infant baptism or older - Page 3 - Mothering Forums
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#61 of 69 Old 12-12-2007, 01:11 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Smokering View Post
Sanctified is not the same thing as justified.

You are wrong.

From dictionary.com:

jus·ti·fy [juhs-tuh-fahy] -fied, -fy·ing.
–verb (used with object)

3. Theology. to declare innocent or guiltless; absolve; acquit.

sanc·ti·fy [sangk-tuh-fahy] -fied, -fy·ing.
–verb (used with object)

2. to purify or free from sin:



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Originally Posted by Smokering View Post

Just... wow.

Huh? This... just doesn't follow.

Infants cannot have or profess faith; therefore they should not be baptised.

Huh? No, this disproves the Catholic position, which claims that baptism is salvific!

The interpretations have very little relevance to the actual texts, or distort them completely.

It is full of non sequiters.

Another non sequiter.

Anachronistic.

I'm sorry if I'm coming across as confrontational here, but to see these Scriptures advanced as 'proof' for infant baptism does make me angry. They are not proof

I find your above comments and sarcastic attitude to be completely offensive to my Catholic Faith and disrespectful to our Church's practice of the Sacrament of Baptism.

You asked the PP to provide you with Biblical passages for your edification, which she did. In response, you proceeded to contemptuously and even condescendingly denigrate and ridicule these passages and give your own personal interpretation of them, which is contrary to the authority of our Church and what it teaches.



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Again with the eisegesis!

It's EXEGESIS.
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#62 of 69 Old 12-12-2007, 01:33 PM
 
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Protestants claim the Bible is the only rule of faith, meaning that it contains all of the material one needs for theology and that this material is sufficiently clear that one does not need apostolic tradition or the Church’s magisterium (teaching authority) to help one understand it. In the Protestant view, the whole of Christian truth is found within the Bible’s pages. Anything extraneous to the Bible is simply non-authoritative, unnecessary, or wrong—and may well hinder one in coming to God.

Catholics, on the other hand, recognize that the Bible does not endorse this view and that, in fact, it is repudiated in Scripture. The true "rule of faith"—as expressed in the Bible itself—is Scripture plus apostolic tradition, as manifested in the living teaching authority of the Catholic Church, to which were entrusted the oral teachings of Jesus and the apostles, along with the authority to interpret Scripture correctly.
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#63 of 69 Old 12-12-2007, 03:46 PM
 
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Originally Posted by StacyL View Post






It's EXEGESIS.
Actually, Eisegesis is a correct term. it means taking a specific word or phrase in scripture out of context to justify your point, which has nothing to do with the intent of the scripture passage.
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#64 of 69 Old 12-12-2007, 05:26 PM
 
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Smokering asked a Catholic PP for references to Biblical passages on this topic, which she provided her with.

Catholics are not allowed to engage in "eisegesis" (i.e. your own personal interpretation of Scripture). That is a strictly Protestant pasttime.

The Church in Her Authority is the one who provides the EXEGESIS of Scripture.

Hence, my previous suggestion to smokering that she read a Haydock Bible to get some EXEGESIS to the passages she does not understand.
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#65 of 69 Old 12-12-2007, 06:07 PM
 
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Originally Posted by StacyL View Post
I find your above comments and sarcastic attitude to be completely offensive to my Catholic Faith and disrespectful to our Church's practice of the Sacrament of Baptism.

You asked the PP to provide you with Biblical passages for your edification, which she did. In response, you proceeded to contemptuously and even condescendingly denigrate and ridicule these passages and give your own personal interpretation of them, which is contrary to the authority of our Church and what it teaches.
Which was exactly what I expected. At least I'm not disappointed It's easy to tell people they're wrong when you hold yourself as the highest authority. "Show me the scripture" is the favored protestant argument because no matter what scripture you give them, they'll just scream that you're (i.e. THE Church) interpreting it wrong (meaning, interpreting it their way). Convenient circle to run around in though, I guess.
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#66 of 69 Old 12-12-2007, 06:11 PM
 
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StacyL, you know you're on my ignore list, right? I can't actually see what you post.

CherryBomb: No, I hold Scripture as the highest authority. Not the Catholic Church. Obviously, we disagree on this issue, and any Protestant/Catholic debate will inevitably come down to the issue of authority--which is really a topic for another thread. However, if you wish to defend any of the Catholic interpretations of the passages given in your link, you are welcome to do so. But a rebuttal is more than just 'of course you'd say that, you're Protestant'.

If decomposition persists please see your necromancer.

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#67 of 69 Old 12-12-2007, 07:32 PM
 
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Originally Posted by StacyL View Post
I find your above comments and sarcastic attitude to be completely offensive to my Catholic Faith and disrespectful to our Church's practice of the Sacrament of Baptism.

You asked the PP to provide you with Biblical passages for your edification, which she did. In response, you proceeded to contemptuously and even condescendingly denigrate and ridicule these passages and give your own personal interpretation of them, which is contrary to the authority of our Church and what it teaches.
Have you ever read the Religious Studies forum guidelines?
Quote:
This is where the tough questions may be asked. Please do not take it personally when someone questions your own particular faith or belief system or posts an interpretation or opinion that does not support your belief.
If your so easily offended by an opposing opinion, perhaps this isn't the forum for you.
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#68 of 69 Old 12-12-2007, 07:32 PM
 
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Originally Posted by CherryBomb View Post
It's easy to tell people they're wrong when you hold yourself as the highest authority.
Indeed, it is.

Personally, I do not see any sincere interest in smokering's posts here in trying to understand the reason why Christians baptize infants. IMO, I see someone who is angrily trying to disagree with the Christian Church's position and prove why their own contradictory personal opinion is the "correct" one.

Oh well - everyone's got an opinion.
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#69 of 69 Old 12-12-2007, 08:20 PM
 
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Closing the thread pending mod review.

Can't give up actin' tough, it's all that I'm made of. Can't scrape together quite enough to ride the bus to the outskirts of the fact that I need love. ~ Neko Case

 
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