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#31 of 49 Old 08-09-2009, 02:52 PM
 
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So ... select studies demonstrating a potential correlation unrelated to epidurals leads to speculation regarding causation related to epidurals?
Same drugs, different delivery (IV vs. epidural catheter). I am not implying causation. There is a reason to believe there is a correlation. What's wrong with speculation? If it hasn't been proven false, there is still that possibility. Possibility, not guarantee.

Select studies that demonstrate correlations are used to direct medical care all the time. This is how the standards of care are decided.

I am pro-choice in regards to birth. If a woman truly needs an epidural, I don't believe in denying it. I am not trying to induce guilt. Each and every person has a right to know the risks and benefits of everything before deciding.
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#32 of 49 Old 08-09-2009, 03:07 PM
 
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I just found out we are expecting our seventh child and I am already thinking of an epidural! I have never had one...all births have been natural (well, my first I had a shot of morphene) and our last birth (just 10 months ago) was a wonderful homebirth. I LOVED the homebirth. My husband LOVED the homebirth. I HATE the pain of labor....thus considering going to a hospital and having an epidural.....what are your opinions? Anyone made a similar choice (had natural births then had an epidural)? Were you happy about your choice after wards? I really am not excited about the prospect of a hospital birth (especially in this city) but I REALLY like the idea of not being in so much pain.....
I didn't read the replies...but i can probably guess what the majority - if not ALL of them say.

I only have 2 kids - my first was totally natural. Yep - labor pain SUCKS.

I got an epidural with my second (I doubt i would've had the choice on this though, there were some complications and they had to use pitocin...anyway...). Epidurals are AWESOME. I would get it...you already suffered through 6 labors naturally, why not get a little relief with number 7?

My birth was pain free - once I got the epidural. And getting it didn't hurt that bad. The only thing that hurt was the contractions prior to getting the epi and having the tape removed. Getting the tape removed from my back actually hurt worse than birth.

I was still able to move around in the bed as well...i actually got on all fours to see the the baby would turn (the cord was around his neck and i was minutes away from a c-section). I did need a bit of help...but it really wasn't so bad. It wore off pretty quickly too.

Okay...now i'll sit back and wait to be banned or flamed for my pro epi post
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#33 of 49 Old 08-09-2009, 03:25 PM
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I had an epi with my oldest. While I did get great pain relief, it didn't help at all when the baby was pressed on a nerve. So, they gave me more pain med. Still didn't help. At this point I have NO control of my lower body, ended up with a 4th degree episiotomy and a forceps delivery. I am lucky to not have had a c-section. But, that's not the end of it. I blacked out when I tried to stand to go to the bathroom and it took forever for the drug to completely wear off. Recovery was LONG. I didn't understand how these other women could bounce back so quickly after birth. Sex hurt for about 9 months (because of the episiotomy--which I know was a result of the epi).

Baby #2 was natural hospital birth with midwife. They thought because of my scar tissue that I would tear. I only had a very small tear, didn't stitch it. Baby #3 was born at home. .. 9 pounds 10 ounces and big. Small difficulty with shoulder dystocia, midwife reached in around head to dislodge the shoulder. NO tearing at all. I credit this feat to the birthing tub I labored in.

You mentioned that you had a homebirth for your most recent addition. Have you ever had the chance to use a birthing tub. For me, it really helped. But, this is YOUR choice. You know yourself best. I just want you to hear my story so that you know that the epidural isn't all it is cracked up to be.

Amy

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#34 of 49 Old 08-09-2009, 04:22 PM
 
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Honestly, I thought about it with #4. #3 was such a stressful difficult birth (at home) and I was worried about repeating it. I didn't think about it for very long though, I just couldn't put my baby (or myself) through a hospital birth unless it was absolutely necessary. I ended up with the most perfect homebirth I could imagine, nearly pain free and less than an hour from "oh I'm actually in labor" to baby.
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#35 of 49 Old 08-09-2009, 08:28 PM
 
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Originally Posted by catsandcats View Post
Same drugs, different delivery (IV vs. epidural catheter). I am not implying causation. There is a reason to believe there is a correlation. What's wrong with speculation? If it hasn't been proven false, there is still that possibility. Possibility, not guarantee.

