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#1 of 52 Old 07-20-2010, 11:45 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I know this is probably a huge overreaction, which is why I'm venting here instead of IRL, but I'm so sad....

Yesterday my mom gave my dd formula for the first time while babysitting her.

Admittedly I hadn't pumped enough, BUT there was some rice milk in there and I had told her to stretch the bm with a little rice milk to make a full bottle. DD hates the bottle anyway, so most of the time my milk just gets poured down the drain after the first ounce or so. I only work 3-4 days a week, I work 5 minutes from my house, and I wait tables, in the evenings/overnights only, so most of the time I'm not at work for more than 5 hours anyway. So I don't see there being a nutritional need for formula if we are only taling a few ounces a week. I just don't want to start down that path especially since I am struggling with depression and breastfeeeding means I HAVE to keep dd with me all the time and that is a good thing in my situation. It keeps me from running off and neglecting my family when I'm having a rough day.

There are lots of issues with my mom but she is the only sitter I have right now. I am 90% sure the whole thing was premeditated since she was only about a 2 minute drive from my house when she went and bought formula (amd she bought Earth's Best soy, which means she had to go LOOKING for it since most places don't carry that). She claims that she didn't have time to go home and get the bottle of pumped milk. But she had time to walk through a department store with a screaming baby, find the formula, find distilled water, find a bottle, pay for it all, and then mix it up in the car?

I know that one bottle is not the end of the world and that dd isn't destined for a lifetime of suffering or anything. In the big picture, I guess it's not that serious. But it's always been a point of pride for me that my kids had never had formula, solely due to my dogged efforts to give them only my milk even when it was extremely hard. So...it just bugs me, is all.

I'm halfway hoping dd has a really nasty poop or something so i'll have a legitimate reason to say "don't ever feed my child that again."

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#2 of 52 Old 07-20-2010, 11:51 AM
 
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I'm halfway hoping dd has a really nasty poop or something so i'll have a legitimate reason to say "don't ever feed my child that again."
You have a legitimate reason without that. You're the mom.

I'd be quite POd at my mom if she did that. Yes, sounds deliberate. She could have also called you... "hey, she's out of milk, what do you want me to do?" All of those made more sense than what she did.

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#3 of 52 Old 07-20-2010, 12:08 PM
 
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It sounds to me like you are upset for the right reasons.

I know your mom's heart was in the right place though. She probably thought that since the baby hates bottles, that maybe she would like it better if it was formula. Maybe Grandma would rescue the situation with a magic cure. Maybe the baby would be happy the rest of the night, and everybody would get a good night's sleep.

She also bought earth's best... so, clearly she was trying to do what she thought would be the best thing. I bet that stuff is more expensive too!

Obviously, Grandma loves her grandbabies. She just wanted to do a good thing.

I'd just try to make sure you always have enough pumped milk next time. Maybe stretch it yourself with rice milk before your mom has a chance to take things into her own hands. Gently tell her to use breast milk only unless it's an ABSOLUTE emergency. Just explain to her what you said.
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But it's always been a point of pride for me that my kids had never had formula, solely due to my dogged efforts to give them only my milk even when it was extremely hard.
She wants you and your kids to be happy. But, you just need to explain it to her in a way that makes her understand. Otherwise, she's just going to be thinking "You kids had formula and you did just fine". "You kids didn't have carseats and you did fine" "You drank from the hose..." "I fed you pizza when you were six days old...". (facts get fuzzy after age 40)
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#4 of 52 Old 07-20-2010, 01:00 PM
 
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Oh, I remember you/your mom now. Your mother is extremely toxic, I'm sorry to say. I'm a total stranger but I have no doubt it was 110% deliberate. She has been deliberately undermining you your whole life. I hope you successfully get away from your mother soon.

Homeschooling mama to 6 year old DD.

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#5 of 52 Old 07-20-2010, 01:15 PM
 
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I just don't want to start down that path especially since I am struggling with depression and breastfeeeding means I HAVE to keep dd with me all the time and that is a good thing in my situation.
I am so impressed that you have come to that realization. You are wise beyond your years and your experience.

I suffered from PPD with my last baby and I thought that it was best handled by distancing myself from him whenever I could. After all, worrying about his care made me anxious, so the more he was cared for by others, the less anxiety I would have, right?

Wrong! Sadly circumstances (another child in the hospital) led to us weaning at age eight weeks.

With this upcoming baby I am determined to handle PPD completely differently. I intend to keep baby close to me. If I'm feeling anxious, the solution is more baby, not less.

I totally understand why you're upset and yet you are rational enough to know that it won't ultimately be a harmful thing for baby to have one bottle of formula.

