Smoking weed and breastfeeding???? - Mothering Forums
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#1 of 101 Old 08-27-2003, 03:39 AM - Thread Starter
 
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I am just wondering, I know mom's who have breastfed and occasionally smoke pot. I have done some research and am confused. It seems that it is transmitted a little and could do harm in third trimester or first 6 months...but for older kids it seem that there are no ill effects. One book cited a study where there were no differences in cogtnitive function, growth or motor function in kids who were exposed. But when I asked an advice nurse at our local hospital she said it was child abuse and causes arrested development, she'd call child protective services and so on? Any opinions?
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#2 of 101 Old 08-27-2003, 05:44 AM
 
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http://www.kellymom.com/meds/marijuana.html

The advice nurse is right that it is considered abuse from a legal/DHS perspective, just as if the mom had allowed the breastfeeding child to "do" the drug through a method other than via breastmilk. The child would likely be removed from the home, and the mother could be jailed. I don't think that's a reasonable risk for a mother to take.

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Roman (3/98), Evalina (3/00), Nadia (3/03), and Kira (11/07)
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#3 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 09:50 AM
 
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It can also affect your milk supply. One of my friends was exclusively nursing and (i later found) out smoking weed too. Her baby was FTT and put on formula.

Working for WIC, it's unlikely that I would report someone for doing it once in a great while, but if you're doing it on a regular basis, it's no better than letting your child smoke it. Then I would report it.

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13yo ds   10yo dd  8yo ds and 6yo ds and 1yo ds  
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#4 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 03:07 PM - Thread Starter
 
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What does FTT stand for? I am finding the info useful, it has promotd some dialog with a friend of mine who needs it.
thanks,
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#5 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 03:13 PM
 
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failure to thrive
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#6 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 03:17 PM
 
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Failure to thrive. [nt]

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Roman (3/98), Evalina (3/00), Nadia (3/03), and Kira (11/07)
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#7 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 05:34 PM
 
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In case this is at all helpful, I remember reading somewhere that there is a true clinical reason to AVOID recreational drugs, even pot, while BF, and it's this: newborn and infant liver function is not fully "online" right away, and is therefore not up to the task of processing the drugs from the blood the way an adult liver is.

Also true of regular alcohol consumption.

Not that I don't indulge from time to time...
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#8 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 07:17 PM
 
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Although I know better, sometimes I just cannot believe my eyes.

Anyone who would consider smoking weed during pregnancy, lactation, or around their children - period - is extremely selfish - not to mention STUPID!:

AND I know because my Dad smoked it when I was growing up and I hated it but I was a kid so there was nothing I could do about it.
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#9 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 07:31 PM
 
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i'd really like to know how this is different from drinking alcohol (physically), especially since marajuana is demonized by our culture and alcohol is somehow acceptable, even though alcohol has been proven more addictive and harmful. what's wrong with an occasional puff if an occasional glass is ok??
i'd like to know how much is really passed into the mother's milk, and how harmful it really is to the baby or toddler, and if one is worse than the other, especially for the moderate mama who chooses to indulge once in a while.
:
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#10 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 07:51 PM
 
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I don't think you should drink while nursing, pregnant, or for that matter while you have a child in your care. I have read that an occasional glass of wine is ok, but I don't still don't indulge. I put my children's health ahead of my own "indulgences."
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#11 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 08:00 PM
 
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There are so many things that we can't protect our children from - being picked on at school, sickness, disease, heartbreak - why expose them to something you can protect them from?

Here is some more information:

http://www.kellymom.com/meds/marijuana.htm
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#12 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 08:03 PM
 
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Has anyone read the research about the Rastafari women studied in Jamaica?
Their babies, exposed to heavy smoke throughout pregnancy and lactation, actually scored higher on the tests the researchers did at both three months and one year
In Jamaica, though, they consider the effects medicinal and spiritual. When children get sick, for example, they don't touch aspirin and pharm. drugs... they make very weak ganja tea for the child to drink. They swear by it.
If it is used to raise ones awareness and/or for meditative purposes, an ocassional toke will not hurt. If someone is using to escape their problems or to "feel good", it's not a good idea, period.
The Kellymom website actually did say it correctly: that heavy use has been shown to effect infants, in that it may make them sleepy or drowsy and can be stored for long periods of time in the infant's system. The only part that seemed to say it wasn't okay in very small amounts, ocassionally, said that it was because it interfered with the mother's care of her child. This is propaganda UNLESS the mother is, as I said before, using it to escape her problems or trying to solve her pyschoses through self-medication.
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#13 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 08:29 PM
 