Select studies that demonstrate correlations are used to direct medical care all the time. This is how the standards of care are decided.

I am pro-choice in regards to birth. If a woman truly needs an epidural, I don't believe in denying it. I am not trying to induce guilt. Each and every person has a right to know the risks and benefits of everything before deciding.
A degree of reason to believe there may be a correlation by one means of delivery utterly unrelated to another, particularly when that other means so heavily alters the degree of infant exposure, can not be used to indicate the presence of an, itself unstudied, equivalent potential correlation -- that's what's wrong with speculation, plain and simple. It can't be done. As for not having been proven false ... it has also not been absolutely proven false that epidurals will increase the risk of babies born to mother who use them later sprouting unicorn horns, but there would clearly be something wrong with speculating that they might. It being unstudied does not make the possibility a legitimate matter to bring up in epidural decision making conversations. I would also add that such speculation is heavily and needlessly alarmist, particularly given the sheer volume of people who fail to fully understand the difference between a correlation and a causation.
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#36 of 49 Old 08-10-2009, 03:04 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Liquesce View Post
As for not having been proven false ... it has also not been absolutely proven false that epidurals will increase the risk of babies born to mother who use them later sprouting unicorn horns, but there would clearly be something wrong with speculating that they might.
Okay, I am SO too lazy right now to get into agreeing or disagreeing so I am not going to comment except to at this.

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#37 of 49 Old 08-10-2009, 09:40 AM
 
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As for not having been proven false ... it has also not been absolutely proven false that epidurals will increase the risk of babies born to mother who use them later sprouting unicorn horns,
:
Yup. Well said. Just because it hasn't been "proven false" doesn't make it a legitimate concern. As a matter of fact, it's really hard to "prove" a negative anyway.
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#38 of 49 Old 08-10-2009, 10:46 AM
 
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I think it's like everything with interventions--we must consider the risks and benefits to each and apply those to our own personal situation.

I've read the research in the past and would suggest the OP does as well. Then do the risk benefit analysis for her situation.

I've had a few friends who have basically gone to the point of exhaustion and transferred and received an epidural. For them the choice was either epidural or cesarean (that's how it was presented to them at the hospital as they were exhausted--often at labor for a very long time the mw would fight to get them that chance at an epidural rather than an automatic section for 'failure to progress').

From what I have read, it's unlikely that I personally would choose an epidural to ease my own 'pain' during labor. However, if there was a case where physically there was a reason why I needed to have one and at that point the benefits outweight the risks then I would do it. Of course, I've had like four kids now, including the last birth (which was precipitous). So may be a moot point because though as I may be done, I don't know!

I do have a couple of friends who have had them for all births, including my SIL. And, most definitely they don't always work. Some of them had to have them redone during labor as well.

Perpetually breastfeeding or pregnant ENFP mom to a lot of kids...wife to a midwestern nice guy...living in tropical paradise...pink cats and homebirths rock!

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#39 of 49 Old 08-10-2009, 01:31 PM
 
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Haven't read all the PPs, but have you ever looked into hypnosis for childbirth? It's amazing! I originally came across it when an article mentioned that hypnosis is used in place of anesthesia (when someone is allergic, for example) for surgery, and recently read about it being used for dental procedures/having teeth pulled (http://hypnobabies.wordpress.com/200...eth-and-birth/). That was pretty convincing for me! I did Hypnobirthing for my first birth and Hypnobabies for this one. Good luck in your decision!

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#40 of 49 Old 08-10-2009, 02:26 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thanks for all the responses! Hearing from so many women whom I know share a lot of the same philosophies about childbirth and child rearing as I do is awesome!

I love the idea of going to the hospital, getting an epidural and then just hanging out, having fun with no pain until it's time to push the baby out. I know that actually does happen for some people like that...and I know that there are a LOT of risks and interventions involved...one of which is not enough pain relief, etc.

