AARGH...family stuff (very long rant) - Mothering Forums

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Old 04-14-2006, 06:06 PM - Thread Starter
 
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DH gets a call from FIL yesterday saying that they feel uncomfortable with me NIP our 5 month old DD (we just saw them this past weekend for dinner at a restaurant). We are invited to spend time with them for an Easter/birthday celebration this weekend and I guess they wanted to 'warn' us beforehand that they would not be tolerant of my nursing DD in front of them in their house. The following is the email exchange that happened this morning. Any input or advice would be greatly appreciated, as both DH and I are under a lot of stress about all of this. THANK YOU, wise mamas...

letter from DH to FIL:
Dad,

Thanks again for trying to be sensitive with bringing up yesterday's discussion on nursing. I was aware of your efforts, and I appreciate it. As I'm sure you could tell from our talk, we have dissenting views on the etiquette regarding nursing in public.

Perhaps you are right that part of these differences stem from traditions from some of those from the older generations mixing with more progressive views from the younger generations. But after thinking about it for a while, M and I do find it interesting that of all of our family, friends, and neighbors, only the H family has an issue with nursing in public. Most people just don't find it that big of a deal anymore. We have even had a number of strangers approach us in public and praise us for having an open nursing relationship.

That being said, we do respect our family members and elders. Therefore, while we have not changed our belief that M should be able to nurse K whenever and wherever she wants and needs to, we will refrain from doing so while under your roof or the grandparent's roof.

You mentioned that you have had discussions with family members regarding your shared discomfort regarding nursing in public. Everyone is entitled to their opinions, but I am going to strongly suggest that people not voice any condescending opinions to us (particularly this week-end). Of course we know that you and J (SMIL) would never do this. Perhaps it would be best for you to talk with your parents and give them a bit of a briefing, and suggest that they (your mom in particular) not make any inappropriate comments. In the interest of family harmony, M and I would prefer to avoid coming under attack for our beliefs, but if we are pushed, we will go toe to toe with anyone and uphold the decisions that we’ve made.

Since you told me on the phone that you would be willing to talk with both M and I about why nursing makes you uncomfortable, we will take you up on this. We will respect your wishes to not nurse K in front of you under your own roof, but in return, we would like you to think hard about why you are asking this. So far, I have only gotten that you and your generation didn't do it this way and that you aren't used to seeing it - not very compelling arguments and quite frankly this is not a sufficient answer to our justified question.

In other words, just because something makes us uncomfortable, doesn't necessarily make it wrong or shameful or inappropriate. There are many things that used to make me uncomfortable (including the first time I saw a mother nurse!), that I have come to accept through the experiences of life, learning, expanding my consciousness and trying to think outside of my little black box.

Nursing children is a natural, beautiful, and magical experience. It is not something that should be hidden, or quite literally be kept in the closet. And M and I feel strongly about doing our part to continue to change public opinion so that people realize this. Every time a mother leaves a room to nurse, it teaches others (especially our children) that there is something awkward or unnatural going on. My guess it that if you had grown up in a family where nursing was more honored, your views might be different as well.

Finally, since you have brought up the topic of us making you feel uncomfortable, I feel obligated to point something out. What about your mom and her drinking making others feel incredibly uncomfortable? Why is it that this family tolerates her drinking and subsequent cruelty? For the life of me, I can't understand why you would take a stand on my wife nourishing our child while completely covered up in front of you, and not make a peep to your alcoholic mother who dominates all of our social engagements and verbally berates and embarasses all of us.

Her alcohol induced venom is poisonous and is destructive to everyone. Talk about uncomfortable. M and I do not enjoy being around her when she is drinking. Out of respect for you and the family, we have tolerated it thus far. But I am reaching the end of my fuse. I will not continue to let her insult me or M using alcohol as an excuse. And look out if she ever goes after K.

I know you believe in honoring your parents. We do too, which is one of the reasons we are willing to compromise under certain circumstances regarding nursing in public. But I don't believe in honoring one's parents at the cost of letting them do whatever they wish and hurting those around them that they're supposed to love and honor. Something here is very wrong and it hurts us deeply that you have chosen to confront us regarding nurturing and nourishing our precious daughter, while ignoring this obvious and atrocious display from your own mother. We find it incredibly ironic that your mom is one of the people pushing our current discussion, when she is the primary cause of so much pain and discomfort in our family.

