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Old 09-18-2002, 03:52 PM - Thread Starter
 
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About 3 1/2 weeks ago, I went in for a regular prenatal appt--28w 5d--and there was no heartbeat. The initial explanation was that I probably had a blood pressure spike, since I developed PE in my first pg and I was beginning to show symptoms again, despite no previous problems in this pg. I was induced, had a breech VBAC, and delivered a beautiful little baby girl, Samantha Jean. After her birth, we found out that she had actually died of a cord twist, right above where her belly button would have been, and that she had actually died about a week before. We were able to hold her and spend several hours with her after she was born, take pictures, that kind of thing. We have had an incredible amount of support from our family, church, and friends here.

Life is beginning to settle, although we are still having our moments frequently. Part of what has been so difficult, in addition to losing our baby, is that after my son's birth it took us 4 years to get to the point of being willing to try another pg. With him, I developed PE, and had an emergency cs at 30w. As a result, he has mild cerebral palsy, and it took a lot of soul searching to decide if we were willing to risk doing that to another person after having watched him struggle. I was also extremely ill, and could have easily died. There was about a 20% chance of PE for this pg, but it looks like the symptons of PE were a result of the stress to my body from her death.

Part of what has also made this difficult is that we were prepared to watch for problems with the PE and the risks that involved. But to have had a perfect pg, low to normal BP, and then have this happen out of the blue has been overwhelming. We had just reached the point in the pg where, even if I developed PE again, there was a good chance of survival, and a good chance of getting the pg almost to term, even if we needed to intervene at some point. We had finally begun to breathe easier.

Additionally, we were notified last week that we are being transferred to Germany next year; dh will go in Feb, we will finish out the school year, ds is 4 1/2 and is very attached to his school, friends and routine. We had thought that with only 5 years left in the AF, that we would not be transferred again. It is just feeling like everything in our lives is out of control. We would also be under military healthcare over there, and I refuse to even attempt another pg under them. That was a major problem during the first pg. By the time we get back, I will be in my mid 30's, not old to be having a baby per se, but it increases the risk of the PE even more.

I am not even sure of what I am looking for with this post. I guess I just needed to ramble and get some of it out. Thanks for listening

Carrie
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Old 09-18-2002, 04:01 PM
 
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(((((Carrie fam))))))
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Old 09-18-2002, 04:03 PM
 
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My thoughts and prayers are with you and your family.

Amy - Blessed wife to Jesse (the best dad in the world), mother of 10 on earth plus 8 in heaven.   PROUD to be a Catholic! : winner.jpg familybed2.gifhomeschool.gif

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Old 09-18-2002, 04:04 PM
 
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(((((((((((((((((((((((Carrie))))))))))))))))))))) )))))))))))))))

I am so so so sorry!!!I would love to give you a big !
THese are trying times for you....
We are all here for you!

always,

mamasoleil
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Old 09-18-2002, 04:07 PM
 
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My heart goes out to you and your family at this time of loss.

Robin
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Old 09-18-2002, 04:08 PM
 
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(((((Carrie))))))

I'm so sorry for the loss of your daughter.
We're all here for you
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Old 09-18-2002, 04:12 PM
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Old 09-18-2002, 07:46 PM
 
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no words can express...
blessings for your days & nights,
maria
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Old 09-18-2002, 11:12 PM
 
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I am so sorry for your loss. Nothing can ever compare to the loss of a child.

Incidently, my sister lived in Germany for several years and really loved it. While she had a nightmare-from-hell birth while under military care in the US at Ft Erwin in California, she had her last two children in Germany. The second was a c-section due to a short umbilical cord and her third was an all natural VBAC!!

Don't be afraid of the health care in Germany it is sometimes much better than what military wives often receive in the states.

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Old 09-18-2002, 11:55 PM
 
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My thoughts are with you, and your beautiful little girl.
I wish you peace.
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Old 09-19-2002, 12:45 AM
 
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I am so very sorry for your loss.
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Old 09-19-2002, 01:04 AM
 
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I offer you my condolences on your loss, how tragic, I can't imagine the sadness of everything that you've had to face. That said, let me offer some info re: military health care system in Germany. There are fewer AF bases than Army posts, do you know where exactly you will go? Landstuhl is the major military hospital in Germany. Most posts/bases only have a small clinic. You are sent out to hospitals on the German economy most of the time. In my experience, OBs don't attend births in general. My first birth was a really bad experience in a stateside military hospital. My second, I had an all-natural labor but after pushing with the midwife for three hours and her head not even engaging, she got the doc (whom I had never met, she didn't speak English, only Russian, luckily I had took Russian in colle, the one time it's ever come in handy *L*) and after another hour of pushing and me starting to go into shock, we (the midwife, 2 OBs and myself) decided to do the c-section. They usually knock women out but they cared that I wanted to be awake and gave me a spinal instead. The hospital usually didn't want you to room-in if you'd had a c-section but I explained that I wanted her with me the whole time and they were fine with it. Germans tend to give their babies a lot of supplemental feeds-sugar water, fennel tea (helps with colic and they give it whether or not baby is colicky) and other things, so, you have to be foreceful that you don't want baby to have *anything*. They made me stay in the hospital 9 days (for reasons I won't go into right now). With my third birth (in a different German hospital) I went in at 9 pm, the midwife insisted I was in false labor, we argued, baby was born at 11:30 pm *LOL*. I left after about 15 hours. They will also allow you to have a home birth, with a midwife if you can find one in your area who will do it and who speaks English, I know Army wives who have done it but I couldn't find one in my area. If you want to know more, just email me.
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Old 09-19-2002, 01:11 AM
 
