what do you wish you had put in divorce settlement/parenting agreement? - Page 7 - Mothering Forums

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#181 of 305 Old 03-04-2009, 09:33 PM
 
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Soooo, I don't understand. Regardless of what you have in your parenting agreements, nothing happens if the agreements are violated? Unless you go back to court? Isn't it already a court order? Does the police enforce those?

Akie, single mom to M (02/18/06), E (08/04/07) and Z (06/22/09)
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#182 of 305 Old 03-04-2009, 09:59 PM
 
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Soooo, I don't understand. Regardless of what you have in your parenting agreements, nothing happens if the agreements are violated? Unless you go back to court? Isn't it already a court order? Does the police enforce those?
excuse the typos tonight...

stbx & I actually get along decently & we really only have interactions dealing with dd, but from what I've seen it's one thing to have something in the decree and another to follow it. A good friend has an awful divorce & her x is not doing many of the things listed. There is nothing she can do but document it, and will bring it back to court to amend the agreement. For example, since hw is not consistently done & the kids are not prepared for school, she'll be asking to amend their agreement & not have them stay over during the week.

ANd from what I've seen, the police enforce what is in the agreement - child is returned at x time but it's now y o'clock so they can be there when you get your child without a fight. It's not like the police can enforce all the parenting related things. Financially you can document, but it will cost you more to go to court each time he doesn't pay for something, so it's more beneficial to document and have something adjusted as lump later on.

Hope that made sense - I'm kinda tired & rambling on.
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#183 of 305 Old 03-28-2009, 11:32 AM
 
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*bump*

DD 2/08
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#184 of 305 Old 03-28-2009, 12:26 PM
 
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i'll come back later and write down some of these brilliant ideas. thanks for your collective wisdom, ladies!

what about clothing? i'm sure that stbx will never ever buy the kids so much as socks. i'll be living on 150$/ month (after rent) and so keeping the kids clothed will be hard. can i ask him for a clothing allowance, or ask him to pay for 1/2 of everything, then keep receipts?
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#185 of 305 Old 03-28-2009, 01:17 PM
 
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i'll come back later and write down some of these brilliant ideas. thanks for your collective wisdom, ladies!

what about clothing? i'm sure that stbx will never ever buy the kids so much as socks. i'll be living on 150$/ month (after rent) and so keeping the kids clothed will be hard. can i ask him for a clothing allowance, or ask him to pay for 1/2 of everything, then keep receipts?

You can ask, but he doesn't have to agree. The only thing that he has to pay is what is in the court order. BTW, child support covers clothing for the kid(s) so it is doubtful that even if he agrees to it, it would be upheld. Kind of falls into the morality clauses category, those aren't enforced either.
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#186 of 305 Old 03-28-2009, 04:48 PM
 
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i'll come back later and write down some of these brilliant ideas. thanks for your collective wisdom, ladies!

what about clothing? i'm sure that stbx will never ever buy the kids so much as socks. i'll be living on 150$/ month (after rent) and so keeping the kids clothed will be hard. can i ask him for a clothing allowance, or ask him to pay for 1/2 of everything, then keep receipts?
Are you getting child support? That's the point of child support. Seems like if you only have $150 a month after rent then there's a bigger issue than clothing. Do you have any other living options? Family that can help?
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#187 of 305 Old 03-28-2009, 05:58 PM
 
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Are you getting child support? That's the point of child support. Seems like if you only have $150 a month after rent then there's a bigger issue than clothing. Do you have any other living options? Family that can help?
i may or may not get child support starting in july, that remains to be seen. i can live on that little, i've done it before. i'd rather not, though. if i end up not getting child support i'll apply for student loans so i'll have more to live on in september. in the meantime i'm looking for a job. the $ will work out.
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#188 of 305 Old 03-28-2009, 06:43 PM
 
