Loved my intrathecal! No natural childbirth for me EVER again! - Page 3 - Mothering Forums

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#61 of 225 Old 03-31-2005, 08:02 PM
 
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Originally Posted by pamamidwife
we don't think we deserve to be in pain in our culture. we take pills for EVERYTHING.

not to mention the fact that women who are sexually abused will oftentimes have more traumatic dealings with birth because of their abuse. some find natural birth empowering, others feel like they're being victimized all over again.
This is what I was thinking exactly! I think that the OP was not really sure of what to expect. Perhaps never having been around birth before, & the way some describe their births, that is what she was expecting. Her expectations were high & her reality was not near them. Also we (most americans) come from the era where Pain=Bad/Negative. There IS a pill for EVERYTHING, and we are bombarded with these images constantly!

I was also thinking something along the lines of abuse in her past as well. (Could be completley wrong) Sensations of birth are incredible & that is why women are so vulnerable during this time. I am sad she did not feel empowered afterward. I am sad that she felt such negative feelings to such a powerful event.

Cristina - "If you find it in your heart to care for somebody else, you will have succeeded." Maya Angelou
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#62 of 225 Old 03-31-2005, 08:14 PM
 
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Ramlah what you're describing is exactly how I felt. I was 100% sure I was tearing horribly into my urinary tract. It's too bad that my only natural labor was absolutely my best labor but my 2nd birth which was medicated for last hour or so was hands down my best birth. And like you I was ready to go. Did not fear birth had every confidence in my body--too bad my medwife didn't. It is good to hear that it went better when you were upright. I'm hoping those changes make a big difference with this birth.
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#63 of 225 Old 03-31-2005, 08:19 PM
 
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As a momma who's done it both ways, I can totally understand the OP's point of view.

I wanted a natural childbirth with my first. I was Bradley trained, had a great coach of a husband, great midwives. After 40+ hours of labor and stalling in transition at 9 cm, I ended up with an epidural. For the longest time, I was always so bummed out that I couldn't go the distance after making it so far. I wanted to feel that urge to push, and feel that whoosh as the baby comes out.

So I went for natural childbirth again for my second baby, and it went faster this time and I was able to do it. I had a labor pool, I was in complete control, and silently dealt with my contractions all the way until transition. Then the pain was excruciating. I wanted to claw my way out of my own skin and run away. I never felt that urge to push like I'd always heard about, didn't feel pressure, just overwhelming pain. And when my son came out, all I was thinking about was that the hurting was over. I was beaten and spent. I didn't even want to hold my baby until I felt better.

With my first, I was coherent and euphoric, uncontrollably giddy, and I swept my baby girl up onto my chest and loved on her immediately. With my natural childbirth, I was waaay more out of it and couldn't even bear to hold my son right away.

It really gave me a new perspective on my first birth. I no longer feel sad that I had that epidural. And now I sorta wish that I'd gotten one for my second birth.

Sure, I'm proud of myself for doing it. There's something about knowing that I CAN do it. But I wish that I enjoyed it more. I didn't.

Mommas all experience childbirth differently. Some women's bodies are built to handle delivering with little to no pain. And some of us apparently have way too many dang pain receptors in all the wrong places!

You can't knock a momma down for her own experiences - they're her own, and she's entitled to have an opinion about them. Even on MDC - sure, it's about all things natural, but natural is not always pretty. It's okay to say that.
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#64 of 225 Old 03-31-2005, 08:19 PM
 
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Wasabi- Thank you! Me too!
I feel like I learned so much from DD's birth, it has really helped me feel more prepared for this one.
I think my new midwife will be a much better match too!

I love to think of a birth where pushing is a pleasant, brief time that leads right to having a baby in my arms!