You are doing amazingly well! I feel certain that everything will work out wonderfully for you and your little ones. You inspire me!

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#6 of 52 Old 07-20-2010, 01:17 PM
 
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Yes, I'd be mad. I'd also do everything in my power to find someone else to keep your dd. Clearly, your mother knows no bounds.
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#7 of 52 Old 07-20-2010, 11:06 PM
 
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I'd be PISSED big time! I think you need to very clearly (write it down if need be) tell her what an emergency is. I'd also confiscate what is left of the formula 'cause leaving it with her is just asking for her to do it again without asking.

Surviving sleep deprivation one day at a time with dd (Oct '11) & ds (Oct '08).

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#8 of 52 Old 07-20-2010, 11:10 PM
 
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I would be out of my mind furious. I am so sorry.

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#9 of 52 Old 07-21-2010, 12:28 AM
 
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Hugs!!
My mother in law insisted the my son needed a pacifier, but he never used them. We left the kids w/ her for a few hours to go out to eat and a movie and she had had her neighbor run to the store to get him pacifiers!! I had to laugh when she said he didn't take it. Well, duh, I told you that! Now she knows better. I just don't let her babysit when they are babies. lol

How did she know to use soy and not milk based? That stuff is also hard to find. At least here it is. Most stores don't carry organic formula here.

Rhiana mom of 4
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#10 of 52 Old 07-21-2010, 12:51 AM
 
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I would be out of my mind furious. I am so sorry.
Me too. I would go bananas on my mother if she pulled this. You are your baby's mama, so YOU decide what she eats!

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#11 of 52 Old 07-21-2010, 01:00 AM
 
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While in this case, it seems like she sort of went out of her way to feed formula instead of breastmilk (because you don't leave home with a baby without their milk, and it sounds like you had bm at home for her?), and while you mom is a toxic person (from other posts I've read from you) - I just want to point out that rice milk is not a good substitute for breastmilk, even in small amounts. I think it's better for your dd to have formula supplementation if they run out of milk than rice milk, right?
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#12 of 52 Old 07-21-2010, 01:10 AM
 
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Originally Posted by waiting2bemommy View Post
Admittedly I hadn't pumped enough, BUT there was some rice milk in there and I had told her to stretch the bm with a little rice milk to make a full bottle.
I realize the situation is more complicated than this and it does seem as though she perhaps was looking for an occasion to feed formula, and I would be ticked about that too. But as an aside, I would not recommend stretching expressed breastmilk for an infant with rice milk any more than I would recommend stretching it with water. The expressed milk becomes nutritionally diluted. Honestly when there is not enough expressed milk and the child is under one I do think the difference should be made up with formula.

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#13 of 52 Old 07-21-2010, 01:31 AM
 
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if it was me I'd be beyond insane beside myself out of my mind furious. And I'd be even more furious that it was soy, which I avoid like the plague for my kids and myself.

Mama to 2 sweet gorgeous children, a 4-year-old DS and a 1-year-old DD.
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#14 of 52 Old 07-21-2010, 02:19 AM
 
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I'm sorry you are upset, but I do agree that formula, probably even the soy version she bought, is better than supplementing with rice milk. I know you don't want your babies to have any formula, but really, using even a small amount of rice milk is the same thing (except less nutritious).

Not knowing how toxic your mom is (just read the pp mentioned it), I would wonder I she truly was trying to do what she thought was best at the time. Did she know how long it would be until you were off work and could nurse the baby?

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#15 of 52 Old 07-21-2010, 06:00 AM
 
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Originally Posted by lifeguard View Post
I'd also confiscate what is left of the formula 'cause leaving it with her is just asking for her to do it again without asking.


You sound much calmer about this than I would be.

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She claims that she didn't have time to go home and get the bottle of pumped milk.
Holy mother of god, I would be angry.

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#16 of 52 Old 07-21-2010, 01:55 PM - Thread Starter
 
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so...update....I confronted her, gently, about whether it really was logical to go buy formula when she was less than 5 minutes from the house...she changed her story, and ds comfirmed it, that she ALREADY had the formula before she even came to my house. All she had to do was mix it up and feed to dd. She said she had bought it on her way to babysit "just in case." So basically she had planned to give it to dd whether or not I pumped enough.

it's neither here nor there now, but dd had horrible gas and a hard tummy all day yesterday and took a really nasty poop that was much darker and thicker than anything i've ever seen come out of her. Her farts stunk horribly too. That was the main reason I've been using rice milk, because even though there's no nutritional value, it is super easy to digest, and according to my 2 yo taste-tester, lol, it tastes like breastmilk and I don't think a few ounces a week are going to stunt her development.