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these are the things that we've agreed on (or hopefully will soon)
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  • Access to be as agreed by both parties. In the absence of agreement, the following shall apply: The children will stay with alternating parents in a two week repeating schedule. They will stay with Party 1 for 72 hours, then the Party 2 for 72 hours, then Party 1 for 48 hours then Party 2 for 48 hours. The exception to this will be ds2, who will not spend more than one consecutive night with his father until he is at least 30 months old and is deemed ready by both parties.
  • If either party is more than 15 minutes late picking up or dropping off the children that time must be made up to the party kept waiting.
  • Both parties claim the right of first refusal.
  • That if we ever had to go back to court because we could not work things out... HE paid all legal fees.
  • -A full background check is provided to the other when one of us plans on living with someone.
  • requiring that he have life insurance with you as the beneficiary.
  • No smoking in front of the children
  • No more than 3 drinks in a 24 hour period and no illegal substances starting 12 hours before the visit, ending after the children are dropped off with the other party
could anyone copy out the language in your own agreements that communicates any of these things, or anything similar that i might be able to modify to fit what i need to say? i tried to make that first one sound official, but it took forever and was exhausting. if i want this done by thursday i'll have to do it myself, and i'm no lawyer, believe you me.
sooooo.... anyone?
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#189 of 305 Old 04-26-2009, 09:57 AM
 
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#190 of 305 Old 04-26-2009, 12:23 PM
 
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This thread is genius...thank you so much.

I put in that DH cannot have DS for overnight visits until he receives documented and long term anger management counseling, and he must have adequate housing in the form of a house or apartment (since he's living in our camper right now).

Also, if he pushes for joint custody and I eventually have to give on that, I will require that I get sole discretion of where DS goes to school.
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#191 of 305 Old 04-27-2009, 02:47 AM
 
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Originally Posted by lilyka View Post
you can require that he carry a life insurance policy that your child is the beneficiary of. I don't know if that money would be available to you though to use though? they would also be entitled to SS benefits if he died (provided they would have otherwise qualified). you may also take out a life insurance policy on him with you or the children as the beneficiary.
The life insurance should go into a trust for your child in the event of father's death, and someone both parents agree on should be the executor of the trust. The executor can dispense money for legitimate needs while the child is a minor and child can get bulk when s/he reaches the age that you specify (29 is the usual number, I think, so it doesn't all get spent on partying when they're 18). I believe this is how it works, but check with your lawyer!
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#192 of 305 Old 05-20-2009, 05:40 PM
 
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#193 of 305 Old 05-20-2009, 05:59 PM
 
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While my separation is completely amicable at this point and all our custody issues are non-contested... I wish I'd been more specific. So that if things got hairy in the future, we'd both be more covered. Oh well!

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#194 of 305 Old 06-09-2009, 01:17 PM
 
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This is a great thread so I am just giving it a bump. I also don't understand why it isn't a stickie.

thanks to everyone who has contributed to it - I have drafted a parenting plan and hopefully we will start discussing it on Thursday.
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#195 of 305 Old 06-09-2009, 09:29 PM
 
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This is a great thread so I am just giving it a bump. I also don't understand why it isn't a stickie.

thanks to everyone who has contributed to it - I have drafted a parenting plan and hopefully we will start discussing it on Thursday.
It was a sticky for quite a while and then it was taken down. I don't know why, it's an important thread and a great resource.
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#196 of 305 Old 06-10-2009, 12:25 AM
 
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subbing

will have to come back later.
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#197 of 305 Old 06-25-2009, 09:32 PM - Thread Starter
 
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can't believe this thread is still alive...glad it's been of some use.
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#198 of 305 Old 08-04-2009, 05:04 PM
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I'm bumping this thread in case I need it in the future.

I'm still reading over what everyone else wrote (thank you! I think the "right of first refusal" is especially important.)

Did anyone get extremely specific in your parenting plans, such as:

My ds is often hungry right before bed, and dh will just complain that he didn't eat enough for dinner and put him to bed hungry. (Ds is 7.) I'll go to ds and tell him that he can get up and eat if he wants to.

So could a parenting plan state that "child will be accommodated with food upon request" or something similar? Or is that getting too nit-picky?

