what's with this trend of starting labor < 40 weeks? - Page 3 - Mothering Forums
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#61 of 110 Old 06-26-2004, 11:29 AM - Thread Starter
 
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from another board i go to ~

I went to my 37 week appointment yesterday and my doctor mentioned that he was going to "try to speed up labor naturally" so when he checked me to see if I was dialating/effacing he started stretching my cervix and stripping membranes without giving me any warning. ... He also mentioned that he thinks I should try to do the castor oil thing



why are women allowing this??
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#62 of 110 Old 06-26-2004, 01:43 PM
 
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Originally Posted by klothos
from another board i go to ~

my doctor mentioned that he was going to "try to speed up labor naturally" so when he checked me to see if I was dialating/effacing he started stretching my cervix and stripping membranes without giving me any warning. ..
Right. Because someone poking and prodding your cervix is completely natural! This is exactly why I don't allow my OB to do any internals, aside from obvious privacy and risk of infection reasons. I've read of far too many doctors stripping membranes without even telling the mother what they're doing, the women don't even know whats going on a lot of the time. If they would just ask exactly what the doctor will be doing during an internal they might be able to have a little more control, but heaven knows when I've questioned the reason for internals I've offended a couple nurses... And heaven forbid you offend a doctor :

I think a lot of women simply don't know that they can question their doctor's judgement or decisions. Doctors went to school for this, so they must know more about my body than I do, and who am I to question them? That type of thing.
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#63 of 110 Old 06-26-2004, 03:40 PM - Thread Starter
 
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i'm so mad right now.

i went back to the forum (i had replied to that with sheer astonishment that this poor woman isn't even at 40 weeks yet, and her doctor never even explained to her the risks of early induction)... and there are people saying that there ARE NO RISKS. one woman said, "in fact I even asked my doctor about babies coming early. He said that new studies show that a baby born between weeks 37 and 39 do better than babies born between weeks 40 and 42."

ARRRRRRGGGGGGGGGGGGHHHHHHHH

:: scream ::

:



i should just stop going there. all it ever does is piss me off and make me want to cry.

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Doctors went to school for this, so they must know more about my body than I do, and who am I to question them?
i think that's exactly the problem.
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#64 of 110 Old 06-26-2004, 04:09 PM
 
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"in fact I even asked my doctor about babies coming early. He said that new studies show that a baby born between weeks 37 and 39 do better than babies born between weeks 40 and 42."
And, of course, they don't even ask to see these studies. So any doctor can claim something he does is supported by a "study" and he knows no one will ask questions. "Oh! A study was done! That's like, scientific, right?"

A study was once done showing that it was actually cancer that caused smoking. Studies can prove anything we want.
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#65 of 110 Old 06-26-2004, 04:29 PM
 
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Originally Posted by klothos
i'm so mad right now.

i went back to the forum (i had replied to that with sheer astonishment that this poor woman isn't even at 40 weeks yet, and her doctor never even explained to her the risks of early induction)... and there are people saying that there ARE NO RISKS. one woman said, "in fact I even asked my doctor about babies coming early. He said that new studies show that a baby born between weeks 37 and 39 do better than babies born between weeks 40 and 42."

i should just stop going there. all it ever does is piss me off and make me want to cry.

You sound exactly like me everytime I check out my birth board at BabyCenter DF is always asking why I even bother reading their posts since they always make me upset. I ask myself the same thing at times, but I guess I'm hoping to be able to educate at least ONE woman...

The women on mainstream boards are so maddeningly ignorant...it's just really really sad...
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#66 of 110 Old 06-26-2004, 04:33 PM
 
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i was 10 days early. i labored at home for 12 hours on my own before i called my midwife to meet us at the hospital. well she was out of town!! i was at 10cm and ready to start pushing. i pushed for 3 hours before her fill in dr. came in telling me i was going to have to have a c/s if things didnt speedup.
i heard her around the corner telling a nurse she had a pampered chef party to go to in 2 hours!!!
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#67 of 110 Old 06-26-2004, 06:00 PM
 
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This quote says it all:

"The plural of anecdote is not data."

Doctor's studies are sometimes pulled out of their :
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#68 of 110 Old 06-26-2004, 07:16 PM
 
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Originally Posted by orangemustang
i pushed for 3 hours before her fill in dr. came in telling me i was going to have to have a c/s if things didnt speedup.
i heard her around the corner telling a nurse she had a pampered chef party to go to in 2 hours!!!


