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"I supplement once a day... I mean, I need a break! don't you think?"

6K views 177 replies 48 participants last post by  Momtwice 
#1 ·
Arggg.. I was completely *enraged* last night where I work.
Well, I work at a Children's store part time, and this lady came in with this 2 week old beautiful baby. She was beautiful, she looked like a little angel.
Well, the baby's grandma was holding the baby and the mom was right next to her. The grandma said "my daughter is trying to breastfeed" and I said "oh, that's great. You will love it, it is so good for them too". and then she said "yeah, but I supplement ONLY once a day, you know, I need a break here! don't you think?"

ok, as you can imagine my face changed right after she said that, and I imagined this poor little 2 week old drinking that formula, when her mother IS there and CAN exclusively breastfeed her.. I mean, if you have the milk and are home full-time, why not do it? would it kill you to sacrifice your "space" for your child? There are so many children out there that cannot enjoy the benefits of breastmilk, because their mothers need their "space"...

I am saddened to see where our world is going...
 
#53 ·
Setting all judgements aside, I have to say that *often times* (notice I didn't say "everytime") supplementing, esp. at 2 wks. of age, is a really, really crappy idea if the mom wants to make breastfeeding work. I just went through this with a friend. She had a premie that had to stay in the hospital after she went home. She pumped while he was in the hospital, but never at night. Well, she got "used to sleeping at night" (her words) and didn't want to have to get up at night with a newborn after he came home, so she decided to give "just one bottle at night so she could get some sleep". But let's look at how this played out. She would nurse him at 9 PM, put him to bed, he would sleep for 4 hours or so, get a bottle of formula that filled him up so he would sleep *another* 4-5 hours (he would wake around 6 AM). So she now has a lowbirth weight newborn who needs tremendous calories for the growth spurts he is having and mom is not nursing from 9 PM until 6 AM. And now she has supply issues and the ped wants her to supplement after every feed with formula. How much longer do you think it will be before this baby is totally on formula? For a problem that could have been solved as easily as by telling her "if you want to make this work, you aren't going to be able to sleep all night"?

This scenario is all too common in our society. And yet we hear "experienced" mothers recommend to their friends who are new moms to give "just one bottle of formula a day" so they can have a break ALL THE TIME. Yes, some are blessed with bountiful supplies and babies thrive. But I think the scenario I've described above is more common than we would like to acknowledge. And society's answer - why, more formula! of course. And here at MDC we can't put to lie the notion that routine supplementing is totally harmless?

edited for spelling
 
#54 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by Mom2six
This scenario is all too common in our society. And yet we here "experienced" mothers recommend to their friends who are new moms to give "just one bottle of formula a day" so they can have a break ALL THE TIME. Yes, some are blessed with bountiful supplies and babies thrive. But I think the scenario I've described above is more common than we would like to acknowledge. And society's answer - why, more formula! of course. And here at MDC we can't put to lie the notion that routine supplementing is totally harmless?
Well said, Chava!
 
#55 ·
So many great posts!


Last year I got reamed here on the Support and Advocacy board for posting my thought that WIC should not give free formula without a prescription. I actually didn't post on any of the bf'ing boards at MDC for awhile after that I was so mad. Boy, did that make some moms mad when I said that.
It would be easy enough to get a prescription or a signed note from the pediatrician, wouldn't it? Seriously though, they offered formula every time I went in (I've since refused WIC because eating too much dairy gives me the runs and they won't give bf'ing moms the benefits after baby turns 1yo)... "are you supplementing at all?" Me- "No!". WIC- "If you need any formula, be sure to call us." Every time they offered. Not just once, but every time I went in... despite the fact that I told them dd nursed until 20 months and dd would wean himself.
: They also gave me a hard time that dd doesn't drink milk, even when she was still nursing.
:

So yes, I put a Militant Breastfeeding Cult picture on my website (since I don't want to be referred to as a nazi) and I boycott Nestle (gotta remember to check those labels, I bought a bar of chocolate at the hfs and after I gave a piece to dd I saw Nestle on the back
).

