Maybe WE should call the police? - Mothering Forums

 
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#1 of 25 Old 06-14-2007, 05:15 PM - Thread Starter
 
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If you live in a state where your rights are protected by law. Where you are legally allowed to nurse in any location you are legally allowed to be and someone starts harassing you... What would happen if WE were the ones to call the police? Security guard won't leave you alone? Let him hear you call 911 yourself...

"Yes, Sergeant Martinez, I'm at the mall and Mr Smith, who is a security guard at the mall, is attempting to break the law by forcing me and my child to eat in a toilet stall. I have explained that it is a State Law that I can feed my baby here, since we are allowed to BE here, and he continues to harass us which has lead to the screaming fit you can hear in the background. Perhaps Mr Smith needs to be educated on the law, but I'm in no position to do it, with a hungry baby who just doesn't understand the idea of waiting with a hungry belly. Could you possibly send out an officer to assist Mr Smith in understanding the laws of this state?"

Just wondering... if the police (who are there "to protect and serve") are called BY us rather than ON us, would it change the tone of the encounter?

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#2 of 25 Old 06-14-2007, 05:36 PM
 
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right on!

i think i would get so upset if security tried to harass me that i would definately feel the need to call the cops.

eta: however, it is pretty sad that sometimes *ahem* the cops themselves don't always seem to know the law. pretty scary.
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#3 of 25 Old 06-14-2007, 05:40 PM
 
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Whenever I describe an incident of a mother being harrassed to DF he ALWAYS says that they should have called the police. (Although not 911, our police here have a non-emergency line, and he suggests using that, kind of like for a noise complaint!)

It would definitely add something to your story to the news or in a lawsuit.

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#4 of 25 Old 06-14-2007, 05:52 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Twinklefae View Post
Whenever I describe an incident of a mother being harrassed to DF he ALWAYS says that they should have called the police. (Although not 911, our police here have a non-emergency line, and he suggests using that, kind of like for a noise complaint!)

It would definitely add something to your story to the news or in a lawsuit.
Yeah, I wouldn't call 911, it's not an emergency, but if you have a cell (I don't) I recommend saving the non-emergency police # on there. You never know when a situation might arise, be it NIP or something totally unrelated.

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#5 of 25 Old 06-14-2007, 06:03 PM
 
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I would totally threaten to call the police (and do it) if I was being harrassed; I have also heard of people threatening to call their lawyer (even if they don't have one). I think usually if you are bold enough to say you are following the law and they are harrassing you, the harrasser would probably back down. Anti-NIPers seem to more offen go for women who seem not so confident in their rights.
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#6 of 25 Old 06-14-2007, 06:17 PM
 
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I think that is AWESOME!!!!!!!! Isn't the non-emergency # 311? You should just dial 311 and then proceed to tell the story. Even if you dialed your cousin or aunt or mom or neighbor, it might get them to back off. Somebody please do this because I want to read what kind of reaction you got!

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#7 of 25 Old 06-14-2007, 06:44 PM
 
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Originally Posted by BCFD View Post
I think that is AWESOME!!!!!!!! Isn't the non-emergency # 311? You should just dial 311 and then proceed to tell the story. Even if you dialed your cousin or aunt or mom or neighbor, it might get them to back off. Somebody please do this because I want to read what kind of reaction you got!
hey BcFD, i haven't seen you on here in a while! good to see you!
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#8 of 25 Old 06-14-2007, 09:29 PM
 
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This all sounds good in theory, but even if your state has a law giving you the right to breastfeed does not mean that the law is enforceable. For example New Jersey gives fines to businesses that harass women for breastfeeding. Calling the cops may scare the guard away, but I'm sure that if the guard were to make a big enough stink the cops would side with the guard. Without an enforcement clause on the law what would you do then?

The fact is, just because there is a law doesn't necessarily mean it won't be broken, and worse then it being broken is there is a good chance that the law won't be enforced.

Sorry to sound bitter but my state (PA) just screwed up a law and instead of stating that women have the "right" to nip, it said we have the "permission" to nip. This law does worse then nothing.
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#9 of 25 Old 06-15-2007, 08:13 AM
 
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which states have the enforcment clause in the laws?? anyone know???
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#10 of 25 Old 06-15-2007, 01:35 PM
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I used to keep the non-emerg # for the police on my cell for things like being cut off in a crosswalk (pedestrians always have the right of way in my province), I should re-program it in my phone in case I run into this sort of thing. Because here, as far as I know, it is enforceble. But regrardless, even if it's not enforceable, you can make the call to complain you are being harrassed. They may take it more seriously if you are saying "I am calling because I am being harrassed by this security guard, I am feeling very threatened and s/he is upsetting my child."
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#11 of 25 Old 06-15-2007, 02:08 PM
 
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I was at a hearing when our county was considering passing a bf-friendly ordinance. The county supervisors asked the sheriff how something like someone harassing a bfing mother would be enforced. He said that if the responding officer couldn't get the harasser to back down, then they could be charged with disturbing the peace. What a cool guy, huh?

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#12 of 25 Old 06-15-2007, 09:10 PM
 
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i don't understand. what is the point of having laws in the first place if there is no garauntee they will be enforced?
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#13 of 25 Old 06-15-2007, 09:29 PM
 
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I wouldn't call the police. I'd call the local newspaper.
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#14 of 25 Old 06-15-2007, 10:30 PM
 
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http://www.ncsl.org/programs/health/breast50.htm

Thought that was interesting..

I'm curious as to which states actually enforce the NIP laws too. Anyone know?