Even though it *really* doesn't surprise me, that REALLY pisses me off! Argh!
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#69 of 110 Old 06-26-2004, 10:49 PM
 
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FWIW, I had an 11 pound 4 ounce baby boy 27 months ago. 5 hours of labor, 3 pushes posterior... easiest delivery ever. Why do I think so? My doc was totally cool about leaving me alone. No drugs, no IVs, no induction.
She did sugegst later I migth want to think about natural induction methods next time and the nurse said if she realized how big my baby was would have pushed for pain meds.
He was born a day earlier than I expected him, 5 days later than my "due" date that was negotiated. Scan said 1st, I said minimum for sex was this day so we compromised on the 12th.
I am rock solid on my dates this time and my due date is one day off from my calculations. We shall see how this works.
I am hoping for less than 13 pounds though.
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#70 of 110 Old 06-26-2004, 11:53 PM
 
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Does anyone know what the pediatricians, especially neonatologists, think of the trend to induce/deliver before 40 weeks? I know that they do not have primary responsiblity for the baby before birth. But surely they can't be happy with all these preterm (is that the correct word?) babies they are treating. Or am I naive?
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#71 of 110 Old 06-27-2004, 01:15 AM - Thread Starter
 
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what a good question, Kari_mom!
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#72 of 110 Old 06-27-2004, 03:16 AM
 
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It's ironic that this is being discussed right now. I just got a message from a friend I haven't seen in ages - we write every once in a while. I knew his wife was pregnant and had asked how she was doing, this is what I got back today
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We're 38 weeks, she's really miserable. Achy, can't sleep, wants her doctor to induce to get it over with, but our doctor wont do it. We're full term ,so it could happen any time, or we could have another 2 - 3 weeks to go.
On the one hand, good for her Dr. On the other I notice that at 38 weeks with their first they think 3 weeks is the longest they can go. Evidently another Dr who won't let them go past 41 weeks. Better than 38, but still . . .


(oh and I got another, "When are you do? Your huge!" today. I'm 21 weeks. Gotta tell you, I think that contribute at least a little. Everyone just gets so darn big when they're pregnant - that can't be natural )
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#73 of 110 Old 06-27-2004, 07:23 PM
 
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Yep - this early-induction thing is S.O.P. around here. Nobody (and I mean nobody ) in the big suburban practices goes past 39 weeks. All scheduled inductions at 39 weeks with quick transfer to C/S for failure to progress. Such BS. This is primarily so "mom can have baby on Dr's day on call" and to avoid weekends, evenings and holidays. (And of course their golf games) :Puke Actually, my OB/GYN rotation in one of these practices was the beginning of my desire to homebirth/UC & my coming to these boards! So there's a small silver lining (very very small).

About the peds - no, they really don't like the early inductions. My mother's a small-town ped, and is forever dealing with the local OB & his early c/s or inductions at 36/37 wks (and sometimes oops the dates are wrong! so it's really a 34/35 weeker!). She's definitely not impressed & would really prefer the kids to come in the 39-41 wk range, although she's much less crunchy than I am about things and does believe in induction for <2 weeks post-dates.

crafty mama to Chloe and Emma (10/08) and Piper
emergency medicine PA and single mother by choice
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#74 of 110 Old 06-27-2004, 09:01 PM
 
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I guess people should ask their prospective docs if they play golf.

T
What is a "pampered chef"?
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#75 of 110 Old 06-27-2004, 09:20 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by magemom
FWIW, I had an 11 pound 4 ounce baby boy 27 months ago. 5 hours of labor, 3 pushes posterior... easiest delivery ever. Why do I think so? My doc was totally cool about leaving me alone. No drugs, no IVs, no induction.
She did sugegst later I migth want to think about natural induction methods next time and the nurse said if she realized how big my baby was would have pushed for pain meds.
First, yay for you (and your doc)!! But WHY would you "think about natural induction methods" when you had NO problems? What am I missing? Just to avoid another "big" baby? Maybe you just grow big babies, and clearly your body can birth them....if it ain't broke, don't fix it, doc!!


Oh, and to the nurse: Is the mother incapable of requesting/determining if she needs meds??!?! She would have pushed for pain meds - NOT her call!!!!


Aaaargh....that's just one of my hot buttons. How presumptious of the nurse to think SHE knows better than YOU if you "need" pain meds!




