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Slate article makes an unfortunate point

2K views 38 replies 22 participants last post by  coyotebones 
#1 ·
http://www.slate.com/id/2128061/nav/tap1/

Points out that the ease associated with living with disposable diapers is generally ease for the mother, and going diaper free is more work heaped on the mom.

It is true that EC requires more attention from the parent, more attachment, etc. That's an interesting cultural point. When are we ready to give up ease for our parenting values?

A lot of the time I do find myself opting for a little TV, some game boy for the kids, something to allow myself ease. I don't beat myself up about it too much. It makes me better able to commit to my child and be a better parent overall. When I have time to myself to recharge, I can be a better mama for my kids. So I guess it's about choices. If someone else finds the choice of EC too demanding and infringing on her ability to give herself graciously as a mother, then she should opt out. For a brand new, inexperienced mother assimilating everything new about being a parent, one more new thing to suss out may just be too much.

I do, however, think the recent articles make it seem more difficult than it needs to be. For an AP parent, it's not that much more of a stretch to try EC. For a mainstream parent, it might be just too much to ask. When a child is in the sling, in arms, in mama's bed... noticing the signals or simply putting the kid on the potty after naps isn't really that much more work -- especially if you have a realistic expectation that you'll "catch" sometimes, and sometimes go weeks with out much success. Articles make it seem like you have to be constantly vigilant. Really, we werent' much like that in my family, and still felt we benefitted from EC. Just the fact that my boy was familiar with the potty over the years, knew where pee came from, never turned off the signal in his head that said, "Hey, I have to go" or "Hey, I'm wet" - these made for a much smoother transition to the potty in the toddler years.

Don't get me wrong, it wasn't perfect. My two year old is diaper free all day and night -- except -- he demands I put him in a cloth diaper when he has to poop. We went long periods of his babyhood using cloth diapers pretty much all the time. After naps and at night time, however we stuck him on the potty routinely. We never stopped putting him on, we always changed him whenever he was even slightly wet -- we kept the conversation alive about elimination so it wasn't a big shocker to him at two when we wanted him to use the potty.

Because really, isn't it even slightly ridiculous to train a kid to pee in his clothing for two years, ignoring bodily sensations and the feeling of wastes against the body, and all of a sudden at two or three ask the kid to do something completely different? Start paying attention to the things we've been asking him to ignore all along? That was a huge struggle with my older son, and the reason I was drawn to EC with my younger. Sometimes in our fast-paced lives we did have to opt for the ease of the diaper. But that only meant telling my younger son, "Yes, you're wet, and we'll change you as soon as we can!" The communication kept happening. With my older son, he could have gone hours in his disposable without ever noticing or caring.

I remember when both my kids were newborn and they would cry at diaper changes, cry when they had to pee. These babies were aware of the sensation. Babies can't say exactly what it is that's irking them, but my kids were definitely aware of some kind of feeling when it was time to go. If we only pay attention to the little ones and help them go on a potty instead of training them to get over it and ignore the feeling, I think it's a good thing. And catching all the time is not the goal. Just keeping the concept alive for kids so it isn't such a drama come age two or three. What the articles miss is that it really doesn't have to be perfect. It can be fun if it's a game or a challenge, enjoying the process of communicating with your baby not striving for the specific goal of training by three -- three weeks or three years!

I hope these recent articles encourage more mamas to follow their instinct and look into EC. I remember my initial shock and disbelief when I first heard about it. Crazy parents! Bizarre! But something kept drawing me back to look into the information available on the internet, browse the books. With the public eye on EC, I think many more mamas will become interested because what we're offering here is just another tool in the parenting toolbox, as oddball as it may seem at first. It's compelling and exciting to make that deep connection with your child.

Hey, this got long, I think I'll put it on my blog!
 
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#2 ·
I think this question she asks says it all:

Quote:
All of which sounds like the sort of incremental, intimate process that requires near round-the-clock contact. And who is likely to be so devotedly attentive? I wonder.

hmmm, who?

it really is a whole different mindset
 
#3 ·
I thought this was a well-written article with some good points, though a little misguided. Bazelon's thoughts on EC adding to our already over-scheduled lives are true in theory, but I just haven't found that to be the case at all in practice. We all know how easy it is to give our babies the chance to eliminate when they need to, and if our children really need to go, it takes so little time to help them onto the proper receptacle and wait for them to do their business. It really is a different mindset.

Anyway, thanks for sharing, pamelamama !
 
