Low-Milk Supply Tribe - Page 17 - Mothering Forums

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#481 of 1093 Old 12-02-2005, 11:59 AM
 
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Adrienne....

I remember how sad I was too....... and I am so sorry this has happened to you.

Please, please don't feel like you have to leave this thread tho, or a sub-forum, if we ever get one. We need advice & support here from mamas like you who have travelled the hard road of low supply.....

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#482 of 1093 Old 12-02-2005, 12:49 PM
 
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Well, I just finished the member count on this thread. I got 79. That's 79 mamas who we all have collectively helped work through low-supply issues in one way or another. And I think we should all be proud of the support we have given each other.

I'll compose a pm to the mods tomorrow to ask for our own sub-forum. (too tired now!) Please, if anybody else feels like we should push for a subforum, please pm them too....

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#483 of 1093 Old 12-03-2005, 03:27 AM
 
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Popping in to say I had low milk supply issues with my second, after having abundance with my first. Turned out to be (two years LATER!) a hypothyroid problem. In retrospect - D'oh! Why didn't my CNM check for that?! I had all the symptoms, and could have saved myself so much frustration with non-stop pumping and struggling. So if anyone is having issues with milk supply after having followed all the conventional advice on frequency of nursing, pumping while nursing, herbs, etc, and you may have a weight problem, check your thyroid levels! That's all. Off my soapbox now
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#484 of 1093 Old 12-03-2005, 03:38 AM
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*pokes head in to say hi*

I'm currently pumping for all of our newborn's needs (she is a bit over 2 weeks) due to a breast reduction I had at 19. I don't have normal let downs, and I am jealous of mother's who have milk that actually sprays instead of drizzling out. *sigh*

Unless I use VERY firm/hard massage (it has sorta hurt in order to work) on my ducts with my pump set on max/high, or otherwise the milk won't come out. I think also her suck is not strong enough yet -and- her latch is poor because I have *whisper* huge swollen nipples. The nurse, lacatation consultant, and my doula think that my large nipples are a large part of the problem for my baby and until the swelling goes down and she is older/bigger, her latch will continue to be very poor. Since the pump RIPS at my nipples, I'm not sure hte swelling will eVER go down.

I'm currently pumping about 80% of her needs, which is quite high for a breast reduction, so that is good news. I give her her forumla at night (I figure it's the best time because this way she sleeps for longer stretches,) and breastmilk only during the day. I pump at night faithfully every 3/4 hours, and during the day I pump every 2/3 hours, been taking fenugreek, but will not be taking DPD. I honestly get burned out sometimes, pumping and all, I feel like a dairy cow, it all seems so mechanical... *shrug*

I do hope as her supply needs increase, I will be able to produce more milk, which I understand can be an issue for breast reduction women.
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#485 of 1093 Old 12-03-2005, 05:55 PM
 
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I am glad to have found this site. I just joined after seeing a link from babycenter. I too have had low milk supply, I only get 5ml when I pump and my son is 1 month old. I have been taking fenugreek since day 5 postpartum, just switched yesterday to a tincture of fenugreek, fennel and blessed thistle. Also tried reglan and am now on domperidone for about a week and a half and am up to 40mg 4 times a day. Also I drink mothers milk tea. I put son to breast sometimes and then he gets bottle after and then I pump or I just pump and do bottle. I don't know what else to do, I had my thyroid tested and blood count done. He was born c-section but it seems like all this should have atleast made an improvement. Any other ideas of what to try? I use a double pump, drink lots of fluids. I so very want this to work and am trying so hard not to get discouraged that Ds gets mostly formula.
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#486 of 1093 Old 12-03-2005, 06:23 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adrienne
Sad to announce that my milk is all gone. We have been down to just drops for a week now and my baby needs me so I can't justify pumping when he wants to be held and cared for.



Best wishes to you all and I'll see you in the other (happier) forums!

I hope you don't feel discouraged. You did it for as long as you could. The fact that you did it at all sets you apart from a lot of people in the world. I went through the same thing with both DC. #1 nursed for 4 mo and #2 for 3 mo. I did pumping, feeding every half hour, and every suppliment known to increase production you can think of. It does, in my opinion, give you a close bond with your children when you have to fight for them to keep them bf. Good job and best of luck.
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#487 of 1093 Old 12-03-2005, 07:36 PM
 
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i have two questions. first, except for coffee and sage, what other foods decrease your supply? and second, how many swallows should ds be getting per feeding? he swallows about every 2nd suck until the evening when my milk supply seems to slow way down. also, i'm trying a new form of fenugreek and was wondering if anyone has had experience with it. on the recommendation of the specialist at my health food store, i bought the fenugreek seeds. apparently you put a teaspoon in water for about a day until they start to sprout and then you eat them. she said it was better than even the tincture. anyone try this?
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#488 of 1093 Old 12-03-2005, 09:08 PM
 
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The author of Mother-Food said that bananas, chocolate and avocado seemed to have negative effects on her supply.