As you can tell, I had a lot to say, which is why I chose e-mailing as a response. Please give me a call so we can further discuss before we drive up to see everyone tomorrow. We love you.


AND THE RESPONSE WE JUST GOT A FEW MINUTES AGO FROM FIL:
(paraphrased in order to comply with the UA)

"You say that the H's are the only family that finds breast feeding in public uncomfortable, but by your own comments to me regarding the national debate on this topic, you know that not to be true." He goes on to describe a little informal survey that he took of some friends, neighbors and coworkers that 'proves' that apparently everyone is shocked and disgusted by nip. He also voices his resentment of the fact that breastfeeding mothers are protected by law.

He stated his reasons for being uncomfortable with nip..."Call me old fashion, but I would only expect to see a woman's bare breast in a bedroom, a doctor's office, a strip joint or Playboy magazine. As much as I like the various parts of a woman's body, I prefer not to see them while I'm out and about in public doing business or being with my family. I guess another way of saying it is I don't view breast feeding as a spectator sport!"

He then goes on to criticize 'our generation' for throwing etiquette, traditional values and culture out the window. Say WHAT?

He did end on a positive note..."I'll call you to discuss this in more detail, but mostly I am so thankful and delighted you and M are still coming. You just cannot imagine just how much we love you both...and of course my very own Grand-daughter!!!" This was of course before I was able to send my own rebuttal and to tell them that we wouldn't be going.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
Gross.

Anyways, a little background info.
-ILs are Christian, we are not. Although in the grand scheme of things this is a non-issue, the Biblical ideal of honoring your elders has come up several times in this discussion.
-I like to think of myself as a very discreet NIP'er. I do cover myself as best as I can (easier said than done with an active, distractible 5 month old )
-Out of the three women that are apparently the most bothered by NIP. two have breast cancer and none of them have ever nursed themselves.
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Old 04-14-2006, 06:21 PM
 
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Oy, I'm sorry you have to deal with this. Your husband's letter was great! Hugs to you mama and I hope Easter goes well.

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Old 04-14-2006, 06:28 PM
 
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For a dye-in-the-wool anti-NIPer that's an astonishingly civil response. I fail to see how his friends agreeing with him about NIP generally makes any difference to the fact that most of the people who actually know *you* and have seen *you* personally nursing have no problem with your level of exposure. (I wonder if those friends he spoke with have ever actually seen breastfeeding? I wouldn't be at all surprised if they were "I've never seen it, but I know I would be shocked if I did" clueless types.)

Maybe if you go and continually leave with your dd to nurse her to the point that they see her for all of 15 minutes during the entire time you're there and continue to nurse right in front of them when you meet them away from their home....nevermind, they probably won't realize they get more time with her when NIP happens.
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Old 04-14-2006, 06:29 PM
 
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I agree with the PP that your DH did a fantastic job of stating your case while respecting his family's right to disagree. As much as I disagree with your FIL's POV on the subject, I think he is doing his best to delicately handle a family situation that involves unrelated issues (i.e. Grandma's alcoholism). If it were me, I think I'd respond to FIL that I appreciate his concerns, will respect his wishes as long as he respects our compromise, and look forward to seeing him and the rest of the family on Easter.

to you and your family. I hope Easter is enjoyable in spite of the NIP issue!

Tabitha ~ devoted wife to my best friend Stephen ribbonyellow.gif and gentle Christian mom to six DSs: notes.gif E - 2/09/00REPlaySkateboard04HL.gifA - 3/05/03superhero.gifA- 6/05/06 guitar.gif H- 2/07/08 jog.gif J - 11/14/10 bouncy.gif T - 8/23/12 + stork-suprise.gif due 9/20/14!  brokenheart.gif DD Janae 10/19/09 angel2.gif
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Old 04-14-2006, 06:29 PM
 
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Originally Posted by kidspiration
I see this tender and loving event as a special bond and act of love between Mother and child, but also quite intimate and personal. Call me old fashion, but I would only expect to see a woman's bare breast in a bedroom, a doctor's office, a strip joint or Playboy magazine.
Does this mean that he has an intimate and personal relationship with Playboy magazine? I guess he's not the only man, considering how popular it is!