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#15 of 25 Old 06-15-2007, 11:40 PM
 
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If I remember correctly, at an Area LLL conference years ago, Mama Jake said it's having a right w/o a remedy. What this means is that you have the right to do something, but if someone decides to violate that right, you're only true recorse is a lawsuit. There will be no fines and no arrests for violating that right.

Now, it would be great, if in places where is there is no remedy, if the person would be cited or arrested for "disturbing the peace."

And, someone posted above about PA's once good law that is now screwed up. They changed it from "right to breastfeed" to "freedom to breastfeed."

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#16 of 25 Old 06-16-2007, 03:22 AM
 
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I see that Georgia specifies "BABY" (age 0-12months) and other states say "CHILD."
This is a problem for those of us with older children who are still nursing. We should have the same rights, but according to the law, we don't Hmp!
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#17 of 25 Old 06-16-2007, 05:56 AM
 
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In Hawaii, the law is pretty progressive (at least according to LLL, and compared to other places in the U.S.). Violation is not allowing the mother and the nursing CHILD full and complete access to any place the mother and/or child would/could otherwise be. However it is a civil rights violation not a criminal violation. Complaints can be made to the civil rights commission, and a lawsuit can be filed. You can win one hundred bucks.

A brave mama who was harassed at our local library recently, and further harassed in writing by the library director after she complained, went up the chain to the state director of libraries and got a written unconditional apology and a laid-out program of re-education of all library staff statewide.

There was also a nurse-in involved, but the state director had already SPOKEN by then.


My point - and I do have one - is that calling the police may or may not be the way to go, depending on your laws. In this recent case here, calling on the organization to uphold the law, and going to the top to do it, worked. If you are in a state with a different law the process might be different.
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#18 of 25 Old 06-16-2007, 10:12 AM
 
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I wonder if there are lawyers that specialize in bf-ing civil rights. Can you file a discrimination suit against an offending party and be compensated? In my mind, the only way that businesses will stop harassing a bf-ing pair is if they know their bottom line is on the line.

If I could find such a lawyer, I would show the person complaining a copy of the NYS law that protects bf-ing and, if there's still a problem, call the lawyer and then call the cops. While there are many great law enforcement types there are some real jerks who would side with the harasser. If they knew a lawyer was already involved they'd be more inclined to follow and uphold the law than to take advantage of a very vulnerable woman and child.
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#19 of 25 Old 06-17-2007, 12:16 PM
 
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What does the bold mean exactly here?:

Minn. Stat. § 145.905 a mother may breastfeed in any location, public or private, where the mother and child are otherwise authroized to be, irrespective of whether the nipple of the mother's breast is uncovered during or incidental to the breastfeeding.

That is doesn't matter if anything is showing??

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#20 of 25 Old 06-17-2007, 12:26 PM
 
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Originally Posted by mommyofmany View Post
What does the bold mean exactly here?:

Minn. Stat. § 145.905 a mother may breastfeed in any location, public or private, where the mother and child are otherwise authroized to be, irrespective of whether the nipple of the mother's breast is uncovered during or incidental to the breastfeeding.

That is doesn't matter if anything is showing??
Yeah those are the best laws! You are allowed to NIP and no one can tell you to cover up!

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#21 of 25 Old 06-17-2007, 12:50 PM
 
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What does the bold mean exactly here?:

Minn. Stat. § 145.905 a mother may breastfeed in any location, public or private, where the mother and child are otherwise authroized to be, irrespective of whether the nipple of the mother's breast is uncovered during or incidental to the breastfeeding.

That is doesn't matter if anything is showing??
Yup So if, OMG, some nipple were showing, you STILL have the right to NIP. I like that clause.

What we need is a lawyer, possibly a nursing/extended nursing mama, willing to work pro bono in each state and province. If, said lawyer, had the local BF laws/statutes that protect the right (or freedom as the case may be) to NIP handy and readily available and a number a mama being harrassed could call in this type of situation it would save a lot of tears.

Just a thought.

LP
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#22 of 25 Old 06-17-2007, 01:04 PM
 
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Because here, as far as I know, it is enforceble. But regrardless, even if it's not enforceable, you can make the call to complain you are being harrassed.
Yes it's a right here but enforceable? Unfortunately, I don't think so.

Protected by the Charter of Rights and Freedoms - Yes sort of.

Under the Human Rights Code of NS - There is nothing specific detailing the rights of a nursing mother

Infact Canada - Breastfeeding Rights

TBH I have yet to encounter any negative behaviour towards nursing my DS (nearly 18 m/o) in NS or ON. I can't even say I've seen any looks of disapproval???

I'm headed to the UK in a few weeks for a wedding and intend to NIP... We'll see how that goes over Anyone happen to know my rights in England?

LP
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#23 of 25 Old 06-18-2007, 06:46 AM
 
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Originally Posted by carriebft View Post
Yeah those are the best laws! You are allowed to NIP and no one can tell you to cover up!
Quote:
Originally Posted by LittlePeanut View Post
Yup So if, OMG, some nipple were showing, you STILL have the right to NIP. I like that clause.

What we need is a lawyer, possibly a nursing/extended nursing mama, willing to work pro bono in each state and province. If, said lawyer, had the local BF laws/statutes that protect the right (or freedom as the case may be) to NIP handy and readily available and a number a mama being harrassed could call in this type of situation it would save a lot of tears.

Just a thought.

LP
Awesome! Thanks!!

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#24 of 25 Old 06-18-2007, 01:42 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Found one our parenting group... YAY!!

She's gonna print the law on the back of her cards for us to just have, so if someone confronts us we can basically say "I'm within my rights, if you have a problem with this, please call my lawyer."

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#25 of 25 Old 06-18-2007, 01:43 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Maybe the "finding your tribe" would be a good place to post "Looking for a [your state] Lawyer?"

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