what do you wish you had put in divorce settlement/parenting agreement? - Mothering Forums
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#1 of 305 Old 04-21-2007, 07:49 PM - Thread Starter
 
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there is a verrry long thread in parents as partners telling my whole sordid tale but briefly: my stbx left me very unexpectedly 5 months ago after 11 years. we have a 3 year old dd and a 9.5 month old ds. stbx was formerly a great dad but has become less and less involved over these past months. we're doing therapy but he has filed for a divorce and refuses to reconsider. he has agreed to give me physical custody and i'm trying to convince him to give me legal custody as well. we are going to try and use a mediator so as to not get into a nasty lawyer battle.

my questions: what didn't you put into your divorce settlement and/or parenting agreement that you now wish you had? what specific things should i ask for? what are the things you are glad you now have in writing? i have trusted this man wholly for years but i want to leave nothing to chance! help me to avoid making mistakes i'll regret later on.
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#2 of 305 Old 04-21-2007, 08:25 PM
 
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My divorce is in progress. But some things I've learned along the way are :

1. My ex priorities money vs. custody much higher than I would have thought. He is much more concerned about the financial aspects, overall. I assumed that wouldn't be the case early on. I'm going to try negotiating by letting him have a bit more in the $ department if he'll let me have the custody wording that I want.
2. Make sure you know what you are getting tax-wise and whether you'll still be able to claim head of household. Make sure it's settled who claims the exemption for your DC.

My financial planner gave me some very wise advice. He said that he felt I should focus less on the short-term financial stuff (like giving ex $5k here or there... we have a lot of retirement assets) and concentrate on the long-term things (like who has what financed in their names, andwhat custody arrangements we have, and whether I will be able to do what I feel is best in terms of schooling or letting Phoenix visit now that ex wants to remarry).

As he pointed out, a few thousand here or there in retirement is something I can make up for as I wish. But having things worded poorly in the custody arrangement is something I will have to live with for a long time.

I started out thinking that the less specific things were worded custody wise, the better, but I"m also rethinking that.

It's too soon for me to know what I'll end up regretting... hopefully mamas with finalized divorces can chime in because I want to know, too!
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#3 of 305 Old 04-21-2007, 08:36 PM
 
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I really like the clause we have that if our kids have extra-curricular type activities (anything over $100) we split based on our percentage of income.
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#4 of 305 Old 04-21-2007, 09:09 PM
 
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not to feed the children food they're allergic to.
payment for preschool and activities
ability for 1 sport season per year or alternate year to be priority and scheduled around for visitation. (ex hasn't expressed any willingness to take dd's to birthday parties on his weekends let alone a soccer games etc.
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#5 of 305 Old 04-21-2007, 09:11 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KristiMetz View Post
1. My ex priorities money vs. custody much higher than I would have thought.
i'm finding this to be true as well...so mind boggling to me. :
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#6 of 305 Old 04-21-2007, 09:15 PM
 
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I had a clause that if he was over fifteen minutes late picking up, visit was cancelled, because I got tired of waiting around for him and he would call after an hour or two and say he was "on the way" only to show up another hour or two later.

You could ask for copays and prescriptions to be split.

Also if you think your children may need braces, put it in now who will pay.

You need to think about who gets the tax deduction.

You could try and use language that neither parent will disparage the other parent and both will be supportive.

You could put how college expenses will be paid.

Hope this helps...
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#7 of 305 Old 04-21-2007, 09:23 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by HappyAgain View Post
I had a clause that if he was over fifteen minutes late picking up, visit was cancelled, because I got tired of waiting around for him and he would call after an hour or two and say he was "on the way" only to show up another hour or two later.
this is a problem i'm having already! : wouldn't have thought to put this in writing.
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#8 of 305 Old 04-21-2007, 10:41 PM
 
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Hi, Still_Snarky, I'm at the very beginning of this, too.

Quote:
Originally Posted by HappyAgain View Post
You could ask for copays and prescriptions to be split.

Also if you think your children may need braces, put it in now who will pay.
I am so confused. So these things, and the other things like activities, copays, college, that pp mentioned, would be in addition to c/s?? I thought I was on my own for those.

Similarly, the house. If we need a new roof or whatever, I was thinking I would be on my own for that since I would be the one living here (god willing I can afford to), even though we would co-own it. So this kind of thing could be written in?