I have thought of hypnobirth or hypnobabies before (any recomendations about which one is better?) but I have such a hard time making my body relax....I don't feel like I could actually accomplish that.....but it doesn't hurt to start training and trying, I guess!

It is very hard to imagine being happy in a hospital setting where I was a "patient" and my baby was a "patient"....that would be very irritating and frustrating. I will have to do a bit more research about the hospitals here and care providers here and see how bad it would be.

Ugh. I really hate decisions like this!! I love getting the cute baby at the end.....I just wish they could teleport out!

Heidi : Married for 15 years, expecting our 8th baby in July!

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#41 of 49 Old 08-10-2009, 02:51 PM
 
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Me too! I also think that since it's only been 9 months since you last did it is making you want the epidural. My kids are all almost 4 years apart and that has a lot to do with the fact that I was not ready to deal with the pain for quite a while.

Evergreen- Loving my girls Dylan dust.gifage8, Ava energy.gifage 4 and baby Georgia baby.gif (6/3/11).

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#42 of 49 Old 08-10-2009, 03:07 PM
 
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I have thought of hypnobirth or hypnobabies before (any recomendations about which one is better?) but I have such a hard time making my body relax....I don't feel like I could actually accomplish that.....but it doesn't hurt to start training and trying, I guess!
I haven't actually used the Hypnobabies yet (sorry it sounded like I had...not due till Feb), but I was totally convinced by the testimonials on this board, particularly from Veritaserum, if you can track her down. That's why I recommended it to my sister, which is who I got my kit from. Unfortunately I don't feel like she actually 'chose' to use it during the labor and birth, although everything still went great. I think she favored the CBE she got from the birth center and kind of disregarded the HB.

The Hypnobirthing class I took was exactly what I needed for my first birth, with a private instructor--who introduced me to Mothering! Yay! No complaints from me.

But from what I understand, Hypnobabies goes more in-depth into actual anesthesia techniques, which sounds like what you would benefit from. Plus it is a homestudy course, which is perfect for me with one hypnobirth under my belt and a 3 yr old I can't leave at home a lot.

In any case, like you said, it couldn't hurt to practice. It is absolutely wonderful to give yourself some true relaxation on a daily basis during pregnancy. You repeat visualizations and affirmations of having the birth you want, which helps bring that into reality. My sister and another friend who practiced during pregnancy but didn't really use it during labor said even that made it worthwhile to take the course.

HTH!

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#43 of 49 Old 08-10-2009, 03:26 PM
 
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If epidurals were merely about pain relief with no other complicating factors or side effects, it probably wouldn't be a tough decision! Whenever I start to think how nice it would be to get an epidural, I remind myself of all the reasons I chose NOT to get it in the past. None of those have changed for me.

38y.o. wife to the best husband on earth for the last 19 years and Mommy to 5 going on 6. DUE Feb. 2, 2010. We delay and selective vax. I love BF'ing and CD'ing.
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#44 of 49 Old 08-10-2009, 05:34 PM
 
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I also thought this way with #7. Isn't that funny? I was really wanting another UC, so the option was out, really. Even when I got into the shower, I thought I should go for that epi, because it was going to get much worse, and it never did. My babies come really fast, so that isn't much of an issue. But, it is still a terrible pain, and after #6, you just don't forget anymore.

Well, God answered my prayer. By the time I was actually having any pain, the baby was born in 1h15m later. But, this is the thing, it was the least painful out of all my labors. I kept thinking that I had so much longer to go, because it just didn't hurt as much as I thought it should.

So, God really answered my prayers on that point. He was also a little peanut though, too, since I had lost a twin early on. So, that may make a difference. I have little babies. Kymberli
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#45 of 49 Old 08-10-2009, 05:39 PM
 
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I have only had one birth (so far); it was in the hospital, drug-free. When I decided I wanted a natural birth it wasn't so much because I was anti-epidural, but because I didn't like all the things that inevitably come with an epidural (the "cascade of interventions). Caths, IV fluids, continuous fetal monitoring, and staying in bed really don't appeal to me. Plus, I know my personality is just really bossy! I like to be in control and I don't like other people (incl. nurses and docs) telling me what I can and can't do.

