OMG stupid STUPID S-T-U-P-I-D advise given to me - Mothering Forums

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#1 of 48 Old 03-20-2010, 11:46 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Unfortunally we found out the Ped I wanted wasn't under our insurance (or one of them) so we ended up being assigned to another... I kept an open mind though....
Yea well got over that SUPER quick...
So I took my NB in for her first "checkup" at 8 days old the one concern I gave the nurse was the fact she hadn't have a BM in days and was a bit fussy in the evening from the "gas"... I knew there might be some BF issues tossed around so I was braced for that but OMG this was SOOO over the top!
I KID you not the advice..
Doctor walks in doesn't intro himself doesn't say ahh cute baby lets check her out doesn't ask how I am nothing he jsut asks..
Breast or bottle?

Me:.. breast

How often?

Me: as she needs sometimes every hour sometimes every 3 depends and shes does sleep a streatch at night..

How long?

Me... Ohh sometimes 5 mintues sometimes up to 45 or more

HIM.. Well see there is your problem! You should NOT nurse more than every 2 hours (okay that alone is silly but even that is 12 feeding a day its not a "horrible thing to say" but nope it gets better.. Because your breasts won't have enough time to "refill" YUP those were his words they need to fill up again and the baby will jsut get air (cause didn't you know our boobs are filled with air?) that will make her gassy and constipated also NEVER nurse more than 15 mintues per side cause yea then she will jsut suck me dry and again poor baby will just be sucking air and my boobs will get sore So if baby needs to suck more past the limited 15 mintues then give her a pacifer cause babies do have strong sucking needs (that last line about there needs was the ONLY thing he said that was "correct").. I mean SERIOUSLY? AIR filled boobs that need to "refill? Like seriously they gave you a degree??
Needless to say I'm NEVER going back I just nodded and didn't argue because it was pointless I knew instantly I'd NEVER go back... I'm dropping the secondary insurace monday its out state medicare I qualified because of my diabetes and high risk heat condition to have the pregancy covered so the NB is automatically covered for a while but we don't need her to me out income and DH job we can handle a diffrent and better HC plan. I liked the Doctor I saw at the hospital I'm planning on giving him a chance.. When he came to see me he introduced hims self he held my DD (with my permission) and spoke to her he cradled and rocked he asked how I was doing and when he left reminded me I can BF as long and often as she needs and wants...
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#2 of 48 Old 03-20-2010, 11:55 PM
 
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Wow. That's deplorable! I would report his "advice" to the head of that office. In fact, I'd consider reporting him to the AAP for giving out misinformation that will likely jeopardize many breastfeeding relationships.

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#3 of 48 Old 03-20-2010, 11:57 PM
 
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Who knew that boobs were filled with air!

Sometimes, I really do wonder about some medical professionals, especially when the information given to the mother is completely false and irrational.

Makes me wonder what medical journals he's reading.

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#4 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 12:02 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Originally Posted by Bokonon View Post
Wow. That's deplorable! I would report his "advice" to the head of that office. In fact, I'd consider reporting him to the AAP for giving out misinformation that will likely jeopardize many breastfeeding relationships.
After leaving I "googled" him nothing on him popped up but things on the "office in general" and on the other doctor in his practice did and the reviews we horrible so I have a feeling my complaint would fall on deaf ears... I did notice a lot of bottles when we waited...
Reporting him to the AAP is a thought though...

Deanna

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#5 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 12:19 AM
 
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regardless of the bad info, it is not a normal thing for a nb to be going days without a bm, and I would get that checked out asap
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#6 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 12:31 AM
 
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regardless of the bad info, it is not a normal thing for a nb to be going days without a bm, and I would get that checked out asap
i disagree... if baby is EBF, you should not worry about a few days between BMs. are her BMs *large* BMs when they finally do come?

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#7 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 12:50 AM
 
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i disagree... if baby is EBF, you should not worry about a few days between BMs. are her BMs *large* BMs when they finally do come?
This is not the case for newborns:

http://www.llli.org/llleaderweb/LV/L...Jan98p123.html
http://www.mother-2-mother.com/norma...ough-milk.html

It is not til several months old that it is normal for bf babies to not have bm every day. Especially in the first few weeks as bf is becoming established, it is important to note several bm daily. I would highly suggest a lc for a nb not having bm for several days.
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#8 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 12:59 AM
 
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ElliesMomma - it is normal for an older BF baby to do a few days, but an 8 day old? NO. That is not normal.

I would look into this.

Also, try to keep track of how often you are nursing, and make sure it is at least every 3 hours during the day (or at least 8 nursings a day). If you have a really sleepy baby you may need to offer/get them to nurse when they are not yet asking for it.