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#199 of 305 Old 08-08-2009, 09:48 PM
 
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So could a parenting plan state that "child will be accommodated with food upon request" or something similar? Or is that getting too nit-picky?
Too nit-picky. Difficult to enforce. Courts won't impose something like this (there's a general assumption that anyone who is fit to have even visitation will feed their kids, but specifics such as whether a kid should have a bedtime snack kind of falls into those day-to-day decisions parents have the right to make).

Also too vague--what does "accommodated" mean? Does it mean if it's clear food is being used for boredom or as a delay tactic, your child still needs to be fed? Does it mean if your child needs to be given specific foods? What if he is offered a banana and refuses it and demands a cookie?

In addition, remember that just about anything you put in a plan can be used against you (as these things generally are enforced on both parents) in court by a jerk. "You and DS were stuck in traffic and YOU DIDN'T BRING A SNACK and he went hungry for 15 whole minutes and now you're violating our agreement." Sure, it probably won't hold up--but you still have the hassle of dealing with it.

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#200 of 305 Old 09-03-2009, 03:45 PM
 
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#201 of 305 Old 09-06-2009, 09:54 PM
 
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In the class I went to they said you could go back and ask for an adjustment of cs if it was 10% or more. So if he's making more or there's a lot more costs...like daycare you can go back and ask for modification on the order.

Right now I'm totally hurting because our kids have so much copays in medicine. ANd he holds control of our flexible spending plan and is probably printing out the receipts for what *I* spent and getting the money. I need suggestions for working out the medical. One kid got approved for medicaid and the other two are being expedited so hopefully this won't be an issue for too long.

Now my medical coverage that is a big issue.
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#202 of 305 Old 09-23-2009, 03:19 AM
 
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bumping

has anyone included something like a "mission statement" for co-parenting their children? I would love to do something like this (this is something I wanted to do in therapy before STBX filed for divorce).
I wanted to come up with a set of co-parenting Vows and make those with him in front of witnesses. But it looks like we are heading towards a mainstream divorce where I am struggling not to forget anything.
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#203 of 305 Old 09-23-2009, 06:36 AM
 
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In the class I went to they said you could go back and ask for an adjustment of cs if it was 10% or more. So if he's making more or there's a lot more costs...like daycare you can go back and ask for modification on the order.

Right now I'm totally hurting because our kids have so much copays in medicine. ANd he holds control of our flexible spending plan and is probably printing out the receipts for what *I* spent and getting the money. I need suggestions for working out the medical. One kid got approved for medicaid and the other two are being expedited so hopefully this won't be an issue for too long.

Now my medical coverage that is a big issue.
Discuss the medical bills and the FSA with your attorney. You may be able to get a court to make him reimburse you.

Also, does the FSA have a Take Care card(mine does)? It works like a credit card. You just use that to pay instead of paying cash and waiting for reimbursement. The catch is that the doctor has to accept credit cards.
This will take your stbx out of the equation. The problem is that you need a card and if your stbx controls the account, then he's probably not going to agree to give you the card. Which means that you have to go to court to force him to.
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#204 of 305 Old 09-24-2009, 01:57 PM
 
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If you have a 529 accounts(s) for your child(ren), there can only be one owner. The secondary doesn't get any information/power to change it unless the first DIES.

So - my stbx doesn't have me listed as the secondary. Or at least, he refuses to answer the question. Does anyone have something written about accounts for the children? I want to remain as the secondary. Actually, I'm fighting for ownership of the accounts (we were traditional when married, EVERYTHING went in his name only) but would be okay if he provides me with internet access to the accounts and/or monthly statements. But it seems totally WRONG for him to put someone other than me as the secondary owner. Especially if I win sole physical custody, right?

Akie, single mom to M (02/18/06), E (08/04/07) and Z (06/22/09)
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#205 of 305 Old 09-25-2009, 02:10 AM
 
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So I have read through this whole thread borrowed some very useful idea's and added my own. Are any of these completely irrational or likely to be tossed out by a Judge? Oh by the way they are worded funny and pretty random. I meet with a Lawyer through my school on Tuesday and would like to have a general Idea of what I want.


