Newly Pregnant. Go vegetarian again? - Mothering Forums
Forum Jump: 
 
Thread Tools
#1 of 18 Old 02-11-2010, 04:34 PM - Thread Starter
 
futureclown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 5
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

   

futureclown is offline  
#2 of 18 Old 02-11-2010, 04:40 PM
 
Sayward's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 593
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
You're going to get just as many conflicting 'facts' (read: opinions) here. Including mine. =)

I'm a vegan and have had a wonderful pregnancy (36 weeks yesterday). I feel confident that I am doing the best thing, health-wise, for me and for my baby. I do believe that dairy is absolutely unhealthy, and I believe that meat in the quantities eaten in the developed world is also detrimental to longevity and wellness. That's leaving all ethics (animal rights/welfare) aside.

That being said, healthy babies are born to vegans, vegetarians, and omnivores alike. You really just have to follow your heart and use your head, and do what's right for YOU. In other words, nutrition science is imperfect and no-one can give you the definitive answer you seem to be seeking.

cruelty-free, beastie-full!
Sayward is offline  
#3 of 18 Old 02-11-2010, 05:22 PM
 
CatsCradle's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2007
Location: New York City
Posts: 2,006
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Sayward's advice above is very good. I might add that I've been a vegetarian for 20 plus years (including through pregnancy), and vegetarianism (with a little veganism from time to time) has been a huge learning process for me. I'm going to go out on a limb here, but I think that people who decide to go vegetarian make the mistake of simply eliminating meat from their diet and substitute the lack of meat with high carbs that lack adequate or required nutrition.

Over and over again, I hear about people who try vegetarianism and then decide to go back to an omnivore diet because they didn't feel well or didn't feel full or began experiencing various ill health effects. The answer is simple: vegetarianism will work when your body is getting the balance and nutrients that it needs. I have to say that it is very difficult, in this meat-centered society, to adjust to a lifestyle and diet where you are insuring proper nutrition without meat. I don't think this has to do with the availability of nutritious vegetarian meals, but with a psychological shift from having meat at the center of most meals to eliminating that large portion of one's diet and relying on other sources. I'm a living example of that - as in the early years, I merely substituted meat with pasta, bread, you name it. I felt like crappola for a long time and didn't know why. Finally, I really had to evaluate what I was eating on a daily basis and commit myself to a new way of eating. After that, I had a great pregnancy and I feel better than I ever have. I'd be vegan, but I do like an occassional piece of cheese (I love cheese more than chocolate!).

I wish you much luck on this - it can be done and it can be healthy. It requires a little work and a shift in thinking from "I don't eat meat" to "I eat for my optimal health." I hate to say it, but I think even vegetarians are too meat focused! (meaning they focus too much on the elimination of meat and not on nutrition).

"Lawyers, I suppose, were children once." Charles Lamb.
CatsCradle is offline  
#4 of 18 Old 02-11-2010, 06:44 PM
 
Magelet's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2008
Location: San Francisco Bay Area
Posts: 2,702
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
As Sayward said, I'm not sure there is anything impartial on this. I think many people feel strongly one way or the other. From everything I've learned about nutrition, I feel very strongly that your baby needs at the very least lots and lots of high quality eggs and full fat dairy, and would be better off with meat and fish too. There may be some people who can do ok without meat and fish, I don't personally think anyone can do well long term without at the least lots of eggs and full fat dairy, and there are a lot of people who need meat as well as dairy and eggs to thrive.

From what you described, it sounds like the way you were doing vegetarian wasn't working for you. It may be that a different way of being vegetarian might work for you, however, pregnancy is definitely not the time to experiment, since it sounds like eating meat does work well for your body.

Caroline, partner to J, post partum doula, kitchen manager, aspiring midwife, soon to be nursing student, mama to my furbaby, someday a mama to not so furry munchkins, G-d willing
Magelet is offline  
#5 of 18 Old 02-11-2010, 07:35 PM
 
ursusarctos's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2008
Posts: 2,498
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I totally agree with CatsCradle that vegetarianism is so much more than just eliminating meat!

I also agree with Magelet that pregnancy is probably not the time to be experimenting if you know that you seem to do better with meat.