OP, you've had lots of birthing experience at this point. I'm sure you'll figure what the best choice for you and your baby is.

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#46 of 49 Old 08-10-2009, 09:53 PM
 
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In terms of hypnobabies vs. hypnobirth, I looked up a lot comparing the two and asking on here and the vast majority of opinions I received were that hypnobabies was a more comprehensive program and that people seemed to have more success with it. I used hypnobabies with my last birth and LOVED it. I cannot say enough positive things about it. It actually makes me look forward to giving birth again. I really doubted my ability to be hypnotized. I had learned Bradley with my first and thought I'd be great at it and it all went out the window during labor (granted, it was 28 hours of back labor so that might have had something to do with it). But I just felt relaxed and prepared for my hypnobabies birth. I was so relaxed during the pregnancy (I think partly because you are forced to take time for yourself to practice the skills) and also because the skills themselves help you relax. I was very relaxed during the labor and it was super short- 3 1/2 hours from start to finish. All but 3 contractions were pain free. Just pressure, similar to what it feels like when you get your blood pressure taken. I really could go on and on! Feel free to PM me with any questions!
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#47 of 49 Old 08-11-2009, 12:57 AM
 
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I have thought of hypnobirth or hypnobabies before (any recomendations about which one is better?) but I have such a hard time making my body relax....I don't feel like I could actually accomplish that.....but it doesn't hurt to start training and trying, I guess!
I've used and taught both and I prefer Hypnobabies for a whole bunch of reasons. I wrote some of them here:

http://www.birthnaturally.org/hypnobirthing.htm

Feel free to PM me if you have more specific questions.

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It is very hard to imagine being happy in a hospital setting where I was a "patient" and my baby was a "patient"....that would be very irritating and frustrating. I will have to do a bit more research about the hospitals here and care providers here and see how bad it would be.
Oh, I hear ya there! I love post-partum at home...even with several older kids. I got very, very little rest in the hospital after my first dd's birth and I was annoyed at how often they found reasons to take her away. Of course, I know more now, but I really have no desire to deal with that immediately after giving birth.

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#48 of 49 Old 08-11-2009, 03:38 AM
 
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I have not read all of the replies, but the first thing that came to mind is the overall hospital experience. Find out as much as you can about the hospital- staff, procedures, room, etc. It's more than just getting the epidural- it's the whole hospital birth that you need to think of.

Best of luck with your decision. I've only had two kids, DD is 8 weeks today, and her labor was fast and furious (2 hrs). I came away saying, "Now I get why people request pain meds! That effing hurt!"

Erin
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#49 of 49 Old 08-11-2009, 04:01 AM
 
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Thanks for all the responses! Hearing from so many women whom I know share a lot of the same philosophies about childbirth and child rearing as I do is awesome!

I love the idea of going to the hospital, getting an epidural and then just hanging out, having fun with no pain until it's time to push the baby out. I know that actually does happen for some people like that...and I know that there are a LOT of risks and interventions involved...one of which is not enough pain relief, etc.

I have thought of hypnobirth or hypnobabies before (any recomendations about which one is better?) but I have such a hard time making my body relax....I don't feel like I could actually accomplish that.....but it doesn't hurt to start training and trying, I guess!

It is very hard to imagine being happy in a hospital setting where I was a "patient" and my baby was a "patient"....that would be very irritating and frustrating. I will have to do a bit more research about the hospitals here and care providers here and see how bad it would be.

Ugh. I really hate decisions like this!! I love getting the cute baby at the end.....I just wish they could teleport out!
It's my opinion, that if you want it, you should do it. I don't see much difference between this and wanting to VBAC. Obviously, I'm speaking of the emotional aspect. After six births, if you're feeling the strong desire to enjoy a pain-free birth, I think you should try it. It feels so weird for me to say that... Who knows, you may feel completely different towards the end. Your most recent birth was SO recent! I always think "epidurals FTW" for about a year PP! But in the end, I've never had one.
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