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#31 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 02:23 AM
 
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We did the oral vitamin K with dd, but I'm going to do more research on it this time around... I would not do the vitamin K injection. Only if I was cold, dead, and buried would anyone come close to a son of mine's penis with a knife. Dh would have to be cold, dead, and buried as well because he would just as soon cut off his own foreskin as the foreskin of his child.

I will forever be grateful to my MIL for two things (other than birthing my dh, of course) -

1. She breastfed him for 3.5 years - dh remembers nursing and thus is totally on board with extended bfing of our children.

2. She didn't chop off any healthy, functional parts of his genitalia when he was too little to give his own consent. She left the decision of whether to be circumcised or not to the owner of the penis - my dh. He is very grateful to her for this as well :

My MIL was a wonderful woman, and I wish she was still alive so that I could thank her personally for those two things. I didn't know about the extended breastfeeding before she passed away. We got married right before she passed away and it would have been weird to bring up the circumcision thing before we were married : Nor did I know the true extent of what circumcision actually entailed at that time...

love and peace.

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: Circumcision can never be undone :
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#32 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 02:30 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Gitti View Post
Please don't post that until you have researched the vaccine. Thank you.
I have to agree with the other poster, I would be far more concerned with someone cutting off their sons penis than getting the VitK shot. DS#1 got the Vit K but DS#2 didn't. I didn't think it was worth the risk once I did my research. We don't vax at all anymore so not getting the Vit K was the obvious choice.

OP Come down to the Case Against Circumcision forum and browse around a bit. Post any questions or concerns you may have. But before you go through with it, do some research. I had my first son circumcised because I didn't realize that it didn't need to be done. Thankfully I found the forum here and #2 was left intact.
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#33 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 04:43 AM
 
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How could anyone be more concerned with what you're injecting INTO your son's body than what you're cutting OFF him?

If vaxes are harmful because they're interfering with a normal immune system, circumcision is equally harmful because it removes a part of the body that's specifically designed to be there. It has a purpose -- multiple functions, in fact. It's highly sensitive -- the most sensitive part of the penis, in fact.

A study just published in the British Journal of Urology this month demonstrates that the five most sensitive parts of the penis are all found on the foreskin -- and that the most sensitive part of a circumcised penis is the circumcision scar.

It is not possible to give a baby a gentle welcome into the world by strapping him down, inserting a probe into his penis, ripping away the adhered foreskin from the glans, crushing the most sensitive part of his body, and then slicing it off.

Compared to that pain, the pain of an injection is a butterfly kiss.

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#34 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 06:43 AM
 
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I never was even offered a vit K injection, so it's clearly not necessary, and absolutely NO-ONE would be cutting anything off my baby either.

Circumcision is a barbaric mutilation that belongs in antiquity where it started. I can't get over how anyone could call themselves "civilised" and still support it. Only in America....

Are you planning on cutting up your daughters and giving them vit K jabs to stop them bleeding to death too? (After all, circumcised women are 25% less likely to get HIV, and most of those that have had it done are very much in favour of it for their daughters).
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#35 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 11:01 AM
 
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I never was even offered a vit K injection, so it's clearly not necessary, and absolutely NO-ONE would be cutting anything off my baby either.
Is the vitamin K shot given in the UK (I'm assuming that's where you're from and where you're refering to)?
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#36 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 12:48 PM
 
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Is the vitamin K shot given in the UK (I'm assuming that's where you're from and where you're refering to)?
Yes, apparently it's been recommended since around 1997 to prevent the 1 in 10,000 cases of HDN. I delivered before that, so it wasn't offered.

Unfortunately I think we're going the way of the US with shots which may do more harm than good, most of which are completely unnecessary in small children.

The only thing that might save us is the fact that it costs the health service money - no one pushes any medical procedure over here, they're too worried about where the funding is coming from.
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#37 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 03:50 PM
 
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well maybe in the UK untreated is 1 in 10,000-- someone else has quoted 20 in 100,000 there is a recent Chinese study with a rate of 3.27 per 1,000-- the info behind the studies in NY state is closer to the Chinese rate--- and I am going to have to say in over the years and homebirth midwifery not giving oral or a shot of vitamin K- the numbers of babies I have come across in other mw's practices that have had HDN, LHDN is most likely , 1-3 per 1000--

surgery like a circ can lead to hdn, and is sited in the lit as a source of hdn bleeding, if it doesn't cause a bleed then it still uses up stores and can be a cause of late HDN most common time to be found would be at about 40 days
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#38 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 04:15 PM
 
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There is no way I would circ... EVER. I'm fine with the Vit k.

: on what PP have said.