Basically, I thought that once his alimony and c/s were fixed, that was that, and I was on my own for the rest.

Also, my lawyer was suggesting that I offer him 2 of the 3 kids as dependents for tax purposes. early on that would make sense since he'll be earning more money, but as times goes on and the alimony disappears, i'm thinking I'm going to need those exemptions. ??
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#9 of 305 Old 04-22-2007, 12:43 AM
 
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Personally, I kick myself every day for not doing only TWO things...

1. SPECIFICS layed out for financial arrangements. Right now my ex pays CS. That's IT. It's seriously not much. It'll buy her maybe gas money for me to pick her up from his weekend. If i could go back i'd make sure it was in stone... 1/2 daycare, extracurricular, medical co pays, private school, and college. My DD wasn't going to daycare at the time so CS was fine. I've literally been paying for EVERYTHING for the past 4 years. I"m so bitter about not requesting that he provide more b/c I feel like I do everything financially.

2. When can significant others/friends whatever be involved with the childrens daily care. Obviously it's hard to put this on paper, but having simple steps like "children cannot meet significant others until they have been dating for ___ months and parties will both agree to meet the other significant other prior to introducing children" Of course it doesn't have to be that extreme and you can make it to your own preference. It seems ike my ex totally uses his "father" status as a crutch. He cannot be alone with my DD for any period of time. He hasn't been alone with her in 3 years!!! I just wish we had something in the custody agreement that specifies who are going to be around my child and what their involement and relationship will be specifically realted to the upbringing of my kiddo. Im not opposed whatsoever, but I haven't met ANY of the people he brings around my child and I feel like I should at least know who they are. Then again *cough* I have control issues :
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#10 of 305 Old 04-22-2007, 12:06 PM - Thread Starter
 
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MSM, #2 is something I've been thinking about too. He already introduced Miss P to the woman he cheated on me with. O.M.G. When I told him it was completely inappropriate he seemed confused. Riiiiight.
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#11 of 305 Old 04-22-2007, 12:12 PM
 
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I didn't read this thread, but it just popped out in new posts and I thought I would post really quickly that my mom was always really happy she had college funds in her agreement. Good luck!
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#12 of 305 Old 04-22-2007, 12:15 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Still_Snarky View Post
MSM, #2 is something I've been thinking about too. He already introduced Miss P to the woman he cheated on me with. O.M.G. When I told him it was completely inappropriate he seemed confused. Riiiiight.
Exactly. I mean my ex has his flaws (as do I) but seriously i have a feeling if those two SMALL things were outlined in our custody agreement, there would be no arguing! PERIOD! Those two things are the ONLY things we constantly bicker about. I wish I could go back and totally change it. the only thing it says in our agreement is that "both parties shall not engage in immoral acts in front of the child" Uhhmm... define immoral b/c i'm pretty sure we have two totally different perceptions. Obviously the whole "have an orgy on the couch while you're kid is sitting there watching Monsters, Inc" falls under the immoral clause, but i'm not sure what else
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#13 of 305 Old 04-22-2007, 01:49 PM
 
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Also...a right of first refusal clause....meaning that if its his time with the kids and he's going out, he has to give you the first choice to have the kids before using a babysitter or someone else to watch them.
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#14 of 305 Old 04-22-2007, 02:01 PM - Thread Starter
 
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these are great! keep 'em coming!
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#15 of 305 Old 04-22-2007, 02:04 PM
 
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Originally Posted by MsChatsAlot View Post
Also...a right of first refusal clause....meaning that if its his time with the kids and he's going out, he has to give you the first choice to have the kids before using a babysitter or someone else to watch them.
Ooooh, that is a good one to have in there!
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#16 of 305 Old 04-22-2007, 02:06 PM
 
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No overnights until 3 years. And, then it should be a gradual process that takes into consideration the individual needs of the child.
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#17 of 305 Old 04-22-2007, 02:20 PM
 
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subbing...hope i never need this...but me and dh have been fighting ALOT...
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#18 of 305 Old 04-22-2007, 02:23 PM
 
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I wish I had put something about...

him being responsible for any outstanding debts. I was a sahm that had no access to our bills our back acct (one of the reasons I am gone now) and yet I get all the bill collectors calling me because he put things in my name. Grrrr!

I'm glad that I included these things...

Child support is to be the sum of $600 or one third of net income per month, which ever is more, divided into weekly payments.