DIYer mama to DD 11/00 and DS 6/05- both intact, naturally!
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#65 of 225 Old 03-31-2005, 08:21 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by CaraboosMama
As a newbie to this site I was really surprised to read the title of the OP. I had the opposite experience...I had hoped to deliver w/o pain medication...but then after 4 weeks of staving off pre-term labor, my water broke & then...no regular contractions! I finally consented to induction after trying some natural methods & I really wish I hadn't. Overall, my birth experience wasn't "BAD" (I have my beautiful daugher to show for it, after all!) but I felt like I wasn't as "present" in the whole thing as I could have been. Thankfully no complications from the intrathecal (no tearing, no problems for dd) but I hope to do a homebirth the next time.
This was pretty nearly exactly my experience. (I didn't have pre-term labor, just the part about the water breaking and no contractions. Also the part about trying many different natural methods to get labor to start before agreeing to the induction.) I have not been able to find a "natural" answer to what I could have done differently to make labor begin.

I think my birth experience was actually kind of bad. My son was alert at birth but had a lot of trouble latching on, so I went from a very stressful birth to a stressful week with little sleep trying to get nursing started. We were very lucky and are nursing still!

I wonder whether midwives have researched this. We aren't the only people who have had this, even though it's not "normal." I wouldn't mind starting yet another thread about it, even though some of the comments I got the last time were pretty judgemental of me for agreeing to having labor induced. (I did wait 40 hours after the water broke, and as you know, there is quite a strong element of risk involved!) I just wonder how many people here have had this experience.

Sorry to go off topic here.

Divorced mom of one awesome boy born 2-3-2003.
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#66 of 225 Old 03-31-2005, 08:24 PM
 
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I think the OP needs to examine her own reasons for choosing a homebirth in the first place.

The only reason a woman should have a homebirth is because she wants it, no one else.

"The great enemy of the truth is very often not the lie, deliberate, contrived and dishonest, but the myth, persistent, persuasive and unrealistic."
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#67 of 225 Old 03-31-2005, 08:24 PM
 
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I had a homebirth on February 13th, too.. ... very very painful, but I survived. I did tear though and had to go to the hospital for repair. I had an intrathecal there and it was HEAVEN! Such a relief after so many hours in pain. Those 3 or 4 hours that I was numb from the waist down were such a relief.
I feel the same way the OP feels for the most part. I am very proud of myself for my natural birth, but I wouldn't do it again. My husband wouldn't support my decision to do it again. I think that's what she was getting at. You can still be a great AP mom even if you choose to not labor in pain.
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#68 of 225 Old 03-31-2005, 08:27 PM
 
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You can still be a great AP mom even if you choose to not labor in pain.
ITA.

Half-marathon running Mommy to 3 spunky girls and 1 sweet boy. Spending my days and nights where my kids need me most- at home with them!!

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#69 of 225 Old 03-31-2005, 08:45 PM
 
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AmandaBL, I see what you are saying I was just pointing out that if this is her 'home' message board then she should be able to post about her birth even if it is mainstream style. I admit the title is a bit uhh trollish...but..
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#70 of 225 Old 03-31-2005, 09:12 PM
 
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Originally Posted by ramlah
-Can I ask those of you who have had fast labors, was the pain more overwhelming than with your other labors?
I found my fast labor with DS2 (approx 2 hours total) VERY VERY overwhelming -- the contrax came hard and fast, right on top of one another with no break, no predictable pattern, and an evil evil woman telling me to "be quiet, you're scaring people" after she punched more holes than swiss cheese in my arm trying to place an IV, that my CNM and OB had agreed I didn't have to have, then sticking tape that I'm allergic to onto me against my protests.... resulting in welts, swelling and a miserable rash on my arm DURING labor. If it weren't for that woman, I'd probably be hospital birthing this time :LOL And ordering me off the toilet even though that's the only place I could get hold of my labor AT ALL.

But really --even without that evil woman (who was replaced by a much more wonderful nurse after I cursed her sight and ordered her out of presence, never to be seen again) it was HARD, and scary and NOT what I was "prepared" for (by a 10-12 hour back labor with posterior delivery of DS1)
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#71 of 225 Old 03-31-2005, 10:36 PM
 
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Pretty OT but that last post made me think of this. I think I'm the only person I've ever heard of who didn't speak negatively of back labor! I've always viewed it (and I'm just speaking for myself here) as a plus. Even right after the birth - yeah I thought the pain was really really hard - but the thing about it for me (which was completely unexpected) that I found to be an assest in how I coped was that the pain NEVER subsided. Isn't that weird - that I'd view that as a good thing? One of the things I took with me into labor from my Bradley classes was how women tend to make the mistake of using their downtime btwn contrax to dread what's coming next rather than to take the time during the contrax to anticipate relief. For me, there never was any relief - ever - and I thought that it helped me b/c I didn't fall into the trap of dreading the next contrax! :LOL But I've always been weird like that.

