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#61 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 03:14 PM
 
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I often get the comments on the opposite side of the spectrum that I'm wasting my money by shopping at those places and maybe we'd have a better car if I didn't spend my money on food! See, you just can't win no matter where you fall.
especially the part i bolded.

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#62 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 03:20 PM
 
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Whether or not people percieve your ability to afford organics depends totally on where you live. I moved a few hundred miles after I started eating organic. It was *maybe* 5% more than conventional foods at my original location, plus, I was only dealing feeding pregnant me and dh, and then an infant for a few weeks at the time of the move. When we moved, we went to another fairly urban area, and the prices of the foods we routinely bought were literally 4-5 times as expensive as they were before we moved. There was absolutely NO WAY we could afford to eat organic. I could barely feed my family conventional foods (we moved because of job loss), and if I would have taken that tight budget and had organics, we could have eaten for one, maybe two days of the week and been hungry...even on the cheapest most basic whole foods.

Although there are independent farmers in this area (we are in the heartland, after all), most are an hour away. The farmer's market only runs in the summer, 1 day a week, for a few hours in the morning in the downtown area that takes us a good half an hour to get to. Not going to happen. Plus, I was on food stamps and you can't use them there. (you also couldn't use them for any of the farms that I called and asked too).

So, although we are starting to be able to add organic milk and eggs back into our diet, most of our diet is conventional food unless there is a serious special that brings it into the range of normal foods. However, I am not paying $5 an apple when I can get an apple for $.97 (or less). Not happening in my budget when my ds can sit and eat 4-5 apples in a setting if I let him.

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#63 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 03:24 PM
 
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I don't think it is a bad thing at all, it is just important to recognize it is cultural/marketing/financial trend--and when the dust settles on the trend and society has moved on, there will probably be a great deal of growth and exposure that resulted from the trend. But I do think it is important to be a savy consumer and realize that just because something is packaged for consumption to look "healthy" does not mean it is, and conversly you can find healthy food resources these days (organic foods, bulk brown rice, hormone free milk) in less "hip" venues.
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#64 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 03:30 PM
 
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I don't think it is a bad thing at all, it is just important to recognize it is cultural/marketing/financial trend--and when the dust settles on the trend and society has moved on, there will probably be a great deal of growth and exposure that resulted from the trend.
Hopefully. I see the trend in general as a good thing - for example the attention now being paid to trans-fats and how they are being removed from pretty much everything. This will have an across the board improvement in public health. And if organic becomes the new "must have", then more and more food will be grown "organically" which should mean reduced amount of pesticides, etc. It won't be perfect, but hopefully there will be a net improvement in the general quality of food available on the market.

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But I do think it is important to be a savy consumer and realize that just because something is packaged for consumption to look "healthy" does not mean it is
Can i say it again? ORGANIC LUCKY CHARMS!

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#65 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 03:33 PM
 
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Can i say it again? ORGANIC LUCKY CHARMS!
Yes, but they are magically delicious!:
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#66 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 03:33 PM
 
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ITA, Lisa and siobhang.
organic lucky charms! : i especially love when my mom comes shopping with us to buy her 'natural' energy drinks and sodas. :

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#67 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 03:44 PM
 
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If it isnt organic I fear the hormones and extras that are going into their bodies, but then the money side hits me. And who wants to pay $5.99 for 1 gallon of milk? Thats $1,557.40 a year on just milk alone.
Organic milk at our grocery store is $10.99 per gallon; regular milk is about $5.00 per gallon. I can get raw, organic, farm-fresh milk for $3.20 per gallon, but I have to drive about an hour to get it.

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I also wonder where people who are so snarky about organic foods buy from? If they are just buying it from Raley's or Safeway where they are sitting right next to the nonorganic produce, whats the point? REcent studies have shown that all the fertilizers and harmful chemicals on those products get onto the organic produce, and in theory defeats the whole purpose.
I occasionally buy organic produce, depending on where I'm shopping. Organic bananas are not much more expensive than reg bananas, and still much cheaper than other non-organic fruit. I don't really buy it so that we ingest fewer pesticides; I'm doing it to keep pesticides out of the environment where the produce is grown and to support companies that are willing to make changes.