I don't hate moms who need to supplement, but I am very tired of formula being marketed to the public. How many girls/women just assume formula is just as good as human breastmilk. Sorry, it's not. It's wonderful for babies who can't nurse for whatever reason, it will keep them alive and growing... but it's not breastmilk. All I say, is that when the breastmilk is available- the baby deserves to receive that yummy milk.
 
#56 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by gethane
FF mommies get support for their choice throughout our entire society. It's on TV, its in advertising. When's the last time a FF mommy was asked to cover up while bottle feeding, or to use the restroom to bottlefeed?

.

Such a good post!!!!!

AMEN!!!!
 
#57 ·
I totally agree that some boards here are very mainstream lately! just when I thought I's finally found a place for me...

anyway, I just think supplementing with formula just because you need a break is totally mainstream... but this is IMO and based on my personal experience..

ok.. fire away again!
 
#58 ·
I just wanted to share my experience. After a ped visit when my baby was 1 week old, I decided to give myself permission to give him a single bottle of formula up to once per day. I think that for me, this choice was an absolute lifesaver and a sanity saver. And since I was not experiencing any problems with milk supply, the choice was purely about giving myself a break once per day from breastfeeding.

As a single mom, with no car living in a small town and no help who was stuck inside with a newborn during a very cold winter, I felt really overwhelmed with having to be responsible for every single one of my baby's needs. Perhaps if I had a partner who could have cooked or shopped or done laundry once in awhile or changed a diaper or done ANYTHING at all, breastfeeding 10-14 times per day would not have felt quite as overwhelming. But being single and responsible for EVERYTHING left me needing to find some small space or time for myself. Obviously, I couldn't take a break by actually leaving the baby, but a bottle was a small space.

My son ate every 40 minutes to 2 hours for the first couple of months of his life. Giving him a bottle every once in awhile, meant not just a break in terms of time, but more importantly, once in awhile it gave me a stretch of time in which my body was my own again. My son nurses and co-sleeps and I'm very happy with those choices but I really think that it is likely if I had not allowed myself to occassionally supplement, I would have either given up on breastfeeding or given up on co-sleeping. I needed a tiny bit of freedom in those first days and using a bottle a few times per week gave me that sense of freedom and that I had a self outside the baby.

As it was, we got through those first two months, and I have (almost) never used formula again. Since the time that he was 10 weeks old, I've been exclusively breastfeeding on the 4 days per week that he is home with me and he gets almost exclusively EBM on the 3 days that he goes to day care. Each day, I send him with 3 bottles of breastmilk and one of formula. He drinks the three of breastmilk --once in a great while, he has very hungry day and also has a fourth bottle (formula). But 9 out of 10 times, he does not get to the fourth bottle and given how difficult, I find pumping, I decided that I'd rather have a bottle of formula thrown out almost every day than a precious bottle of EBM.

Come to think of it, although I gave myself permission to give him formula once per day, I ended up actually giving him formula far less often than my "permission" allowed so it was more about giving up the guilt than about actually using the formula. Prior to the ped visit, I was so worried about nipple confusion or lessening my milk supply or about early weaning, that I was determined not to give him a bottle for at least a couple of months and never formula. But honestly, I think in my case, my initial refusal to use a bottle just caused me stress and guilt.

The truth is that the occassional bottle (it ended up being a few times per week), never interfered with my milk supply, I still have plenty for him. And at six months, he clearly prefers nursing to drinking from a bottle and certainly prefers breastmilk to formula. My hope is that this will remain the case for at least a year or more.

By the time that I went back to work when he was 10 weeks or so old, life had gotten a little bit easier and I was less overwhelmed. Plus, I had 3 days per week at my job which gave me a break of sorts (and some adult company!). Thus, I no longer felt the need for a break from breastfeeding so I rarely use a bottle now and the rare times that I do, it is always thawed breastmilk.

I know that someone wrote that if the woman needed a break, she should use EBM. That might work for some women, but I find the whole cleaning the equipment, pumping etc process extremely onerous and I never produce much milk. It would not have been a break for me to give up a nursing session in favor of a pumping session. A break was pouring a can of liquid formula into a disposable liner so that all I had to do was feed the baby and then wash the nipple and collar later. I did not even use the powder mix. So while I did not do it often, it was a huge help when I did --often when I was feeling absolutely at the end of my rope.