#4 ·
the article assumes that most mothers wouldn't benefit -- let alone enjoy -- the time and commitment necessary for EC (and AP). sure, plenty moms have no desire to spend so much initmate time with their children. whatever. that's their life. but for those of us who understand and feel drawn to a parenting style different from the mainstream, EC isn't much of a leap. mainstream moms might see more movies, get more sleep and have an "easier" time with certain parenting duties, but i'd rather have a deeper connection to my son and bring up a boy with more self esteem and confidence.

i find my parenting style enjoyable, not a burden. i'm not a "mother without a life." i'm a mother who sees value in not taken the easy way out.
 
#5 ·
Great post pamelamama!

It is a different mindset for sure. I hear it all the time from ILs and others about AP, cds etc. "Isn't that a lot of work?" uh it's a lot of PARENTING not work, and isn't that what it's all about (apparently not!).

Even worse is "I'm too busy to mess with that" - too busy doing what?! Sure my house could be cleaner and I don't go to the gym or read magazines, but when I got pg (after 10 years of marriage) we made conscious decisions on how to parent. Too many people just do what is convenient for THEM, nevermind what is best for baby.
 
#8 ·
I was pretty disgusted by the article. It just reinforces the social attitude that AP and especially EC are not worth it. It really makes me sad. So thousands of parents, esp mamas, will read this and say to themselves, "yep, I'm like everybody else and it's OK that I want my life back." And it is his or her choice, true. But those of us who choose these parenting practices are not abnormal, and we're certainly not crazy.

Sure, there's a part of me eager to get back to my practice, to take a nap or, God forbid, a shower whenever I want. To have a few days of NOT doing laundry per week. To eat dairy if I want w/o worrying about it affecting ds. I'm tired. But I look at his sweet face and the way he lights up at the sight of me, and it is soooooooo worth it.
 
#10 ·
Although I have a lot of respect for ECers, I'm an AP mama, and EC isn't for me. It DOES seem like more than I want to take on. I kind of resent the implication that anyone unwilling to do EC must be a complete mainstreamer who doesn't want to spend "intimate time" with her child.
 
#11 ·
I want to clarify that I'm not an ECer either. But the article implies that ECing (and AP) is unrealistic for anyone to do because it requires the mother to give up her life which is totally unfair for the mother. I resent that the author seems to think that the benefits of AP practices aren't worth the sacrifices. Sorry zinemama if you are responding to what I wrote. I should have been more clear.
 
#12 ·
It is unrealistic to ask every parent to parent the same way. Each of us has a different personality, different resources, different skills. If I choose to do EC in my life because it intrigues me and catches my interest, that's a good choice for me. It's not a good choice for everyone, and that doesn't make "everyone" a bad mama.

For some people it's hard enough to be a parent, forget the extra sacrifices demanded of an EC/AP mama. There's no denying it's a different way of thinking and being. There's no denying it comes with wonderful rewards. But I can't condemn people who arent ready to go there because they are in a different place on their parenting journey and this just seems like too much for them.

I think the fallacy put forth in the article is that EC MUST be a ton of extra work. It really doesn't have to be, if you just do it in a relaxed way and keep yourself process oriented rather than product oriented.

Most of the response we're seeing is a misunderstanding that EC is about results. It's not. It's about process.
 
#13 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by zinemama
Although I have a lot of respect for ECers, I'm an AP mama, and EC isn't for me. It DOES seem like more than I want to take on.
This is a very common response to a lot of natural family living practices. Moms say this very thing all the time about breastfeeding - and I say, sure, everyone's entitled to her own opinion.

What I find unfortunate about many peoples' initial response to EC is that they assume that it would be SO MUCH MORE DIFFICULT than the more common choice YET they don't really know if it's harder OR easier because they've never tried it. And it's a truly wonderful experience - I'm sad for them that they won't know that experience. Just like I'm sad for a mama who will never know the wonderful feeling of snuggling her infant who is on cloud nine with a milky, delirious smile after a highly anticipated nursing session.


And no, a person doesn't have to try everything before deciding whether it's "for them" or not - that's the beauty of our freedom to choose. But it *is* easier for me to understand when someone says, "I tried breastfeeding or EC or babywearing for 3 months, gave it a truly genuine effort, and decided that it really didn't work for me/my child/our family" instead of hearing time and time and time again from someone who has never even attempted it: "No way I'd EC - that's too much!"

Agreed, though, that everyone is at a different point along the parenting journey, and that's necessary and good. I laughed off EC when I was pregnant. I had an unmedicated birth in a hospital w/ an OB. I wasn't ready to think about EC, I wasn't ready to homebirth, I just wasn't that far along my path. But now, for me, I *am* excited to EC from birth with our babe due in January, and I am so excited to birth at home! I'm ready and excited to do it - and I appreciate people sharing with me their journeys, challenging my ideas in a real way, but not trying to force me into making the same decisions they made.