It is really, really hard for me to pump right now, but knowing that dd can't live off rice milk, having it in the house doesn't leave open the temptation for me to go off and say "just give her a bottle" whereas having formula in the house would lead to exactly that.

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#17 of 52 Old 07-21-2010, 02:00 PM
 
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Oh, I remember you/your mom now. Your mother is extremely toxic, I'm sorry to say. I'm a total stranger but I have no doubt it was 110% deliberate. She has been deliberately undermining you your whole life. I hope you successfully get away from your mother soon.

Sorry, but I completely agree. This is your child, not hers.

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#18 of 52 Old 07-21-2010, 02:10 PM
 
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You have a legitimate reason without that. You're the mom.
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#19 of 52 Old 07-21-2010, 02:40 PM
 
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It is really, really hard for me to pump right now, but knowing that dd can't live off rice milk, having it in the house doesn't leave open the temptation for me to go off and say "just give her a bottle" whereas having formula in the house would lead to exactly that.
I am truely inspired at your efforts to combat your PPD.

Maybe it is time to call in some reinforcements. Do you have a LLL (or other pro bf moms group) in your area? Maybe some of those moms would be willing to "educate" your mom, sometimes having an outsider back you up will do more to enforce your view point and ANYTHING you could do or say, and at the same time give you some face to face encouragement.
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#20 of 52 Old 07-21-2010, 02:42 PM
 
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I'm sorry you are upset, but I do agree that formula, probably even the soy version she bought, is better than supplementing with rice milk. I know you don't want your babies to have any formula, but really, using even a small amount of rice milk is the same thing (except less nutritious).

Not knowing how toxic your mom is (just read the pp mentioned it), I would wonder I she truly was trying to do what she thought was best at the time. Did she know how long it would be until you were off work and could nurse the baby?
I agree with this post

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so...update....I confronted her, gently, about whether it really was logical to go buy formula when she was less than 5 minutes from the house...she changed her story, and ds comfirmed it, that she ALREADY had the formula before she even came to my house. All she had to do was mix it up and feed to dd. She said she had bought it on her way to babysit "just in case." So basically she had planned to give it to dd whether or not I pumped enough.

it's neither here nor there now, but dd had horrible gas and a hard tummy all day yesterday and took a really nasty poop that was much darker and thicker than anything i've ever seen come out of her. Her farts stunk horribly too. That was the main reason I've been using rice milk, because even though there's no nutritional value, it is super easy to digest, and according to my 2 yo taste-tester, lol, it tastes like breastmilk and I don't think a few ounces a week are going to stunt her development.

It is really, really hard for me to pump right now, but knowing that dd can't live off rice milk, having it in the house doesn't leave open the temptation for me to go off and say "just give her a bottle" whereas having formula in the house would lead to exactly that.
I don't get why having it is a temptation for you? DS is EBF but I would give him formula before I would give him rice milk to "fill out" a bottle. Formula at least has the nutrients he needs.
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#21 of 52 Old 07-21-2010, 03:51 PM
 
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I would be angry too, but you simply cannot stretch breastmilk with rice milk for an infant! If you do not have enough breastmilk and no available donor milk, infant formula is the appropriate substitute. Rice milk might as well be water.
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#22 of 52 Old 07-21-2010, 09:22 PM
 
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and I don't think a few ounces a week are going to stunt her development.

It is really, really hard for me to pump right now, but knowing that dd can't live off rice milk, having it in the house doesn't leave open the temptation for me to go off and say "just give her a bottle" whereas having formula in the house would lead to exactly that.
I agree. I would be livid mad and additionally disturbed that she went out and bought it before hand and didn't even bother asking what kind you would want.

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#23 of 52 Old 07-22-2010, 06:15 PM
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i would be LIVID if someone fed my kid formula without my approval. in fact, a nurse did when she was first born and that led to a milk allergy so i totally hear you.

however, i have to respectfully agree that if there is not enough breast milk available, formula is the appropriate backup choice, not rice milk. that is not to diminish your feelings about breastfeeding - believe me, i completely sympathize as i had a challenging experience myself - but strictly from a nutritional perspective.

i hope she understands your feelings from here on in and respects your choices.

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#24 of 52 Old 07-23-2010, 08:07 PM
 
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Rice milk in particular is a poor choice of substitutes due to trace arsenic concerns; the U.K. FDA equivalent recently issued a statement advising it not be given to children under about age four, for example.

If you don't want a big tin of formula around it can be purchased in individual use packets, or ready-to-serve. Both are more expensive, but shouldn't be prohibitively so for occasional use.
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#25 of 52 Old 07-23-2010, 08:17 PM
 
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Why is most of it getting poured down the drain? Can you freeze it in small amounts so thats less likely to happen? And, a BM bottle can be put in the fridge to be saved for later - so it shouldn't just be getting dumped.