I will consult you regarding all major decision but will have sole decision making authority if we cannot come to an agreement.

My home will be considered Liam's Primary residence

Both Parents will agree to make Liam's needs and best interest a priority in all decisions and communications with each other

They will not participate in any behavior that would diminish Liam's love and respect for the other parent.

If there is an accident, serious injury other parent will be called and allowed to come see Liam even if it is not their time

Both Parents and Liam can call at will (within reason as far as times and amount of calls) Liam will not be forced to talk.

Calls to and from Liam by either parent will not be interfered with, monitored, or recorded for use in any future custody litigation, by either party

Calls between parents will not be monitored or recorded for use in any future custody litigation by either party

Both Parties will remain residing within 60 miles of Eugene until Liam is at least 14 and emotionally ready for long distance visits--unless it is deemed unavoidable?????? not sure how to work this one. but we both need to commit to staying here for Liam though I don't think anything like this would fly unless I could figure out how to word it right

Liam be allowed to breastfeed until he chooses to wean

Both parents must provide itinerary if traveling with Liam out of state

50% Visitation is gradual, step wise and according to Liam's needs and readiness

Whoever has the greater tax advantage and return AND does not have outstanding debt that will be garnished from the return will claim him and split the return with the other party

Child support will be based on guidelines

Child care costs and/or School Tuition will be split 50/50 includes summer camps and activities. (I am fine covering them for a while and having the cs based on you contributing to his child care costs but my subsidy in not permanent)--this gets sticky if he never pays his half and CS is based on him paying his half but he is truly unable to pay it right now.

The Van will be payed off or refinanced out of my name by the time the divorce is final.

You will pay half of the credit card debt to Me and I will make payments to Alliance

No passing messages through Liam.

Both parents will claim right of first refusal

You will set up a trust account for Liam listed as beneficiary of your Life insurance policy with annual proof.

A full background check is provided to the other when one of us plans on living with someone.

No smoking in front of the children

No abusing Alcohol and no illegal substances starting 12 hours before the visit, ending after the children are dropped off with the other party


No Driving with Liam if parent has been consuming any alcohol


will not spend more than one consecutive night with Father until he is at least 42 months old and is deemed ready by both parties.

cannot meet significant others until they have been dating for 6 months and parties will both agree to meet the other significant other prior to introducing to Liam

extracurricular over $100 is split based on percentage income

additional medical/dental or therapeutic expenses over 50.00 is split based on percentage of income--this includes prescriptions, copay,braces and regular counseling etc

Homeschooling/alternative/charter/Waldorf and Montessori will all be viable options for Liam's k-12 education
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#206 of 305 Old 09-25-2009, 08:58 AM
 
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Originally Posted by mamamirranda View Post
So I have read through this whole thread borrowed some very useful idea's and added my own. Are any of these completely irrational or likely to be tossed out by a Judge? Oh by the way they are worded funny and pretty random. I meet with a Lawyer through my school on Tuesday and would like to have a general Idea of what I want.


I will consult you regarding all major decision but will have sole decision making authority if we cannot come to an agreement.
See, this kind of thing is so subjective. Really, you're saying that his opinion doesn't count because you have the final say anyway. I agree that it would be nice to have in there, but I would laugh if someone tried to put that in my agreement.

My home will be considered Liam's Primary residence
Since it sounds like Liam isn't going to be doing overnights yet and he does like with you, I think this is going to sound nit-picky if you propose it. It's obvious that your home is primary, and it may get adversarial if you insist on saying it like that in writing.

Both Parents will agree to make Liam's needs and best interest a priority in all decisions and communications with each other

They will not participate in any behavior that would diminish Liam's love and respect for the other parent.

If there is an accident, serious injury other parent will be called and allowed to come see Liam even if it is not their time

Both Parents and Liam can call at will (within reason as far as times and amount of calls) Liam will not be forced to talk.