I've never heard of using the fenugreek seeds. I think the capsules I take are fenugreek seed capsules, though. I really don't know.
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#489 of 1093 Old 12-03-2005, 09:44 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Barbee
i have two questions. first, except for coffee and sage, what other foods decrease your supply? and second, how many swallows should ds be getting per feeding? he swallows about every 2nd suck until the evening when my milk supply seems to slow way down. also, i'm trying a new form of fenugreek and was wondering if anyone has had experience with it. on the recommendation of the specialist at my health food store, i bought the fenugreek seeds. apparently you put a teaspoon in water for about a day until they start to sprout and then you eat them. she said it was better than even the tincture. anyone try this?
Things that can decrease supply:


1. Low Thyroid levels
2. Cold/Allergy Medications (this includes Antihistamines and other medications)
3. Mint
4. Sage
5. Cabbage leaves when applied to the breast
6. Alcohol
7. Hormonal Birth Control/Contraceptives
8. Menstruation
9. Stress/Fatigue/Sleep deprivation
10. Dehydration (don't forget to drink enough water!)
11. Not nursing often enough/over supplimentation
12. Parsley
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#490 of 1093 Old 12-04-2005, 04:54 AM
 
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oh no!!! not CHOCOLATE!!! i just had my last chocolate binge tonight. i'm so going to remind hunter of this when he's a teenager!!! "i gave up CHOCOLATE for you young man!" anything for my boy though.
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#491 of 1093 Old 12-04-2005, 08:47 AM
 
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Still haven't sent a pm to the mods yet!! : ANybody else?? But terrlk's post caught my eye, & a few thoughts came up.

Quote:
I put son to breast sometimes and then he gets bottle after and then I pump or I just pump and do bottle. I don't know what else to do, I had my thyroid tested and blood count done. He was born c-section but it seems like all this should have atleast made an improvement. Any other ideas of what to try?
Unless you're dealing with lingering trauma from a c-sec birth, my understanding is that pressure on the incision is one of the main reasons bf'ing is more difficult after a c-sec, also maybe some anethesia issues, but these things should resolve by 4 weeks, generally. I haven't had a c-sec birth, so I can't give any specific anecdotes, but I'm sure there are mamas here on this thread who can give you better info than that.....

Now, for something I do know a little about.... How long do you put your ds to the breast before you give the bottle? How many hours of the day & night do you reckon he is at the breast? Also, is it possible to pump one breast & nurse him at the other, then switch over after say, half an hour or so? I had a hand pump (Avent), which was useful as I too could only extract small amounts. That way I could stick the whole thing in the fridge when I wasn't using it, & pull it out when I was ready to try pumping again. Even tho you have a double pump, I think that baby's sucking action at the breast is going to be way more efficient at stimulating you & extracting milk.... usually- now ignore that info if you know your situation is different! I would always offer the breast before the bottle every time (I know there will always be times when this is just utterly impossible, but in general)- have you tried breast compression whilst nursing? I also would sometimes nurse with my ds lying on the ground, with me hovering on hands & knees with my breast above him to allow gravity to help the breast milk flow. You can also semi-squat on a low bed or stool & hold bub lower than the breast & get the same effect. Have you talked to an LC to check positioning of mouth on the breast & such? When your ds is nursing, does it feel comfortable? Do you feel a let-down?

Sorry to bombard you with some many questions... just trying to brainstorm some ideas that may help you out.....


btw, welcome to our little tribe...

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#492 of 1093 Old 12-04-2005, 11:44 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by terrlk
Also I drink mothers milk tea. I put son to breast sometimes and then he gets bottle after .
An idea...don't always give him the bottle afterwards. If he knows a bottle will always come after, he might get slow or lazy at the breast because he knows the easier method will come soon. So you might want to mix it up a little. Give breast, wait and then give bottle a bit later. Or give a little bit via bottle first and then breast and then sometimes don't give a bottle. This was suggested to me by an IBCLC, and we've never had problems (knock on wood) with the baby refusing the breast.