Sorry he feels so strongly about it and has rationalized it so much. Ugh!
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Old 04-14-2006, 06:46 PM
 
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Terribly ironic to call anti-NIPing "traditionalism", when for centuries humans have NIPed .

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Old 04-14-2006, 07:45 PM
 
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Perhaps you could gently remind FIL that NIP is in fact 'traditional' and this attitude he displays is the new thinking. Up until three or four generations ago, all babies were fed with breastmilk. And mothers nursed in public because there were no other options.

DH could also mention that his equation of breastfeeding to a medical concern (the doctor's office) sex (the bedroom) or lewdity (the Playboy), is rather concering and frankly a little gross.
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Old 04-14-2006, 08:12 PM
 
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Offtopic: if he thinks bare breasts belong in the bedroom and is suggesting you go nurse in a bedroom, are you supposed to nurse topless? Could you stay in the livingroom if you put on a skimpy outfit first? Or give everyone else a stethescope to hold?
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Old 04-14-2006, 08:18 PM
 
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personally, if someone insulted me so vastly (and to compare your breasts to playboy is insulting IMO), I would respond "see you when she weans".

V.
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Old 04-14-2006, 08:25 PM
 
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Originally Posted by sapphire_chan
Offtopic: if he thinks bare breasts belong in the bedroom and is suggesting you go nurse in a bedroom, are you supposed to nurse topless? Could you stay in the livingroom if you put on a skimpy outfit first? Or give everyone else a stethescope to hold?



:

sorry for contributing to the o/t, but the vision of that in my head is just priceless . . . .

op, my family feels the same way about nip. : i've actually used the pp's suggestion of leaving the room for extended periods, and it didn't take them long to realize that they'd see a lot more of dd if they just shut up!

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Old 04-14-2006, 08:42 PM
 
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Wow.

Oddly, I'm actually exceedingly impressed by both your dh's and FIL's mail. Mainly from the fact, that they spoke to each other so civily, and had such an elaborate discussion. I can't imagine having a discussion like that via email with anyone in my family. :-\

I don't agree with your FIL of course.... iI think he is completely off the mark on this and mistaken, and don't think there is a way to make him see the light, if your dh's mail didn't do it... but on the flip it is also nice to see that he will willing stomp on anyone that gives you guys rude comments, though.



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Old 04-14-2006, 09:12 PM
 
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I think it's ironic that he says he doesn't equate it with shame or lewdness then goes on and mentions times where the breast is exposed, in the bedroom (and that seems to imply when a couple is having sex) and in strip joints and playboy...ummm...

I do think he is trying to be very fair, but I wonder how many other people who have told him they agree with him have actually seen a mom nip and not even realize it! I've had people walk up to me and not even realize I was nursing, just figured I was covering baby because he was sleeping or whatever! It would be fair if when his mom started getting hurtful, they told her to go to the bedroom until she was done...sorry, that would be my retort, though.
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Old 04-14-2006, 09:12 PM
 
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Wow.

If I were in that position, I would have no problem telling the family: "Oh you don't want me to nurse in your house? That's fine, no problem. We just won't be coming."
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Old 04-14-2006, 11:05 PM
 
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Honestly, while I am impressed w/the dialogue I would be uncomfortable with the currant situation.

Do you plan on having more children? Do you plan on showing your DD in the future that bfeeding is something "dirty" that you have to hide? With DD (my first) I was VERY clear that I would be NIP simply because I wanted to deal with it while she was an infant. I wanted no negative comments as she was older and I esp didn't want negative comments/situations when she was much older (and I was nursing her sibling).

If it is actually an exposure issue, then having a cover up (which it sounds like you do?) should be acceptable.