I personally feel that it totally depends on your individual body. Some people do great on vegan or vegetarian diets, some do best with meat. I happen to be of the latter group. I was raised veggie and for a long time ate meat about once a week. My diet was well balanced and composed of whole foods. But since I've started eating meat or eggs every day (small amounts, like a few ounces of meat or 2 eggs) I've had more energy, felt more stable physically and emotionally, and just felt all around better. If you have experienced something like that, chances are you are one of those people that does better with meat in your diet and if I were you I would probably not go veggie again, especially if I were pregnant.

Instead I would focus on getting the best sources of meat that I could: grass fed/pastured or at least organic or hormone free, also organ meat if you can stomach it. You don't necessarily need that much. A little bit of meat actually helps your body to utilize vegetable protein better, for example. So a few ounces of meat in a bean and veggie soup or a pasta dish goes much farther than it seems.

Me treehugger.gif and DH caffix.gif and sweet baby DD heartbeat.gif born 08/2011.

ursusarctos is offline  
#6 of 18 Old 02-12-2010, 09:57 PM
 
rayo de sol's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,031
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Everybody has a strong opinion on this topic, and mine is that pregnancy is the worst time to go vegetarian or vegan. The growing baby needs the more bio-available nutrients and fat and cholesterol from animal foods.

I'm an advocate of Traditional Foods. Come explore our forum: Traditional Foods.

From the Traditional Foods perspective, here is a good diet for pregnancy.
rayo de sol is offline  
#7 of 18 Old 02-12-2010, 10:50 PM
 
MyLilPwny's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2008
Location: California
Posts: 821
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by rayo de sol View Post
Everybody has a strong opinion on this topic, and mine is that pregnancy is the worst time to go vegetarian or vegan. The growing baby needs the more bio-available nutrients and fat and cholesterol from animal foods.

I'm an advocate of Traditional Foods. Come explore our forum: Traditional Foods.

From the Traditional Foods perspective, here is a good diet for pregnancy.

Traditional & nutrient-dense foods/Weston A. Price Foundation advocate, Reiki II practitioner, EFT practitioner, past life & life between lives Hypnotherapist practitioner. Home birth with DD 2007 = never vaccinated, breastfed 3 years

MyLilPwny is offline  
#8 of 18 Old 02-16-2010, 01:41 AM
 
bobandjess99's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Location: Northern IN
Posts: 5,912
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Another Traditional Foods person here.

CPST
bobandjess99 is offline  
#9 of 18 Old 03-08-2010, 04:51 AM
 
annarose999's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: monterey, ca
Posts: 56
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I've been vegetarian my whole life. My vegetarian parents taught me to create complete meals so I would never be lacking nutritionally. When I got pregnant last March I never once thought about eating meat to substitute as I was already getting the nutrition I needed and then... About a month before dd was born I started having intense cravings for steak. Mind you I'd never had steak, but my body wanted something bloody and meaty. I am one to listen to my body, and at this time my baby, and I gave it what it wanted. As others have said, pregnancy is more about the development of your child and if your child wants meat your child wants meat.

Homebirthing, breastfeading, co-sleeping mamma to dd born 12/8/2009, married to the love of my life.
annarose999 is offline  
#10 of 18 Old 03-08-2010, 11:54 AM
 
Gingercat's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Greece
Posts: 297
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
I agree with most of the previous posters: I believe that it does not matter that much as long as you have a very careful and thoughtful diet.

During my first pregnancy (about 3 years ago) I was a vegetarian with the only exception being fish oil. I had a very healthy pregnancy, no complaints at all, not even minor ones. I had a natural childbirth and my DS is one of the healthiest toddlers I know of.

Soon after birth I started gradually adding meat to my diet, following the advice of a naturopath here, a strong supporter of the Weston Price Foundation.
Currently I'm pregnant again (28 weeks) and I eat meat quite often and I mostly follow the recommendations of the WPF (the exception being the dairy; I do not believe that we were meant to consume the milk of any other mammal, humans do not need milk past their weaning stage). However thus far my pregnancy has not been a terribly great one compared to my first one; I developed awful varicose veins (and I'm skinny) and had a yeast infection for the first time in my entire life (!), among other minor problems. Perhaps it is coincidence, I just do not know why all these ugly stuff keeping coming to me during this pregnancy while I'm supposed to eat a "healthier" diet".