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#68 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 03:51 PM
 
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ITA, Lisa and siobhang.
organic lucky charms! : i especially love when my mom comes shopping with us to buy her 'natural' energy drinks and sodas. :
I got into a fight with a friend who accused me of being a food snob when I told her that I don't eat Kraft cheese or velveta.

I thought about it, and discovered that in my mind there is a difference between "tasty" and "good".

Kraft american cheese food slices are tasty on hamburgers. Velveta can make a tasty mac and cheese. But these cheese are not good - they are in fact basically plastic (especially the american pre-sliced cheese indiviudally wrapped in plastic). They aren't even legally allowed to be called cheese because they don't have enough milk in them.

I have no issue with someone saying that some non-healthy kind of food is tasty - heck it is designed to be tasty. And I ain't no puritan - I buy potato chips, diet coke, and so forth.

But tasty doesn't make it good.

<meaningless rant about cheese>
I personally have a huge issue with bad cheese. It pisses me off that decent cheese is so expensive in this country - I lived in England for three years and I got a bit spoilt by the selections. I am very glad that my family can afford to buy cheese at $7 a hunk (whole foods and wegmans both have fabulous selections) - and it makes me mad that due to price or availability, most people is the US have to buy cheese food.

I find that most people I know have no experience with cheese - they know american, chedder, swiss, and maybe havarti. They are scared of blues or of anything that might be strong tasting. But I often find people are very pleasently surprised when I introduce them to goats cheese or a nice stilton or even a hunk of gruyere and they taste great!

Cheese is a craft that humans have been laboring and experiementing with for thousands of years. It deserves more respect than velveta.
</rant>

Okay, maybe i am a food snob... :

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#69 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 03:53 PM - Thread Starter
 
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really interesting conversation here. Glad to see it happen.
I want to add a bit more. About why should one have to explain or justify what they do inorder to become part of the "I shop organic" club.
I drive used cars(thats 15 years and older), shop thrift stores (when I can afford that) and yes I have a cell phone (for our family its a neccessity).
But why should anyone have to justify?
People I know who soley buy organic more power to them. I don't see their freedonm to choose as elitist.
I see elitism another person's need to point out:
-how they pity more poor children because of our food choices.
-tell me that I am not a frugal shopper. (by the way, I leave cashier's in awe when I am done with my coupons)
-point out if I just motor to the stores upwards of 20 miles away ( has anyone seen the price of gas lately)
-when I do go to farmers markets , I am further pressured to have delivery which in the long run is cheaper. I get that but can someone float me the $350 upfront?
There is a big disconnect in that judgement.

I am sure if we look deep enough, we all could do something different for the uplifting of the planet even my 100% organic brothers and sisters. Somewhere on some plane we fall short.
By the way, I don't mind being educated. Educate me. Share with me where to fiind deals, what foods don't have to be organic to keep me safe. But don't preach to me to do away with other life necessities (when you don't know my circumstances). Don't pity my family and cry that we don't have all organic food. HECK DON'T HATE ON ME BECAUSE I BOUGHT BEN & JERRY'S GOBFATHER : It was on sale 2 for $4 and I had a coupon for $1 off 2.
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#70 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 04:00 PM
 
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I would never make anyone feel bad for their food choices! That's horrible. I think that pretty much every mama here at MDC is doing the best they can for their family. I live in an area where organic produce often looks pretty bad. I get what I can when it's available. Fortuantely, we have an awesome health food co-op where I can buy dried fruit, flours, oats, beans and many other grains organic and cheaper than conventional at the supermarket. Also, from May through October, I belong to an aweome organic CSA. We get so many veggies each week that I'm usually sharing them with friends. I always get organic milk and local, organic pastured eggs. I'm extremely lucky that I'm able to afford that.
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#71 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 04:01 PM
 
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awwww...man...lost my post :

here are a couple of links some of y'all who want to buy more organic but are finding it to expensive might find helpful --

http://www.organicconsumers.org/organic/buyingclub.cfm

http://www.localharvest.org

also, you can look into volunteering at your local food co-op. i get almost 20% off my food bill for volunteering 3 hrs a week.