Also the Avent bottles with slow flow nipples worked well for us. No nipple confusion or problems for us...

good luck!
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#493 of 1093 Old 12-04-2005, 11:49 AM
 
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Adrienne
Sad to announce that my milk is all gone. We have been down to just drops for a week now and my baby needs me so I can't justify pumping when he wants to be held and cared for.



Best wishes to you all and I'll see you in the other (happier) forums!

Dear Adrienne--

I salute you and congratulate you for working so long and so hard on your bfing issues. All of us here know how awful and heartbreaking it is to have these problems. I send you lots of hugs and love. Your little one still got a lot of benefit from what you were able to provide.

--hh
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#494 of 1093 Old 12-04-2005, 06:07 PM
 
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On giving a bottle - when DD was very little the ped. suggested I nurse one side for about 15-20 min. Then offer a 2 oz. bottle, then offer the 2nd side.

Even with various bottles - Avent, Dr. Brown's, Playtex, etc... - DD seemed to get nipple confusion (preference) so at 3 mo. I decided to go totally w/ the SNS.


Another thing that can hurt supply is soy. Soy increases estrogen and estrogen suppresses prolactin. So all that soy milk and soy yogurt you thought was good for you......not if your milk supply is low.
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#495 of 1093 Old 12-04-2005, 06:17 PM
 
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Some answers to some of the questions I have gotten: I do use compression and my latch seems to be good, not painful and I have see 2 lactation consultants and talk to one on the phone alot. The problem with putting DS to breast even if he is willing to be on for even 10 minutes is that after there is no milk he just gums it, with having such a small amount he just doesn't keep working at it no matter what I do and if I don't give him a bottle after then he isn't even getting an ounce of food and he usually eats 3 ounces every 2-3 hours so skipping the bottle at a feeding doesn't seem an option. I will try doing some formula first then go to breast so maybe he will be a little more patient at times. I don't feel a let down since there is such a small amount of milk but do see that it changes from light colored to darker thicker milk at the end. Thank you for all the help and suggestions.
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#496 of 1093 Old 12-04-2005, 06:48 PM
 
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Hi,
I am new to this fourm, mom to a ds Jackson who is 5 months old. Since he was about 1 1/2 or so I have battled low supply. Have been working with a LC and tried Fenugreek, Blessed Thissle, Goats Rue, and Relgan. Goats Rue is what I am currently taking and helps slightly. The reglan my body couldn't handle. We have tried pumping in addition to bfing. Although he nurses so much it's getting hard to find the time and energy to pump. It's been very hard on me emotionally as I feel bad for not being able to give him enough bm. Everything we try and nothing seems to help. After this long I really try to not let it bother me and just nurse and give some formula if I have to. I have told myself I am doing the best I can and that's all I can do. However I am feeling in a slump and everything is getting to me. Jackson has also been a very colicky baby and is better but still very demanding and will only let me hold him, feed him, or put him to sleep.

I have ordered dompridone from New Zeland. I ordered it 2 1/2 weeks ago and have not yet recieved yet (guessing it is lost). They won't send another bottle for another week then I have to wait at least another week. From what I hear I do have a little hope. I just hope it will get here someday soon!

Just wanted to introduce myself. I would love to hear from other mom's who have fought this and am up for any advice.

Thanks
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#497 of 1093 Old 12-05-2005, 06:24 PM
 
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Hi Mommy2Jackson! Welcome!

Have you tried the motherlove herbals? Their More Milk Special Blend is a blend of herbs and Goat's Rue. I've seen increase with that. Don't be discouraged about your dom. There is one site in particular that will re-ship w/o charging, I believe. Also, sometimes shipments get held up entering the US, but then are released so that the recipient ends up getting both the original shipment AND the replacement shipment. I've never had a problem receiving shipments so I don't know how it all works.

Have you tried breast compressions to improve flow? Have you tried an SNS or lact-aid system. I swear by the SNS. I own 4 of them (3 regular and 1 starter) and if we have any more kids I'm sure I'll use it from day one.

Have you been to your doctor for bloodwork to check for any hormone imbalances - thyroid, PCOS, estrogen & prolactin levels. Those are things to get checked out.

Hang in there! We're all in this together.
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#498 of 1093 Old 12-05-2005, 07:11 PM
 
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Mommy2Jackson, definitely don't give up on the domperidone - it can take at least 3 weeks.