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#72 of 225 Old 03-31-2005, 11:18 PM
 
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Originally Posted by ramlah

-Can I ask those of you who have had fast labors, was the pain more overwhelming than with your other labors?
My 2 fastest, 45 minutes for my third and 20 minutes for my sixth, were painless. If it weren't for the pressure and feeling like my butt was going to explode, I wouldn't have known I was in labour. (In fact, with my third, my mother pointed it out to me as we were having tea in the morning. "Are you in labour?" "Um, no, why?" "I think I'll send for the midwife anyway." I had the baby 45 minutes later. :LOL )

With my fifth, if there was another option open to me, I would have been to off to a hospital in a heartbeat. My midwife probably would have packed me up herself, after trying to push a 9 1/2 pound, posterior, military presenting baby out for 5 and a half hours. When his 15 inch big head finally broke my coccyx, he was able to be born. Ouch. I may not have had another (the 20 minute reward birth) homebirth if there was the option of a nice, clean hospital with pain medications and running water :LOL .

But anyhoo, as a homebirth midwife my self, I have no gripe with pain meds per se, but the over use of them and the pervading fear of having to experience a natural birth that is conveyed to the women. (Are you ready for that epidural yet? Get it quick, it'll get worse and then you can't have one!) Pain meds, when used judiciously and for the right reasons, are wonderful. So is any other technological tool; ultrasounds, cesereans, etc. We live in a fear driven culture, and that fear is used to make tons of money for certain sectors. It over rides good judgement, and that is scary.
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#73 of 225 Old 03-31-2005, 11:27 PM
 
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Originally Posted by pamamidwife

while it's not uncommon to think that an exhausted uterus is one that does not contract effectively, i don't think that pain caused deaths. i would also venture to say that we are a culture of people that avoid pain at all costs, people that whine alot about pain, people who want to be martyrs, and people that want to "one up" others about their suffering. this is true. i've seen women from other cultures birth and it's VERY different. we don't think we deserve to be in pain in our culture. we take pills for EVERYTHING.

so, hundreds of years ago, it was very different. women just birthed. there was no martyrdom that came from how great your pain is. you just did it. this attitude probably allowed many women not to FEAR birth as much as it is here in this country.
Ha! You notice that too?
It always amazes me that women here love to talk about how long, how hard, and how dangerous their births were. When I was growing up in Jamaica, and when I was having my babies, women boasted about how they worked right up until it was time to go lay down and push. "Me gyal, me wash three line of clothes, raked up the yard, cooked dinner, washed the dishes, moved the goats, bathed the other children and put them to bed, ironed their school uniforms, and called the midwife. Me have baby soon after she reach! Thank Jesus me make it through alive!" :LOL
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#74 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 12:16 AM
 
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Originally Posted by USAmma
However this board is a place that, in the spirit of MDC, promotes natural choices over medical intervention. The epidural has a lot of risks. It would be like me going to the bfing forum and starting a thread on how great formula feeding is. It just doesn't make sense here at MDC.

Yup epidurals are not all magic they can and do go vascular anyone else here ever have that complication? I did and I survived it but some people are not so lucky.
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#75 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 12:19 AM
 
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Originally Posted by sugarbeth
Mommas all experience childbirth differently. Some women's bodies are built to handle delivering with little to no pain. And some of us apparently have way too many dang pain receptors in all the wrong places
Sure we do.. but bottom line I totally disagree that some womyn are better at birthing than others.. pain is largely societal conditioning and I stand firm in my opinion that attendants cause pain.. period! its all about fight or flight.
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#76 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 12:41 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Black Orchid
I can really relate to the OP, although I really REALLY hope that I can have a natural birth with the next baby. I tried, I really did... but after 3 days of back labor and just terrible, horrible contractions I broke down and asked for an epidural... and I felt so freaking guilty about it. I blamed all of the subsequent problems she had (jaundice, nursing issues, colic, reflux) on myself for having an epi Lemme tell ya, that is NOT a good way to spend your PP days and doesn't help avoid PPD.