Wow - ramble queen tonight, eh? Will stop there. Hope any of that made sense...
 
#15 ·
I appreciate the posts in response to the Slate article. I haven't posted here before, just lurked now and then. But I wanted to add that ECing has been easier for us to do in "small bites", meaning once a day and at nighttime. I like doing EC parttime and when my older son was in the hospital, my mom watched my younger ECing son and helped out with getting him to the potty when I was with my older ds. When something is important to a person, they usually find a way to make it work. And when a thing gets to be too overwhelming, it can be a positive thing to take a step back and reassess everyone's needs. Parttime EC has been very manageable and rewarding for our whole family, rather than a burden. And the best thing: we can increase the commitment towards fulltime ECing when my ds and I feel ready for it!!
Since this works well for me and my son, I don't feel I am making sacrifices at all!
 
#16 ·
In my own personal experience EC *was* a lot of extra work. I had to stay on the ball all the time. It was fun and exciting to see my baby go in the potty, no doubt about that. But I had to know where the restroom was when we went places. I had to interrupt conversations at people's house to take her to the toilet, etc.

With dd2 I felt that I was not mentally there. I did EC her for a bit because of bad diaper rash and she actually responded well even on the first day. However between her needs, and dd1's needs, and answering the phone and all that stuff, I just could not do it. (Dd2 ended up not being able to do it anyway, b/c of other health related stuff.) It was much easier for me to give up on EC and run a load of diapers when it was convenient.

I can see EC being useful for some moms and babies. I have turned a couple of my friends onto it and they had some success, but both ended up dropping it because it was too inconvenient. Both are active moms who like to go out a lot with their babies/toddlers and it was too disruptive to that kind of lifestyle.

EC is a very cool thing, and I hope more people try it. I just think of the die-hard EC'ers as a special breed of parents that go above and beyond the call of duty.
 
#17 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by cyncyn
Too many people just do what is convenient for THEM, nevermind what is best for baby.
While it is tempting to think this, when I observe the "mainstream" parents, I neve find myself thinking, "ah how convenient that looks." How often have I been so happy to be nursing, for example, because I know my dd would be screaming like the rest of the toddlers we encounter in planes and other places if she were uncomfortable and couldn't nurse. I can't guarantee that nursing would have worked for all these people but I can guaratnee that if we werent nursing we'd be just like them.

And have you ever seen toddlers screaming at diaper changes. It is heartbreaking. I see how they recoil in pain while being wiped, and resist having the next diaper put on. I have seen people apply rash cream and follow up with anotehr diaper even though the kid JUST WENT .... I can't stand it and often have to leave to make sure I keep my mouth shut. I don't really think this is okay but what to do? I am proud to say that I have turned a few people on to ec though, and they have thanked me for it.

If you have floors (not carpets) then you really dont have to "watch them pee" which is how some describe the demanding nature of ec. While I sympathise with those with carpets, I woudl urge those with floors in even part of the house to try the ultra relaxed approach to ec, which worked beautifully for us. And we were down to 1 miss/day by 10 or 11 months.

Actually I never for a moment think about the 'sacrifice' of ec'ing, because I really truly think it has saved me huge lots of time and energy in the long run. But breastfeeding, to which I am absolutely committed (I mean, I have used some diapers, but never used any forumula and do plan to CLW), does weigh on me now and then. I've still never left dd more than 2-3 hours at a time, and she nurses to sleep *every* night unless we are driving home and she falls asleep in the car. But she still nurses 2-3 times every night. And I am happy for her. Someday I want to sleep on my back all night long though. And diversify my wardrobe. Right now all I can wear is my "uniform" (nursing tops - we NIP regularly).

Okay okay this seems offtopic ... though it isn't, i dont think
anyway congratulations miziki for ec'er on the way. I'm jealous
 
#18 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by USAmma
In my own personal experience EC *was* a lot of extra work.
USAmma, I respect that EC was not for you. And what I am going to say is *not* a suggestion that you "could have done it" or "should have stuck with it" - you obviously made the right decision for you and your girls, and you are an incredibly loving, attached, and devoted mama.


What I want to point out to any mamas who might feel more reluctant about trying EC after reading about USAmma's experience is this:

"I had to stay on the ball all the time..."