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I can say that I know a mom on the board that smoked while pregnant, caregivers knew and she didn't have her child taken away and she wasn't reported because she was able to discuss the real literature and studies that have been done or not, not jkust the propaeganda partyline. Maybe she will post and share what she knows? Although maybe not? I don't have the report info in front of me, but my understanding is that the jamaica study showed no negative effects on kids from pot smoking while pregnant. I also know quite a few people that have been investigated by CPS after being reported and none of the kids were taken away in any of the cases. Of course this is in a state that has decriminalized pot, so I can't say what would happen in another state.

As far as I know there isn't any evidence of FTT from pot smoking.
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#14 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 08:40 PM - Thread Starter
 
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Oh, that is a pretty clear indication that despite popular counter culture opinion, it isn't safe, even if it is occasional.
thanks.
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#15 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 08:51 PM - Thread Starter
 
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I was repling to the prior post about failure to thrive, with my last "yikes" post. The whole issue is so confussing for me. I know many mom's and am part of a subculture of people who feel pot is a medicine and OK in milk. Many of the older kids are so bright and aware conscious beings, and their mom's extended breastfeeding and smoked probably more than occasionally.

There is probably more hysteria around it like it is taboo, because it is decriminalized but still illegal...ugh. I read the Jamaica study too, and another that found no ill effects, yet...I'd guess smoking anything when your still breastfeeding is probably a real bad idea.

Bottom line is that doctors cant make money off pot so it is thought to be bad...hummm

Thanks for the useful info.
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#16 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 10:44 PM
 
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I was discussing this via IM with my Dh, and he sent me this link. Not directly related to bfing, but thought provoking nonetheless.

http://cgi.kqed.org/topics/news/pers...ana/index.html

Laura, mama to J (15), N (12), E (9) , M (6), and our little caboose, R (3).
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#17 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 11:08 PM
 
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My issue with the link you gave laurata is that my reasons for the legalization of marijuana are black and white. The war on drugs, specifically mj, has put away people for outrageous sentences because of madatory sentencing. I won't go any further into my reasons because that's not the point of this thread.

The link you provided asks your opinion and receives it. Then says, "yeah, but!" over and over. I'm mildly insulted by the tone of it but that just because I started my period today. Heh.

Quote:
Bottom line is that doctors cant make money off pot so it is thought to be bad.
This is usually my line in this reoccuring thread topic. Nail meets head.

Quote:
smoking anything when your still breastfeeding is probably a real bad idea.
Also true.

I'm aware of a mother that uses mj as her antidepressant, as she's opposed to personally using ssri's or other mood elevators. I support her nursing her child just as I support my other friend who was prescribed wellbutrin while pregnant and then nursing.

It's about what works for us.
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#18 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 11:11 PM
 
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candiland, thank you for presenting the Jamaican study. I have always argued that anything in moderation is OK. Popping Sudafed everyday is going to be detremental to your child, drinking Diet Coke every day will have an effect, marijuana every day will have a detrimental effect. The occasional toke will not.

Our country cannot ascertain the difference between a junkie and occasional recreational use. I don't get how we couldn't have learned from Prohibition. Whenever something is outlawed the demand for it grows and a criminal use capitalized on it. OK, OT but this drives me up the wall.
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#19 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 11:13 PM
 
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Also, I'm always disheartened when I hear women either being told or discussing amongst themselves all the nono's while bfing. I believe that my body can filter majority of the badness and that most of the things I've been made scared of are not as bad as I'm told because women are constantly given reasons why bfing is hard and you can't live the life you want while doing so. You may as well feed the baby formula, etc.

