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#1 of 20 Old 09-28-2012, 01:52 PM - Thread Starter
 
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There have to be some, other than deliciousness, no?

 

I'm wondering if anyone knows of a condition/issue that benefits from/requires eating gluten and/or dairy. I read so much about how cutting out gluten and dairy changed a kid's behaviors, eased symptoms, cured an adult's XYZ condition. Is there ever a benefit to eating this stuff, other than the nutrients you may or may not be able to absorb?

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#2 of 20 Old 09-28-2012, 10:54 PM
 
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I am unaware of any specific benefit of gluten (which doesn't mean there isn't one).  And the only benefits I have heard and seen regarding dairy are related to raw dairy.

 

But maybe someone else has more info.


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#3 of 20 Old 09-29-2012, 03:32 AM
 
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ooh good question. 

 

i have no clues on this but this is my thought.

 

gluten is protein. many different kinds of protein. so it is a good source of protein. wheat is the one plant that has a lot of protein. 

 

perhaps someone who is sensitive to certain kinds of proteins might be able to deal with gluten protein?!!! so maybe some genetic disorder?

 

what is interesting is that in the countries that consume a lot of dairy and wheat - US, China, India, Russia - stomach issues are a common problem. some have identified it as intolerances but most people just live with those conditions and seek medical help - but traditionally have never associated dairy and gluten as an issue. 

 

i just had this conversation with a mom from one of those nations. her 12 year old is in acute pain most of the time. but she has chosen not to give up all because its just too hard to completely give up muffins and icecream.

 

i tell you i am learning a LOT about food choices from middle school kids. and nutritional decisions. how habit and availability is really screwing our children up. 

 

so i am so glad what NY did with giant sodas. at least its a stand. 


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#4 of 20 Old 09-29-2012, 04:17 AM
 
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Milk would provide protein and fat in a liquid, important for staying hydrated in desert climates. That's all I can think of.
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#5 of 20 Old 09-29-2012, 06:26 PM
 
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Milk - and yogurt and cheese etc, - is a great and easy source of calcium.  Other sources (dark leafy greens) are somehow always less popular among those who need the calcium.   Like growing children.

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#6 of 20 Old 09-29-2012, 06:36 PM
 
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when i think of desert climates i think of the middle east and africa. most of the tribes living there - the desert people really drink hot tea. they ferment the milk either into cheese or yoghurt. meat is a bigger part of their diet than milk. milk by itself is actually dehydrating. 

 

and milk as good source of calcium - the netherlands and india (whose stats i am a little aware on in this matter) have pretty high incidence of osteoporosis - ie brittle bone. and they are high consumers of milk and dairy products. 


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#7 of 20 Old 09-30-2012, 10:44 AM
 
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I've read that cheese was accidentally made by putting milk in a cow/goat/sheep stomach and leaving it in a cave. I believe the climate was desert.
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#8 of 20 Old 09-30-2012, 09:32 PM
 
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Originally Posted by CelloMomCars View Post

Milk - and yogurt and cheese etc, - is a great and easy source of calcium.  Other sources (dark leafy greens) are somehow always less popular among those who need the calcium.   Like growing children.

Actually milk has half the calcium as soy milk and almond milk do.  But the US dairy industry sure doesn't want that to become common knowledge.


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#9 of 20 Old 10-01-2012, 02:33 PM
 
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Actually milk has half the calcium as soy milk and almond milk do.  But the US dairy industry sure doesn't want that to become common knowledge.


The calcium in those milks are added - they are fortified.  This is because the natural calcium in a soybean is not digestible by humans.  I made my own soy, almond, and rice milk for many years and it is very true that I had to buy the CalMag liquid to add to it, for it to have any digestible calcium.  Almonds, of course are better off in the calcium department, but still almond milk is not the same as eating an almond.  In the milk, you are not getting the good fats that will help your body actually absorb the calcium, unfortunately.

 

If you're looking for calcium in milk, whole animal milk is the way to go!  Gives you the fat you need to actually use the calcium :)  That said, I hate the taste of cow's milk LOL!  I do love some whole milk yogurt and cheese, though .. yum yum!


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#10 of 20 Old 10-01-2012, 04:46 PM
 
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I've always read that soy calcium is very absorbable. I avoid all calcium supplementation because of adverse effects from a calcium supplement several years ago. I'm dairy allergic and my bones are stronger now that I've taken full responsibilty for my diet. Since I'm also allergic to soy, so I don't get my calcium from there. I prefer greens. I add parsley to everything I cook.

I'm seeing lots of differing opinions here on dairy. What about gluten? It works well in breads and other baked goods because it holds everything together, like a binder. When making bread, you knead it, partly to activate the gluten and partly to distribute the yeast evenly.
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#11 of 20 Old 10-01-2012, 05:02 PM - Thread Starter
 
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To clarify: I know that both have lots of nutritional value. That's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about health benefits -- I know that's linked to nutrition in some ways but I don't mean simply a source of calcium or a source of fiber or protein. I mean, has anyone seen other health benefits from INCLUDING one or both in their diets the way so many report seeing health benefits from EXCLUDING them?
 