Oh, and Klothos -- the only way *I* would choose to birth in a hospital was if the door to my room locked from the inside!

Kinsey
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#76 of 110 Old 06-27-2004, 09:44 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Greaseball
I guess people should ask their prospective docs if they play golf.

T
What is a "pampered chef"?
A company that does in-home sales parties, they sell some pretty neat kitchen gadgets.
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#77 of 110 Old 06-27-2004, 09:51 PM
 
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Originally Posted by mehndi mama
.......I had that happen, but I'm sorry to say that I actually took the CNM that said it up on the offer. It was my "grand experiment" to see if the outcome would change at all after having 2 homebirthed babies end up in NICU - one never making it back out (he lived 5 hours) and the other staying a week. And what did I get? Another week-long stay in the NICU......for reasons that the CNM told me if she had attended me at home would have been no cause for concern. Lovely experiment......taught me to stay the hell away from the freakin' hospital!
T
This is very interesting. My son was rushed to the NICU after a hosital birth, and I do feel they jumped the gun. I mean, all they did was observe him for 4 days and load him up on antibiotics that he didn't need that contributed to many health problems.........but, I'm not bitter or anything

Anyway, could you expand on what was "wrong" with your last child and why there would have been no cause for concern at home.

Thanks,
Amy
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#78 of 110 Old 06-27-2004, 10:51 PM
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This trend is frightening... I was the victim of it when my DD came into the world barely past 37 weeks. I was contracting regularly and was 4 cm and 90% when they told me that they would have to AROM because my labor wasn't progressing "fast enough". Sadly, I was not educated about this and my poor DD was born only 4 hours later. I am certain that her severe jaundice, feeding problems, awful reflux and ever lasting colic were at least partically caused by this abrupt eviction.

I have seen on mainstream boards this cavelier attitude of "being tired of being pregnant" leading to early inductions and it disgusts me.

The next time we will only be seeing an OB, if a MW determines me to be high risk again (I had PIH with my DD) and will be working with an experienced doula to ensure that we are not subjected to these dangerous medical decisions. We are hoping for an assisted homebirth next time to avoid all the nonsense all together.
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#79 of 110 Old 06-28-2004, 12:56 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Messy Nessie
I have seen on mainstream boards this cavelier attitude of "being tired of being pregnant" leading to early inductions and it disgusts me.
I see it on other boards all the time as well, and to me it just seems so incredibly selfish. I understand being tired of being pregnant, I honestly do (tomorrow is my due date and no sign of popping lol) but ya know what? Tough. You (general "you", not specific) wanted to have children (whether planned or not, since obviously there are other options available...like abortion and adoption) so you need to do what is best for the CHILD, and many times that means putting your own needs and wants aside. You're not 8 years old playing house, you don't get to pick and choose when you're the mommy. You're tired of being pregnant, but ya know what? If your baby wasn't ready to leave the womb, I'm sure you'd get tired of the NICU really fast.

Can ya tell I've been going over that rant in my head for a while? I would love to post that to the next woman on a mainstream board that says she's being induced because she's tired of being pregnant. My other favorite line is "I want my body back" (they apply this to the early breast-weaning of their babies too). Yep, I miss being able to bend over to tie my own shoes, but for the love of Pete, enjoy being pregnant while you can! Each pregnancy is a once in a lifetime experience and they look on it as a burden and it's just sad.

This is really upsetting to me, especially right now, knowing my pregnancy is almost over (and being asked repeatedly when I'm going to have the baby when it could be another 4 weeks!), reading sooooo many birth stories starting with inductions and ending is c-sections, getting blasted for trying to educate women on the risks of induction and just knowing that for every educated mother-to-be there are at least 10 more who outright refuse to educate themselves (let alone those who don't have the resources or those who don't know they're uneducated).

Hmm... I think I'm a little hormonal tonight...
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#80 of 110 Old 06-28-2004, 03:38 AM
 
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Anyway, could you expand on what was "wrong" with your last child and why there would have been no cause for concern at home.
Sure, Amy - She started out with "funny breathing" (CNM's words)....yeah, no kidding, they chopped the cord before she got going! So they took her to NICU, where they put her in a oxygen/vapor hood, and then took blood for a test. It came back with an elevated leucocyte count (which I believe had something to do with the prophylactic IV antibiotics we tried), so they started her on antibiotics. Her leuc count didn't go down, even with the abx, until I nursed her for the first time, when they finally "allowed" me to the next day.