 

 

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Old 04-14-2006, 11:08 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Victorian
personally, if someone insulted me so vastly (and to compare your breasts to playboy is insulting IMO), I would respond "see you when she weans".
Ditto.
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Old 04-14-2006, 11:19 PM
 
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Hmm. I guess I jumped to my own reaction. How does their criticism make you feel? Is the compromise you reached a fair one in your eyes? How do you feel about spending the holidays kibbitzing with people who object to such an important choice in your parenting? Are you hoping to change their minds? Is it very important to your DH that you maintain a good relationship with them? Is it important to you?

I guess these kinds of questions would guide me. I'm not sure if you're just ranting and looking for support, or needing a plan of action. Breastfeeding is important enough to me that if my in-laws banished me to another room I'd probably stop visiting them and force interaction on our turf, or perhaps stop seeing them altogether. I expect my family to support my parenting choices or stay quiet about them. That's just me though.

In any case I hope your weekend is peaceful
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Old 04-14-2006, 11:27 PM
 
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If I were in that position, I would have no problem telling the family: "Oh you don't want me to nurse in your house? That's fine, no problem. We just won't be coming."
Yup, same here...

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Old 04-14-2006, 11:47 PM
 
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However, the fact remains that she probably only has a year or less to live, and so there will be a tendency to cut her a little slack.
I personally would respond with "Well, in that vein, X has only a year or two left to breastfeed so let's cut him a little slack too."

I'm sorry you are dealing with this closeminded attitude. Do you have to spend long there or is it just a dinner?
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Old 04-14-2006, 11:48 PM
 
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Breastfeeding is important enough to me that if my in-laws banished me to another room I'd probably stop visiting them and force interaction on our turf, or perhaps stop seeing them altogether. I expect my family to support my parenting choices or stay quiet about them. That's just me though.
This is what has happened w/ my dh & his father & step-mom. While they've never come out and said that they don't like NIP, it's clear they don't. They've never asked me not to nor said anything to dh, but they don't ask to come over & rarely invite us to their house. Actually, it's turned out to be great!

Anyway, our pool of unfriendly breastfeeding places is getting smaller because, as I am now nursing our second child, I no longer need to leave the room for my comfort and won't do it for the comfort of others. There are times when I do for my comfort still, but it's rare. We were again invited to a super bowl party this year that we didn't end up attending b/c I'd have to go upstairs to 1 of 2 bedrooms (there are 4 in the house) to nurse my son. Last year we went on the condition that I'd leave the room to nurse my daughter, who no longer nursed outside the home. Sad thing is that this couple has a baby 1 month younger than mine. You can guess how that baby is fed.

Back on topic...

If you are comfortable, then go. But as a PP mentioned, if you plan on having more children, will you want to leave your older child(ren) while you nurse the younger one or possibly have to try to convince the older child that, no they can't take that food into the bedroom, they have to leave it in the dining room so they can go w/ you to a bedroom while you feed the baby? This scenerio is 1 of the reasons why I won't go somewhere I can't feel free to nurse where/when I need to.

Good luck,
Sus

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Old 04-15-2006, 12:14 AM
 
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Originally Posted by Baby Makes 4
I personally would respond with "Well, in that vein, X has only a year or two left to breastfeed so let's cut him a little slack too."

I'm sorry you are dealing with this closeminded attitude. Do you have to spend long there or is it just a dinner?
:

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Old 04-15-2006, 01:27 AM
 
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I personally would respond with "Well, in that vein, X has only a year or two left to breastfeed so let's cut him a little slack too."

I'm sorry you are dealing with this closeminded attitude. Do you have to spend long there or is it just a dinner?
LOL!!

I really like this response...

Tammy
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Old 04-15-2006, 01:27 AM
 
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Very nicely written letters! My hat is off to your DH! Anyway, I guess what you should do is based off how you are feeling about all of this. Me personally, with my inlaws, if they said any of this to me then I just wouldn't attend a function at their home until my child weaned. They would be welcome at my home where things are done by my rules, but I would respect their rules by not attending as a nursing mother. There have been times that I have left a room to nurse my kiddos, but that has been based on my own comfort. If anyone ever requested that I leave the room I wouldn't go to their home again until my child weaned. But, if you are comfortable with the compramise to go and nurse in another room, then more power to you. I totally don't agree with your FIL's veiwpoints and do think you and your DH are in the right with nursing your child wherever and whenever she needs.