Visitation- The children will not travel to visit until such a time that the youngest child is 5 years of age. Visitation is to be every other weekend and three weeks per year with alternating Thanksgivings and Christmases. Contact with the children must be consistent and often before children will travel to visit. The father will prove stable environment before the children will travel with/to him.

I wish that I hadn't included...

There is to be a morality clause included that specifies no adult that is not either a relative or spouse may be in the home with our children after 10 pm.
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#19 of 305 Old 04-22-2007, 04:59 PM
 
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I have

uninsured medical expenses cover at 20/80 me/him. He makes 80% of the children's combined support.

1% of his salary every year, until he retires, payable in full by April 15, for my retirement purposes. (too many single moms end up working, supporting themselves and the children with no extra money for retirement) He has yet, in five years of divorce paid this..... I am not too worried, I have the court order and eventually I will start taking him to small claims for each year. (most likely this year)

9.9% interest on all unpaids.

48 hour notice of visits. first refusal, I have them all birthdays, we work out an EOH, thanksgiving... his, Winter break.... mine, Easter is always mine.... spring break EOH.

CS continues until they are out of college, after age 23 the CS amount goes to them directly if they are in Grad school. His family has a family trust that SHOULD pay for their college... if not, I have a 529 that I am putting some into, and we will pay books and tuition for undergrad, and as much as we can with grad.

I wish...

Now that the kids are older, and soccer costs over 900 a year, and the girl's riding lessons are no longer enough to do what she wants.. (she wants to jump and dressage.. with her own horse) I wish I had put in that he pays half of these expenses.
half of summer camps expenses.

half of transportation costs... they go to a non local school, and will need their own transportation, whether it is a car or a decent bike in high school. (no easy city bus route, and live over 10 miles from the high school they will attend.. international high school, Spanish immersion el, and middle schools.. public, but there is no way we could afford to live in the neighborhood)

That if we ever had to go back to court because we could not work things out... HE paid all legal fees.

IMO, CS is only for the basics, food, shelter, clothing, childcare. In a perfect world, my former spouse would happily pony up for the activities his children love and would happily take care of their medical costs without my having to take him to court. It is not happening.

Before you all think I am being way to harsh with him, he makes well over 100K a year, and draws over 50K a year from his family trust.
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#20 of 305 Old 04-22-2007, 07:16 PM
 
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1% of his salary every year, until he retires, payable in full by April 15, for my retirement purposes.
preach on! I am taking notes!

Quote:
CS continues until they are out of college, after age 23 the CS amount goes to them directly if they are in Grad school.
perfect as I hate it when there's some arbitrary age for cut off...anyone think if a kid goes to trades or aprentices how to word that?

Quote:
That if we ever had to go back to court because we could not work things out... HE paid all legal fees.
ooh good one!
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8 might be enough
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#21 of 305 Old 04-22-2007, 07:35 PM
 
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I've read a custody agreement that ensured child would be with each parent on the parent's birthday as well as Mother's/Father's Day.

Tanya
Mom to John (age 11), James (age 9) & Katherine (age 5)
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#22 of 305 Old 04-23-2007, 06:50 PM
 
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Make sure that your parenting plan prioritize things like holidays vs. school breaks vs. special occasions, etc. -- that is, make sure you spell out what kind of event takes precedence over another kind, so that if your birthday falls on his weekend you both know which one of those takes priority, likewise if you have the kids Christmas day but that falls on his weekend, etc. It can be a hassle if this kind of thing isn't clear.
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#23 of 305 Old 04-24-2007, 03:13 AM
 
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Hi,

my situation is a little different because we were never married and we split up when I was pregnant. I didn't have a clue about custody/child support/etc etc. If I had, I soooo would have taken care of it before I had ds! So...after my ds was born and the ex started coming around (and acting like a real charmer, let me tell ya...) I found myself a new (sleep-deprived, post-c-section pain) mama sitting in a lawyer's office totally freaking out. Luckily, the lawyer had a standard custody agreement that was actually really cool and detailed. It had a lot of the stuff in it already that you guys are talking about. Things I never would have thought of because I had never been through anything like this. Anyway, he just had me add some things of my own that were really important. I added that my ds could not be in the home of anyone who smoked anything inside, because the ex smoked pot inside and I was really worried about that (and his poor judgment in relation to it). Also that he could not have any visits if under the influence of anything...I think the exact language was something like "for 24 hours proceeding the visit". We also did supervised visits until ds was 6 months, then started a very gradual visitation program.