!

Haven't read the whole thread, but wanted to comment...I had a "natural, pain free birth", and my baby still was jaundiced, had colic, and still has reflux issues....please don't hold guilt there!!

~C~

ETA: Pain free??? I meant drug-free....LOL...
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#77 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 12:51 AM
 
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Originally Posted by sevenkids
"Me gyal, me wash three line of clothes, raked up the yard, cooked dinner, washed the dishes, moved the goats, bathed the other children and put them to bed, ironed their school uniforms, and called the midwife. Me have baby soon after she reach! Thank Jesus me make it through alive!" :LOL
That is classic! I love it!

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#78 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 01:04 AM
 
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so let me ask a question ... how do you think the use of drugs during childbirth affects the mother/baby bond, if at all? i wonder because i know that natural childbirth releases hormones into the body that make us want to mother our babies and don't drugs interfere with that process? i do understand that many of the women on MDC have made the choice to AP regardless of their birth decisions but what about for the general population? i'm curious how this might affect mothering and what others think.
mandi

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#79 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 01:05 AM
 
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Originally Posted by love_homebirthing
I think I'm the only person I've ever heard of who didn't speak negatively of back labor!... the thing about it for me (which was completely unexpected) that I found to be an assest in how I coped was that the pain NEVER subsided...
Well, that's one way of looking at it! :LOL For me personally, I feel like I can handle anything as long as I don't have to face back labor again.
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#80 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 01:12 AM
 
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Originally Posted by sevenkids
Ha! You notice that too?... "Me gyal, me wash three line of clothes, raked up the yard, cooked dinner, washed the dishes, moved the goats, bathed the other children and put them to bed, ironed their school uniforms, and called the midwife. Me have baby soon after she reach! Thank Jesus me make it through alive!" :LOL
The day my last baby was born I had painted the living room of my rental house...I was trying to even out the ceiling, but the paint simply would not smooth out...I tried to open another five gallon container of paint, but I could not do it as I had "dropped" and my center of balance had changed. I walked to the school to get my three children walked them home, fed them, helped them with their homework, put them down to bed, got myself ready for bed, laid down, and then realized that I was not going to be going to sleep for a while - I had another job to do...deliver my fourth baby!! I put out a snack, boiled water, called the midwife, gor out the birth kit, filled the bathtub with warm water, and set up the camera.

I was having a baby!!

He was born at 3:06 a.m., he was welcomed by his older siblings and I made breakfast for them before taking them to school ... he was show and tell for his siblings that day!

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#81 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 01:27 AM
 
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This thread is getting pretty OT but I wanted to add that I'm glad to see it here.

Quote:
The contention that all pain in childbirth is created by attendants, or that birth isn't painful (or shouldn't be if you do it "right"), or that all of us are capable of achieving a natural birth, is a little heavy-handed and dismissive, and ultimately hurts people more than helps them
ITA. I planned a homebirth with my ds and stayed at home, in active labor for 15 hrs, stuck at 4cm. I decided to transfer to the hospital for Nubain and ds was born four hours later. 'Violent' is the best word I can think of to describe the entire situation. I blamed myself for a lot of this, but, really, my expectations were unreal. I had read so many NFL birthstories and Ina May books that I really thought the pain would be more manageable. Add to that the fact that my mother told me (and still asserts) that her labor was no worse than menstrual cramps, and I was setting myself up for disappointment. A 'can do' attitude is helpful for oneself, but when advocated for so loudly, I think it can be harmful as well, especially to first time moms.

I've been through it once before and I hope that that knowledge will help guide me through the upcoming birth. But, before having ds, I could never have even imagined that kind of pain existed. I'm glad to see such a frank discussion of it here on MDC.
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#82 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 01:35 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Marsupialmuma
Sure we do.. but bottom line I totally disagree that some womyn are better at birthing than others.. pain is largely societal conditioning and I stand firm in my opinion that attendants cause pain.. period! its all about fight or flight.
I think this comment is arrogant and naive. My labour hurt like , and the pain was not caused by my attitude or my birth attendants.
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#83 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 01:57 AM
 
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Originally Posted by famousmockngbrd
Well, that's one way of looking at it! :LOL For me personally, I feel like I can handle anything as long as I don't have to face back labor again.
I had back labor with #1 and #2;



#3 was easy I earned him!

so was #4!