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Old 04-15-2006, 02:21 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Thanks, mamas, for all of your insightful and of course the humorous responses as well, they've helped me to process this highly stressful situation.

I'm leaning towards not going tomorrow. As a previous poster stated, when it comes down to it, I feel very uncomfortable and compromised as a person thinking about having to quash my motherly instincts and parenting principles in order to pacify other's strange and frankly inappropriate ideals.

I spent 3 long hours today (naking of course...dd is growth-spurting right now) writing a huge response to FIL's email. I totally acknowledge that there are parts that are abrasive but it was so cathartic to write it all out. I am planning to ultimately speak to them in person about this, because I feel strongly in my own integrity and I want to be the one that puts an end to the behind the back conversations and exchanges that don't involve me personally. This is hard for me to do because I am a peacemaker by nature, however, I have been overwhelmed by the mama-bear instincts of wanting to do right by DD. Wow, mamas...we are so POWERFUL...I had no idea that I would feel so incredibly protective.

So here is the email that I wrote, please note that I am not planning to send this and it was enough for me to just write this all out and see it in black and white.

~~~~~~~~
After reading your response, I have to admit that I couldn’t disagree with you more on several different points and quite frankly I am quite offended by some of the statements that have been made. Up until now I’ve bitten my tongue about a lot of the pervasive attitudes that you convey through email as well as conversation, but in this case I am feeling a bit backed up into a corner thus cannot be silent any longer. W, I’m surprised…from all of your hunting experience, didn’t you learn not to mess with a mother bear and her cub ?

I find your pseudo-scientific “attitudes about breastfeeding in public” survey quite amusing. This is a perfect example of two phenomena that skews statistics…experimenter bias (what and how exactly did you ask your colleagues?) and a small non-randomized sample size. Of course you got the results that you did, you only asked a few people that happen to be in a similar age-social-economic-religious-philosophical-political cohort as yourself, did you really expect the answers to be any different from what you received? Come now, did you actually expect us to take this little experiment as a statement of fact of the general public’s attitudes towards nursing mothers?

Also, I find it terribly ironic in a funny sort of way that you deem this anti-nursing-in-public sentiment as “traditionalism”, when human mothers have been nursing their babies outside of their dwellings since time immemorial. If ANYTHING is tradition, this is, if we take the time and care to look outside of our ethno-centric points of view. I

I would be remiss in not bringing up the point that according your so-called “traditionalist” attitudes, breastfeeding is the intimate and special bond that a nursing pair shares as an act that is to be relegated to the private setting. I ask you then, on a practical level…what is an active nursing mother and baby like K and I to do? Stay at home all day? You know that this is nearly impossible and it would be highly inappropriate for me to banish myself and my baby to the confines of my home purely to avoid nursing while out and about. Nurse in the toilet or other out of the way confined space? Do you or anyone else you know consume their food in a smelly public toilet or some dusty back room? No? Well, your sweet granddaughter has the right to the same courtesy and should be able to eat freely and in peace. Anything less than that would be infringing upon her civil rights. Use a bottle? Without getting too much into the nitty gritty health reasons why we don’t do this although I’d be more than happy to expound on this if you would like, our little epicurean prefers her mama’s milk from the tap, and believe me it’s not for lack of trying. Some babies like K just simply do not take expressed breastmilk from the bottle and really, there’s nothing we can do about it because a baby cannot be forced to drink from a bottle. It is very important for you to understand that even if she did take a bottle, we would not be choosing to feed her this way because of the aforementioned health reasons as well as for convenience and comfort (frankly, pumping milk is no picnic, and I have better things to do with my time than wash and sanitize bottles) but I wanted to get this out on the table just in case you were considering this as a solution to this problem that we’re debating. I also need to state that if bottle-feeding K is acceptable yet breastfeeding is not, then we are actually being discriminated against and that is a violation of our civil rights.

