doesn't balance out well for me.

Everybody has a different experience of c-sections, anyway. Some women honestly find that they're not that bad. (I can't even begin to relate to that, but I've come across it more than once.) Some women find them absolutely horrible. I'd happily go through any other bad experience in my life - sexual abuse as a child, emotional abuse from my ex, a very unpleasant divorce, miscarriages - over the experience of a c/s...except the loss of another baby to stillbirth. If I could trade in a repeat of everything else that's gone wrong in my life, done 2 or 3 times over, and not have another section, it would be a fair deal. However, I really want another baby, and the obstetrical industry has managed to destroy every other aspect of my reproductive life - they don't get to plan my family for me.

Lisa, lucky mama of Kelly (3/93) ribboncesarean.gif, Emma (5/03) ribboncesarean.gif, Evan (7/05) ribboncesarean.gif, & Jenna (6/09) ribboncesarean.gif
Loving my amazing dh, James & forever missing ribbonpb.gif Aaron Ambrose ribboncesarean.gif (11/07) ribbonpb.gif

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Old 01-06-2009, 09:31 PM
 
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I agree with the PP about talking over your options with several different care providers... there seems to be a lot of different opinions on the subject. But, even though I really disliked my c-sections, I would still conceive even if I knew I would have to have a c-section.

I think there are definitely ways to make c-sections mother/baby friendly. After the initial 5 minute check over on the warming table (which was within my sight, at least the second time), I got to hold my babies in the OR while I was being stitched. I had them with me in recovery the whole time and they didn't try to weigh or bathe them until I had had them for a while and had nursed (or in my dd's case, tried to nurse) I was never separated from them, all procedures took place in my room and we slept together. It was about as ideal a situation as a c-section can be. I think that if it a choice you feel good about, and the focus is on the baby, you can have a good experience.

Midwifery Student and Mama to 2 daughters and 3 sons.     
ribboncesarean.gif vbac.gifhomebirth.jpg I have given birth a variety of ways and I am thankful for what each one has taught me.

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Old 01-06-2009, 09:51 PM
 
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There's a hospital in the UK that has started doing non-emergent c-sections in a very different (and imo, better) way. If for some reason I had to go that route, I would want it to be as close to their method as possible.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/society/20...icineandhealth
http://www.cfpc.ca/local/user/files/...20delivery.pdf

But yes, if I really wanted another baby and a c-section was the only safe way, then I would go for it.

If I was on the fence about whether or not to have another child, having to have surgery might push me over to the 'all done' side, though.
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Old 01-06-2009, 10:01 PM
 
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All my future births will be via c/s, as were my first two. Honestly, my having children was never about their birth. I didn't have an idea of an "ideal birth experience" beyond having a living, healthy child. So my c/s have not in any way been a disappointment, or traumatic. It seems like many women feel that they've "lost" something or somehow "failed" by having their child(ren) via c/s, but for me it's just a different method by which mine arrived. So no, I wouldn't let a c/s discourage me from having another child.

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Old 01-06-2009, 10:36 PM
 
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How did you make your 2nd c-section this nice? Did you have a great birthing plan or a great doctor? Details Mama!

And thanks for the love , I'm needing it today.
Well, I really should have written this way back when, but believe it or not, even with that great of an experience, I was still very upset about the cs afterwards

I was planning a hbac with a group of FPs. At 39w5 days my blood pressure (which had been creeping up) finally went high enough that they risked me out. But they sen me to a big teaching hospital where they had a good relationship with the maternal fetal specialists there, who they said, if it was safe for me to come home (after 24 hour monitoring) these docs would be the ones to okay it - they had supposedly okayed other hb's in the past.