In fact, I could not even find a spare moment to research and purchase a good pump for my needs (in my price range) for more than a month after the baby was born. Figuring out which pump to buy and learning how to use it was a difficult process and there was no way that I would have been able to use EBM in the first few weeks after he was born. In fact, I still can't pump and nurse at the same time, I just don't seem to be that coordinated. I really can only pump when the baby is at day care and I did not have child care in those first two months.

my 2 cents
clarissa
 
#59 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by loving-my-babies
Arggg.. I was completely *enraged* last night where I work. Well, I work at a Children's store part time, and this lady came in with this 2 week old beautiful baby. She was beautiful, she looked like a little angel. Well, the baby's grandma was holding the baby and the mom was right next to her. The grandma said "my daughter is trying to breastfeed" and I said "oh, that's great. You will love it, it is so good for them too". and then she said "yeah, but I supplement ONLY once a day, you know, I need a break here! don't you think?"
If this woman is already needing a break from her baby after ONLY 2 weeks, what is she going to be like in 6 months or a year or two years?

I know what she'll be like, I've seen it way to many times! She'll be one of those people that shoves her baby/child off on anyone that will watch her for a few hours so she can go do whatever she wants. Some people need to realize that being a parent is about putting your child first, doing what is best for them!
 
#60 ·
YOu know, all these posts make me very sad. I could have very easily been the mom in need of the break.

YOu don't know what her labor and delivery were like. Or if she was getting enough help at home.

I had to pump foor dev becaue she has laryngomalacia and was unable to nurse efficently. However, my mom was no help, and dh, who managed to get a job during this time, had to work14-16 hours a day. I had no help. I was physically exhausted, and still very very weak from my labor (nearly requeried a blood transfusion due to hemmoraging). If my friend had not been out on disability, and able to take me to her home for 2 weeks, I would have had to supplement for my sanity and health.

I had to nurse dd fro 15 min ( she was unable to nurse longer than that), pump, and supplement with ebm, to do it again an hour later. around the clock. Using the finger feeding method took about 30-40 min at a time, which meant between cleaning equipment, syringes, etc, I maybe got 15 min to rest before doing it again. My daughter spent 45 min of almost every hour eating. My friend was able to help by washing the equipment, and most importanly, giving me a 4 hour streach of sleep at night where she fed dev for me with ebm. I needed that break to make milk. I was suffering from serious ppd brought on by sleep deprivation. My mom knew NOTHING about bf. She just didn't know anything.

Dev has gotten formula 3 times: in the hospital 3 hours after birth because I was too weak to feed her, at 5 days old because my mil hadn't come in ahd she lost about 15% of her birth weight and was jaundiced, and the lc said to give it to her so she could be fed until she came with the pump, and at 2 months when I was hospitalized with a migraine and my in laws didn't find my frozen milk. I used to feel guilt over it. I refuse to now.

You don't know what is happening in her life. Don't be so quick to judge.
 
#61 ·
The grandmother said the mother was trying to breastfeed. The mother may not have cared to go into a long speech about her parenting choices with a stranger.

But the stranger is enraged. The stranger's face changed. There are a lot of posts talking about how this board is for support and advocacy. Does that mean we only support and advocate breastfeeding to members of this board? The OP was moved enough to come here and rant, but not moved enough to offer support and information to the mom who is trying to adjust to life with a nursing newborn?

This is what got my back up. That we only support those who do it 100% and do it our way and that we can rant about them but not offer a helping hand. If you want to let off steam, FINE. I've got no problem with that. But other mamas here might be able to help you see the other side of the coin so you won't feel so "enraged". Should I support you in your judgement of this other mother? Should I support your prejudice against someone who is nursing her child all but ONE feeding a day? Or can I help you understand where she's coming from? Can I show you how there are other ways to approach the situation emotionally?

Had your post included something like, "I was so upset, but I told her if she needed anything to call me or email me." OR "I gave her the URL for these boards.", I think this thread would have been much different.

Cluck your tongues at other parents. But only after you've offered them what you can to make their lives better and easier and they've refused your help. If you don't have the time or resources to help out, try to at least give them your compassion. You don't know what it's like to be them.
 