This told me:
1) Her cord should not have been cut
2) She should not have been vigorously suctioned (I think that contributed to the funny breathing as well - she may have shock-aspirated some mucus)
3) She should have been breastfed ASAP, or at least spent more time on my chest so my breathing could help regulate hers
4) We should have stayed home.
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#81 of 110 Old 06-28-2004, 08:35 AM
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My dd was born at 36.5 weeks. Sadly, at the time I wasn't nearly as educated on things as I am now. I tried every natural induction method I was told. Eating pineapple, rasberry leaf tea, blue & black cohosh, evening primrose oil, even castor oil. If I was told it would help labor to start, I tried it. Andy was born at only 5lbs 12oz. She didn't know how to suck yet, so I had to pump and bottle feed for weeks, all the while, continually offering the breast and trying to teach her. She had colic, and reflux. I couldn't get her to sleep for anything. All in all, she was a very high needs baby.
(Although, really, what baby isn't high needs. Can't do it for themselves afterall. )

I'm convinced that all of Andy's problems are a result of her being born early. Majel was almost at the 43 week mark when he decided to come into the world, at home I might add. He was born weighing 9lbs 4oz, and he never had the problems that Andy had. Now granted all of this could simply be that he is a different child, but I like to think there is more to it than that.
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#82 of 110 Old 06-28-2004, 11:12 AM
 
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The flip side to this is people's horrified reactions when I mention that ds was born at 42 weeks and weighed 8lbs. 14ozs. (which I don't think is that big).
They can't seem to understand why I would wait til he was ready instead of getting induced.
My MIL kept telling me about the horrors of overdue babies during the last 2 weeks (she's an RN).

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#83 of 110 Old 06-28-2004, 11:32 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Oh, and Klothos -- the only way *I* would choose to birth in a hospital was if the door to my room locked from the inside!
i can't believe i forgot that too!

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I see it on other boards all the time as well, and to me it just seems so incredibly selfish. I understand being tired of being pregnant, I honestly do (tomorrow is my due date and no sign of popping lol) but ya know what? Tough. You (general "you", not specific) wanted to have children (whether planned or not, since obviously there are other options available...like abortion and adoption) so you need to do what is best for the CHILD, and many times that means putting your own needs and wants aside. You're not 8 years old playing house, you don't get to pick and choose when you're the mommy. You're tired of being pregnant, but ya know what? If your baby wasn't ready to leave the womb, I'm sure you'd get tired of the NICU really fast.
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#84 of 110 Old 06-28-2004, 11:35 AM
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Originally Posted by 3 little birds
My MIL kept telling me about the horrors of overdue babies during the last 2 weeks (she's an RN).
What is with this? The PA at my OBs office did the same thing. Scared me silly because my brother and I came nearly a month "late" and were huge babies 10+ lbs. I was nervous about having a large baby and the PA told me that they wouldn't "let me" go past 40 weeks 2 days to avoid that possibility.

Kai- I did the same thing. Because of what the PA told me, I was pertified of going "overdue" and did everything I could to induce labor naturally. Unfortunately it worked too well and my DD had a lot of the same issues as yours. I carried a lot of guilt and still do to some extent. I try to soothe the guilt by telling myself that I know better now and I will do better next time. And I harbor a lot of anger towards the physicians and nurses around me for making me so afraid of something natural. I feel duped, yk...
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#85 of 110 Old 06-28-2004, 04:07 PM
 
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I was induced with DS at 38w 2d because he was supposedly SO HUGE. Mmm hmm. I was not dilated at all, so you can imagine the cascade of interventions.

Cytotec
Pitocin
Epidural
Constant monitoring, flat on my back
failure to progress after 33 hrs
c-section
wet lungs due to c/s
NICU
breastfeeding failure
PPD

It is horrifying to me that I didnt know this would happen, but I blindly trusted my doctor. I will NEVER let this happen again. But FTM's and moms who have had inductions go ok dont want to hear it.