Anyhow, I went in for observation, was told I needed to stay. Agreed to a cs the next morning (i was 40w even by then) but only if I could definitely go home 24 hours later (because by this point I had already been away from my older child for 24 hours). The doc said he had never had anyone leave that soon, but if I really wanted to, then I could, as long as everything was okay. I also said I didn't want them doing ANYthing to the baby - the doc said that was really up to the nurses and pediatrician and I'd have to talk to them in the morning. Long story short - I stayed up that whole night frantic with worry. The next morning, my husband came and my mom, I was wheeled into the or. Baby was born (while the staff talked about what they wanted for lunch - that's one thing I would change - please treat my birth as reverently as a vaginal. I really can't imagine people chattting that way if I were pushing a baby out). Baby was born - they took him over and weighed him - my husband stood right there. Then my husband brought him over to me. I was just kissing his face (the baby's )saying oh my gosh - i love you so much. He was wimpering a bit and rooting around. And I was like, I think he wants to nurse. I told my husband I was gonig to try and nurse him. So he helped me position him laying across my other boob - I think it really helped that I was an experienced breastfeeder The anestesiologist (sp>?) seemed a little freaked out , but I was like, he's hungry. Then a nurse walked up and was like, OMG!!! And I thought she was going to start in couldn't/shouldn't be doing that, but instead she said - I have NEVER seen anyone do that before!! That is amazing! Can I take a picture? And I was like sure - (I LOVE That picture.). SO I nursed him a little then my husband held him again until they finished up. Then they kind of sat me up ont hte gurney and handed the baby to me. I was wheeled into recovery with him, where he satyed (my husband and mom were there, and then my dad showed up with my older ds and we all just sat in the recovery area marveling). I was brought to a room where later my mom sponged the baby down. Oh - I wanted to add, as far the eye ointment and other vaccines, etc go - I said I was not consenting to ANYthing. The only thing they said was that if I would not agree to a bath/ointment/any vaccines/ then any hospital personnel who handled my baby would have to be wearing gloves. I was like, that's okay, because I don't expect you to be holding him at all. And, just remembered this, the resident (this wa a teaching hospital) in the or, had actually done his internship (or soemthing like that) with my homebirth doctors' practice. and so i think he was amenable to my concerns. Baby slept in my arms that night - once the nurse came in and was like, oh - you're an old pro (whereas with my first child, they insisted it was against hospital policy to sleep with baby in your bed). I was up and walking around about 4 hours after surgery - they said the catheter had to be out for 24 hours before I could go home - it ended up being more like 18. The next day - we were both seen by the doctors and cleared to go home. It was by far my best birth yet

When I was discussing the cs with my husband beforehand I was like, "you'd better not let them do anythng to the baby. and you'd better stay with the baby at every second that I'm not there - since he was the one with two working legs. I think that helped a lot. My mom, dad, and husband all were on board with little to no seperation and wre willing to be advoacates for me. I think it helps to rememebr that you are ulitmately in control (well, God, actually), but I mean more you than the doctors.

My mantra for my third birth was, I only want things that are actually necessary, not just arbitrary or out of routine. My third bnirth was made more complicated by the fact that my baby had a congenital heart defect that was diagnosed in utero. And that whole experience taught me that there are just going to be times that stuff sucks. that it doesn't matter how much you insist or cry or bitch, things might happen to you or your baby that you wouldn't choose. but that really - all that truly does matter is a healthy baby. I was very active on the ICAN list many years ago. And I know that there were lots of women on that list (myself included) who would scoff and roll our eyes or get angry about that sentiment. But after almost losing a child, I've found it to actually be true. Good luck, mama. I know it's hard to consider. But I do think it's worth it

sorry for terible punctuation typeing etc...naking...
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Old 01-06-2009, 10:37 PM
 
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. Mothering is about so much more than birth!
Amen, sister! Thank you for saying this.
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Old 01-06-2009, 11:31 PM - Thread Starter
 
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My mantra for my third birth was, I only want things that are actually necessary, not just arbitrary or out of routine. My third bnirth was made more complicated by the fact that my baby had a congenital heart defect that was diagnosed in utero. And that whole experience taught me that there are just going to be times that stuff sucks. that it doesn't matter how much you insist or cry or bitch, things might happen to you or your baby that you wouldn't choose. but that really - all that truly does matter is a healthy baby. I was very active on the ICAN list many years ago. And I know that there were lots of women on that list (myself included) who would scoff and roll our eyes or get angry about that sentiment. But after almost losing a child, I've found it to actually be true. Good luck, mama. I know it's hard to consider. But I do think it's worth it

sorry for terible punctuation typeing etc...naking...

Thank you, thank you for taking the time to write this up even with your punctuation boo boos.

I think my age shows when I say I've come through wanting to have the ideal birth experience for this birth (or maybe it's because I've had three wonderful birth experiences and my cup is luckily full). I really just want to love and connect with another soul.

Ahhh you are all so lovely - thank you from the bottom of my heart.
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Old 01-07-2009, 03:46 AM
 
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For me, if I knew I'd have to have a cesarean for another baby, I would take steps to ensure I never got pregnant again. It took me over a year to recover physically from the cesarean & emotionally, I'm not sure I'll ever recover fully.

Have you looked into/tried using Evening Primrose oil on the scar tissue from your tears to loosen it? I've heard it can really help.

mom to all boys B: 08/01ribboncesarean.gif,  C: 07/05 uc.jpg, N: 03/09 uc.jpg, M: 01/12 uc.jpg and far too many lost onesintactlact.gifsaynovax.gif

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Old 01-07-2009, 06:34 AM
 
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I think that a new topic has been born here: "How to Have a Better C-Section."