In addition to the great ideas Marcy gave you, have you had his latch/suck evaluated by a speech therapist or occupational therapist? I think there have been some good posts on this thread or in this forum by moms who have had a lot of success with getting the latch retrained to be more efficient.

Come visit the NEW QuirkyBaby website -- earn QB Bucks rewards points for purchases, reviews, referrals, and more! Free US shipping on great brands of baby slings and carriers and FREE BabyLegs or babywearing mirror on orders of $100+. Take the QB Quiz for personalized advice!

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#499 of 1093 Old 12-05-2005, 09:17 PM
 
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I've emailed one of the moderators. She was going to forward my request to Cynthia M. I really think MDC could stand out among the parenting boards if they devoted a sub-forum to this topic.
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#500 of 1093 Old 12-06-2005, 07:23 AM
 
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Marcy, did the mods seem sympathetic to creating a new sub-forum? I know there is a breast feeding support sub-forum, but I'm not sure that's a safe enough place for a lot of low-supply mums to post. I know when we moved out of FYT, there was concern that we would be open to 'attack', for lack of a better term. However, I think right now the need to reach as many low supply mamas as possible outweighs that concern.... Victorian, are you hanging around right now? This is your thread originally, any thoughts on this matter?

In the past when I've had reason to be in contact with Cynthia, I've found her to be very open-minded & reasonable, so hopefully she'll see why we want to have a 'breastmilk supply issues' sub-forum opened.... Peggy O is the woman we've gotta convince, I reckon! Not that I think she is any less open-minded, of course, but she is the keeper of the flame, so to speak....

I think it's time for a little :

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#501 of 1093 Old 12-06-2005, 11:32 AM
 
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They seemed kinda open to it - she just said she's forward my request to Cynthia.

I think we get more support here because we are trying to overcome low supply and not just giving into bottles, kwim?

Have to cut this short - needy-baby today.
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#502 of 1093 Old 12-06-2005, 02:55 PM
 
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Sounds like Cynthia is considering the sub-forum idea. I posted under Questions & Suggestions:

http://www.mothering.com/discussions...d.php?t=377219

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#503 of 1093 Old 12-07-2005, 02:12 PM
 
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Hello ladies!!! It's been a while since I have been around these parts! Just plain old busy I guess! Welcome to the new ladies!...and whoever got the idea to ask for a sub-forum...I applaud you

To update you all on our life since supplementing...

I venture to now say that it is going well. Hosanna was just weighed yesterday and she is now 10.11# wooohoooo! We are supplementing her with goats milk. We found some people who would sell us goats milk unpasturized and straight from the goat! I did a lot of research and she is actually getting more vitamins then she would be with formula...this makes my heart happy.
I am breastfeeding still too! She usually breastfeeds about 3-5 times during the day, and then only breastfeeding at night (mainly, I'm far to lazy to get up to get a bottle ready at night! ) I haven't noticed any change in my supply at all. When she's done breastfeeding I can still hand express milk...and sometimes during the day if I have not breastfed her for about 4 hours I do leak *yipppee* My theory is (and correct me if I'm wrong)...when babies get older and are eatting more solids, mom's milk supply doesn't die because baby isn't sucking as much as before...so I pretend that that is where we are at :-) and goats milk is our "solid"
I'm not using an SNS feeder. I'm not pumping. I did for a while, but it was very emotional for me, many many tears. As much as I would love to be able to only breastfeed, it is so much more important to enjoy the experience I think...and we are there now.
I'm so proud of my little pea she's done so well!
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#504 of 1093 Old 12-07-2005, 03:31 PM
 
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gracious, so glad to hear of your successes! that is wonderful that you found a source of raw goat's milk! when the season is right, they actually sell raw goat's milk at one of our local health food stores here and we used it for a while with our little man. are you adding anything to it, like EFAs or iron or folic acid or something else?

as babies get older and keep growing and gaining strength, their sucking and nursing becomes more efficient so sometimes they nurse for shorter times than before.

i, too, am excited about the prospect of a breastfeeding supply issues forum.

and a belated hug to adrienne. such a heartbreaking choice to make: continue pumping and take time away from enjoying your little one and all the increased stress that goes along with it or choose to feed him formula exclusively and grieve the loss of the breastfeeding relationship you envisioned for yourself... please know that you did your best and you are making the best choice for your family. and little o did get the benefits of drinking your mama milk, even if it was just part of his calories.

and to all the mamas...