I deserved it! I quit while I was ahead.

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#84 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 02:07 AM
 
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My faster (4.5 hours) unmedicated underwater(!) birth hurt waaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyy less than my 40 hours of back labour hospital transfer from a planned homebirth.

Back labour was AWFUL


I do agree though that this thread is out of place here. I DIDN't "make it through" my first experience unmedicated and it was the most god-awful, horrible excruciating pain I could imagine, yet I still planned to do it again!!! And did! And it was amazing and wonderful and still hurt like hell, just a lesser circle of hell :LOL

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#85 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 02:52 AM
 
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Originally Posted by thismama
I think this comment is arrogant and naive. My labour hurt like , and the pain was not caused by my attitude or my birth attendants.
I totally agree. And I actually thought it was pretty misogynistic to say, ironically.
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#86 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 03:28 AM
 
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Originally Posted by applejuice
The day my last baby was born I had painted the living room of my rental house...I was trying to even out the ceiling, but the paint simply would not smooth out...I tried to open another five gallon container of paint, but I could not do it as I had "dropped" and my center of balance had changed. I walked to the school to get my three children walked them home, fed them, helped them with their homework, put them down to bed, got myself ready for bed, laid down, and then realized that I was not going to be going to sleep for a while - I had another job to do...deliver my fourth baby!! I put out a snack, boiled water, called the midwife, gor out the birth kit, filled the bathtub with warm water, and set up the camera.

I was having a baby!!

He was born at 3:06 a.m., he was welcomed by his older siblings and I made breakfast for them before taking them to school ... he was show and tell for his siblings that day!

This makes me smile! :LOL I remember when I had my 6 year old.. I had had a very busy day with the kids, had gone out to run errands that night.. picked up a couple of things for the "impending" baby..lol she was due a day later but since I had never ever gone on my date or anything earlier than 2 weeks after it I thought I was good to go.. came home was walking up the walkway and my water broke! LOL ... went in hung out a while then decided to go to the hospital to have her (keep in mind this had been a UP) and had her a few hours later .. came home stopped off at the grocery store.. ran a few more errands before getting some sleep an then the next day made it to my shopping "date" with my mom with new baby in tow .. you should have seen the look on her face when she saw me show up with a baby :LOL it was priceless!

I don't think I would have the energy for that these days.. but man I was only 25 then
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#87 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 03:31 AM
 
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Originally Posted by thismama
I think this comment is arrogant and naive. My labour hurt like , and the pain was not caused by my attitude or my birth attendants.
You can disagree all you want.. I think your reply to me is arrogant and rude I stand firm I have birthed 8 babies in varying places and headspaces.. I also am drawing on the collective experience of other groups I belong too.. to each their own.. birth was not designed as a flawed process .. attendants were not part of the intitial plan for evolution

We can debate it until the cows come home.. I am not attacking your views so do NOT attack mine.

"mi·sog·y·nis·tic ( P ) Pronunciation Key (m-sj-nstk) also mi·sog·y·nous (-sj-ns)
adj.
Of or characterized by a hatred of women"

Oh my gosh I am : at this how on earth can you misconstrue my comments about pain being societal.. and attendants causing undue performance anxiety and pain due to their interventions as misogynistic.. please.. if you want to pick apart my post make sense about it ok?
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#88 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 04:26 AM
 
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I haven't read all five pages of this, I started from the beginning thinking there were only two pages but when I saw there were more I skipped to the last page! There seem to be alot of things being brought up.

I haven't been through it yet but just wanted to say that the wonderful homebirth stories I hear don't have me thinking my birth will be so easy by any means. I know it is gonna hurt. I may freak out, something could go wrong. I know these things but choose to go for the homebirth anyway. I think in some circles hospital AND home birth can be portrayed to be something it isn't. I don't think anyone should take anybody's word on what it was like or what to expect exactly. Seems to me birth is so different for everyone for many reasons.