Please do not circ your son.
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#39 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 06:48 PM
 
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Originally Posted by tamagotchi View Post
DH's dad says that was the main reason that Russian Jews, like his family, stopped circing in the postwar period, because they were afraid of future pogroms where they would be killed because of that.
I have also heard a suggestion that part of the push to spread circing in the US was to make it harder for Jews to be distinguished, as a preventative in case of similar discrimination here.

I don't know if there is any truth to that theory.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gitti
Quote:
Originally Posted by maxsmum
I'd be far more concerned about the circumcision than the vitamin K shot. we did not do either of them
Please don't post that until you have researched the vaccine. Thank you.
Please note that she said SHE would be more concerned about the circing. She didn't say that anyone else had to have the same concerns as her. We all weigh and rank risks differently.

Leigh, mama to Rostislav homeborn Aug 9 2007, and Oksana homeborn Feb 24 2011.
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#40 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 07:25 PM
 
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I hope I don't get yelled at for posting this but I actually was curious. If you knew someone was going to circ. (ie couldn't be talked out of it, religious reasons or medical reasons-not that I can think of any medical reasons that would be there at birth but theoretically), would it be better to give the Vit. K shot or should the shot still not be given? What is the lesser of the evils? Is it better to wait till after the 7th day when the levels are naturally higher in the body and would that make the shot a mute point?

I hope I don't get yelled at but I'm really quite curious. What would you consider the lesser of the evils? I know that obviously, the preference would be no shot and no circ (MDC has a stance against RIC, as I'm sure we're all aware) but what if for whatever reason that wasn't the situation...

Again, please don't yell and abuse a curious poster....TIA!
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#41 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 07:31 PM
 
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Personally I would say it's better to wait.

-Angela
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#42 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 09:15 PM
 
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Personally I would say it's better to wait.

-Angela
In other words, if you wait the question is considered mute since their own levels are high enough. Did I understand that correctly?
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#43 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 09:21 PM
 
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In other words, if you wait the question is considered mute since their own levels are high enough. Did I understand that correctly?


-Angela
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#44 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 09:34 PM
 
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If they were doing it for religious reasons then they would more than likely be waiting until the 8th day anyhow which would make the vit K shot unnecessary

There are no medical reasons for circumcision at birth Frostbite, gangrene, and cancer don't tend to happen on the foreskin in brand new babies :

love and peace.

mama to two girls and due in November!
: Circumcision can never be undone :
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#45 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 09:40 PM
 
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Originally Posted by trmpetplaya View Post
There are no medical reasons for circumcision at birth Frostbite, gangrene, and cancer don't tend to happen on the foreskin in brand new babies :

love and peace.


:

-Angela
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#46 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 10:24 PM
 
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Originally Posted by trmpetplaya View Post
If they were doing it for religious reasons then they would more than likely be waiting until the 8th day anyhow which would make the vit K shot unnecessary
That's really what the question was, would waiting till the eighth day mean you still need the shot or is it considered a mute point anyway by that day.
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There are no medical reasons for circumcision at birth Frostbite, gangrene, and cancer don't tend to happen on the foreskin in brand new babies :

love and peace.

I'm well aware of that, I just had to add the disclaimer anyway.
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#47 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 10:24 PM
 
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Thanks everyone for the responses.
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#48 of 51 Old 04-26-2007, 11:31 PM
 
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wait for 8 days and get the shot... or oral- oral vitamin k you have the best of both worlds- the baby absorbs it or declined to absorb it -as in natural mechanism-- it is also the same flaw, if there is a problem with absorbtion it not only effects the supplement but all vitamin K- the shot protects those babies
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#49 of 51 Old 04-27-2007, 02:33 AM
 
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I'm gonna add another plea... Please consider leaving your boy whole and intact.... especially if you are only doing this because it is the usual thing to do.
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#50 of 51 Old 04-27-2007, 03:15 AM
 
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Around here doctors or midwives won't do any sort of cutting on a baby unless they have the Vit K shot. My MWs said they wouldn't even clip DS#2s tongue if he was tongue tied, I would have to go somewhere else or wait till he was 10 days old. I would assume the peds office would have the same to say. So even if you wanted to forgo the Vit K and still circ, I highly doubt you could find a doctor willing to do that. My MWs also didn't offer the oral and wouldn't accept that in lue of the Vit K shot.

I hope the OP isn't planning on circumcising after reading this post. Was the question retorical? I hope so. If the OP is still considering then please do some research and don't make the decision blindly. You can cut it off but you can never undo it.
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#51 of 51 Old 04-27-2007, 04:51 AM
 
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We didn't do either. The first (Vit. K) is medically unnecessary, and the second is mutilation.

Ilaria mamma to Owen, Caroline & Patrick .... loving life as expats in Asia intactlact.gifnovaxnocirc.gifuc.jpgnamaste.gif
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