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#9 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 01:31 AM - Thread Starter
 
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regardless of the bad info, it is not a normal thing for a nb to be going days without a bm, and I would get that checked out asap
I'm despertly trying and doing some research.. It is concerning me my DD is currently 12 days old shes had about 48 hours worth of the mectoium diapers then like one trye breastfed type BM then nothing today was day 9 of nothing despite block feeding on demand and her getting a LOT. She gets soo hard in her tummy and you can tell sehs is despertly trying but nothing.. Shes managed two BM today because we "helped" her pass them and they were thick not loose stools you'd expect from breastmilk..
I'm taking her back to the hospital Monday for a "screening" I'll ask them there and hopefully I can get her into a diffrent doctor soon.

Deanna

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#10 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 01:36 AM - Thread Starter
 
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Also, try to keep track of how often you are nursing, and make sure it is at least every 3 hours during the day (or at least 8 nursings a day). If you have a really sleepy baby you may need to offer/get them to nurse when they are not yet asking for it.

Tjej
I'd say between her "waking" hours of around 7am till around 12pm she is nursing around 9-12 times on average and her "nights" between 12am and 7am she is nursing around 2-3 times but one of those can be a 4-6 hour streach of solid sleep.. She is producing a ton of wet diapers... She has long periods of being alert. I do offer a feeding if a daytime nap happens to exceed 3 hours shes tends to not let it though. The only exception is her night streatch.

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#11 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 08:11 AM
 
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The doctor is misguided. Completely and totally. Switching sides before the baby is "done" gets the baby more foremilk, less hindmilk--- and doing that can make baby more gassy. And the baby is going to just get air? It would be funny if it weren't so frightening how little most doctors know about breastfeeding. We learn literally nothing about it at most medical schools and the one pediatrician-taught lecture we had in my family med residency was completely full of incorrect information (wrong on how long milk can be stored, normal frequency of feeding, etc). You have to seek out information yourself or breastfeed if you want to give helpful advice!

An eight day old generally shouldn't go so long between BM (which obviously you know, which is why you mentioned it to the doctor). Is baby gaining weight appropriately? Is baby making normal number of wet diapers?

It isn't popular to say, but occasionally moms do have legitimate supply issues (way more rarely than most mom's who quit early would like to think) even if they are breastfeeding on demand. And sometimes infants have metabolic/hormonal/or anatomic issues that lead to constipation. I would seek out another doctors advice ASAP in addition to seeing a lactation consultant or LLL leader.

And in the meantime, I'd continue the on-demand feeding...

For some sanity, though, I like the LLL info below:

"The First Six Weeks

Most babies, after the first few days, have two to five bowel movements every 24 hours, until they are about six weeks old. The stools should be as large as a US quarter to "count" in this number. Some babies will have more frequent bowel movements, and it is possible for a healthy baby to have fewer bowel movements. If a baby younger than six weeks has fewer than two bowel movements a day, that can still be a variation of normal provided that the baby has an adequate number of wet diapers, is known to be gaining weight at an adequate rate, and the stools produced are substantial in volume."
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#12 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 09:09 AM
 
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Thicker might mean that it is still mec mixed in. How are diapers? Definitely wet? No pink or orange in them?

Honestly I would not be waiting on this. Even if you did some pumping and feeding, or supplementing, that might bring on a bm. When did your milk come in? Are your breasts getting full and hard? And as much of an idiot the dr was, there is some truth in his claim of emptying and refilling. Of course, this is anecdata of nursing 4 babies, but when they wanted to nurse very very freq, like more than once in and hour, I did not get a let down, which no milk flowing.

I would definitely be seeking someone out, today.
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#13 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 11:24 AM
 
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Wow

If my boobs are filled with air where is the valve so I can deflate them a couple cups?!

Surviving sleep deprivation one day at a time with dd (Oct '11) & ds (Oct '08).

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#14 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 11:28 AM
 
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I WISH my boobs were filled with air! Then they wouldn't be so saggy! LOL.

Rachel, mom to Jake (5/04) and Alexia (7/07) a surprise UC thanks to hypnobabies!
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#15 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 11:44 AM
 
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I'm despertly trying and doing some research.. It is concerning me my DD is currently 12 days old shes had about 48 hours worth of the mectoium diapers then like one trye breastfed type BM then nothing today was day 9 of nothing despite block feeding on demand and her getting a LOT. She gets soo hard in her tummy and you can tell sehs is despertly trying but nothing.. Shes managed two BM today because we "helped" her pass them and they were thick not loose stools you'd expect from breastmilk..
I'm taking her back to the hospital Monday for a "screening" I'll ask them there and hopefully I can get her into a diffrent doctor soon.