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#72 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 04:05 PM
 
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Originally Posted by Yinsum View Post
But don't preach to me to do away with other life necessities (when you don't know my circumstances). Don't pity my family and cry that we don't have all organic food.
My mom told me that growing up on foodstamps in her small midwestern town, other people and the cashier would make comments and judgments on what her mom bought - usually not TO her, but outloud to each other.

She told me that it was humiliating to see her own mother be judged (usually as insufficient) every time they went to the store.

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Originally Posted by Yinsum View Post
HECK DON'T HATE ON ME BECAUSE I BOUGHT BEN & JERRY'S GOBFATHER : It was on sale 2 for $4 and I had a coupon for $1 off 2.
Sounds yummy!

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#73 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 04:17 PM
 
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Originally Posted by siobhang View Post
I got into a fight with a friend who accused me of being a food snob when I told her that I don't eat Kraft cheese or velveta.

I thought about it, and discovered that in my mind there is a difference between "tasty" and "good".

Kraft american cheese food slices are tasty on hamburgers. Velveta can make a tasty mac and cheese. But these cheese are not good - they are in fact basically plastic (especially the american pre-sliced cheese indiviudally wrapped in plastic). They aren't even legally allowed to be called cheese because they don't have enough milk in them.

I have no issue with someone saying that some non-healthy kind of food is tasty - heck it is designed to be tasty. And I ain't no puritan - I buy potato chips, diet coke, and so forth.

But tasty doesn't make it good.

<meaningless rant about cheese>
I personally have a huge issue with bad cheese. It pisses me off that decent cheese is so expensive in this country - I lived in England for three years and I got a bit spoilt by the selections. I am very glad that my family can afford to buy cheese at $7 a hunk (whole foods and wegmans both have fabulous selections) - and it makes me mad that due to price or availability, most people is the US have to buy cheese food.

I find that most people I know have no experience with cheese - they know american, chedder, swiss, and maybe havarti. They are scared of blues or of anything that might be strong tasting. But I often find people are very pleasently surprised when I introduce them to goats cheese or a nice stilton or even a hunk of gruyere and they taste great!

Cheese is a craft that humans have been laboring and experiementing with for thousands of years. It deserves more respect than velveta.
</rant>

Okay, maybe i am a food snob... :
You know....some of us just don't like most cheeses. I like cheddar (although I'm not crazy about really aged cheddar), mozzarella and I'll use a few others here and there in sauces and stuff. That's it. I've tried - reluctantly, I'll admit - a few others, and I haven't liked any of them. Blue cheese is disgusting to me - the smell alone makes me nauseous (I'm learning to live with it, though, as dh loves it and dd likes it quite well).

I love Velveeta. I still keep it in the house. I can't stand the single pack cheese clices, though - they taste awful. I need to master making mac and cheese without Velveeta, though...

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#74 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 04:21 PM
 
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Seriously the argument I see about "priorities" and not spending my money on "extra's" like cell phones, etc just cracks me up. You see the same in the mommy wars. If she just gave up her car, sold her house, stopped shopping at expensive stores, stopped doing XYZ she could stay home. So a person goes and does that and is now beat up because they can't buy organic. I guess that mom should just go back to work, huh?
I agree. It's rediculous. Also, "necessities" are relative. I view my cell phone as a necessity, but I also don't have a land line just so I can have it. It has literally saved my life (stranded 28 miles from a gas station or pay phone). I still had to wait 5 hours to be rescued, but had I not had my cell phone, I would have had to just wait until someone came looking for me. And with all the crime popping up in our area, I would prefer to have it when I am out and about with my daughter. Plus, I get free road side assistance with my cell phone plan, which means I don't have to pay to be an AAA member, and it makes me feel safe to be driving around with my daughter knowing I can call and get a free tow truck or a free unlocking.

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#75 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 04:33 PM
 
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Organic didn't exist when we were kids and I am not dead yet so we do the best we can. .
Liane
Most of the food people have eaten over the ages has been organic. The publication Organic Gardening has been published since 1942 (which I think is way longer than the average MDC member has been on earth). I just want people to not think of organics as the "new" thing/way when really it should be considered the authentic way.