It's not as scary as "they" make it out to be.
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#20 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 11:16 PM
 
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Sarah,

I totally agree. My sil stopped bf'ing bc she wanted to drink more than one beer. Somehow, the benefits of bf'ing are less than the effect of two beers in our culture. Very sad.
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#21 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 11:21 PM
 
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Heh, OhMel! My CNMW told me to have a pint while learning to bf at first to relax and that it stimulated let down. This was during her bfing class.

Funny how the information we have on hand is never the same ANYWHERE. Even here.
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#22 of 101 Old 08-28-2003, 11:26 PM
 
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T

I know, it just drives me nuts. My MW told me to have a glass of wine when labor started so I could relax and maybe sleep. I have a friend who's OB told her "Never take any herbs" but told her that all other stuff was fine. WTF? Grrr. I'm sure he told her OTC stuff was fine.
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#23 of 101 Old 08-29-2003, 02:47 AM
 
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The difference between an occasional glass of wine and smoking pot is that pot is illegal and THE STATE COULD TAKE YOUR BABY AWAY. Why would anyone risk that?

Also, regarding the argument that my body can filter out any "bad stuff," my daughter has multiple food allergies. Every time I eat dairy or soy or onions or wheat or corn or rice, she gets sick. It's a different situation, but I firmly believe that I shouldn't put anything into my body that I don't want going into hers!

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Roman (3/98), Evalina (3/00), Nadia (3/03), and Kira (11/07)
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#24 of 101 Old 08-29-2003, 01:38 PM
 
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My son has the similar allergies and I spent over a year on a strict elimination diet. I understand your point. But you're generalizing my idea that we do not trust our bodies as often as we should. At the same time, I uunderstand the level of distrust that comes along with finding out your milk can seem "poisonous" because of glutens, dairy, etc. to your child.

Back to MJ.

Yes, it's is illegal and my point was that it shouldn't be.

It's sad that we have doctors throwing drugs at women who are pregnant and/or nursing that terrify me. But we'll throw that same mother in jail or take away her children for self medicating with pot.

Unfortunately, this thread happens on a cycle here at MDC. There are those that have moral issues with MJ. There are those that support it's legalization. There are those who don't really care.

We're not going to change each others minds.

Also, everyone should think twice before admitting ANYTHING on this board. Some folks take their moral obligation very seriously. FYI.
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#25 of 101 Old 08-29-2003, 01:54 PM
 
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"Our country cannot ascertain the difference between a junkie and occasional recreational use."

Boy is that the truth. At this point you'd think we did live in prohibition times, since so many people think that inbibing one beer makes someone a bad parent and many people (in general) think that any drinking means your an addict. :

Anyway, good point Sarah I haven't seen anyone admit anything. And just in case anyone assumed I was speaking about myself when I referenced a poster smoking during pg, I wasn't. I know I was a little cryptic, but I didn't want to out a fellow mom.

In the decriminalized states, use or possesion doesn't even get an arrest. It results in a ticket and a fine. No jail time required. Misdemeaners don't result in the taking away of children. CPS has to prove neglect or abuse, not just smoking pot. I think I posted that before??
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#26 of 101 Old 08-29-2003, 06:24 PM
 
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Like SarahGuinn, I also know a mama who uses pot daily as an anti-depressant. I really don't see how it's worse than prozac, wellbutrin, zoloft, etc. My mama friend is nursing her 3 year old, who is as sharp as a tack and has the verbal skills of an 8 year old. She also smoked during her first pregnancy. She was very young at the time and was sick every day. The pot helped her feel better and had no ill effects on her dd. Dd is now 13 years old and extemely bright. That said, I personally am not comfortable smoking or drinking at all while pg. I have had a drink a couple of times since I've been nursing though.
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#27 of 101 Old 08-30-2003, 11:24 AM
 
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ok well different things work for different people. Look at it this way some women will drink the whole time they are pg and the baby will be perfectly fine. another women may have one or two drinks and her baby will have FAS. Some women can smoke pot or just smoke cigerates(sp) and it will have no affect on the baby, while another may have smoked a few times and it affects the baby.


Yea your body might filter out all the bad stuff BUT why would you take that chance.

A friend of mine smoked pot and cigerates all while she was pg. Her argument for it was the only thing that will happen is the baby may be underweight. well she had her baby early and had to stay in the hospital for awhile and she's a little behind her peers. Now was it from smoking pot or cigerates or was it just something that was going to happen no matter what she did??? My point is well never know.