Deanna

My DS2 pooped when he was 1 and 2 days old, then after that only pooped every sunday til he was 7 months old and started having solids. He now poops every day. His were also very thick, totally unlike DS1 who pooped liquid every couple of hours!!
Dont panic too much because it might be nothing but obviously if it makes you comfortable get it checked out.
xx
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#16 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 12:48 PM
 
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It sounds like baby is feeding relatively frequently. That's good. Do you get at least maybe 10 minutes of active sucking at each feed (since it sounds like 9-10ish feeds a day)? You can see them sort of open, pause, close and hear the swallow when they close.

The time between stools is really concerning to me. I get that babies vary, but 9 days of no poop would be at least 6 days past my comfort before I was in a doctor's office, and I don't go to the doctor very often. BF newborn babies really do usually poop AT LEAST once a day (usually a lot more often). I am sure there are exceptions, but I would wonder if those exceptions still mean there is something gastric going on.

BTW, are you eating, getting rest as much as humanly possible, and taking decent care of yourself (and able to relax while nursing)? These things are really important. Setting up a big cup of water and a snack bar before you sit down to nurse each time can help with all of that.

Tjej
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#17 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 01:04 PM
 
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Hi mama first congrats on your new little angel! I am so sorry that dr was like that its unreal. I think all pedis should be required to learn the true facts about nursing! If you are uncomfortable about the poop go with your gut and see another dr.
I found the best thing for gas, I learned this from an old wise woman who used to work with my mom, and it has worked with bouth of mine and several friends. Cradle your baby and in a circular motion rub the small of her back. From right below the diaperline. I don't know what it is if it gets things moving for the lo or its just that relaxing for them but it has been a huge help. Good luck and feed ur baby as much as she wants! Air who knew, where's the valve I'd like to deflate some now!
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#18 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 01:05 PM
 
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I WISH my boobs were filled with air! Then they wouldn't be so saggy! LOL.
Agreed!

I think, if I could hold my laughter in for long enough, I would have told that doc, "How did you get a degree???" Then I'd have walked out without paying ANYTHING and complained to both the office manager AND the insurance company. What a complete.... Wow. That's just beyond. I can't understand how he got into this line of work! This is so out-there for breastfeeding misinformation. My head is spinning.


As for her stomach issues, I would definitely keep seeking help for that. I hope you find an answer soon!

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#19 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 01:18 PM
 
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Ds1 pooped once every 5 days or so from maybe 5 days old, ds2 poops hourly!

I just smile and nod at the docs and do what is right for us, as long as my kids are healthy and my newbie is gaining I don't worry.

You need to remember, it is harder to get into veteranarian school than medical school! My faith in the medical community has dwindled to almost nothing after two pregnancies.
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#20 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 01:19 PM
 
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OMG air filled boobs, i'm pretty sure it's only the air filled friends that have those lol
after 15 mins there is still milk and i deffo know from personal experience that you don't have to wait 2 hours for more milk my lo's fed every 30 mins at least during the first few weeks. i could be at a group that lasts 2 hours with both caitlin and caden and feed them at least 4 times in that time and there was deffo milk coming out at each feed.


eta breastfed babies can go as long as a week without pooing so that is normal, as for the gas i found that lieing my lo's across my knees and rubbing their backs helped with gas, just have a burp cloth handy cos they tend to bring up some milk with the gas.

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#21 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 01:30 PM
 
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I WISH my boobs were filled with air! Then they wouldn't be so saggy! LOL.
But sometimes when they've nursed a lot, all that air makes me feel like I might float away. Gotta be careful ya know!

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#22 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 01:31 PM
 
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OMG air filled boobs, i'm pretty sure it's only the air filled friends that have those lol
after 15 mins there is still milk and i deffo know from personal experience that you don't have to wait 2 hours for more milk my lo's fed every 30 mins at least during the first few weeks. i could be at a group that lasts 2 hours with both caitlin and caden and feed them at least 4 times in that time and there was deffo milk coming out at each feed.


eta breastfed babies can go as long as a week without pooing so that is normal, as for the gas i found that lieing my lo's across my knees and rubbing their backs helped with gas, just have a burp cloth handy cos they tend to bring up some milk with the gas.
Again, NOT NORMAL FOR A NEWBORN. It is important to give relevant information. It is not normal for a newborn to go days between bowel movements. At all.
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#23 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 01:32 PM
 
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regardless of the bad info, it is not a normal thing for a nb to be going days without a bm, and I would get that checked out asap
I disagree. An EBF can go up to a week to 10 days without a bm and not be considered constipated. My son went about every 3 days while an infant. Just keep an eye on urine output.