I think that all things being equal I think organic can be done for about the same as conventional in terms of $, but then you have to have other resources i.e. time, tools, storage space, cooking skills, gardening skills, reliable transportation. I think it is within reach of a lot of people who just don't care and out of reach for some here that would really like it ).

People need to do what is best in the big picture (for them). The problem with poverty is immediate needs can make it awfully hard to see the big picture.
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#76 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 04:38 PM
 
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siobhang -
Just an aside, if you have a trader joe's near you, check out their cheese section. You'll be surprised by the prices and the variety.

Yinsum-
Can I have the other icecream?

 
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#77 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 04:41 PM
 
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siobhang -
Just an aside, if you have a trader joe's near you, check out their cheese section. You'll be surprised by the prices and the variety.

Yinsum-
Can I have the other icecream?
actually I have been very disappointed in our local trader joe's. Perhaps it is because it is a small store, but I found it very limited.

Wegmans has a to-die-for cheese selection. I will drive the extra 30 minutes every so often to get their good cheese. But our local safeway actually sells decent chedders and so forth.

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#78 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 04:45 PM
 
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The trader joe's can be very different from each other. I like one a lot better than another near me.

 
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#79 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 04:47 PM
 
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<meaningless rant about cheese>
I personally have a huge issue with bad cheese. It pisses me off that decent cheese is so expensive in this country - I lived in England for three years and I got a bit spoilt by the selections. I am very glad that my family can afford to buy cheese at $7 a hunk (whole foods and wegmans both have fabulous selections) - and it makes me mad that due to price or availability, most people is the US have to buy cheese food.

I find that most people I know have no experience with cheese - they know american, chedder, swiss, and maybe havarti. They are scared of blues or of anything that might be strong tasting. But I often find people are very pleasently surprised when I introduce them to goats cheese or a nice stilton or even a hunk of gruyere and they taste great!

Cheese is a craft that humans have been laboring and experiementing with for thousands of years. It deserves more respect than velveta.
</rant>

Okay, maybe i am a food snob...
When Whole Foods opens here, I am looking foward to to the cheese! That would probably be all I can afford there.
I have never tried Velveta. I know we used it to catch trout when I was 15. They loved it.
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#80 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 04:48 PM
 
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You know....some of us just don't like most cheeses. I like cheddar (although I'm not crazy about really aged cheddar), mozzarella and I'll use a few others here and there in sauces and stuff. That's it. I've tried - reluctantly, I'll admit - a few others, and I haven't liked any of them. Blue cheese is disgusting to me - the smell alone makes me nauseous (I'm learning to live with it, though, as dh loves it and dd likes it quite well)..
fair enough - I can't stand most fish, so someone lecturing on how most americans think that tuna and fish sticks are the only fish around would kind of leave me cold

That said, there is a noticeable taste difference between the hunk of dyed orange kraft chedder and kerrygold chedder cheese. There is also a substantial price difference.

It is the fact that processed cheese dominates the cheese market and sets the standards for taste that bugs me. But then, I care a lot about cheese. And I am weird. I know that. I never expect anyone to agree with my obsessions ; )

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I love Velveeta. I still keep it in the house. I can't stand the single pack cheese clices, though - they taste awful. I need to master making mac and cheese without Velveeta, though..
Velveeta does make great mac and cheese. Gruyere also makes nice mac and cheese, as does emmental - both of those cheeses are what most people think of as "swiss" - only generally without the holes in them.

Now, if I could find local cheese maker - OH. MY. GOD.

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#81 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 04:50 PM
 
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I don't understand why it has to be an all or nothing proposition. I don't know a single person who eats ALL organic. I try to eat certain things organic that I know have the most pesticides - for intance, strawberries which I only buy on sale. I often buy produce at Trader Joe's where it is frozen and organic and as cheap as the regular stuff at Stop and Shop.