Calls to and from Liam by either parent will not be interfered with, monitored, or recorded for use in any future custody litigation, by either party
This will likely already be stock phrasing in the agreement


Calls between parents will not be monitored or recorded for use in any future custody litigation by either party

Both Parties will remain residing within 60 miles of Eugene until Liam is at least 14 and emotionally ready for long distance visits--unless it is deemed unavoidable?????? not sure how to work this one. but we both need to commit to staying here for Liam though I don't think anything like this would fly unless I could figure out how to word it right
I'm pretty sure there will already be a clause in there about how far you will be allowed to move with Liam. Now, I don't really think you can control how far he moves. But my agreement states that if Ex moves farther than XX miles away, we have to go back to mediation to alter the visitation schedule. So he can move if he wants, but he should know that ds may not be coming to visit as much.

Liam be allowed to breastfeed until he chooses to wean
This is just going to make you sound crazy. I'm sorry, but it is DS just weaned himself at 3, and ex didn't even know he was still nursing. No one is going to force you to wean. They may force you to pump, but just keep the extended nursing between you and your son. It looks nuts to the court system.

Both parents must provide itinerary if traveling with Liam out of state
Wish I had this in mine!

50% Visitation is gradual, step wise and according to Liam's needs and readiness
I think you're going to have to be more specific on this. Your ex will look at this and just see that you'll never agree liam is ready. "When Liam shows XX signs of readiness and understands and consents to overnights..." Just Something more detailed.

Whoever has the greater tax advantage and return AND does not have outstanding debt that will be garnished from the return will claim him and split the return with the other party

Child support will be based on guidelines

Child care costs and/or School Tuition will be split 50/50 includes summer camps and activities. (I am fine covering them for a while and having the cs based on you contributing to his child care costs but my subsidy in not permanent)--this gets sticky if he never pays his half and CS is based on him paying his half but he is truly unable to pay it right now.

The Van will be payed off or refinanced out of my name by the time the divorce is final.

You will pay half of the credit card debt to Me and I will make payments to Alliance
Why can't he just pay them directly? I have to say I wouldn't want to give money to my ex and not know what he's going to do with it. I'm not saying you'd just keep it, but that may be the logic that he could argue.

No passing messages through Liam.

Both parents will claim right of first refusal

You will set up a trust account for Liam listed as beneficiary of your Life insurance policy with annual proof.

A full background check is provided to the other when one of us plans on living with someone.


No smoking in front of the children

No abusing Alcohol and no illegal substances starting 12 hours before the visit, ending after the children are dropped off with the other party
The stock phrasing in my agreement was 24-hours before ds' visit. 12 hours and he could still be messed up on something.

No Driving with Liam if parent has been consuming any alcohol


will not spend more than one consecutive night with Father until he is at least 42 months old and is deemed ready by both parties.

cannot meet significant others until they have been dating for 6 months and parties will both agree to meet the other significant other prior to introducing to Liam

extracurricular over $100 is split based on percentage income

additional medical/dental or therapeutic expenses over 50.00 is split based on percentage of income--this includes prescriptions, copay,braces and regular counseling etc

Homeschooling/alternative/charter/Waldorf and Montessori will all be viable options for Liam's k-12 education
Just my thoughts... I think it's pretty good.
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#207 of 305 Old 09-26-2009, 01:44 AM
 
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Thanks to all who have posted here.

Anyone with experience with ex-partners and pot use? Clauses in the parenting agreement seem difficult to enforce, or would one back it up with drug testing? Trying to decide how big of a deal to make it......it's not super-frequent (I think), but is most likely going to occur pretty much forever, as far as I can tell.
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#208 of 305 Old 09-26-2009, 02:04 AM
 
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Thanks to all who have posted here.

Anyone with experience with ex-partners and pot use? Clauses in the parenting agreement seem difficult to enforce, or would one back it up with drug testing? Trying to decide how big of a deal to make it......it's not super-frequent (I think), but is most likely going to occur pretty much forever, as far as I can tell.
As long as there's something in the agreement about no alcohol or drug use within 24 hours of visitation and during all visitation time, I wouldn't worry about it. As long as he's not using it around the kid or under the influence while caring for DC, I don't see a problem with it. A judge is very unlikely to agree to mandatory drug testing for suspected occasional marijuana use, unless you can show that it's affecting his parenting or putting the child at risk.