As for your allegations of breastfeeding not being a spectator sport, most nursing mothers in the United States today don’t just “whip it out” and expose themselves entirely, and I count myself in this group. I feel that I am a very discreet nurser when I am out and about, and have taken it upon myself (thanks in no small part to the very generous and much appreciated gift certificate that you and J gave me at the beginning of my pregnancy) to purchase comfortable nursing clothing that allows me to nurse K with the utmost of discretion. Furthermore, I do conscientiously utilize a light blanket to cover K’s head especially while she’s latching on, honestly this is easier said than done with a very vibrant, bright, active and alert 5 month old such as our little precious one but my intention is to do my best. I also do everything I can to anticipate K’s needs so that she is not hungry to the point of being fussy and frantic, because if I am not paying attention to her hunger cues it becomes very difficult to simultaneously soothe and feed a hungry, crying infant. It might surprise you to learn that I have practiced nursing in front of a mirror and also in front of close friends and family, so that I have become skilled in holding K without exposing myself to others, not only to preserve my own sense of modesty but also to maintain a level of comfort in the presence of others, both of which are very important standards for me to uphold. Feeding my baby is something that I have to do as a mother, multiple times a day, and I have done my best to prepare myself in order to do so in the most discreet, comfortable way possible. Can you honestly tell me that you’ve actually seen my or any other nursing mother’s nipple while nursing her baby? Well, I can tell you that if you did, you were probably so close to her as to have been infringing upon her personal space, and what were you doing staring at her chest? I actually highly doubt that you or your buddies and neighbors have ever really seen a breast completely exposed during nursing. Furthermore, I can guarantee you that you’ve walked past many a nursing mom and you didn’t even know that she was breastfeeding.

I find your remarks about women’s breasts as curious and contradictory and your rationalizations an accurate reflection of the strangely puritanical American ideals regarding women’s bodies. In once sentence you state that you don’t “equate [this activity] with shame or lewdness”, yet several sentences later you admit that you expect to only see women’s breasts in the “bedroom, doctors office, a strip joint or Playboy magazine”. For once and for all, please be clear on what it is that you believe. I am not sure if they taught this in science class back in the day when you were in school, but humans are mammals, and the biological norm for feeding our offspring is by breastfeeding. By the comments that you’ve made, it is clear to me that you equate breasts mostly with sexual functions. Now I find it bizarre that this is a widespread attitude, as this implies that American men would become sexually aroused by the sight of a woman feeding her child. To me, that’s perversion.

Now that I’ve commenced getting this all out on the table and ceased to continue walking on eggshells while discussing the subject of breastfeeding, I seem to be on a roll here so I’m going to continue. Am I the only one that finds it fantastically interesting that the three women who are apparently voicing their opinions regarding how I am feeding my child all have NOT ONE DAY of nursing experience between them? Hmmm…I don’t mean anything rude by pointing out this somewhat disturbing fact but what can I make of it other than some ladies who are attempting to insidiously tamper with my parenting philosophies and breastfeeding relationship with my daughter? Any thoughts on this would be greatly appreciated, because quite frankly I am at a loss as to why women will attempt to sabotage another woman’s rights and principles in this way and the only reasons that I can come up with that someone would do this are misogynistic and sinister and I think it’s understandable that I feel ganged up against by people who can’t relate to me at all on the matter.

I am glad that our efforts to accommodate other’s wishes and comfort level are appreciated, and likewise I do appreciate your statement of defending us in the event that someone makes an untoward remark to us. I sincerely hope that this does not come to fruition as all I wish for ALL of us is a happy, relaxing weekend holiday and celebration, but if it does, it feels nice to have your support. So being The Nursing Mother In Question, after much discussion with my dear, courageous husband I have decided to retire to a private area in peace in order to feed K while at your home. To be perfectly honest, I will be doing this first and foremost to preserve MY OWN (and K’s) comfort level as I don’t feel good about doing something in front of other people knowing that I am being scrutinized and judged, the fact that other people will be more comfortable is a fortunate consequence. As you can deduce from what I’ve written here, I am very passionate about my somewhat hard-won breastfeeding relationship with K. Nursing is not easy, and contrary to popular belief, it does not come naturally to all women, myself very much included. After our difficult, traumatic birth and my subsequent complications and surgery, my breastfeeding relationship with my incredible daughter has been my calm in the storm, and is one of the few things that have gone right for me in the first months of being a mother. I cherish each moment that I have the opportunity to nourish and nurture my little one, as breastfeeding, besides being the superior form of nutrition for her little growing body and brain, is so much more than about food. I know this closeness and love that we share will follow us for the rest of our lives and for this I feel blessed.