Otherwise, everyone else is right, rice milk is a poor substitute.
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#26 of 52 Old 07-23-2010, 08:44 PM
 
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Oh wow, I can relate to all of this - intentionally not allowing formula in the house, and having it as a point of pride that your lo has never needed anything other than mama's milk. I would have been very, very upset if my baby had been given formula instead of breastmilk when there was breastmilk available (and it sounds as if there was, at least some, that wasn't used).

If most of your pumped milk is getting wasted at the moment, then you are making at least a little more than the baby needs, not less, and if you can adjust how it's handled, then you shouldn't have any need to resort to rice milk (which can be very harmful to gut flora and proper iron absorption, even in small amounts) or formula at all. Breastmilk can be stored in the back of the fridge, as long as it was never frozen, for 5-7 days. Using a sterile or sanitized container for pumping and storage, rather than one that was just cleaned with soap and water, should get you closer to the full 7 days before any spoilage.

Unlike formula, fresh breastmilk does not need to be poured out of a partially used bottle - it can be refrigerated and used again. Breastmilk has antibacterial properties that formula doesn't, which is why it isn't dangerous to store partially used bottles. If rice milk or formula has been added, though, then it would not be safe to store, so there's another reason not to "stretch" breastmilk.

To conserve it best, though, the baby should get bottles with only the amount she typically eats at a time (1 or 2 ounces); the caregiver can always give more if she finishes it. The same goes for freezing; if you're having to keep it longer than a week, freeze in an ice cube tray (less than full so the cubes will fit in the neck of the bottle) or those Sensible Lines trays and then transfer the 1oz cubes into a freezer zip bag. Then only thaw what the baby will drink; having smaller amounts frozen also reduces thawing time so that the baby will not have to wait long for it to be ready.

And sit down with the baby's grandmother and have an open talk about why she resorted to lying to you, in addition to doing what she knew you didn't want to do. It would have been one thing if she used the formula after the breastmilk was gone instead of rice milk (which would have been somewhat reasonable although she should have discussed it with you first); but to leave the breastmilk in the fridge and give only formula, and then to lie about the circumstances? That is strange, potentially hostile behavior, and I would want to get to the very bottom of it.
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#27 of 52 Old 07-23-2010, 10:23 PM
 
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I would be angry too, but you simply cannot stretch breastmilk with rice milk for an infant! If you do not have enough breastmilk and no available donor milk, infant formula is the appropriate substitute. Rice milk might as well be water.
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that:

i would be very hard pressed to feed ricemilk to any infant left in my care, even if the mother expressly asked me to. you can stretch breastmilk with donor milk or formula, not other "milks" or other liquids.
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#28 of 52 Old 07-23-2010, 10:53 PM
 
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Oh wow, there are a lot of issues here.

Deliberately feeding your baby formula when you expressly asked her not to is not OK. But maybe she knew rice milk wasn't good for a baby, especially one who is only a few months old? I would be really conscientious about making sure I had more than enough breastmilk there next time. I'd rather have a little breastmilk go to waste than have my baby fed formula without my permission. But I do agree with the posters here who stated that rice milk, even just a little to stretch the breastmilk, is just not nutritionally acceptable for a three month old baby. kaylee18 had some good advice on not wasting pumped milk as well.

I'm sorry this happened.

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#29 of 52 Old 07-23-2010, 11:09 PM
 
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I don't know the backstory with your mom, but I do want to say...rice milk contains large amounts of arsenic and very little nutrients. The fact that your baby was fed an organic soy non gmo formula was actually probably a bit healthier for the baby. Rice milk also says on the box not to give it to babies (probably the arsenic and the nutrient thing...), and so maybe your mom read that and wigged?

I know it sucks to have your parenting boundaries crossed, and I'm sorry she did that. But at least rest in knowing that your baby had a healthy alternative when your little one was still hungry. :

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#30 of 52 Old 07-24-2010, 12:34 AM
 
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I am sorry she did not give your child the breastmilk. I wouldn't have been ok with that at all.

If someone told me to give a baby ricemilk I would say no. That is just not appropriate for an infant. Sometimes we have to face choices and we might need to use tools we would rather not in order to do the best thing for our children. The best thing for your child is not ricemilk. Ricemilk is not nutritionally adequate for a baby.

I do think you will be happier looking back and thinking "I made the right choices for my kids" than "my child never had a drop of formula" My own child had some formula and it was necessary at that time.

Pumping is extremely hard, I do understand it is rough, that is also making the best choice for your child.


Not all those who wander are lost 
JessicaS is offline  
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