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#209 of 305 Old 09-26-2009, 02:05 AM
 
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TearyCloud Thanks so much for your feedback I see where you are coming from on most of the things.

"I will consult you regarding all major decision but will have sole decision making authority if we cannot come to an agreement."
"See, this kind of thing is so subjective. Really, you're saying that his opinion doesn't count because you have the final say anyway. I agree that it would be nice to have in there, but I would laugh if someone tried to put that in my agreement".

That is just another way of saying sole custody.

Calls to and from Liam by either parent will not be interfered with, monitored, or recorded for use in any future custody litigation, by either party
This will likely already be stock phrasing in the agreement

True but they don't address recording calls. Ex has a history of recording all of his calls he submitted them in a custody case against his Ex. In Oregon only one party needs to know the call is being recorded for it to be submissive in court.


My home will be considered Liam's Primary residence
Since it sounds like Liam isn't going to be doing overnights yet and he does like with you, I think this is going to sound nit-picky if you propose it. It's obvious that your home is primary, and it may get adversarial if you insist on saying it like that in writing.

True thank you!

Both Parties will remain residing within 60 miles of Eugene until Liam is at least 14 and emotionally ready for long distance visits--unless it is deemed unavoidable?????? not sure how to work this one. but we both need to commit to staying here for Liam though I don't think anything like this would fly unless I could figure out how to word it right
I'm pretty sure there will already be a clause in there about how far you will be allowed to move with Liam. Now, I don't really think you can control how far he moves. But my agreement states that if Ex moves farther than XX miles away, we have to go back to mediation to alter the visitation schedule. So he can move if he wants, but he should know that ds may not be coming to visit as much.

I guess I could live with something like that in there.

Liam be allowed to breastfeed until he chooses to wean
This is just going to make you sound crazy. I'm sorry, but it is DS just weaned himself at 3, and ex didn't even know he was still nursing. No one is going to force you to wean. They may force you to pump, but just keep the extended nursing between you and your son. It looks nuts to the court system.

As it is Li is starting to wean and I think will be done by three, but I wanted something in there showing that he supports Liam's Nursing relationship. I am not thinking he will contest anything but I see your point if bringing that up maybe I should just leave it out.

50% Visitation is gradual, step wise and according to Liam's needs and readiness
I think you're going to have to be more specific on this. Your ex will look at this and just see that you'll never agree Liam is ready. "When Liam shows XX signs of readiness and understands and consents to overnights..." Just Something more detailed.

I hear you. Maybe the lawyer I meet with will have some advice on this one. I think I can set up ages that the changes in visitations can take place, but my concern is what if he is not ready at the age I thought he would be.

You will pay half of the credit card debt to Me and I will make payments to Alliance
Why can't he just pay them directly? I have to say I wouldn't want to give money to my ex and not know what he's going to do with it. I'm not saying you'd just keep it, but that may be the logic that he could argue.

He has never shown that he can pay his bills on time, the debt on those cards is in my name only and if he doesn't pay them I get screwed.


No abusing Alcohol and no illegal substances starting 12 hours before the visit, ending after the children are dropped off with the other party
The stock phrasing in my agreement was 24-hours before ds' visit. 12 hours and he could still be messed up on something.

I think I will just keep it to the illegal substance one but for 24 hours, I trust him to manage alcohol intake responsibly. But I am not sure I would like it if he started smoking pot again. Oh I don't know on some levels I trust him to make good decisions here others I don't. Blah

Again thank you so much.
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#210 of 305 Old 09-26-2009, 02:23 AM
 
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Sorry I don't have time to read the whole thread BUT if I were to change one thing it would have been the wording on visitation.

I found in MI that 'reasonable visitation' has no limits. My ex chose not to return my dd when she was 2 & I spent almost a year battling the courts to get her back because there was no time frame on when he had to return her.

So I guess I would have it set at 'every other weekend' or something specific at least.

Sahm to 2 girls (17 & 15)& Cody (7/09).
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