#64 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by chellemarie
This is what got my back up. That we only support those who do it 100% and do it our way and that we can rant about them but not offer a helping hand.
Well said - I think this is what got my feathers ruffled as well.

Kitty
 
#66 ·
I have so many feelings on this subject. And I feel yucky and crabby today so shouldn't even be posting. :LOL With my first two kids I supplemented because the nurses/dr.'s etc pushed it so much! I was ignorant so I did it. Not because I needed a break (which I did "need" but motherhood doesn't really allow for that esp. in the first year) but b/c I was made to feel like I was denying my babies something if I didn't give them formula. I was also a single mother with my oldest child, 18, and a senior in high school. I had a job and almost got fired for pumping in the bathroom when someone turned me in saying I was using a vibrator in there!
Anyway, my point with that is that I know what it's like to be single, young, and need a break. However, it was banged into my head when I was pg at 17 that this was MY choice to become a mother and there was a lot of responsibility that went with it. For that reason, I have not done the whole "I'm not getting sleep or a rest or whatever" thing. If I was expected to be the best most responsible parent at age 18 when my future was less than bright then why not at 30 when I have a good life? I found Mothering when my 3rd child was born and was so glad to not supplement him. I exclusevly nursed him until he was 1 (which was 3 months longer than his older siblings) and am currently tandem nursing my 3 1/2 year old and 18 month old. Neither one has ever had a bottle. Do I get exhausted? Of course! Do I not deserve a break? Yes but why does it have to be a feeding break? Why not nurse the baby and then take a hot bath, a nap, whatever?

That said, this is a breastfeeding support board. I think many of us have come here with gripes about FF babies or other similar issues. I supplemented FF with my first two kids and don't feel offended by what I read here. I just didn't know. And if you do know and feel comfortable with your decisions then no offense needs to be taken, KWIM? For those of you that "know" with your first children I'm jealous for sure! But don't feel angry when you all talk about it. As for the lady in the store, there's really nothing you could do. She's just following what she's been told. So be angry at society and the media and advertising. That's what I do!
to all of you!
 
#67 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by ekblad7
Do I get exhausted? Of course! Do I not deserve a break? Yes but why does it have to be a feeding break? Why not nurse the baby and then take a hot bath, a nap, whatever?
I suppose that this is the part that I find difficult to understand. What single mother of a newborn has time to nap or take a bath? Even though my kid is six months old, I can count the number of naps that I've had on less than one hand, and they have all been when the baby has been at day care and I decided to skip work for a day because I was so tired (risky business for keeping my job!). I know that I have it worse than some mothers since even as a newborn, my son never slept more than 10 or so hours in a 24 hour period. But the kid almost never takes a nap for more than 15 minutes in a row --certainly not on a schedule that I can count on him sleeping long enough for me to fall asleep myself (besides everything else that needs to get done during those 15 minutes).

As for a bath, I've had two in six months because someone was kind enough to come spend the night so that I could sleep and regroup.

I know that I am not going to change any minds here, but I think that deciding to once in awhile give a bottle was my first lesson in understanding that no, I won't always be a perfect parent. I can have an idea or a standard, but I need to be flexible enough when it is not working to try something different.

Also, it was a recognition that I needed to have some of my own needs met as well. I have not run a ton of AP stuff just Dr. Sears and a few mothering articles, but I think that a good parent must be a healthy parent. For me, taking care of my health meant recognizing that I could say up to once per day that my body was my own (so with a baby feeding 14 or so times a day, I got 1 time in which I could take care of me while still feeding him because no one else was going to).

Maybe some mothers manage to remain the perfect parent and never compromise on any of their ideals, but I'm not sure that this is actually a great lesson for kids in the long run. I don't have many months as a parent under my belt, but I have many years of teaching experience and one of the valuable lessons that we try to teach our students is that they may not always be able to accomplish everything they expect. Or they might not be able to do everything that they think is important all at the same time. They need to recognize when they get overwhelmed and problem solve to figure out what can change. Instead of disliking themselves or giving up on the whole process, they should try to understand what they can and cannot do and then compromise and be flexible.