Organic is great on many levels but it is way down the list from chemicals in foods and hormones in dairy. For my daughter, I try to get organic dairy (we don't drink cow's milk so cheese) because I think the dairy industry has so muddled with cows that the hormones are affecting our daughters' growth and development. Girls are getting their periods at 8yrs old.

I wish people would take some of the focus off of the organic vs non organic debate and work on getting companies to remove toxic dyes and dangerous preservatives from our foods. That is a much more dire situation needing immediate attention, in my humble opinion

On the fad thing, I don't know about that. I have been a vegetarian since I was a young child and before that, my family was macrobiotic. This was a LONG time ago and it was far from trendy. My mother broke out of the european mold of meat and cheese and wine and went in a different direction. I still get chastised from my french family We shopped at a super small hfs in our neighborhood and my parents scraped by as a struggling artist and teacher/musician. They wanted what everyone wants - good health for their families. There was definitely some luck involved (no driving for one) but also a lot of effort and thought on my mother's part.

I'm glad to see more people becoming vegetarian and vegan. It's a great trend and more power to it
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#82 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 04:57 PM
 
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siobhang: I'm not crazy about emmental (I've had it several times, as my mom is a french onion soup fanatic, and will only use emmental to top it), but maybe I'll try it for mac and cheese. Mac and cheese is one of my favourite foods, and is ds1's favourite. I suppose I could give gruyere a try, too - I've been trying to think of real cheeses to use for my mac and cheese. I currently use part cheddar, part mozza, and part Velveeta.

Kraft cheddar (Cracker Barrel) is actually the high end stuff for us! We used to buy the no-name stuff at the grocery store, but dh likes to snack on cheese, and he doesn't like the no-name much. (The kids snack on it, too - but they don't care about the brand.) I have some organic white cheddar I bought for our decadent breakfast on Saturday - it's pretty good, too...but expensive. I only bought it because we only needed a small amount. Despite being more expensive by weight, it was the cheapest block of white cheddar in the store, because it was small. I'd go organic on cheese, but there's just no way. We go through a lot of it around here.

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#83 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 05:18 PM
 
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Honestly, I think there is a bit of classism when it comes to food choices.

When I walk into our local health food store (Food For Thought), it is crammed full of junk food. Puffed rice cereal and cheetos are crap food to me, whether they are organic, made with real organic cheddar cheese, or whatever (puffed rice cereals really irk me because of the havoc they wreak with my blood sugar, so no offense to people who eat puffed rice cereal ).

But, I think to a lot of people if you have a kid walking around eating Pirate's Booty (gotta be honest, it doesn't look all that healthy to me by reading the label), that's no big deal, but if that same kid were walking around eating Chee-tos, the eyes start a'rollin'.

I think it's a combination of classism and the same type of insecure snobbery that people who live alternative lifestyles tend to be prone to. That's why sometimes we have the crunchy wars here are Mothering, in addition to the mommy wars.

I read an article recently about the "Dirty Dozen" (if you search for Dirty Dozen you'll see several articles). There are some key fruits and vegetables that, if you buy organic, can greatly reduce your intake of pesticides and such. I believe peaches and potatoes are on the list.

I don't know where all of the delicious organic cheap food is at. I live in Wichita, KS and we have two local farmer's markets and when I went there, I was very unimpressed with both the food and prices. So, I guess I'll have to do some more digging to find the "real" local farmers around here that might have cheaper prices, because that selection wasn't cheap and the quality wasn't too great either.
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#84 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 05:43 PM
 
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Honestly, I think there is a bit of classism when it comes to food choices.
This might be based on location. When I was a kid and we were shopping at the local hfs it was anything but snobby. We were frindge and looked it

Where we recently moved from, a very rich and snobby town, the local hfs was where the non-snob, hippyish women went - or the kids who did not fit the town norm, worked. We left that town because we didn't fit in but we miss that little haven, the hfs.
Where we are now is a Whole Foods very nearby. There is quite a mix of peope who shop there. I don't get the feeling that people shop there to be cool. They're there because they want to eat particularly healthy food OR they want to buy fresh and/or exotic cheeses/meats/baked goods.
Then again, it's difficult to make these types of judgements based on clothing or other superficial elements. What else can I go on?