1) Practicing EC is never an "ALL OR NOTHING" thing!!! You do NOT have to stay "on the ball all the time" - that is a personal choice, not a requirement of EC, and many many ECers do part-time EC (taking EC breaks as needed -- ie., tired mama one day? particularly high-needs super-teething baby that week? ...take a little EC vacation, come back to it when ready).

2) "Imperfect EC is *still* EC!!!" This quote is famous on the EC yahoo group for reminding parents that the goal of EC is NOT perfection (in terms of getting every pee/poop into a potty at every moment of the day, or totally doing away with diapers, etc.) --> the goal is COMMUNICATION. You can easily explain to your baby, "We're going out and mama is putting a diaper on you - if you need to go, and if I can't take you to the potty, it's ok to go in your diaper and I will change you as quickly as I can!"

I'm only saying that EC is exceedingly adaptable. There's no "right way" or "only way" to EC. It doesn't have to be "a lot of extra work!" IMO, if it's feeling that way, it's time to make adjustments - and yes, that may mean not doing EC at all for some families, but more often than not, changing expectations that you have of yourself for doing EC has some really positive results. Not unlike going through extended breastfeeding - sometimes you feel like you REALLY are done w/ nursing your 18 month old and have strong urges to wean, but then you make a small but meaningful adjustment to the relationship (shortening a nursing session or talking w/ your toddler about mommy needing a break) -- the pressure is relieved, and you enjoy it again.

 
#19 ·
Wanted to respond to this specific scenario, as it's a legitimate question/concern:

Quote:
I had to know where the restroom was when we went places.
WAIT!!! You soooo don't have to do EC when you're out, not if you don't want to, not if you don't feel ready to try it. That is a choice for each mama to make on her own according to each outing. Second, needing to "know where the restroom" is when you go places -- this is certainly NOT unique to EC!
Whenever you decide it's time to for your child to use the potty (whether that's at 6 wks or 9 mos or 15 mos or 3 yrs old), you're going to need to do this - to know where the bathroom is and to make their getting to the toilet a priority. So... I think that the above scenario is not that "EC is too much work" but rather "having exceedingly high expectations" about practicing EC that can easily be adjusted to make an ECing fit more comfortably into one's life at that particular time.

When we started EC, we didn't do it at first when "out and about." I wasn't ready to do that. And slowly, gradually, I became more comfortable with it. If I would have expected myself to do that from the beginning or before I was ready, I surely would have quit ECing and said "it was just too much."

But see the difference? Those expectations are not EC expectations - those are individual, personal expectations of practicing EC. IMO, you *have* to be gentle and gradual with yourself! Start slowly. And even doing that, sure there will be families who decide still that EC isn't for them. And that's ok, too!
 
#20 ·
Quote:
I had to interrupt conversations at people's house to take her to the toilet, etc.
Again, please wait! This is NOT a requirement of EC or a problem inherent to EC!!!

This is a personal choice.

No ECer will ever say to you that you have to do this in order to EC. For me, sometimes I did feel it was fine to say "hey, sorry to interrupt, but dd has to pee - be right back" and at other times I just whispered to my baby "sweetie, mama can't take you to the potty right now, so go in your diaper if you need to go, I'll change you quickly!"

Keep in mind, though, that at some point even traditionally diapering parents interrupt conversations w/ friends to change a very wet diaper or especially a poopy, smelly diaper. Or at least I hope they do (and I think most do!)...
 
#21 ·
Quote:
I have turned a couple of my friends onto it and they had some success, but both ended up dropping it because it was too inconvenient. Both are active moms who like to go out a lot with their babies/toddlers and it was too disruptive to that kind of lifestyle.
Again, I think this is absolutely a matter of personal expectations - not a function of EC itself.

I go out a lot w/ my baby/toddler! And I *know* many other moms do, too. This is like saying, "Well, if you're breastfeeding you have to stay home to nurse because it's too difficult to do in public."

We are very active -- and we have to drive at least 20-30 minutes to get *anywhere* from my house (sucks, I know!). But even for us, it eventually became WAY easier and MORE convenient for us to do EC while out than to wrestle w/ a diaper bag stocked w/ cloth dipes, then find a place to change her, and convince dd (who hated diapers) to be changed without a HUGE struggle, etc.