To be honest, I don't know even if I had found a time for a nap or a bath (and believe me there wasn't), if those types of things would have given me the same thing that a break from breastfeeding did. I think that the definition of break varies among people mine was about my body. I also does not think that choosing to have a break from nursing at 2 weeks will somehow turn into leaving my child with random people in order to go shopping! It just meant that I found a way for the first two months of my postpartum period to take care of myself a bit, keep sane in a challenging time. After 10 weeks, we went back to exclusively breastfeeding without any problems.

For the record, I am not young and I went into choosing to have child as a single woman with my eyes as wide open as possible. No regrets at all. But it has been a learning process --no matter how prepared I might have been for the reality of being a new mom, it has been both more challenging and more joyous than I ever knew.

I would think that support means supporting all breastfeeding mothers not just ones who do it "perfectly."

clarissa
 
#68 ·
Chiming back in. It was the need a break comment that did it for me.

My second child had colic. She bawled six hours a day for 2 months. Finally, yes, I did need a break. I rented a hotel room for the weekend about 15 minutes away. And went there with my sewing maching and pieced a quilt top for my son. And drove back every 3-4 hours to feed my baby! And I was "only 23" at the time, and also had an 19 month old (when she was born, he was almost 2 when I did the weekend "away").

Ya know, most of us who are successful breastfeeders have hard luck stories too. My last baby, born in November, I had a horrible time getting him on the breast. He lost almost 13% of his birthweight. He had jaundice and was under glowy blanket at home. He had reflux and bawled constantly. Finally, had to put sugar water on my nipples every feeding time for over 2 weeks. I worried and worried that my nursing relationship would fail. And still I did it. He's still a pretty horrible feeder and my nipples are sore probably 3 weeks out of every month because of how he pulls of, gets on, kicks and squirms and knocks himself off, gets on. I just nurse him laying down now, unless we're out in public and I have to do it sitting. It's a matter of priorities. And the priorities of our society MUST change if we ever hope to see breastfeeding as more than a fringe practice.

So if you aren't "enraged" over a woman who's needing a break with a 2 week old infant, that's fine. Personally, every time I hear about a person that chose to have a child, but then doesn't want to give it the best they can, I am enraged. But to each their own I suppose.

This isn't about people who "can't" breastfeed. No one is critical of them. This is about women who CAN breastfeed, and choose not too, or choose to supplement, putting their nursing relationship in jeopardy. This isn't about me, this isn't about you. It's about supplementing being one step on the road to failure, either quickly, or by shortening the breastfeeding relationship by months.

I don't know how you can truly believe breastfeeding is best, and still find all these excuses why its ok if a woman "chooses" not to do what's best for her baby.

Edit: wait a minute, did I miss something in the original post that identifed the mother shopping as a single mother? If not, why are we talking about how single mother's need a break?

Also, before someone jumps on me for not understanding about single mothers, I was a single mother with three children, no car, no job, and no work experience. That was 6 years ago.
 
#69 ·
I suspect that the woman has very little support for or information about breastfeeding and is just doing her best. She probably doesn't know that by formula feeding she is decreasing her own milk supply and compromising her infant's health. But to give her a dirty look or look away, what is that saying to her? It's only throwing more negativaty on the breastfeeding situation. Support and/or positivity would be better. Often times there is NO support for breastfeeding within the family and friends. Her doctor is probably supporting her supplementing, and possibly her whole family. We all know it can be difficult. We need to support all women who are trying to do their best to take care of their babies.
 
#70 ·
Well i'm just going to end my participation in this thread with one last comment because its making me feel like tearing my hair out in frustration.

I think its fine that the OP came here and vented about something she saw in public that made her feel *enraged*. That's what she felt, and that's what she posted, and everyone else can post all day about why she shouldn't feel the way she did, but I don't think that's going to change how some of us FEEL when we see things that are almost surely going to lead to bf failure. This isn't a post about how she slapped the woman silly, or beat her over the head with a rotting fish. It's about the OP saying she FELT enraged. I for one, think that's perfectly fine.
 