I will start a new thread for us to discuss it.
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Old 01-07-2009, 06:46 AM
 
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yes, I won't let the fact that I've already had 4 sections determine my family size. But then, as dissapointed as I was (especially for the first and 3rd -my vba2c attempt) none of my surgical births were overly traumatizing. It's hard to say how the experience will play out for you, of course. But I personally, will not-not have another baby because of the need for a c-section.

I do hope you are able to vbac, though. And regardless, read about how to make a cesarean more gentle (I know there are stickies/threads here).

ribboncesarean.gif cesareans happen.
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Old 01-07-2009, 03:34 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I do hope you are able to vbac, though. And regardless, read about how to make a cesarean more gentle (I know there are stickies/threads here).

No VBAC for me - I had tears with each vaginal birth leading up to a huge tear with my last. I had surgery to repair and was told if I had any more children vaginally it would be really really bad in the long run (keeping the poop and pee inside )

No amount of oil or homebirth good vibes stopped me from tearing during any of my births. I think I just tear.

Kim
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Old 01-07-2009, 03:35 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I think that a new topic has been born here: "How to Have a Better C-Section."

I will start a new thread for us to discuss it.
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Old 01-07-2009, 03:35 PM
 
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But as to the question, I would not never have another child if I felt that c/s was the only birthing possibility. Mothering is about so much more than birth!
: I wouldn't think twice about it.
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Old 01-07-2009, 03:38 PM
 
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No VBAC for me - I had tears with each vaginal birth leading up to a huge tear with my last. I had surgery to repair and was told if I had any more children vaginally it would be really really bad in the long run (keeping the poop and pee inside )

No amount of oil or homebirth good vibes stopped me from tearing during any of my births. I think I just tear.

Kim

oh, no. That sounds awful. Sorry, I didnt quite understand and have very little knowledge on tearing (considering I've never had a vaginal birth or known anyone who had that happen to that extent).

I do have to say that my c-sections were all a very positive experience (considering) and I am for the most part, at peace with my births. I had a wonderful OB who followed my wishes, I got to hold my babies while they were putting me back together and nurse very soon after getting into recover. We were never separated for more than a short time (and DH always always went with) so I don't have horror stories like some do. Of course, I wish to have been able to vaginally birth and avoid surgery but I surely won't let that impact my decision to add to our family.

ribboncesarean.gif cesareans happen.
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Old 01-07-2009, 07:47 PM
 
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KimCarrots, I've been in a similar spot where I had to choose c/s births in order to keep having kids, I feel for you, its not easy.

I lost my second baby due to injuries from a natural birth and I have a high chance of having it happen again. I have since had 2 c/s and planning a 3rd in April.
C/s wasn't very traumatic to me in comparison to my second birth, but I did try hard to have a good attitude about having surgery to have babies. A lot of the energy I would normally put into preparing for a homebirth, I put into preparing for healing well from c/s. I had an experience similar to vbactivist, very close to baby, no separation, instantly nursing and good recovery.

Good luck with your decision.

Married Catholic mami : to 5 boys, : 9 6 3 : 5 mo. 5/6/02-6/22/02 (HIE)
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Old 01-07-2009, 07:53 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by liseux View Post
I lost my second baby due to injuries from a natural birth and I have a high chance of having it happen again.....

... A lot of the energy I would normally put into preparing for a homebirth, I put into preparing for healing well from c/s. I had an experience similar to vbactivist, very close to baby, no separation, instantly nursing and good recovery.

Good luck with your decision.
First

I love the idea of putting energy into the healing to make it a positive experience. Thank you for that idea.
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Old 01-07-2009, 10:21 PM
 
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KimCarrots, thanks.

I forgot to mention that one of my good friends had a very bad tear that did not heal well & had reconstructive surgery & then chose a c/s. She and I were in Bradley class together so we very much wanted NCB, but she also had a great c/s experience. It also helps to have an OB that will work with you to help make it as smooth as possible. You can have your hands free now, even the IV hand, they are usually cool with you bringing music, although it helps to ask OB what kind of system they have. Personally, I liked the OB's choice of tunes. The baby can go right to your partner after a quick scan by the nurses and then to you either on the table, or as you leave the OR. Primary sched. c/s are usually very very fast & very smooth.

Married Catholic mami : to 5 boys, : 9 6 3 : 5 mo. 5/6/02-6/22/02 (HIE)
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Old 01-07-2009, 10:29 PM
 
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I have had two c-sections. Neither was an awful experience. My repeat section was actually pretty simple. After she was born, she stayed in DH's arms and near me. I was wheeled from the OR to my room and baby rode with me. I don't think we were ever seperated. I had my c-section at 2PM and was ready to leave by 9AM the next morning. I ended up being released after 24 hrs (24 hrs exactly, we were all packed, ready to go and bolted the second it turned 2pm!)

I would not let a less than ideal birth experience stop me from having kids. No way.
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