~claudia
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#505 of 1093 Old 12-07-2005, 03:34 PM
 
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I got some raspberry leaf capsules to add to my mix for trying to increase my supply and was wondering if anyone knew the amount to take. I have looked at breastfeedingonline.com and a few other sites to no avail. Any help is appreciated. Thanks and good luck to all.
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#506 of 1093 Old 12-07-2005, 04:59 PM
 
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I just posted what I hope was an eloquent and impassioned plea for us to get a subforum

I had a heartwarming moment yesterday... Tristan, in the midst of teething, seems much more interested in nursing, and using his sign to tell me that he wants to nurse ("milk" sign)... and yesterday while he was nursing for a while he was swallowing every 5 sucks or so. I was amazed that "that much" (ha ha) milk was hiding away in there, I figured I was probably down to drops.

He's also been drinking his formula/milk mix (we're trying to switch to whole milk but I guess he likes the taste of the Baby's Only formula enough that he didn't like the switch! So we're mixing it and upping the milk: formula ration ever so slowly) out of a cup lately... 7 oz today. That's 7 more oz than he drank yesterday out of a cup! Perhaps he will get enough calories during the day at some point that we can stop with the SNSes at night... and subsequently PERMANENTLY! cross fingers...

to all, Jen

ps: terrik - I only ever drank red raspberry leaf in a tea, so I don't know how much to take via capsule, sorry... if I can find my wise woman herbal somewhere I will look. If I can't I'll call my chiropractor for you, I know she's got it...

: mama to T 9/04 and E 11/08
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#507 of 1093 Old 12-08-2005, 02:34 AM
 
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Hi all.
My little one is gaining slowly, but I need to get more into her. I am pumping and supplementing with that and goat's milk (fortified)-I can only get 1/2 oz per breast when pumpming and fitting in lots of sessions is very stressful with my two year old, etc, etc. She is getting frustrated with the tubing (tiny tube and syringe-like SNS)-am I doing it wrong? I did try a bottle and she drank a little the first time, but now just wants to chew and won't suck (teething). I can sometimes just tell that she is hungry, although she is a VERY mellow baby, and sometimes just gives up if my milk comes in too slowly or not at all.
But it is hard to tell, besides the weight gain being slow. My husband is not even sure that there is anything wrong and the growth charts are bogus; so I don't get a lot of support there. Also don't get support because my breasts leak-like actually squirt out. But if I don't catch it or stop it, then thats all there is. It's like it all leaks out. :
Dd is happy and alert and gaining steadily (but very slow-less than a 1/2 oz a day: she went from about the 50 percentile down to the 5th and now 10th). Midwife thinks she needs more, I think she needs more, but friends and dh say she is fine and I am overly worried (I do have a touch of ppd). She is 5 months old and even though I waited until 6 mos with ds, I am thinking about starting her on some cereal, mainly because I can mix it with the bm/goat milk as she is refusing other ways to get it into her.
And it is frustrating to throw away breast milk because it has been heated too many times (twice and twice refused).
Thanks for any advice.
Any thoughts on this?
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#508 of 1093 Old 12-08-2005, 09:02 AM
 
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Allie - She's gaining she's gaining she's gaining!!!! Even if it's slow, she's still gaining!!! Don't worry!!!!!! Be Happy!!!!!

The only reason I have to supplement is if/when I don't, she loses. So be happy that she's gaining!

Okay, now that we've got that down...

Has the ped. given okay for cereal? Does she seem interested in it or is the tongue relfex still present? I'd say try a little - maybe mixed w/ avocado to pack in some good calories and see how she does.
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#509 of 1093 Old 12-09-2005, 12:31 AM
 
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You are the mom and you know best, if you feel like she should be getting more...you are probably right...I'm sure we're all set up to know these things
With the bottle thing, have you tried a feeding cup? babies seem to take to them real easily and then do an easy transition to the bottle...
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#510 of 1093 Old 12-09-2005, 02:11 AM
 
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Thanks for the replies. It is so hard to know sometimes. I usually trust my instincts, but I think I have a touch of ppd and am feeling fuzzy. I do believe that milk production is right on par with hormone balance, so I am taking some herbs to help support the liver as well as the milk boosters.
Anyway, I gave dd a cup of ebm/goat's milk and she is getting better at getting it down that way. At least it doesn't make her mad. I don't think she is ready for solids yet, so I will keep going with the cup for at least a few more weeks (she is 5 months tomorrow!).
This pumping thing is hard! With an active two year old and all the washing of parts and such, it is so frustrating to only get 1/2 oz per side per session.
Hang in there, mamas!
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