Having said that I have to note that I find Dr. Mercola's dietary plan to be very useful and thoughful; he divides people into three broad categories (after an extensive metabolic diet testing): 1. the carb types, 2. the protein types and 3. the mixed types. I think this approach explains very well while certain people thrive on vegetarian and vegan diets while others see significant improvements to their health following the WPF.
Gingercat is offline  
#11 of 18 Old 03-08-2010, 12:04 PM
 
annethcz's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 2004
Location: on the beautiful prairie of MN
Posts: 9,947
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Having been both a lacto-ovo vegetarian and an omnivore for alternating long periods of my adult life, I can see both sides. I was veggie for 6 years, during 2 pregnancies. During most of my time as a vegetarian, I felt healthy and well and had no cravings for meat. But during my pregnancies, my body absolutely craved meat. I've heard many other vegatarians say the same thing.

Just based on your post, it sounds like you know your body fuctions better when you include meat in your diet. I don't think you need to include large amounts of meat in your diet, but if it will give you the energy you need to have a happy and healthy pregnancy, there's no need to feel bad about eating meat.

New signature, same old me: Ann- mama of 2 boys and 2 girls, partnered to a fabulous man.
I'm an unintentional weasel feeder and I suck at proofreading.
annethcz is offline  
#12 of 18 Old 03-08-2010, 12:19 PM
 
organicmidwestmama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: home on the range
Posts: 566
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by rayo de sol View Post
Everybody has a strong opinion on this topic, and mine is that pregnancy is the worst time to go vegetarian or vegan. The growing baby needs the more bio-available nutrients and fat and cholesterol from animal foods.

I'm an advocate of Traditional Foods. Come explore our forum: Traditional Foods.

From the Traditional Foods perspective, here is a good diet for pregnancy.
ita. breastfeeding is also, in my opinion, the worst time to go vegan/vegetarian. our bodies have a very hard time making dha out of veg sources like flax. the more dha you have in your body and breastmilk has been proven to increase intelligence amognst other benefits. human babies arent vegan, they drink moms milk, so personally i dont relate to the idea that feeding baby vegan during pregnancy or beyond is biologically normal. fish is super great, and people can do very well with fish as thier only "meat".
organicmidwestmama is offline  
#13 of 18 Old 03-08-2010, 02:08 PM
 
Sayward's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2009
Location: Portland, Oregon
Posts: 593
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by organicmidwestmama View Post
ita. breastfeeding is also, in my opinion, the worst time to go vegan/vegetarian. our bodies have a very hard time making dha out of veg sources like flax. the more dha you have in your body and breastmilk has been proven to increase intelligence amognst other benefits. human babies arent vegan, they drink moms milk, so personally i dont relate to the idea that feeding baby vegan during pregnancy or beyond is biologically normal. fish is super great, and people can do very well with fish as thier only "meat".
There are vegan sources of DHA that are bioequivalent to animal-derived DHA. The idea that a pregnant or breast feeding veg*ns cannot get DHA (not ALA which is what one gets from flax, but DHA identical to that in fish and other sources) is simply untrue. Please refer to these articles.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15812447

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18589030


Saying that breast milk is 'not vegan' doesn't make much sense. Every other herbivorous mammal drinks breast milk in infancy before beginning its 'vegan' life. Breast milk is 100% vegan and 100% natural in 'vegan' mammals.

I'm not trying to argue with your opinion, just the [incorrect] data with which you present it. To each his own.

cruelty-free, beastie-full!
Sayward is offline  
#14 of 18 Old 03-08-2010, 02:59 PM
 
organicmidwestmama's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: home on the range
Posts: 566
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Quote:
Originally Posted by Sayward View Post
There are vegan sources of DHA that are bioequivalent to animal-derived DHA. The idea that a pregnant or breast feeding veg*ns cannot get DHA (not ALA which is what one gets from flax, but DHA identical to that in fish and other sources) is simply untrue. Please refer to these articles.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/15812447

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/18589030


Saying that breast milk is 'not vegan' doesn't make much sense. Every other herbivorous mammal drinks breast milk in infancy before beginning its 'vegan' life. Breast milk is 100% vegan and 100% natural in 'vegan' mammals.