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(((((((((((carrie)))))))))))))) so very sorry about the loss of your daughter
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Old 09-19-2002, 02:26 AM
 
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I hope this fine you well. i am so sorry for your and family lost. Please now that my soul is with you.
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Old 09-19-2002, 04:40 AM
 
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{{{{{Carrie}}}}} I just wanted to let you know how sorry I am for your loss.
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Old 09-19-2002, 06:15 AM
 
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oh carrie...... ((((((((((((({{{{{{{{hugs}}}}}}}})))))))))))))

I have no words to describe how sorry I feel for you and your family. my thoughts are with you
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Old 09-19-2002, 06:20 AM
 
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((((((((((((((((((Carrie)))))))))))))))))))))))))) ))
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Old 09-19-2002, 02:31 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I just wanted to say thank you all for the support and hugs. It has been really helpful to "talk" about this with other people; helps me to sort out the rational from the irrational, and make sense of it all. Surreal is a good word for it, Xiola'sMomma.

abimomma and Jenmom, thanks for the encouraging words on the healthcare avail. in Germany. We will be going to Ramstein, so Landstuhl is the MTF. Reading their web page, I am not impressed with how they handle OB/GYN. After having dug and dug on tricare's website, it appears we are allowed to stay on standard while in Europe, they just discourage you from doing so, so my son and I will be seeking German healthcare as much as we are able to find it. I can't speak a word of German (well I can curse a bit, courtesy of my German exchange student roomate in college ), how common is it for people to speak English? They have offered some basic conversational German courses, so I will be taking those...but not until we arrive.

Thanks you all again--it is good to have a place where I can go, no matter what time of day, and find support. And since we will be losing the in person support of our friends soon, it is nice to know there is someplace to go no matter where we are
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Old 09-19-2002, 04:10 PM
 
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I am so sorry for your loss.
My thoughts and prayers are with you.

The truest answer to violence is love. The truest answer to death is life. The only prevention for violence is for the heart to have no violence within it.  We cannot prevent evil through any system devised by mankind. But we can grapple with evil and defeat it, but only with love—real love.

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Old 09-19-2002, 05:31 PM
 
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I just wanted to add that Samantha Jean is a beautiful name. My condolences on the loss of your precious, precious daughter. Your post really touched me-thanks for sharing your story.
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Old 09-19-2002, 05:48 PM
 
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There are no words ...

I'm so sorry about your loss.

- Amy
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Old 09-19-2002, 05:56 PM
 
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Hugs to you and your family. I'm so sorry for your loss.
((((((((((carrie)))))))))))))))))
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Old 09-20-2002, 01:26 AM
 
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I am just so very very sorry for you, your family, and your precious child.
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Old 09-20-2002, 02:01 PM
 
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in my experience, the Germans are more likely to use non-traditional treatments for certain things. They are also pretty cool about things like not vaccinating. They almost adamant about breastfeeding newborns. *However*, they do NOT encourge ENing at ALL. In fact, I met with several women whose Drs griped to them at length about how it wasn't necessary and the child wasn't really getting milk at that point, etc. They tend to supplement from the beginning, begin solids at a month old and will often wean their babies to solids around six months old (off of bottle and/or breast), it was rather shocking to me when I enountered women doing this on the advice of their German pedis. I was still nursing DD#1 when I started seeing a German OB because I was pregnant with DD#2 and he gave me a very hard time because she was still nursing (said it was bad for the baby I was carrying because of hormones, etc). I told him off and he said it was my decision and we basically agreed to disagree. When I became pregnant with DS, I didn't bother to tell the OB (a different one) that I was still nursing DD#2. I have found that military docs tend to be young and impressionable. *Most* of them I've had a very easy time working with. They have been eager to learn when I had something to share. For instance, our pedi with DS wanted to give him iron, I explained why it's bad to give breastfed babies iron, he looked it up and didn't recommend it to any other breastfed babies. I felt more....looked down on by the older German docs that I saw, like I was a stubborn child rather than someone with an educated opinion. Another thing-the Germans tend to do a LOT of ultrasounds, with both of my pregnanies I went 'round and 'round with them about it and both times allowed them to do one and that was it. You really have to put your foot down, they aren't used to women doing that with them. So, having said all of that, *I* wouldn't go see a German doc as my regular doc. If you want to go off-post for your OB appointments, talk to the Tricare guy, I did it and stayed on Prime, going through the clinic on post for other things. That's all based on my experience, I'm sure there are other people who had other experiences/different docs in different regions. Good luck, hope I've shared some good info. Email if you wish to talk about it some more [email protected]
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Old 09-20-2002, 05:46 PM
 