If you've gotten this far, THANK YOU so much for reading and for any pearls of wisdom!!
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Old 04-15-2006, 02:48 AM
 
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Send it!! Please send it! He got to say his piece and lay his feelings all out on the table and I beg you to do the same. I don't think it was abrasive or rude at all, I feel that you expressed yourself in a coherrent, eloquent, polite but assertive way.

Let us know.





Ps.
Send the email.














send it

















Have you sent it yet?
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Old 04-15-2006, 03:07 AM
 
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It's fine. You aren't telling him *he* is a pervert you aren't telling him that those other women are evil for not breastfeeding and you aren't saying that you're going to come and not NIP yourself but rather are bringing along a group of mama friends who will sit on his front lawn and NIP for you.
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Old 04-15-2006, 03:28 AM
 
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Yes!!! PLEASE PROMISE US that you are going to send it!!!! DON'T CHANGE A THING!
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Old 04-15-2006, 03:40 AM - Thread Starter
 
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you guys rock! thank you thank you thank you.

dh has suggested that i don't send the email because really, they won't 'get' most of what i wrote at best, and at worst i would possibly be instigating a huge fight.

i agree that i'm the only one that has to censor themself through all of this and that it's supremely unfair. however, it is dh's family and i don't want to open this can if it's going to make dh's life miserable.

again, aaargh!
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Old 04-15-2006, 05:32 AM
 
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I absolutely hate that this situation exists. It so terribly sad that any mama has to deal with it. I think you're going above and beyond trying to accomodate them. Although I really think that you should send your e-mail, I think that you are right to respect your dh and his wishes with his family. I have BTDT with similar situations with my dh's family. And I think that your dh is doing a fantastic and articulate job in expressing both your and his feelings about this matter.
I'm a pretty free-minded and not easily offended woman. But I have to say that it deeply bothers me that he's telling you that how you feed your baby isn'nt dirty or lewd or shameful, but that the part of your body used to feed your child is a part that should only be seen by men while they're being oogled at, or of course examined(by a male, I'm sure) under medical circumstances. If I were you, I"m not sure I could hold myself back from making a comment on that one point in particular. I see a lot of things that I'm offended by when out in public(small girls dressed provacitively (sp?), words across the bum of little girls pants, people with their bellies hanging o ut all over the place, women with half their breasts hanging out their shirts, etc.) and I can't do anything about them and they are not natural and loving. And yet nobody asks them to cover up or go sit in the bathroom till they're done exposing themselves. Sorry to rant on your thread. i just feel so frustrated by this twisted view that is so gracefully hidden under traditional, biblical views of respect. I think your FIL might wanna consult his Bible a little closer as there are many rerferences to a nursing mother and letting the children be free to come to him. Maybe not in the same verse, but I think Jesus would not agree with your FIL.

Jessica, mama to Emma, 7, Mattie, 5.5 and Lilly, 3 and someone new this Halloween-ish.

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Old 04-15-2006, 05:56 AM
 
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Originally Posted by kidspiration
W, I’m surprised…from all of your hunting experience, didn’t you learn not to mess with a mother bear and her cub ?
Yay! I could have "quoted" your whole e-mail! But, this was my favorite!
BTW Has anyone heard that song by folk singer Joules Graves called "Nipplephobia" It's great! She sing this song about it being ok to sell cars and things with naked women on billboards but it's not ok to feed our babie. If you ever see her live, she really gets people dancing, especially to that song!
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Old 04-15-2006, 06:01 AM
 
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Yeah, I think he's kinda missing the point that that breasts are basically feeding implements first and foremost. your fils' email seems like he is basically trying to be respectful, but I can't believe that as a "traditionalist" he's upholding the appropriateness of breasts in the bedroom and in playboy and strip clubs, yet calling breastfeeding "intimate" and private. Is bottle feeding intimate and private?

Why can't people get it through their heads that we're just feeding our kids???!!!! It's no much more sexual than giving them a bottle or a pacifier or a carrot!!
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