Good luck
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#24 of 305 Old 04-24-2007, 03:31 PM - Thread Starter
 
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i'm hoping things like holidays will be fairly simple since he doesn't want to share physical custody. he sees them for a MAX of 10 hours a week, usually more like 4-6. nonetheless, everything will be put into writings. god, i never thought i'd be in this place. though, i suspect none of us did... :
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#25 of 305 Old 04-25-2007, 05:01 PM
 
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Things I have that I like:
-Holiday (and birthday) schedules taking precedence over weekends
-He has to pay 52% of educational expenses (which is vague, but our DD is in private school, and my legal source says that can be interpreted as an educational expense.)
-He has the kids for two weeks in the summer (one in July and August), and he is supposed to let me know when those weeks are by May 1st or else he doesn't get them. He never takes those weeks!

Things I didn't get that should have been in there:
-They should have made him sell his car or refi. Mine was paid off, but his was only a year old when he left me for someone else. Both names are on the loan, but he got the car. He hasn't paid on time EVER, and it is actually almost a year late in getting paid off because he is that far behind. My lawyer said you can't make someone refinance, but I would never ever let that happen again. My credit is so in the toilet.
-We don't address the $ of extracurricular activities and I get nickle and dimed left and right on those.
-Right of first refusal. XH dumps his kids on the girlfriend all of the time. In the early days, he actually had his gf's 14 year old sister babysit our autistic child, and there was nothing I could do about it. Now, they just bring the kids home early when they have stuff to do.
-Sleeping/living arrangements when they are at their dad's. XH and gf have a 2 bedroom house right now, and my 9 year old DD is having to share a room with her 12 year old brother and gf's 5 year old son. : And there's nothing I can do about it. I know someone whose kids stay in a tack room of an old (non-converted but no longer used) horse barn when with their dad.

Things I wish I didn't have in there but I do:
-The two weeks in the summer (but I fought that as much as possible.)

Some parents also have problems with their exes not letting the kids talk to them when visiting. If you anticipate that being a problem, you'll want to write in that you will have unlimited phone access to the kids when they are with him.
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#26 of 305 Old 04-25-2007, 06:06 PM - Thread Starter
 
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my god, i never knew what other single parents had to deal with. for all of us.

these suggestions are great btw, much more thorough than the NOLO parenting agreement book i spent $25 on.
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#27 of 305 Old 04-25-2007, 06:33 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Still_Snarky View Post
my god, i never knew what other single parents had to deal with. for all of us.

these suggestions are great btw, much more thorough than the NOLO parenting agreement book i spent $25 on.
This was a good idea for you to post this- wish I had gotten more advice from "been there, done that" parents! My lawyer was good but too nice and by the book.
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#28 of 305 Old 04-26-2007, 11:38 AM
 
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I haven't done my agreement yet, but I intend to put in a clause about medical stuff - ie vaccinating, medical treatments if God forbid they ever get sick or are in an accident. And schooling. I want to home school or alternative school and while he agrees now, it might not be so convienient for him in 5 years.
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#29 of 305 Old 04-26-2007, 12:37 PM
 
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Something I like, but will likely never use b/c my ex is, erm, something other than reasonable, is the language before the "possesion" schedule which says, "Possesion to be as agreed by both parties. In the absence of agreement, the following shall apply..." It leaves the door open for making workable arrangements, but gives an outline of what to do in lieu of that.

I wish we had something about our (ex's and my) birthdays.

We live 1000 miles away from my family, so as we move from Temporary Orders to Final, it is imperative to me that I retain my two uninterrupted weeks during the summer, during the time span that I want, so we can go home.
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#30 of 305 Old 04-26-2007, 03:31 PM
 
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I wish we had a clause making overnights conditional on DD's father keeping up with regular visits (not overnights) here.

He currently has open visitation at our house with 15 days notice (he lives in another country) and 5 weeks (overnights) per year with her in his country (3 in summer and 2 at Xmas; or 5 weeks in summer - alternating years).

But, he seems to have decided to stop visiting her here. And those summer/Xmas weeks just seem too much at her age (4 now) when it will have been 6 (some years, 12 other years) months since they have been in the same place together.

So far, it's not a major issue since he seems willing to work out other arrangements. But if he ever gets a bug up his rear end...
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