BUT if it did affect her baby while she was pg whats to say it wont while she's bf'ing. i just think that you should do everything you can to make sure your baby is as healthy as can be.
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#28 of 101 Old 08-30-2003, 01:07 PM
 
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Quote:
Originally posted by SarahGuinn
My issue with the link you gave laurata is that my reasons for the legalization of marijuana are black and white. The war on drugs, specifically mj, has put away people for outrageous sentences because of madatory sentencing. I won't go any further into my reasons because that's not the point of this thread.

The link you provided asks your opinion and receives it. Then says, "yeah, but!" over and over. I'm mildly insulted by the tone of it but that just because I started my period today. Heh.
True. I think it's good for people who can't make up their mind whether the legalization of MJ is good or bad. I'd be curious if states where MJ use is decriminalized have statistics on whether there is much difference in abuse problems, higher rates of use, etc. It seems like moderate use isn't unreasonable and probably fine. Personally I wouldn't risk it.

Interesting debate.

Laura, mama to J (15), N (12), E (9) , M (6), and our little caboose, R (3).
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#29 of 101 Old 08-30-2003, 01:43 PM
 
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if you drink every day it WILL affect your baby, no argument there.
if you smoke pot, it will not, and I have yet to see a study that says otherwise.

I am the mom Arduinna was refering to. You will not be arrested for admitting that you smoke pot while pg to a healthcare provider. It was the only thing that kept me out of the hospital, I was unable to eat anything for 3 months at the beginning of ALL of my pgs. Yes, I have have used it to treat depression. It worked in both instances. All of my babies scored 8 or 9 on the APGAR, none were underwieght AT ALL. When I was visited by a pediatrician and a social worker after the birth of my last child in the hospital, I went over all of the literature they gave me with them. I gave them the example of the Rastafarian moms, they agreed with me about all of it. They told me that they consider it "a lifestyle choice" to smoke mj, that as long as we weren't dealing or doing anything really harmful, like coke or crack or heroine then it wasn't an issue, but that it was their job to follow up with mamas who have admitted this to their healthcare providers while pg. Their concern was that I would cross over to other drugs that WERE harmful. They wanted to know my reasons for choosing to do this, and I explained it to them. They wished me well and went on their way. I knew the risks, I am willing to fight for my rights as a mother. I know they won't take my kids away, I have looked into the legalities of it in our city and state, and read many posts by joyberryjoy here on mdc. If you have a question regarding the issue of the kids being taken away, she will answer your questions, her dh is a lawyer (and I think she is one, too, but I could be wrong and she just writes like one.)

edited to add...
they didn't follow up because they can't, legally they have no authority to come into my home and accuse me of something they didn't witness, even if I admitted to doing it in the past. They have more to worry about than ppl like me.

I'm not interested in convincing anyone to agree with me or support me. So all of you nay-sayers can spew your venom at me all you like, I am not hurt by it, I have thought about this issue harder than any of you, you can be sure. I have done more research than any of you about it. I did not make this decision with no information or out of ignorance, and other than saying that, I am not going to go out of my way to defend myself.

I am, however, willing to have an intelligent thoughtful discussion about it and answer questions if you like.
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#30 of 101 Old 08-30-2003, 07:53 PM
 
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"women are constantly given reasons why bfing is hard and you can't live the life you want while doing so. You may as well feed the baby formula, etc. ...It's not as scary as "they" make it out to be."said one mom

Another mom replied

"I totally agree. My sil stopped bf'ing bc she wanted to drink more than one beer. Somehow, the benefits of bf'ing are less than the effect of two beers in our culture. Very sad."

It's sad when the culture interferes with bf, yes. But it is also sad when a mom CHOOSES alcohol or drugs over bf. Some moms don't get accurate bf info or suport, while others are immature and selfish. I know a mom who didn't bf at all because she wanted to do party drugs and was tired of abstaining while pg.
:Puke

Take the time to heal from your marriage before you move on with someone else. Make a list of all the qualities you would like in a new partner and then work on growing that way yourself. ~mandib50
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