I feel like it would be a good thing for me to wander to a different thread and define why I think *I* am not doing a "career" as I raise my children as opposed to saying things that offend other people. Definitions vary.
I don't think it is a betrayal of feminism. I don't think it's a waste of resources. I think my education is being fabulously used... but I still don't feel that this is a career for me. Or maybe I'll blog about it because at least then I won't piss off MDC. ha.
My advice may not be appropriate for you. That's ok. You are just fine how you are and I am the right kind of me.
Mothering is absolutely my full time career now. Its also my full time job.(no fulltime is 9-5, i work 24/7) Its also a relationship with three people. It consumes my whole body and soul and mind, and i choose it that way.
If only i got paid to pursue this career, i dont.
But mothering (parenting) really defies definition.
For a nanny who gets paid, its a job.
If youre a teacher, its a career.
But if youre a homeschooling sahm (or even not homeschooling, cos i really feel like im a teacher alot of the time), youre not really anything...youre just a woman/a bit of a loser really...probably not that bright, a little overweight maybe? (noone said that here, but the attitude is certainly out there)
Feminisim came along and gave us choices to pursue careers outside the home. Im glad about that and i benefited. But the philosophical dilemmas around work and reproduction have never been solved.
So mothering is a career, and it isnt.
Mothering is certainly hard work, and probably the most challenging work i can think of though, whatever you wish to call it.
Hey, i enjoy a challenge!
I don't think they are. And I think that contention is a bit ironic after all the oversensitivity that has come from the other side.
Like I said above about the double standard, this definitely can go both ways.
Well, in an attempt to be as objective as possible, based on the definition from Wikipedia by way of the Oxford English dictionary that I provided in post #232, anyone who does any work, for themselves, their family, or someone else, paid or not, outside the home or at home, falls under this definition. I think this part... "It can also pertain to an occupation or a profession that usually involves special training or formal education, and is considered to be a person’s lifework." Being a mother is definitely a person's lifework and it is definitely a career. So is being a teacher, nurse, artist, writer. You can also argue that being a mother does require training and an education. It definitely does!!!! From day one, you are training yourself and educating yourself to be a good mother, to make the right choices, to do the right thing. As an example, going to LLL or another breastfeeding help organization can definitely be considered an education and training, so, sure, it totally makes sense to call it a career... if you choose.
I personally don't have a problem with mothers calling mothering a career, just like I don't have a problem with mothers calling mothering something else... as long as it's not just mothering. I've heard that before and THAT is insulting.
The people drawing a distinction between mothering and "real" careers don't always give me the feeling that they think mothering qualifies as something *equal* to a career. There's an undertone that stay at home mothering is somehow "less than" or a betrayal of feminism or a waste of talents or education -- or that it drags down society financially. Or that motherhood should be more like other relationships -- friendships -- dating -- things that are "on the side" or otherwise not the core of one's life.
I agree for the most part. I don't think people on this thread think like this though.
It's great to see this lively discussion! Please note, though, that there are posts in this thread that make critical generalizations about others. As a reminder, the User Agreement states "we expect our members to keep conversations civil and on topic, and uphold the integrity and diversity of the community. We value the honest and supportive exchange of ideas and opinions, and we ask that members avoid negative characterizations and generalizations about others." In addition, it further states "Hate posts and personal attacks will not be tolerated. Treat others as you would want to be treated. Attacking someone to provoke a negative response is not allowed." Please edit your posts if they make negative characterizations or generalizations about others or attack another poster. Accusing someone of being overly sensitive is not appropriate.
In addition, there are several posts discussing concerns about other posts in this thread. Concerns about other posts should not be raised in a thread. The proper avenue for addressing concerns about other posts is via reporting (flagging) a post or PMing a moderator or administrator. Please edit your posts if they contain concerns about other posts in this thread or what should and should not be posted here.
And, now, back to the lively discussion!
Its OT to the thread i know, but the discussion on mothering and careers, and whether they are the same or different is something in the back of my mind constantly, and i would say it is probably the same for many educated mothers...whose education that is, would have given them other choices. (except if you have an liberal arts degree...right?)
Welcome to MDC, DHinJersey! It's nice to have a father here discussing things!
What if, instead of coming onto this thread slamming Sustainer, you asked some questions of her? Maybe ask her why, in your opinion, she's hedged her position? What do you think she's said that is "dripping w/ misandry?"
IMO, these are things that will further the discussion.