I tend to think that some women will do best at home and some best at the hospital. I am naturally really against going to the hospital myself and very uncomfortable around docs and the way they do things. I'm very modest about my body and don't believe I could give it my all in a hospital setting with nurses and docs around.

I think some women are more comfortable with all the things that come along with the hospital birth experience and thus will have less pain there. I don't think anyone can deny that stress and tension causes more pain. That is simply fact. So if the thought of homebirth stresses a person out and they were convinced by others to do it cuz it is better then I can see them having an awful expiernce. Same thing goes for the hospital. I can see how people can end up feeling duped.

I see women get told downright lies about drugs and their effects and many other procedures and I feel they definately got duped! Everyone needs to do their own research and make their own choices. It is sad there are so many who try only to influence for their own selfish reasons. I know people like that and it isn't a cool thing to do.

I have a lot of respect for the home birth community compared to the hospital birth community. Thus far I have been told untrue things only by the hospital birth communtiy. The home birthers have been completely honest with me and for me that is one of the many reasons I want to be a part of it.

Stay at home wife to Jason for 7 years Mama to Larissa Mae 2 years old :, Gavin Clay 7 months :, and Neveah Ann April 24, 2005 to July 13, 2007 ED for my food allergic babe. :::
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#89 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 04:47 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Wow! Ok, I'm here. I didn't expect this kind of response at all. Wow. I don't even know where to begin. I just posted what, yesterday? This is the first time I've had to sit down and come back here. Look, I'm not even sure what a troll is - someone who just posts on a forum to cause trouble or something? That's what it sounds like.

Anyway, I'm a poster here, I used to post under ilovemybaby, but I lost the password and you know how that goes...had to get a new name. But, I love Mothering and this forum - I've learned a lot here. As Pam said, I felt it was a safe place to post. I've received so much support here in the past.

I posted in great detail before about my first birth experience. The thread went on and on and I received a lot of help and concern. Someone even recommended a birth trauma counselor for me in another state, and she and I had a few phone conversations that were helpful. That thread was very overwhelming for me. I ended up copying the whole thing and saving it on my computer.

I felt I could post this on Mothering because of my history here, with that thread I posted about my first birth.

Also, I remember reading in the Mothering magazine an article talking about med/no meds for childbirth. And it said something about the "compassionate use of medications". It really touched me because of my first birth experience. I thought that if Mothering could advocate the compassionate use of meds then it would be ok to post here, especially since I tried the homebirth.

Some of you had questions about my first birth. About my option to go to the hospital - I would not have made it in time. My baby came fast. We just stayed home and I did the best I could.

I know it was my choice to be home. But I made that choice thinking that water would help the pain, based on a lot of stuff I read. I didn't know that my own personal pain was going to be so horrific. I felt like I was being raped or drawn and quartered or something. By the time I realized the pain was too much, we were in the thick of it and I was almost 10cm.

I know that childbirth pain is common, and I knew about it before hand, but all I can say is that for me, it was absolute torture.

Yea, I'm still angry about the first birth. I'm mad, sad, frustrated, etc. That will probably never go away and I'm fine with that. It's normal and I don't need to squash my feelings down. So, if you got some of that from my post, it's definitely still there.

I'm just soooo glad, soooo grateful I was able to have a great second birth. I took control of my birth choices the second time. Yes, I made my own choices the first time, but without all the information I needed.
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#90 of 225 Old 04-01-2005, 06:35 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Marsupialmuma
You can disagree all you want.. I think your reply to me is arrogant and rude I stand firm I have birthed 8 babies in varying places and headspaces.. I also am drawing on the collective experience of other groups I belong too.. to each their own.. birth was not designed as a flawed process .. attendants were not part of the intitial plan for evolution

We can debate it until the cows come home.. I am not attacking your views so do NOT attack mine.
You are attacking my lived experience, and the experience of many other mamas on this thread, when you say that the amount of pain we experienced is directly related to the birth attendants present when we had our babes. I am saying that FOR ME THIS IS NOT TRUE. If it was true for you, that's fine and valid, but you'd run into less difficulty with me if you owned your own experience.

And I don't buy for one second that attendants "were not part of the initial plan for evolution." This mama is part of evolution, and she was designed to have LOTS of birth attendants.
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