Quote:
Originally Posted by KristiMetz View Post
When I walk into our local health food store (Food For Thought), it is crammed full of junk food. Puffed rice cereal and cheetos are crap food to me, whether they are organic, made with real organic cheddar cheese, or whatever (puffed rice cereals really irk me because of the havoc they wreak with my blood sugar, so no offense to people who eat puffed rice cereal ).
See to me they are a world apart. One has chemicals and dyes and the other may also not be wholesome necessarily, but it is at least safe to consume.
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#85 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 05:44 PM
 
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Well, I am just not completely sold on the whole organic everything issue. I've really researched it, and I do believe in buying organic fruits and veggies. I just think to myself, how do we know that these are honeslty made organically? Like the other day I was shopping, and there is organic PAM!!! I do buy some organic things, but 1. hubby is 100% against buying anything organic, 2. I buy groceries for 11 people, so it would be waaaay to expensive. I do, however, buy specific things just for my kids, like special crackers, Stoneyfield farms yogurt.

I don't buy something just because it says organic, I buy things that maybe don't have Hydrogenated oils, high fructose corn syrup, etc. etc.

Busy Mama to three beautiful girls and loving wife to my hubby
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#86 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 05:55 PM
 
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Originally Posted by KristiMetz View Post

But, I think to a lot of people if you have a kid walking around eating Pirate's Booty (gotta be honest, it doesn't look all that healthy to me by reading the label), that's no big deal, but if that same kid were walking around eating Chee-tos, the eyes start a'rollin'.
Pirates Booty looks pretty good to me, and it looks a lot healthier then Cheeto's (or any other children's-marketed snack food *ahem* Gerber). And considering how BAD the ingredients are in Cheeto's, I probably would roll my eyes at them.

For pretty much the same price you can get a much better quality product. I would only consider it "classist" if one was considerably more expensive when people start the eye rollin'. Otherwise it's just a matter of poor choices, which can be found in ANY class.

Cheeto's

Ingredients
Enriched corn meal (Corn meal, Ferrous Sulfate, Niacin, Thiamine Mononitrate, Riboflavin, and Folic Acid), Vegetable Oil (Contains One or More of the Following: Corn, Soybean, or Sunflower Oil), Whey, Salt, Cheddar Cheese (Cultured Milk, Salt, Enzymes), Partially Hydrogenated Soybean Oil, Maltodextrin, Disodium Phosphate, Sour Cream (Cultured Cream, Nonfat Milk), Artificial Flavor, Monosodium Glutamate, Lactc Acid, Artificial Colors (Including Yellow 6), and Citric Acid.


Pirates Booty:

Ingredients
Corn Meal, Rice, Rice and/or Sunflower Oil, Aged Cheddar Cheese (No Fat Milk, Salt, Cheese Cultures, Enzymes), Whey and Low Fat Buttermilk.

What is inherently unhealthy about Pirates Booty?

Frankenstein never scared me. Marsupials do. Because they're FAST.
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#87 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 06:02 PM
 
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First, I will be honest and admit that we buy a good many of our groceries at Walmart. They sell a lot of the organic food that we consider staples. (peanut butter, milk, cheese, cereal, sugar, flour, yogurt etc).
I haven't read the whole thread yet, so I don't know if anyone has addressed this yet, but I'd be wary of "organic" at walmart. They're being investigated for their handling, labeling, and stocking practices. The article I read (I'll find it in a second) specifically mentioned yogurt being one of those foods.

Not the article I'm thinking of, but this one talks about the issue: http://www.organicconsumers.org/arti...ticle_3606.cfm

Here's the one I was thinking of: http://www.newsdesk.org/archives/000966.php
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#88 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 06:25 PM
 
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I haven't read the whole thread....but WalMart could be giving away organic food, and I still would not buy it.

I agree that it's not just about the "organic" label. We can thankfully walk to an organic farm, so summer and fall we eat a LOT of fresh organic fruits and veggies. Otherwise we just try to eat as healthfully as we can...winter is tough in the colder states, though I did just find organic blueberries on sale for cheaper than non-organic!