I'm not trying to argue with your opinion, just the [incorrect] data with which you present it. To each his own.

so you are suggesting vegans need to supplement with algae-derived dha? that isnt a whole food, in my opinion, its a supplement.

i dont know of a whole, vegan food that provides dha in the human diet other then through ala, flax or the like, which our bodies dont convert well to dha. algea in formula is not really a food imho. the real question to ask would be have vegan mothers milk been tested and compared to omnivorous moms milk and does the ave vegan mom make enough dha in her breastmilk, and for tha matter does the average omni mom? who knows? i do not know but its an interesting question.
organicmidwestmama is offline  
#15 of 18 Old 03-08-2010, 05:17 PM
 
marimara's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2008
Location: Florida coast
Posts: 1,519
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
Every one has an opinion on this matter. Yours is the only one that counts That said, it's best to educate yourself on nutrition and do what feels best for you. I was a vegetarian (lacto ovo) for 7 years. When I got pregnant I *needed* to eat meat ( I trusted my body's intuition and cravings). I didn't eat red meat but I started poultry and fish. My body was talking to me and I listened. Now this may have been that I felt I needed meat because I wasn't the most healthy vegetarian around. Now, dd is 3.5, I'm no longer bfing and I'm contemplating going back to lacto-ovo veggie.

If I were you, I would just focus on eating healthy foods in general, unless you have an overwhelming urge (intuition or craving) or a Want to eat a certain way (vegetarian, vegan, omni, TF).
My rules for just plain old healthy eating?? (remember these are MY rules, for my body, I'm not telling you to eat this way, or that every one needs to eat this way, this is the way that I feel is best for me and I'm just offering this as an example, probably could be called "omni; plant-based"):
Whole foods, just like they are found in nature, organic, fresh and local.
Not a whole lot from packages.
Mostly plant foods w/some others thrown in as my body tells me I need it.
And lots of fresh, pure, clean water. And fresh air
If I were pregnant, I would add a good prenatal vitamin (possibly the one from Rainbow Light) and to make sure I get some DHA from somewhere.

Living Simply and Enjoying Life
marimara is offline  
#16 of 18 Old 03-08-2010, 06:13 PM
 
WorldsBestMom's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2009
Location: USA
Posts: 488
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)
At the end of the day one wants to ensure that the baby gets all the nutrition he/she deserves from a variety of food.

Worlds Best Mom
WorldsBestMom is offline  
#17 of 18 Old 06-28-2012, 12:37 PM - Thread Starter
 
futureclown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 5
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

Thank you all for your advice. I haven't been on here in ages because the pregnancy I posted for I was unable to carry to term. The boy that I was with and I broke up and I moved back home to Los Angeles. Now, two years later, my boyfriend and I are trying to conceive and I thank you all so much for your advice and input. Love to you all! XOXOX
 

futureclown is offline  
#18 of 18 Old 06-28-2012, 12:39 PM - Thread Starter
 
futureclown's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 2010
Location: Los Angeles
Posts: 5
Mentioned: 0 Post(s)
Tagged: 0 Thread(s)
Quoted: 0 Post(s)

This was excellent advice and you are so right.

futureclown is offline  
Reply

Quick Reply
Message:
Drag and Drop File Upload
Drag files here to attach!
Upload Progress: 0
Options

Register Now

In order to be able to post messages on the Mothering Forums forums, you must first register.
Please enter your desired user name, your email address and other required details in the form below.
User Name:
If you do not want to register, fill this field only and the name will be used as user name for your post.
Password
Please enter a password for your user account. Note that passwords are case-sensitive.
Password:
Confirm Password:
Email Address
Please enter a valid email address for yourself.
Email Address:

Log-in

Human Verification

In order to verify that you are a human and not a spam bot, please enter the answer into the following box below based on the instructions contained in the graphic.



User Tag List

Thread Tools
Show Printable Version Show Printable Version
Email this Page Email this Page


Forum Jump: 

Posting Rules  
You may post new threads
You may post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are On
Pingbacks are On
Refbacks are Off