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#24 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 02:14 PM
 
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my dd didn't poop and we gave her a suppository once and she started going on her own. a newborn needs to be going everyday.

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#25 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 02:33 PM
 
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I don't know if anyone has suggested this, but if baby is mostly constipated, giving a small amount of white grape juice with an eyedropper can dramatically loosen things up, without being as traumatic as some of the other solutions people sometimes suggest. Also, doing the same with weak catnip tea does wonders to relax tight little stomachs, expell gas, relax baby, releive colic (major or minor), especially when combined with some time relaxing in a vibrating bouncy seat. Catnip will also help a ton if you drink it yourself so baby gets it through the milk instead. DS2 had similar gas/colic/constipation problems in the early weeks and the catnip/bouncy seat combo worked wonders. You may also want someone check baby's latch, as they can get less milk and more air if latched incorrectly. HTH Best of luck to you Momma.

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#26 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 02:49 PM
 
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I disagree. An EBF can go up to a week to 10 days without a bm and not be considered constipated. My son went about every 3 days while an infant. Just keep an eye on urine output.
Correction. A baby over 3-4 weeks of age can go that long. But we're talking a newborn here and that has a different set of "rules."

From kellymom:

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Without becoming obsessive about it, monitoring the frequency and quantity of bowel motions is one of the best ways, next to observing the baby’s drinking, (see above, and videos at www.thebirthden.com/Newman.html) of knowing if the baby is getting enough milk. After the first three to four days, the baby should have increasing bowel movements so that by the end of the first week he should be passing at least two to three substantial yellow stools each day. In addition, many infants have a stained diaper with almost each feeding. A baby who is still passing meconium on the fourth or fifth day of life, should be seen at the clinic the same day. A baby who is passing only brown bowel movements is probably not getting enough, but this is not very reliable.

Some breastfed babies, after the first three to four weeks of life, may suddenly change their stool pattern from many each day, to one every three days or even less. Some babies have gone as long as 15 days or more without a bowel movement. As long as the baby is otherwise well, and the stool is the usual pasty or soft, yellow movement, this is not constipation and is of no concern. No treatment is necessary or desirable, because no treatment is necessary or desirable for something that is normal.

Any baby between five and 21 days of age who does not pass at least one substantial bowel movement within a 24 hour period should be seen at the breastfeeding clinic the same day. Generally, small, infrequent bowel movements during this time period mean insufficient intake. There are definitely some exceptions and everything may be fine, but it is better to check.

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#27 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 02:51 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Thanks gals I'm reading this all getting some good information and trying to figure out the next step. I don't think my issue is supply shes is fully feeding good patterns of suck and swallow mouth fills with milk I'm leaking a lot between I'm also pumping once a day (I pump opposite side while baby nurses) I ussually get 2.5oz during that feeding..
I'm going to contact a LLL or some breastfeeding LC around here and see what they suggest or say. I do know her latch is great though...
The lack of BM them selfs don't big time worry me its the fact shes is clearly uncomfortable because of it.
Of course I'm working on changing doctors..

deanna

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#28 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 02:52 PM
 
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The time between stools is really concerning to me. I get that babies vary, but 9 days of no poop would be at least 6 days past my comfort before I was in a doctor's office, and I don't go to the doctor very often. BF newborn babies really do usually poop AT LEAST once a day (usually a lot more often). I am sure there are exceptions, but I would wonder if those exceptions still mean there is something gastric going on.
Tjej


This pattern may be normal for your baby, but it is unusual for breastfed newborns and definitely a red flag that should be looked into asap. The LLL article a PP mentioned above is a good explanation about the importance of poops in newborns.

As for that ped - I'm not even going to go there.
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#29 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 03:33 PM
 
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Gentle reminder mamas-- namecalling, no matter how deserved, is against the User Agreement. If you've indulged, please edit. Thanks!

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#30 of 48 Old 03-21-2010, 03:34 PM
 
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Hello!

Would appreciate it if you all would keep the UA in mind when posting.

Quote:
Do not post in a disrespectful, defamatory, adversarial, baiting, harassing, offensive, insultingly sarcastic or otherwise improper manner, toward a member or other individual, including casting of suspicion upon a person, invasion of privacy, humiliation, demeaning criticism, name-calling, personal attack or in any way which violates the law.
There are other ways to get your point across about how ill-informed the doctor was without calling him names.

Thanks!



tinybutterfly

"Be kind, for everyone you meet is fighting a hard battle." -Plato
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