I have a neighbor who always complains that our local farm's prices are too high...which I don't get, since the nearest grocery store is 25 minutes away. So that's 2 gallons of gas at $2.50 a gallon to spend almost as much on produce as you would by walking down the road. Plus I'd rather support my neighbors by buying their produce...and it's just darn fun to pick your own strawberries.

A writer/runner/thinker/wife with two daughters (11/02 and 8/05), one dog, three cats, seven fish, and a partridge in a pear tree... in Vermont.
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#89 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 06:41 PM
 
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I'd like to add some thoughts about organic vs non organic. In another thread I wrote that we are lucky to shop at a local store that sells only organic fruits and veggies and than 99% of the rest of our groceries are organic. We buy this way because we feel so strongly to put non pesticide non gmo items into our bodies and that of our 2 year old son as well as helping to restore natural soil to our earth. We are both fortunate and privilaged to be able to shop this way. But, we have also made tradeoffs, we don't eat out, we don't go to the movies, buy things that are frivilous, we live in a small house, and other things that are limited to our single income.

The amount of pesticides that build up in children's bodies due to thier small size and how much they eat is enormous. I think that as a society we are finding out the effects of what pesticides are doing to our bodies with cancer and other disease. Women's bodies are affected next because we tend to have more fat cells, more chemicals get stored there. Also, our land is being destroyed due to non organic farming.

If you live in an area where there are no stores that carry organic, could you grow your own? could you talk with some small farmers or find some farmers near you that do farm organic and then set up a co-op with other people in your community? Could you shop bulk on line with other people in your family or community?

I think it all boils down to what you are concerened about and what you are interested in changing if anything at all. I think that if more people demanded organic more would have to be produced and the cost would come down. of course that would take awhile. But, I don't shop at a regular grocery store because our food bill would actually be MORE expensive than shopping at a natural foods store. That is because we are vegan and the veggie type foods as well as organic veggies are horrible and terribly expensive. So we shop at the natural foods store and our bill is smaller. Sometimes I feel like part of the problem because I don't shop and demand better food at a mainstream grocery store but that is where I realize my privelage comes in. There is a lot to grapple with when it comes to this issue. but there is more to it than just organic- it is peoples lives at stake, ours, farmers, and our earths future too.

I have a friend who is the mother of 2 kids and her husband and they live on one income and she spends $50 a week on organic fruits veggies and groceries. She cooks from scratch and is also vegan.
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#90 of 171 Old 01-08-2007, 06:56 PM
 
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I think the term organic has gotten diluted every since it became an FDA certification process. Any processed food labeled organic is a waste of money. To me that's the biggest gimmick of marketing. Not that you shouldn't ever, ever eat processed food but there are so many loopholes when it comes to processed food that the term organic doesn't usually mean all that much.

I do think you lower your food bill automatically when you prepare food at home and not do packaged covenience or take out. One dinner is also usually turned into two lunches. Our chickens are used thoroughly. Usually for 2 dinners and the carcass eventually becomes chicken stock. We buy things in season by belonging to a CSA. I'm hoping to finally get a deep freeze so we can save tons of money by buying a whole pig and a 1/4 of a cow.

I prefer local and organic, then local, then non-local organic, then non local conventional for things. I can get most things within my first two choices. A lot of farms around here practice organic farming but can't afford to be certified.

I think someone early in thread hit it on the nail when they said you really have to change your whole way of thinking about food to make the committment to local and/or organic. Organic produce flown into Vermont in the middle of January or July for that matter from South America to me defeats the whole purpose of going organic. How can it be sustainable practices to be wasting all that jet fuel? I try to plan meals seasonally and think of cooking more than one meal at a time.

Also, Americans spend less on food in relation to income than any other Western country. I value good food it's worth it to me to make room in my budget and sacrifice other things to make sure my family is eating right. I know not everyone can do that. All I ask is that everyone try to feed their families the best they can and be mindful of what you're eating.

There is food elitism but that goes into Organic being a sexy marketing term and restaurants that are places to see and be seen rather than actually eating. I never really associate that with MDC to be honest.
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