#71 ·
I am far from a perfect parent, that's for sure! But who gives the baby a bottle that couldn't hold him/her while you had a break? I guess I don't get that part. I never had anyone to do either so I didn't have time "off" either. That's part of being a parent, IMO. Yes, a healthy parent is a good parent, I agree with that. But when your baby is 2 wks old you should just be bonding and that's about it. Now when they're 15 months or so, taking a half day to pamper yourself is great! Or even an hour at the gym, on a walk, whatever. Parenting is NOT easy. It doesn't make you feel good all the time. That's just the way it is. Our society, IMO, is way to focussed on things being easy. We (in America) do have it pretty easy as far as many things go. We should appreciate that and suck up the rest.
 
#72 ·
I guess a question is, what is the best way to support her? I don't think agreeing that supplementation is a good idea or that, yes, she needs a break, is truly supporting her or her baby. That is more like enabling. I think the best way to support her is to try to correct the misinformation she has received. And as a society, we need not only to correct the idea that supplementation is not detrimental to breastfeeding and to baby's health, but that babies have needs and we have to be prepared not to be able to get a break sometimes. That's part of being a parent -- their needs come first.

And I do understand the OP's feelings, whether they are "correct" or not. I can't tell you how sad I am when I go to pick up my son at daycare and see another formerly BF baby with a big can of formula. I can rationally understand why it happens. I know how hard it is to maintain a supply while pumping at work. But it still makes me sad. And odds are, this baby will be on 100% formula before he/she turns 1.
 
#73 ·
Just popping back in for a moment to make a point. All you ladies with stories of giving yourself permission to give bottles so that you could have a break under trying circumstances - you do see that the examples you are giving are NOT what the OP was addressing, right? I'm getting the sense that most people can't get past their suspicion that the OP is pointing a finger at them to see that we are talking about two different things! ROUTINE SUPPLEMENTATION ON A DAILY BASIS is NOT the same as "I gave myself permission to give an occassional bottle so as not to lose my mind". Society at large pushes the idea that mom's who exclusively bf are martyrs and that you can't have any time to yourself, yadda yadda yadda - so you need to give that baby a bottle of formula at least once a day so that you can have a break! But that mindset totally ingnores the reality that doing so *can* have a detrimental effect on breastfeeding. Period.

Edited to add: I keep forgetting to mention that if you look in parentnig books like "What to Expect" and Dr. Spock, replacing a feeding a day with a bottle of formula is the same method they recommend for weaning a breastfed baby to a bottle if the mom wants to quit breastfeeding. Your body makes less milk and then you replace another feed with a bottle. Interesting that it is recognized in this context but seen as not a problem when done on a daily basis for "a break"!
 
#74 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by Wildcrafter
She probably doesn't know that by formula feeding she is decreasing her own milk supply and compromising her infant's health. But to give her a dirty look or look away, what is that saying to her? It's only throwing more negativaty on the breastfeeding situation.

This is interesting.... society tells mothers that formula is just as good as breastmilk. (or better, some doctors say, this is what I was told when I had dd, that formula was EVEN BETTER... pleeease!)
Everyone accepts formula, it's everywhere, it's even "trendy" to ff, people look at YOU weird when you say you bf after a certain age, and you don't have to right to do the same? this is not fair. People give ME dirty looks sometimes when I'm NIP, why can't I do the same to ff mamas?
People think we are weirdos for wanting to nurse until are babies are ready, I think that gives us the right to think they are weirdos for giving their babies artificial milk BY CHOICE when they could be giving them the best.
IMO, there is enough information out there to know bm is far much better than formula.
 
#76 ·
Quote:

Originally Posted by ekblad7
But when your baby is 2 wks old you should just be bonding and that's about it.

Exactly! The baby was 2 WEEKS OLD! if you already need to supplement your baby at 2 weeks old in order to take a break, what will you do when your baby is 2 MONTHS OLD in order to take a break? This is what parenting is all about. It is exhausting, and we all need breaks, but will you compromise your baby's health so you can rest? I wouldn't.

I had my dd as a teen, and even though my husband (her father) was always there for me, I was alone, 17 and trying to figure things out all by myself, trying to juggle school, caring for my dd without anyone to help me other than my dh. I was beyond EXHAUSTED, but I chose to bf exclusively until I had to wean for medical issues at 3 months. and still at 3 months.. I did not want to wean her!
And formula does compromise baby's health. I am a believer in that all babies have at least a small allergic reaction to formula.
 
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