Oh, how big was my giant child? 7 pounds 12 ounces. And posterior too, which they didnt mention till he was born. Gee ya think that might've had anything to do with my FTP? Thanks for telling me so we could tryo something to help him turn! GRRRRRRR

editing to add- that having a baby in the NICU is *horrible* and my son wasnt even in any sort of incubator. He was just in a bassinet and had an IV of antibiotics. The separation from him was so depressing and crushing that I still to this day cannot think about it without crying. I dont know if I will ever get over it. And yet people risk it everyday with these stupid inductions.
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#86 of 110 Old 06-28-2004, 04:19 PM - Thread Starter
 
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i'm 38 weeks, 2 days today! i can't imagine being induced right now for any reason.

even though most days i'm hot and uncomfortable (and have to pee all the time)... i'd much rather wait a few more weeks until this little sprite is ready to come than try to force her out before she's ready. as i told my SO a couple of days ago ~ ovens don't toss the muffins out before they're done cooking, yk? or... you wouldn't take a batch of muffins out of the oven just because they *look* nice... you take them out when they're all done inside.

i'm so sorry to hear about your experience. s
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#87 of 110 Old 06-28-2004, 06:46 PM
 
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In this malpractice happy society, you would think that OB's would be scared to induce early for fear of being sued over a preterm baby!
As an obnurse, you probably already know that as long as inducing labor before forty weeks or term is the standard of care in the medical community with the full blessing of ACOG and the insurance companies, there is no real fear of being sued over the birtha and expensive care of a preemie.

I would think that the insurance companies would not allow this policy as care in those NICU's is very expensive, and they often pick up the tab for it.

Then again, no one is asking little old me for my two cents worth, so oh well!

"The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie, deliberate, contrived and dishonest, but the myth, persistent, persuasive and unrealistic."
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#88 of 110 Old 06-28-2004, 07:11 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Greaseball
That's so funny when docs think their hospital is just like home. :LOL As if pretty pictures on the walls and nice bedspreads are the reason we want homebirths!
In one of his books, Dr. Robert Mendelsohn put forth a scenario in which the lighting suddenly changes, wallpaper rolls off the walls, the pictures disappear, the nice homey furniture morphs into hospital paraphenalia, and the bed in the ABC* or L&D room rises and breaks in half into a delivery table or operating table so the doctor can deliver his raison d'etre, the Caesarean Section.

I always like the home court advantage. Any athlete will tell you that it is a true advantage to their performance. Why would a pregnant woman be any different?

Just ask the Detroit Pistons!!

*ABC - alternative birthing center.

"The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie, deliberate, contrived and dishonest, but the myth, persistent, persuasive and unrealistic."
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#89 of 110 Old 06-28-2004, 07:28 PM
 
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... "in fact I even asked my doctor about babies coming early. He said that new studies show that a baby born between weeks 37 and 39 do better than babies born between weeks 40 and 42."...
Un-freaking-believeable! Truly, unbelieveable! Did this woman ever think to ask for the study/studies in which this was proven? And if there was a study or studies to prove this "factoid", who paid for the study to be done? Over how long a period of time was this study done? What/where was it done? Who was included in the study?

How arrogant of ob's to think they can improve on nature.

Quote:
i think that's exactly the problem.
Thank you klothos

"The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie, deliberate, contrived and dishonest, but the myth, persistent, persuasive and unrealistic."
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#90 of 110 Old 06-28-2004, 07:44 PM
 
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Alittle T, but germaine to the discussion at hand...

As an elementary school teacher, it is my obligation to warn all of you mothers and mothers to be that if you want your child to be a candidate for special educational services in the public schools one of the questions you are asked is at the time you enroll your child in school is -

Quote:
"Was your child born prematurely or before term?"
Therefore if you are foolish enough to allow some obstetrican to induce labor before forty weeks, your child will never be considered to be a candidate for the "Gifted" or "Enrichment Program" since educational psychologists are trained in the educational departments of universities to believe that a child born before term can NEVER be considered for the "Gifted" or "Enrichment Program".

However, if your child is behind in his studies and is a candidate for an IEP or Resource in the public schools, this is one of the questions that you WILL BE ASKED and it is a major consideration as far as the educational experts are concerned!

Where will that obstetrician be who coerced you into being induced at 37 weeks? There will be a new and improved obstetrical trend in five to ten years from now, after they have damaged your child.

You are going to live with the decision and the child for a long time after your baby is born!

A further side note: doctors are actually technically liable for the damage they do to your child until they are eighteen, if the damage can unequivocally be proven to be the doctor's sole responsibility. This is very difficult to do, as you can imagine, but it is true.

"The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie, deliberate, contrived and dishonest, but the myth, persistent, persuasive and unrealistic."
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