To give a step-by-step picture into how ECing went for us when out and about (and remember, we did NOT do this from the beginning - we came to it gradually!!!):

* offer bathroom at house as the last thing before getting into car
* kept little potty in trunk of car, offered potty upon arrival at new location
* once inside new location, if feasible, I'd watch for signals/she would communicate sometimes (though if too distracted, would not and I'd go by intuition and timing which was very 2nd nature for me at that point) - when I though it was time, I'd simply take her to the bathroom, hold her over the potty, quick wipe, quick flush, and we were out of there far faster than diaper changing could have occurred (and please know we were late starters - began EC w/ dd at 8 mos, so I had definitely changed my fair share of diapers!!!)
* if an accident happened, and of course this happens (and even does when toddlers potty learn!!) I carried a small plastic bag w/ a change of training pants & pants - we simply changed just as one would a diaper
* when ready to leave, go to car and offer portable potty in trunk again
* upon arriving home, offer potty

OR OR OR

* if we were going to be someplace so distracting or inconvenient (in terms of potty location) or if she or I just didn't feel like doing EC that day for *whatever* reason, we simply DIAPERED her!!!


PLUS --> as dd got older, the frequency with which she needed to go decreased greatly. Several hours between pees. Very regular once-a-day poops right after lunch. AND, signalling got clearer and clearer with increased verbal ability! So this whole process actually continued to get MORE simple than what I describe above.

Quote:
I just think of the die-hard EC'ers as a special breed of parents that go above and beyond the call of duty.
This kind of makes me uncomfortable/awkward (not angry, just sort of "made over" when it's really not something special or extra). Please try not to think of ECing parents that way - seriously - we're no different from you! Honestly, I feel like saying this is SO similar to what some non-breastfeeding moms say to breastfeeding moms, "you're a special breed of parents that go above and beyond for nursing your child!" For the large majority of breastfeeding moms, it's *easier* to nurse than to use formula/bottles, even if you have a rough start w/ nursing. Sure, there are moms for whom breastfeeding is NOT easy, and they HAVE made unbelievably heroic, herculean efforts to give their babies breastmilk (like my amazing friend who pumped exclusively for A WHOLE YEAR... I bow to her!!!
). And it's very similar w/ EC.

*In general* EC is just a change of perspective, because if you think about it, you're putting time in as a parent dealing w/ toileting one way or another. Whether you put the time in changing diapers, washing them, doing that for 18 mos - 2.5 or 3 yrs, and then potty training your toddler -- OR you distribute that time differently practicing EC in the way that's best for your family -- OR you do a 50/50 combo of diapering and EC straight down the middle... you're still putting in that time. OF COURSE there are exceptions too, like USAmma's family, where diapering is a necessity due to health related stuff (I'd be doing the same in her position, no doubt!). But IN GENERAL, with EC you're just distributing your focus/attention differently than w/ conventional diapering/potty training.

I really hope I haven't offended anyone - and if I have, *please* tell me so I can avoid doing it in the future... AND please accept my apology! My only intention in replying to USAmma's post was NOT to dismiss her feelings (as I've said, I really understand and respect where she's coming from regarding EC)! My replies are only meant to address some very reasonable, common concerns and ideas about EC requirements that many parents have.
 
#22 ·
I appreciate all the info you've been providing on EC, Miziki. I had been thinking that it was an "all or nothing" endeavor. Now I can see how it might not be as labor-intensive as I'd thought.

However, I am very uncomfortable with the way you compare a mama's willingness to EC to her willingness to breastfeed. To me, these are on completely different planes. Breastfeeding is a matter of health. Everyone, even those who use formula, knows this. Denying a child breastmilk is depriving them of their birthright.

Potty training methods, on the other hand, are a matter of parental choice. So one kid knows from an early age how to use the potty and another one starts at age three. Now, maybe there are long-term developmental implications, but they are not clear or documented at this point. Not the way the benefits of breastmilk are.

A woman who dismisses breastfeeding as, "not for me" is simply not comparable to someone who isn't interested in EC.
 
#23 ·
Quote:
Breastfeeding is a matter of health.
I would say that EC is also a matter of health. Just think of the feces in the garbage and all the germs. Think of the impact on the earth of all those diapers. Cloth diapers, if not washed immediately, are also sitting and ripe with germs. A child or any person could accidentally touch it and get ill.
I did cloth diapers with my first baby, and that year I had Hand-Foot-Mouth disease, and Fifth's disease. I swear it was from the diapers. I wasn't around anyone and was home.

I attended college full-time and EC'd with my 2nd dd.
I EC with my 3rd baby, now. A lot less waste in my home, and less mess. No one gets as sick anymore, either.
Just my .02
 
#24 ·
Quote:
Just think of the feces in the garbage and all the germs. Think of the impact on the earth of all those diapers. Cloth diapers, if not washed immediately, are also sitting and ripe with germs.
and let's consider mental health. i can't imagine ignoring my dd's signals and forcing her to give up in any area of her needs, including hygiene.
 
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