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#12 of 20 Old 10-01-2012, 05:23 PM
 
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i am not sure if you will find that kind of info OP.

 

technically there is no health benefit to eating meat right? even vitamin B12 right. you can meet the protein requirement very well being vegan or vegetarian.

 

so what could be the health benefits of eating meat? i see gluten and dairy the same way.

 

do you know what i just learnt from a scientific paper in my nutri class. the higher the family income the lesser the 'bread' intake. which is why in general - rich people are not that obese. statistically. fascinating stuff.


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#13 of 20 Old 10-01-2012, 06:51 PM - Thread Starter
 
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That's true, I suppose. It just seems like there's such a wide array of "issues" that are helped or solved by cutting these two things out that it made me wonder if there is possibly any unique benefit to them. Of course, everything I have been reading lately points to just about every food, whole or not, potentially causing or exacerbating health issues of one kind or another, so it leaves me wondering what the heck I should be eating!

 

That's an interesting study. It makes me wonder though -- I don't know anyone (wealthy or not) who doesn't eat "normal" amounts of bread other than a few celiac/IBD/gluten intolerant friends. Some are huge, some are thin, although of course my thinnest friend is gluten intolerant, and my chunkiest two LOVE bread. sigh I'm just mad b/c I finally mastered bread and pizza dough and LOVE to bake it more than sweets now. And I keep ending up feeling (knowing) that I should not be eating it.

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#14 of 20 Old 10-01-2012, 06:56 PM
 
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I thought the rich have less obesity because they can afford personal trainers.

Seriously, I'd like to see that bread study. I prefer to review the info myself instead of accepting another's interpretation.

Other than the binding properties of gluten, I think the benefits are nutritional. I know of no reports of healing benefits of either. I have read that brown rice and miso soup have healing propertied, as does cod. Interesting question, though.
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#15 of 20 Old 10-01-2012, 09:39 PM
 
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Originally Posted by swd12422 View Post

 sigh I'm just mad b/c I finally mastered bread and pizza dough and LOVE to bake it more than sweets now. And I keep ending up feeling (knowing) that I should not be eating it.

oh mama everything is not lost yet. it just means more learning. if you have the $$$s you can master gluten free pizza and bread. seriously (if you enjoy cooking - find it an adventure) then you can continue eating pizza and bread without gluten. i have mastered gluten free pancakes (some white rice flour coz its more binding, some brown rice flour and buckwheat flour) because dd can eat it. her body rejects gluten pancake. or should i say her tongue. she 'll take a bite of it and not eat anymore. which is a problem at sleepovers because pancake is the favourite breakfast. 

 

you will also discover many parts of the world does not put dairy on their pizza. armenia puts mayo on their pizza and its delicious. also you will be surprised that pizza is a traditional food in many countries of the world but its not called pizza. meat on a thin tortilla like crust is what russian pizza is. i think its called pizza mostly for the younger non immigrant children of immigrant parents or grandparents so they can relate. 

 

i am grateful to a starch sensitive friend and a friend with rheumatoidal arthiritis for giving me an opportunity to experiment. 

 

however i am a veggie person. how to cook and eat veggies i have never seen or heard of before. THAT is my own challenge that i enjoy. 

 

I thought the rich have less obesity because they can afford personal trainers.

 

are you being facetious here? are you implying that the rich exercise more? That is a fallacy. Yes of course hollywood can get their figures back so much quickly after birth is because they work out for their profession, but that doesnt include others. 

 

this is the article http://www.cpc.unc.edu/projects/nutrans/publications/Popkin%20Nutr%20Trans%20IJO%202004.pdf

 

the author also wrote this fascinating book: 

The Nutrition Transition

Diet and Disease in the Developing World

 

what is key these days is not just what we eat - but the whole culture of food. 

 

and unfortunately as the US realises how bad the 'culture' of food has been here with industrialising food, the developing countries are now getting into the 'wonder bread' culture. cooking is now seen as a waste of time. its more about earning money rather than spending time cooking a healthy meal for your family. 


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#16 of 20 Old 10-02-2012, 09:20 AM
 
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Hold it! There is no reason for normal healthy people to give up gluten, or dairy, for that matter. If obesity is the concern, keep dairy to a minimum, because I've read that dairy has a closer link to obesity than gluten (in a book, which I can't remember the title). I'm dairy allergic but eat pasta frequently! And the white stuff (I used to eat whole grain pasta, but I'm happier eating white), and I and my son are both thin. I think carbs in general, and gluten, have undeserved bad reputations!