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So sorry for your loss. I cannot begin to understand how you and your family must feel. I am glad you have support.
I agree with Xiola'sMomma that you will know when the time is right for you to have another baby. In your situation, I would take all the time needed to grieve.
I wanted to let you know about a Dr. Tom Brewer (maybe you already do) who claims to have wonderful success with a high protein diet for pregnancy. 80 to 100 grams of protein a day. He claims to never have lost a baby or mother to PE. I do not know if this is accurate but we followed his nutrition plan and had easy pregnancies. His website is www.blueribbonbaby.org. I hope you do not take this info as guilt-inducing - you are not in any way responsible for the loss of your beautiful daughter! I just wanted to pass along info that could be helpful (certainly could not hurt to try it) in your next pregnancy.
Again, my sincere sympathy at the loss of your daughter.
Kirsten
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Old 09-20-2002, 09:56 PM
 
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Carrie,

I feel so deeply for you. Your story is so similar to mine. In my case the placenta abrupted.

I will light a candle tonight in honor of your precious baby Samantha Jean. What kinds of things have you done to remember her?

This is truly a place of love and healing, please know you can share freely here and get the support you need. I found writing helpfull and extend to you a warm and gentle welcome to write what ever you need to here.

Greif is a journy and you have many roads to travel down. I wish you peace.
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Old 09-21-2002, 04:32 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Again, thank you all for the support and kind words. The past few days have been easier except when ds has questions/comments. Most of the time he is doing okay, but to see his heartbreak is worse than my own. After some initial concerns about "meeting" the new baby (he is extremely shy about meeting new people), he was SO looking forward to being a big brother. He tried to play his favorite game of poke me in the belly and the baby kicks back today. His face lit up, and he said "Mommy, I feel the baby kicking!" (you could tell he was trying to convince himself) and I had to remind him. Things like that.

On the other hand, I managed to go in to my office Friday. I work PT mostly at home, but usually go in once a week for an hour or so. It felt good to be back into my regular routine a bit more.

Jenmom, I am sure I will be emailing you as I come up with more questions

mamacrab, thanks for complimenting her name. Before dh and I had met 11 years ago, we both decided on that name, so her name has a lot of meaning for us--the child we dreamed of through our childhood, courtship, and marriage. Dh is having a hard time with that aspect of her death, because her future was very real to him.

Kirsten, thanks for the info. Actually, I was following Brewer's diet, which is why we believe that the signs of PE were a result of my body's stress at her death, not true PE. As best we know, there is no diagnosis of PE in my medical records for this pg, but it is listed as a possible contributing cause on the death certificate, with cord constriction being the primary cause. I am planning on asking about the specifics of this at my pp appt this week. I am also going to ask about a testing for a clotting disorder; apparently this can also cause PE in some pg.

Ms. Mom-thank you. Our hospital put together a memory box for us. It included her hand and footprints, the clothes her hospital picture was taken in, the bracelets they would have used, the measuring tape they used. The clothes and measuring tape have spots of the birthing fluids and blood still on them. We also took pictures after she was born, as well as at the funeral and graveside service (2 separate services in 2 states). We made impressions of her hands and feet. Several hours after the burial, dh and I took a sheet and just went and sat and listened at her graveside. It is a beautiful area at the top of a hill, surrounded by trees, out in the middle of nowhere, quiet and peaceful. I have written her birth story, and am working on events during the pg and the past few weeks, and would like to get birth stories from dh, my Mom, and my MIL (they were all there). I would like to eventually put everything together in a memory book.

So that is where we are at right now. Monday marks when she would have been 1m old, so I expect that next week may have some especially difficult moments. Thank you all again for your loving support.

Carrie
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Old 09-23-2002, 12:35 AM
 
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Carrie, Thank you for sharing you daughter with us. My heart aches every time a new mother comes here with a story like yours. I also feel so belessed that this forum exists for all of us.

It's been almost 9 years since my daughter was born still and I still find healing taking place within me.

Your service sounds so lovely. I savor the memories of my daughters service and her birth. Our hospital was so loving and kind to us and thoes memories have carried through to this day.

We have a wall in our hallway in her honor. Several poems, birth/death certificate, foot/hand prints and her dress in a shadow box. It's a lovely memorial and now I can walk past it and smile instead of cry.

Please continue to be gentle with yourself. Reach out to thoes around you for support and help. Take good care of yoruself as you travel the many paths of greif.

You, Samantha Jean, and your family are in my thoughts. I lit a candle tonight in her honor.
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