I'll have to look fir the web site where I read this (just this past weekend!), but I read that the reason there are so many diets claiming they can solve health issues is because different bodies work differently. I've always been thin, and I eat makes me feel healthy, and energetic. Do that, unless you have some other health concern, is my advice. In other words, if it ain't broke, don't fix it!

The amount of calories you'll burn kneading the bread dough will help keep you trim
So enjoy your new skills! Expand on them, if you'd like, adding in whole grains, or replacing wheat flour with oat (slightly sweeter than wheat). Search the Internet, or ask questions here to learn more about other flours. But don't give up gluten just because soneone has to avoid it..

Dairy, now, I'd recommend caution. But I'm dairy allergic, so may be prejudiced. In addition to possible weight gain, there is the added link to increased osteoporosis. But I would still enjoy small amounts of dairy, if I could. Just make it quality stuff. Find a local farmer whose cows are grass fed with no chemicals. More expensive, true, so all the more reason to enjoy!

Good luck with whatever you decide. Remember, we're all unique. So, too, is our parenting and our food choices.
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#17 of 20 Old 10-02-2012, 01:38 PM
 
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Agreed that I think the personal trainer comment must've been said tongue-in-cheek.

 

And the bread study is old and should be easy to find.  I think it was specifically that they ate less white bread vs. bread overall but I could be remembering wrong.

 

Vegans can get the protein they need without meat but I personally think this takes some level of skill to ensure it happens.  So not impossible, but not exactly a no-brainer.

 

The dairy studies I saw (and I didn't do an extensive search, but saw maybe 5-6) linking dairy to obesity didn't state whether or not they used milk without Bovine Growth Hormone.  I also saw studies linking dairy to an increase in Insulin Growth Factor and cancer with the same problem.  I have to wonder if the potential was there for the growth hormone to be the problem vs. dairy on it's own.  I should look to see if there are newer studies on this.  Someone on here that's digging might want to keep those thoughts in mind.  Similarly, I didn't find data on pasture-raised cattle or raw dairy where obesity (or IGF and cancer) is concerned.

 

Also agreeing that bioindividuality plays a huge role in why this eating regimen works wonders for one person and does nothing for the next.  When you study a LOT of eating regimens, you find a few commonalities across the board--but very few.  One person's miracle is another person's poison.

 

Last, you are not getting the calcium you think you are from milk.  When the gov't put out the new "My Plate" scenario, the researchers at Harvard got so ticked off that they put out their own version--which removed dairy.  From their website:

 

 

Quote:
"The Healthy Eating Plate, created by experts at Harvard School of Public Health and Harvard Medical School, points consumers to the healthiest choices in the major food groups. The U.S. Department of Agriculture's MyPlate, in contrast, fails to give people some of the basic nutrition advice they need to choose a healthy diet. The Healthy Eating Plate is based exclusively on the best available science and was not subjected to political and commercial pressures from food industry lobbyists."

 

and

 

 

Quote:
"It recommends limiting milk and dairy to one to two servings per day, since high intakes are associated with increased risk of prostate cancer and possibly ovarian cancer; it recommends limiting juice, even 100% fruit juice, to just a small glass a day, because juice contains as much sugar and as many calories as sugary soda. Read more about healthy drinks and read more about calcium, milk and health."

 

 

Here is a link to their article on calcium and milk:  http://www.hsph.harvard.edu/nutritionsource/what-should-you-eat/calcium-and-milk/index.html

 

Not that Harvard is the be-all-end-all, but it was a place I knew I could find the information quickly and I think it's a reasonably reputable source to consider when looking at the available information.


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#18 of 20 Old 10-02-2012, 01:50 PM
 
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Also agreeing that bioindividuality plays a huge role in why this eating regimen works wonders for one person and does nothing for the next. 

YES!!! i have also found generational geographic eating plays a huge role in how we react. dont have any scientific paper to back me up but it seems logical to me. it was actually my OB who pointed it out to me. in his clinic he found japanese pregnant women could eat sushi right through out their pregnancy and seeing i was about to jump wagged his finger and said - nope the same does not apply to me. 

 

i think our genes remember or some sort of food memory is passed down when one lives in an area for generations and eats teh same food. 


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#19 of 20 Old 10-02-2012, 02:26 PM
 
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Sorry, just noticed now the confusion regarding the personal trainer comment. That was *definately* said tongue-in-cheek. And, yes, Hollywood stars were foremost in my mind. I certainly didn't mean any disrespect.
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#20 of 20 Old 10-02-2012, 06:43 PM
 
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Sorry, just noticed now the confusion regarding the personal trainer comment. That was *definately* said tongue-in-cheek. And, yes, Hollywood stars were foremost in my mind. I certainly didn't mean any disrespect.

smile.gif just so you know i just dont get a joke unless its v. explicit. 

 

i now get it jog.gif


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